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[00:00:01]

YEAH, UH, LIKE CALLED TOWN WORK SESSION, TUESDAY, JANUARY 19TH, 2021

[Town Council Work Session on January 19, 2020]

IS I SESSION, UH, FIRST UP OR REVIEW PROCESS.

WHEN A FREEDOM OF INFORMATION WE REQUEST IS RECEIVED, DOUG.

YES.

SURE.

YOU WANT ME TO TAKE THE PODIUM? SURE.

THAT'D BE GREAT.

YOU CAN DO THAT BJ.

CAN YOU ALL SEE ME VERY WELL, AS LONG AS THEY CAN HEAR YOU.

OKAY.

YOU CAN HEAR ME.

I'LL TRY NOT TO GET IN THE WEEDS TOO MUCH AND TRY TO GIVE YOU AN OVERVIEW, UH, WHAT TOWN STAFF DOES WHEN IT GETS A FREEDOM OF INFORMATION ACT REQUEST.

AND JUST TO GIVE YOU KIND OF LIKE AN IDEA OF THE SCOPE OF THIS SO FAR THIS YEAR, THE TOWN HAS RECEIVED 91 PRETTY MUCH IN THE PAST.

WE TOLD HIM JUST TO MAKE IT SIMPLE, UM, IN 2020 OR 20 2191, UH, SORRY, I APOLOGIZE.

YOU TURN BACK OFF, JUST TAP IT.

OKAY.

91 YOU SAY DOGS INSERT LIKE, AND THEN THE LAST 19 DAYS, NINE 91 AND 19 DAYS.

SO IF YOU EXTRAPOLATE THAT OVER THIS YEAR FOR THE REMAINDER OF THIS YEAR, WE WOULD GET SOMEWHERE BETWEEN 17 AND 1800.

UM, SOME OF THESE ARE RELATIVELY SIMPLE.

UH, SOMEBODY MIGHT ASK BRITTANY A DOCUMENT I'LL REPORT.

SOME OF THESE ARE MASSIVE.

UM, ON ONE WE GOT, UH, WAS ASKING FOR, UM, WHEN WE WENT BACK THROUGH THE TOWN SERVER, WE FIGURED IT WOULD BE, UM, SOMEWHERE BETWEEN 75,000 AND 80,000 DOCUMENTS THAT WE WOULD HAVE TO GO THROUGH, UH, ON THE TOWN SERVERS.

UM, AND, UH, BECAUSE THEY RELATED TO, UM, UH, INVESTIGATIVE, UM, LAWSUITS, UM, UM, THE TOWN ATTORNEY'S OFFICE WOULD HAVE TO GO EVERY THROUGH EVERY ONE OF THOSE DOCUMENTS.

AND, UM, IT, IT PUTS A BIG BURDEN ON STAFF AND, UM, UM, BECAUSE, UH, A LOT OF THESE ARE NOT RELEASABLE BY LAW.

UM, UM, BECAUSE OF DATA PROTECTION ACTS, UM, TAX LAWS, LAWS RELATING TO UTILITY RECORDS, PERSONNEL, EMPLOYMENT LAWS, HIPAA SECURITY PROTECTION ACTS, UM, AND OTHER LAWS DESIGNED TO PROTECT PRIVACY, UH, AND OTHER LEGAL, LEGALLY PROTECTED DOMAINS.

UM, WE, WE HAVE TO SIT THROUGH THESE SO, UM, AND YOU CAN GET YOURSELF IN CRIMINAL TROUBLE IF YOU RELEASE THEM AND YOU'RE NOT SUPPOSED TO.

UH, SO, UM, IN SOME OF THESE LAWS ARE NOT EASY TO DECIPHER.

UM, UH, YOU, YOU HAVE TO BE CAREFUL AS TO WHAT LOOKS ON ITS FACE MIGHT BE SIMPLE TO SEE WHETHER OR NOT IT'S LEGAL TO RELEASE.

AND THEN WHEN YOU STARTED DATING THROUGH THE CASE LAW AND REGULATORY LAW, YOU REALIZE IT'S, IT'S NOT, NOT A BRIGHT LINE.

SO, UH, THAT, THAT CAN GET TRICKY.

NOT ALL, UH, FOYER REQUESTS ARE FREE.

UH, IF IT, UM, UH, IT'S UH, RELATED TO STAFF TIME, UM, GENERALLY SPEAKING, IF IT'S GOING TO COST STAFF, UM, FOR THEIR HOURLY RATE, MORE THAN $250, WE CHARGE FOR IT.

UH, WE DON'T LIKE TO CHARGE WORK.

UM, WE ARE A GOVERNMENT, WE DON'T OPERATE IN SECRECY.

UH, YOU KNOW, TOWN, FOLKS, COUNTY FOLKS ARE OUR NEIGHBORS.

THEY'RE OUR FRIENDS.

UH, UM, WE LIKE TO KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON.

I LIKE TO KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON.

YOU LIKE TO KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON, BUT, UH, IT COMES TO A POINT IN TIME WHERE IF, UM, YOU KNOW, SOMEBODY IS ASKING FOR 75, 80,000 DOCUMENTS AND IT TAKES, UM, UH, 500 HOURS OF STAFF TIME TO GO THROUGH THAT.

IT'S NOT FAIR TO OTHER TAXPAYERS BECAUSE SOMETIMES PEOPLE ARE GOING THROUGH FISHING EXPEDITIONS JUST TO GET DOCUMENTS.

[00:05:01]

I HATE TO SAY THIS, BUT WE'VE HAD SITUATIONS WHERE PEOPLE DO IT SIMPLY TO HARASS.

AND 99.99% OF THE REQUESTS ARE NOT THAT 99% OF THE REQUESTS ARE ABSOLUTELY LEGITIMATE AND PEOPLE WANT TO KNOW, AND WE WANT TO GIVE IT TO THEM.

BUT BY THE SAME TOKEN, WE HAVE TO BE FAIR TO EVERYBODY.

UM, UH, THE, UH, THE RATES ARE BASED ON THE EARLY RATES OF THE STAFF PERSON WHO IS PERFORMING THE SEARCH.

IF YOU DON'T HAVE IT'S, UH, UH, RELATED TO PUBLIC WORKS, UH, USUALLY THE PUBLIC WORKS DEPARTMENT WILL, UH, PUT THEIR PERSONNEL IN CHARGE.

THERE'S NO POINT IN HAVING THE TOWN MANAGER LOOK THROUGH, TAKE THE TOWN MANNERS, YOUR IT'S TIME TO LOOK THROUGH SOMETHING IN PUBLIC WORKS OR MY TIME OR ANY TINA PRESLEY'S TAC.

UM, SOME OF THESE DOCUMENTS ARE ALL DOCUMENTS, THEY'RE IN STORAGE AND, UM, YOU HAVE TO GO RETRIEVE THEM.

AND, UM, SOME OF THESE OLD DOCUMENTS ARE NOT, UH, OBVIOUSLY NOT SCANNED.

UM, YOU CAN'T RETRIEVE THEM THROUGH A COMPUTER.

AND, UM, THE, THE NEWER DOCUMENTS ARE MUCH EASIER TO ACCESS WORSE.

THE OLD DOCUMENTS ARE NOT, I WISH THEY WERE, I WISH WE HAD, UH, STAFF TIME AND MONEY BUDGETED MONEY, UH, TO, TO PUT EVERYTHING AND DIGITALIZED FOR.

BUT AS YOU ALL KNOW, WE ALL KNOW MONEY DOESN'T GROW ON TREES.

UM, UM, WHAT WE DO TRY TO ENCOURAGE WHEN PEOPLE ASK FOR DOCUMENTS, UH, FREQUENTLY, THEY ASKED FOR ALL DOCUMENTS RELATED TO A SUBJECT, AND WE ENCOURAGED THE REQUESTER TO BE MORE SPECIFIC BECAUSE WHEN YOU ASKED FOR ALL DOCUMENTS, SOMETIMES UNWITTINGLY, THEY CAN BE ASKING FOR THOUSANDS AND THOUSANDS OF DOCUMENTS, AND IF THEY CAN NARROW THEIR REQUESTS DOWN, UM, THEY CAN SAVE THEMSELVES MONEY, TIME, AND, UM, STAFF A LOT OF EFFORT AND THEY CAN GET IT A LOT FASTER.

UM, AND JUST TO GET INTO THE LAW, I DON'T WANT TO GET TOO FAR IN, HE READS ALL PUBLIC RECORDS.

UM, THIS IS VIRGINIA FOIL OFF ALL PUBLIC RECORDS THAT ARE OPEN TO THE CITIZENS OF THE COMMONWEALTH.

UM, REPRESENTATIVES OF NEWSPAPERS AND MAGAZINES WAS CIRCULATION IN THE COMMONWEALTH AND REPRESENTATIVES OR RADIO AND TELEVISION STATIONS I'LL HAVE TO COMMONWEALTH.

UM, AND YOU, UH, THE ACCESS TO RECORDS, UH, ARE PROVIDED BY, UH, EITHER BY INSPECTION.

PEOPLE CAN COME IN AND LOOK AT THEM, OR THEY CAN, UH, ASK FOR COPIES OF THE RECORDS.

USUALLY PEOPLE WANT COPIES, UH, BUT IT'S AT THE REQUESTERS OPTION.

UM, IF THEY WANT TO COME UP, MAN, AND LOOK AT THE RECORDS, UH, WE IN THE TOWN, UH, HAVE TO ENSURE THAT WE TAKE PRECAUTIONS FOR SAFEKEEPING.

WE HAVE TO MAKE SURE SOMEBODY DOESN'T SLIP OUT A PAGE AND INSERT A FAKE PAGE.

UM, AND THAT CAN BE A CONCERN IF YOU'VE GOT, UH, UH, RECORDS THAT ARE ACTUAL LEGAL RECORDS, THAT CAN BE A REAL CONCERN.

SURE.

UM, AND THE INTERESTING THINGS IS IF A PERSON WANTS TO DOCUMENT, IT DOES NOT HAVE TO BE IN WRITING.

THE REQUEST DOES NOT HAVE TO BE IN WRITING.

AND IT DOES NOT HAVE TO MAKE REFERENCE TO THE FREEDOM OF INFORMATION ACT, UM, THAT IS UP TO THE TOWN TO MAKE SURE THAT THEY UNDERSTAND WHAT THE REQUEST IS.

AND THAT'S WHY THE TOWN ASKS THE PERSON TO MAKE THE REQUEST IN WRITING.

UH, SO WE KNOW SPECIFICALLY WHAT IT IS THEY WANT, SO WE CAN GET IT TO THEM.

SO THERE'S NO CONFUSION.

UM, IF, UM, WHAT THEY REQUEST, UH, SOME OF IT IS LEGALLY ALLOWED TO BE RELEASED.

AND SOME OF IT ISN'T, WE HAVE TO RELEASE THE PORTION THAT IS RELEASABLE AND THE PORTION THAT'S NOT RELEASABLE.

WE HAVE TO REDACT IT OR WITHHOLDING AND TELL THEM EXACTLY, UM, THE NATURE OF WHAT'S BEING RELEASED AND UNDER WHAT CODE SECTION THAT CAN BE RELEASED, UH, NOT ENOUGH TO LET THEM KNOW EXACTLY WHAT IT IS.

YOU KNOW, WE CAN'T TELL THEM WE'RE RELEASING THE, UH, UH, UH, JUVENILE, UH, WHOSE NAME IS JOHN DOE FROM YOU.

BUT WE CAN SAY THAT THIS IS A, A RECORD PERTAINING TO THE JUVENILE.

WOULD YOU NOT RELATE TO THAT INFORMATION? UM, UH, TO, YOU KNOW, THE RECORD DOESN'T EXIST.

WE TELL IT DOESN'T EXIST.

WE DON'T HAVE IT.

WE DON'T KNOW WHERE IT IS.

HOWEVER, IF WE DON'T HAVE IT IN OUR POSSESSION, BUT WE KNOW THAT WHAT YOU WANT IS A WARREN COUNTY RECORD.

WE SAY, UM, LIKE A BUILDING, UH, UH, INSPECTION RECORD, WE DON'T DO BUILDING INSPECTIONS, WARREN COUNTY.

DOES YOU WANT TO GO CHECK WITH THE, UM,

[00:10:01]

UH, OFFICE ABOUT THE BUILDING OFFICIAL, HERE'S HIS ADDRESS, HIS CONTACT INFORMATION, AND THIS IS WHAT YOU WANT TO GET.

UM, WE HAVE FIVE DAYS TO PROVIDE THE RECORD AND THAT'S A SHORT WINDOW.

UH, IF IT'S NOT PRACTICAL, UH, UH, THAT WE CAN GET IT TO THEM IN FIVE DAYS, WE HAVE TO TELL WHY WE CAN'T GET IT TO THEM IN FIVE DAYS.

AND WE HAVE FIVE WORKING DAYS.

UM, AND THEN WE GET SEVEN MORE BUSINESS DAYS.

IF FOR SOME REASON WE CAN'T GET IT DONE IN THAT 12 DAY BUSINESS PERIOD, WE HAVE TO PETITION THE COURT AND WE HAVE TO SHOW GOOD CAUSE WHY WE CAN'T GET IT.

AND ONE GOOD REASON MAY BE THAT, UH, UH, THE RECORDS ARE, UH, ARCHIVED SOMEWHERE, UH, MAYBE IN THE LIBRARY OF VIRGINIA BECAUSE EVERY SO OFTEN, UM, UH, RECORDS HAVE TO BE SENT, UM, ACCORDING TO LAW, TO THE LIBRARY OF VIRGINIA.

AND THAT'S WHEN WE, WE PETITION THE COURT AND SAY, LOOK, THE RECORDS ARE IN VIRGINIA, UH, ENRICHMENT, AND WE HAVE TO LOCATE IT.

AND WE JUST DON'T KNOW WHERE IT IS, BUT WE'LL MAKE A GOOD FAITH EFFORT TO FIND IT, UM, UH, FAIL TO PRODUCE THE RECORD, OR WE DON'T RESPOND TO IT.

UH, THAT'S CONSIDERED A VIOLATION OF FOYA AND WE GET FINED FOR IT.

YOU DO IT A SECOND TIME.

YOU GET AN INJUNCTION AGAINST YOU AND YOU GET FINE, DEEPEN MORE AND APPLY.

IT CAN BE LEVEL LEVIED AGAINST THE INDIVIDUAL, AS WELL AS AGAINST THE TOWN.

UM, WE CAN ONLY CHARGE, UH, ACTUAL OUT-OF-POCKET COSTS.

IN OTHER WORDS, IF A, UH, THE PERSON WHO WORKS FOR A PLANNING AND ZONING, UH, GETS PAID A $20 AN HOUR, AND HE IS THE PERSON THAT ACTUALLY IS PRODUCING THE RECORDS.

HE CAN CHARGE $20 AN HOUR AND NO MORE, NO EXTRA PROFITS OR OVERHEAD OR ANYTHING ELSE.

UM, WE HAVE TO PRODUCE THE RECORD, UH, IN THE FORM THAT WE HAVE IT.

HOWEVER, IF SOMEBODY WANTS A HARD COPY OF IT, UH, AND WE ARE ABLE TO PRODUCE A HARD COPY, WE CAN DO THAT.

YOU HAVE TO DO THAT.

JUST, I'M SORRY TO INTERRUPT YOU.

UM, SO IF WE DO PREVENT LIKE PERCENT A HARD COPY, LIKE YOU SAID EARLIER, SOMETHING THAT WAS LIKE 75,000 DOCUMENTS IS THAT, SO IF THEY WANTED LIKE PAPER COPIES OF THAT, I'M ASSUMING THAT THE EXPENSE OF THE PAPER IN THEIR PRINTER, BECAUSE THE ANA EXPENSIVE PRINTER COPIER PRINTER IS THAT, IS THAT, UM, PASSED ON TO THE PERSON REQUESTING IT.

IT CAN BE WHAT YOU DO IS YOU, UH, BEFORE YOU CAN CHARGE A REQUESTER FOR IT, YOU HAVE TO MAKE A GOOD FAITH ESTIMATE OF WHAT IT'S GOING TO COST AND TELL THEM, LOOK, UM, WE CAN FURNISH IT TO YOU AT X COST.

IF WE GIVE IT TO YOU ELECTRONICALLY, LIKE IN A ZIP DRIVE OR A THUMB DRIVE OR WHATEVER IT'S GOING TO COST YOU, Y WHICH WILL BE FIVE TIMES AS MUCH, IF IT'S A PAPER COST, ARE YOU WILLING TO INCUR THAT EXPENSE? IF YOU ARE FINE, WHAT WE'LL SIT DOWN AND DO THAT FOR YOU? UM, YOU KNOW, WE CAN DO IT IN HOUSE.

WE MAY BE ABLE TO SEND IT TO A, UH, A PRINTER AND GET IT TO YOU A LITTLE CHEAPER, UM, YOUR OPTION, UH, BUT YOU KNOW, IT'S YOUR CALL AN OLD DOCUMENT.

AND IT HAS TO BE SCANNED BECAUSE, I MEAN, IF THEY FOUND ONE IT ELECTRONICALLY AND SOMEBODY'S GOT TO STAND AT WHAT YOU ALL USE HERE, BUT LIKE AT SCHOOL WE HAVE LIKE A COPIER THAT CAN SCAN IT AS A PDF.

SO I'M ASSUMING WHICHEVER EMPLOYEE HAS TO BE AT THE COPY OR SCANNING IT, WE WOULD CHARGE FOR THEIR TIME.

CORRECT.

OKAY.

I JUST, I'M JUST CURIOUS.

YEAH, THAT IS CORRECT.

UM, BEEN THERE AS A LAW ENFORCEMENT AND CRIMINAL RECORDS, UM, BASICALLY IF IT'S A, UM, CRIMINAL INCIDENT INFORMATION RELATING TO FELONY OFFENSES, UM, THE, UH, GENERAL DESCRIPTION OF THE CRIMINAL ACTIVITY REPORTED THE DATE OF THE ALLEGED CRIME, THE GENERAL LOCATION OF THE ALLEGED CRIME, THE IDENTITY OF THE INVESTIGATING OFFICER, OR THE POINT OF CONTACT AND A GENERAL DESCRIPTION OF ANY INJURIES SUFFERED OR PROPERTY DAMAGED OR STOLEN IS GIVEN.

AND OUR VERBAL RESPONSE IS SUFFICIENT.

UM, AND THE REASON FOR THAT IS IT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE GIVEN IN WRITING JUST A BOLD RESPONSE.

HOWEVER, IF THE RELEASE OF THE CRIMINAL INCIDENT INFORMATION IS LIKELY TO JEOPARDIZE ONGOING INVESTIGATION OR PROSECUTION, OR THE SAFETY OF AN INDIVIDUAL IT'S CAUSED THE SUSPECT TO FLEE OR INVADING THE DETECTION RESULT IN THE DESTRUCTION OF EVIDENCE, SUCH INFORMATION MAY BE WITHHELD UNTIL, UH, THAT, UH, DAMAGE, UH,

[00:15:01]

OR, UH, INJURY IS NO LIKELY, UH, TO OCCUR FROM THE RELEASE OF THE INFORMATION.

UM, AND, UH, ADULT ARREST, UH, PHOTOGRAPHS TAKEN DURING THE INITIAL, UH, INTAKE, UH, IS RELEASABLE EXCEPT WHEN NECESSARY TO AVOID JEOPARDIZING AN INVESTIGATION.

UH, IN FELONY CASES, OF COURSE, JUVENILE INFORMATION IS NOT RELEASABLE, UM, RECORDS OF COMPLETED, UH, UNINTENDED DEATH INVESTIGATIONS TO THE PARENT OR SPOUSE OF THE DECEDENT OR DUNIA FAMILY MEMBERS, UM, IS RELEASABLE TO THAT, TO FAMILY MEMBERS, BUT NOT TO OTHER, WHAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT IS, UH, UH, SUICIDES OR THINGS OF THAT NATURE.

THAT'S PRIVATE INFORMATION, UH, MISDEMEANOR INFORMATION IS GENERALLY, UH, RELEASABLE AND THE DISCRETION THAT THE LAW ENFORCEMENT THAT'S, UH, YOU MIND YOUR BUSINESS, THAT'S STRICTLY UP TO THE LAW ENFORCEMENT.

AND THIS IS FOR YOU ONLY WITH RESPECT TO RECORDS.

YOU ALSO COVER MEETING RECORDS.

DO YOU HAVE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? I'LL BE GLAD THAT ANSWERED IT.

SURE.

I JUST HAD A FEW, BUT, UM, SO IT'S, IT'S A VIRGINIA STATUTE THAT GOVERNS OUR, IT'S NOT, IT'S NOT THE TOWN STRICTLY STATE.

YES.

OKAY.

UM, IS IT POSSIBLE TO KNOW WHO THE REQUESTERS ARE FOR ON OUR END? YES.

THEY HAVE TO GIVE THEIR CONTACT INFORMATION, NAME, ADDRESS, AND OTHER CONTACT INFORMATION.

OKAY.

SO IS THAT, IS THAT INFORMATION TYPICALLY WE'D BE ABLE TO REVIEW LIKE THE LIST OF 91 THIS YEAR, JUST OUT OF CURIOSITY.

YEAH.

WE, WE, UH, MOST ALL THE REQUESTS ARE, UM, THEY'RE NOT ONLY IN WRITING BECAUSE WE DO ASK FOR IT.

UM, MOST OF IT COMES IN ONLINE.

OKAY.

UM, WHEN IT'S A REQUEST THAT PERTAINS TO US INDIVIDUALLY, WE ALWAYS HAVE KNOWLEDGE OF IT BECAUSE I KNOW THAT SOMETIMES THE TECHNOLOGY THAT'S FOR LIKE, UM, YOU KNOW, IT TO JUST GO IN AND GRAB EMAILS AND WE, WE ALWAYS WE'D BE MADE AWARE OF THAT.

I MEAN, IS, IS IT YOU ALL AS INDIVIDUALS? YEAH, I THINK IS A MATTER OF COURTESY.

OKAY.

JUST DOUBLE CHECK AND I THINK THAT'S IT.

OKAY.

AND YOU WENT IN THE HOUSE, HAVE YOU, IS THAT GOING TO FALL TO SCOTT'S HE ASKED ALMOST ONE OF MY QUESTIONS.

EXACTLY.

UM, IF THESE FOIL REQUESTS THAT CAME IN IN 91, UH, ARE WE ABLE TO SEE THEIR INVOICES THAT ARE ASSOCIATED WITH THEM AND HOW MUCH WAS, YOU KNOW, ESTIMATED OR CHARGED FOR HOURS ON THOSE ONES? UM, IS THAT PART OF THAT WE CAN SEE THE RECORD.

I'M SURE IF YOU WANT TO SEE THEM, WE'LL BE GLAD TO PROVIDE THEM.

NO.

UM, IT'S ALL PUBLIC 20, GIVE THAT PREDICTED 17 TO 1800 FOR CALENDAR YEAR 21.

HOW MANY WERE THERE IN 2020? I DON'T HAVE THAT.

WE COULD COMPILE THAT, BUT I DON'T HAVE IT BECAUSE I THINK THAT WOULD BE AN INTERESTING NUMBER JUST TO SEE AND HOW WE STACK UP.

UH, WE USED TO DO THAT WITH LIKE, UH, PERMITS, RIGHT? HOW MANY PERMITS WE'RE GETTING THAT LAST YEAR AT THE SAME TIME.

JUST CURIOUS TO SEE HOW IT STACKS UP.

UM, SO IF IT'S NOT, IF IT'S IN THE SCOPE OF A STAFF MEMBER, SO I GUESS I DON'T UNDERSTAND, I NEED TO ASK ONE QUESTION HERE ABOUT HOW STAFF MEMBERS ARE PAID.

ARE THEY PAID AS CONTRACTORS WITH BILLABLE HOURS OR ARE THEY PAID HOURLY FOR DUTIES PERFORMED WITH THE NEW LINE OF WORK? STAFF MEMBERS WERE PAID SALARIES.

OKAY.

SO IF WE'RE CHARGING THE PUBLIC FOR SOMETHING THAT'S IN THE, WITHIN THE SCOPE OF WORK OF A STAFF MEMBER DURING THEIR NORMAL HOURS, I'M ASSUMING THEY'RE NOT BEING DONE AFTER HOURS.

ARE WE DOUBLE BILLING THE PUBLIC BECAUSE THEY'RE BEING PAID SALARY.

AND THEN THEY'RE ALSO, NOW WE'RE BILLING THE PUBLIC FOR A FOYER REQUEST THAT IS RELATING TO SOMETHING THAT WOULD BE IN THE LINE OF WORK.

LIBBY MINUTE, GO AHEAD, STEVEN, GO AHEAD.

IT'S STATUTORY.

I MEAN, THAT'S A STATUTORY PROCESS.

THAT'S DRIVEN BY OUR STAFF COULD BE TIED UP DOING NOTHING, BUT FOR WE REQUEST AND NOT DOING THE DAY-TO-DAY BUSINESS OF THE TOWN, THAT'S WHY WE'RE WE CHARGE.

YEAH.

UM, IF IT WASN'T FOR THAT, THEN YEAH, WE WOULD BE STAFF.

WE'LL BE TIED UP DOING NOTHING BEFORE.

IN 2.2, THREE, SEVEN OH FOUR OF THE CODE OF VIRGINIA, WHICH DEALS WITH FOYA.

IT SAYS A PUBLIC BODY MAY MAKE REASONABLE CHARGES

[00:20:01]

NOT TO EXCEED ITS ACTUAL COSTS INCURRED IN ACCESSING DUPLICATING SUPPLY.

WE'RE SEARCHING FOR THE REQUESTED RECORDS, NO PUBLIC BODY SHALL IMPOSE ANY EXTRANEOUS INTERMEDIARY OR SURPLUS FEES OR EXPENSES THAT YOU COVERED TO REGROUP LIKE GENERAL COSTS.

THE GENERAL COST ASSOCIATED WITH CREATING OR MAINTAINING RECORDS OR TRANSACTING THE GENERAL BUSINESS OF THE PUBLIC BODY AND DUPLICATING FEE CHARGED ANY DUPLICATING FEE CHARGED BY A PUBLIC BODY SHALL NOT EXCEED THE ACTUAL COST OF DUPLICATION.

BUT YOU ALSO COVERED ALL CHARGES FOR THE SUPPLYING OF REQUESTED RECORDS SHALL BE ESTIMATED AND ADVANCES.

AND YOU ALSO MENTIONED THAT AS WELL, RIGHT? THAT'S WHY WE DON'T CHARGE FOR, UH, UH, MORE ROUTINE AND SMALLER AMOUNTS, BUT WHEN THEY BECOME LARGE AND, UM, UH, PANCAKES, TIME CONSUMING, WE FEEL LIKE WE NEED TO BECAUSE, UM, LIKE I'VE HAD, UM, SOME THAT TAKE WEEKS AND WEEKS TO DO, AND, UM, I CAN'T GET TO ANYTHING ELSE.

AND THAT'S WHY, AND THAT'S WHAT FOR YOU SPECIFICALLY AND EXPLICITLY PROVIDES FOR IT.

SO I HAVE A LITTLE BIT OF FEEDBACK FROM THE PUBLIC, UM, AND THEY TOLD ME THAT THEY'VE EXPERIENCED WHAT THEY FEEL IS VERY HIGH IN VOICES.

THAT'S WHY I ASKED TO SEE THEM.

SO I'LL BE INTERESTED TO SEE WHAT THOSE INVOICES ARE.

I JUST KNOW THAT IF THE THOUGHT AS A FEDERAL EMPLOYEE WAS TASKED TO COMPLETE A FOYER REQUEST, IN SOME RESPECT, WE WOULDN'T BUILD BACK THOSE HOURS FOR THAT REQUEST, UM, REGARDLESS OF HOW LONG IT TOOK.

UM, SO I DON'T KNOW.

IT JUST SEEMS LIKE THE, BEFORE WE REQUEST THAT, I THINK BROUGHT ALL THIS UP.

HOW, HOW BIG REQUEST WAS THAT? OH, WE GOT ONE.

UM, IT WAS EITHER AT THE END OF LA, I THINK IT WAS AT THE END OF THE LAST YEAR, UH, THAT, UH, WAS ALMOST 80,000 ON, UM, DOCUMENTS.

AND, UH, THERE WAS, IT'S A MATTER THAT RELATED, UH, TO OUR LAWSUIT, UH, AGAINST THE EDA.

AND, UM, THAT W IT WAS THE DOCUMENTS ARE, UH, UNDER THE PURVIEW OF THE SPECIAL GRAND JURY, WHICH WAS SUBJECT TO A BLANKET ORDER THAT THE DOCUMENTS WEREN'T SUPPOSED TO BE RELEASED.

UM, UM, SO IT, UM, AND RIGHT NOW WE'RE STILL IN LIMBO, WHETHER THEY CAN EVEN BE RELEASED AND WE WERE THREATENED WITH A LAWSUIT IF WE DIDN'T RELEASE HIM AND THREATENED WITH CONTEMPT OF COURT, IF WE DID.

AND, UM, THAT'S A CONUNDRUM.

SO CAN YOU SHARE THE RECENT ONE? WE HAD THE TWO, I RECALL YOU SAYING 15,000.

YEAH, THERE WAS ANOTHER ONE.

YEAH.

THAT, UM, JUST RECENTLY THAT WAS THIS YEAR, UH, UH, ONE OF, ALL OF THESE DOCUMENTS THAT WAS LIKE 15,000 DOCUMENTS, MOST OF WHICH HAD REALLY DIDN'T SEEM TO HAVE ANY, UH, YOUR NAME, JERMAINE THIS TO THE, UH, WHAT THE REQUEST OR REALLY WANTED TO.

AND, UM, BECAUSE I DON'T THINK THE REQUESTER, UM, MEANT TO ASK FOR THE BREADTH OF WHAT THE REQUESTS ARE ACTUALLY, UM, WROTE.

AND WE KIND OF NARROWED IT DOWN AND SAID, IS THIS WHAT YOU REALLY MEAN TO ASK FOR IT? AND THE REQUESTER SAID YES, BUT EVEN SO IT WAS A VERY LARGE NUMBER OF DOCUMENTS.

AND, UM, YEAH, I'M STAFF IS A, IT'S A SMALL NUMBER OF PEOPLE THAT WE HAVE HERE, UH, WHERE WE HAVE ABOUT SIX, SEVEN PEOPLE IN TOWN HALL.

UM, SO IT'S NOT LIKE, UM, IT'S LIKE, WE'RE A LARGE, UM, FEDERAL GOVERNMENT OR STATE GOVERNMENT.

I MEAN, W WE, WE'RE NOT ONLY THAT THE REQUESTER WAS ONCE IN GOVERNMENT AND HE KNEW, I MEAN, HE HE'S, HE'S BEEN HERE AND HE WAS, HE SAID AT THIS TABLE FOR A FEW YEARS, SO HE, HE, HE KNOWS.

AND I, AND, AND THE QUESTION IS, DO WE WORK AFTER HOURS? A GOOD EXAMPLE IS WE HAD A THREE-DAY HOLIDAY THIS PAST WEEKEND.

I WORKED ALL THREE DAYS, UH, 10 OR 12 HOURS ALL THREE DAYS.

SO YEAH, I DO WORK EXTRA HOURS.

I VERY SELDOM DON'T WORK WEEKENDS DAIRY.

JUST ONE POINT I WOULD LIKE TO MAKE, UM, YOU KNOW, UM, DOUG, I WAS TAKEN BACK THE FIRST TIME I HEARD THIS AND YOU CAN GET A FOUR YEAR REQUEST IN THE SUPERMARKET AND IT, YOU KNOW, I ALWAYS DUG IN AND, YOU KNOW, YOU PUT IT IN WRITING AND THAT'S THE FIRST THING THAT HE IS, HE HADN'T MADE CLEAR TO US.

UM, MY SECOND POINT IS, IS, IS WE, WE GOTTA CHARGE THIS, OR WE WOULD NOT GET ANYTHING DONE

[00:25:01]

HERE AS FAR AS DOING THE PEOPLE'S BUSINESS HERE FOR OUR TAIL.

THAT'S MY POINT, LAURIE.

UM, THE ONE THING THAT I, THE ONLY THING I WOULD SAY, AND LISTENING TO WHAT YOU WERE SPEAKING ABOUT IS, IS THAT IF, AND I HEAR WHAT, UM, COUNCILMAN MCFADDEN SAYING ABOUT, YOU KNOW, IF YOU'RE REALLY DOING IT DURING THE WORK HOURS THAT YOU'RE ALREADY BEING PAID FOR AND UNDERSTAND HOW THAT COULD SEE, YOU KNOW, BUT MY OTHER THOUGHT ON THAT IS, IS THAT IF, IF WE HAD LARGE REQUESTS LIKE THAT ALL THE TIME, IT COULD POSSIBLY, UM, LEAD US TO HAVE TO HIRE MORE STAFF, TO BE ABLE TO HANDLE THE FOYER REQUESTS AND THE THINGS LIKE THAT.

AND WHAT I WOULD, I WOULD NOT WANT TO DO IS TO INCUR MORE EXPENSES FOR THE TOWN'S CITIZENS OVERALL, TO HAVE TO HIRE EXTRA STAFF, TO BE ABLE TO FULFILL THESE REQUESTS.

I THINK THERE ARE SMALL REQUESTS AND THINGS THAT YOU COULD DO THEN, THEN I UNDERSTAND THAT.

BUT, BUT WHAT I WOULDN'T WANT US TO DO IS LITERALLY HAVE ONE DEPARTMENT AND THE TOWN HALL THAT'S JUST HANDLING FOYA.

THAT'S GONNA END UP COSTING THE TOWN, TAXPAYERS, ADDITIONAL SALARIES AND SUPPLIES AND THINGS LIKE THAT.

THAT THAT'S WHERE I FEAR THAT THIS COULD GO IF WE DON'T, IF WE DON'T HAVE ANY COSTS INCURRED WITH THE REQUESTS, UM, 91 AND 19 DAYS, 91 AND 19 DAYS.

AND I KNOW THEY'RE NOT ALL LARGE, BUT AS I SAID, YOU KNOW, UM, IT'S NOT LIKE THERE ARE PEOPLE SITTING OVER HERE TWIDDLING THEIR THUMBS WITH TIME ON THEIR HANDS TO BE RESEARCHING AND LOOKING THINGS UP AND THEN RUNNING IT BY YOU TO MAKE SURE IT WAS LEGAL TO BE SHARED AND, AND THEN COPIED OR SCANNED.

I JUST THINK THAT, I THINK THAT WOULD GET, UM, THAT, THAT COULD GET VERY TIME-CONSUMING FOR STAFF.

AND I, I WOULD THINK THE END RESULT WOULD BE, WE'RE GOING TO NEED MORE STAFF.

AND I DON'T, I DON'T KNOW THAT THAT'S, I DON'T KNOW THAT I WOULD LIKE TO GO IS TO ADD STAFF JAKE.

YEAH.

UM, I FEEL LIKE, I FEEL LIKE, UM, HAS SOME FAT IN IT, THERE IS A, THERE'S A QUESTION HERE THAT YOU WANT TO ASK OR YOU HAVE SPECIFIC PURPOSE.

SO THE KIND OF REQUESTS FOR LAST YEAR VERSUS THIS YEAR, OR THE TOTAL CHARGES BY REQUEST, I THINK YOU'RE ULTIMATELY GETTING AT SOMETHING.

UM, AND I, I MIGHT BE INFERRING THAT IT'S, UH, WE NEED TO REDUCE OUR CHARGES OR MAKE THIS EASY TO ACCESSIBLE OR WHATEVER IT MIGHT BE, BUT IS THERE A PARTICULAR, AND THAT YOU WANT OUT OF THIS THAT YOU CAN PUT ON THE TABLE TONIGHT THAT WE SAY, YOU KNOW, STEVEN, THIS IS WHAT WE NEED TO WORK TOWARDS OR COUNSEL, THIS IS WHAT I'M THINKING.

AND THEN WE NEEDED TO TRY TO ACCOMPLISH, UM, CAUSE I MEAN, I DON'T WANT TO CREATE MORE TIME AND EFFORT FOR, FOR STAFF TO TRY TO DIG UP MORE INFORMATION FOR US.

I'D RATHER JUST PUT IT OUT THERE, WHAT WE WANT THEM TO DO.

AND THEN LET'S, LET'S, LET'S BRING THAT BACK TO US AND A PROPOSAL TO ADDRESS IT, OR, YOU KNOW, AND GET COUNSEL TO LOOK AT IT THAT WAY OR WHATEVER WE WANT TO DO.

DOES THAT MAKE SENSE? IT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE.

UH, YOU KNOW, I'M LOOKING FOR DATA, I LIKE DATA.

I'M UNDERSTANDING, YOU KNOW, WHAT, WHAT IT ALL MEANS.

I'D LIKE TO SEE MORE DATA THAN WE HAVE.

AND, UM, SO YOU WANT TO BE, IT'S ALMOST THOUGH, I MEAN, IT'S ALMOST LIKE MICRO-MANAGING, YOU CAN GIVE ME A WEBSITE THAT YOU GIVE ME A WEBSITE AND SAY, IT'S PUBLIC KNOWLEDGE, GO FIND IT.

I DON'T KNOW WHERE TO FIND THAT INFORMATION.

SO IF THAT'S SOMETHING THAT'S READILY AVAILABLE TO THE PUBLIC DEFINED, I'M HAPPY TO GO THERE AND DO MY OWN RESEARCH.

I'M HAPPY TO, WELL, I'M SURE IF YOU WANT TO DO YOUR OWN RESEARCH, I'M SURE THEY HELP YOU OUT.

OKAY.

I'M HAPPY TO DO THAT.

WELL, I WAS IN, I UNDERSTAND YOU'RE LIKE THAT.

I WAS JUST TRYING TO FLUSH OUT IF THERE WAS SOMETHING HE WANTS TO WORK TOWARDS, WE CAN DO THAT.

UM, I JUST NEED TO KNOW THE DETAILS.

I NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT I HAVE THE RIGHT INFORMATION.

YOU KNOW, THIS ISN'T VERY IMPORTANT TO ME THAT I UNDERSTAND THINGS AS A NEW COUNCILMAN, THAT I DON'T JUMP INTO MAKING ANY JUDGEMENTS OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT.

THEN IN FACT, I HAVE THE INFORMATION PROVIDED AND I NEED TO KNOW.

AND SO THAT'S WHY I'M TRYING TO DO MY DUE DILIGENCE TO UNDERSTAND THINGS BEFORE I MAKE ANY, ANY JUDGEMENTS, NO RUSHING TO DOZENS ON ANYTHING ABOUT ANYTHING.

SO, SO MANY OF THE DATA.

SO WAS THERE SOMETHING MORE THAT DOUG NEEDED TO EXPLAIN TO YOU? ONE MORE QUESTION, WHICH WAS, HAVE WE EVER BEEN FINE? NOT TO MY KNOWLEDGE, WE TRIED VERY HARD TO COMPLY WITH THE ACT.

WELL, ONE OF THE REASONS I WAS ASKING ABOUT THE 91 REQUESTERS, I'M JUST CURIOUS IF THERE'S ANY RETREAT, EITHER REPEAT OR REPEAT ISSUES AND THAT DOESN'T NEED TO BE ANSWERED NOW.

I'M REALLY JUST CURIOSITY.

UH, THERE ARE A RE WELL, I CAN ANSWER, UH, THERE ARE A FEW REPEAT REQUESTERS ON, UH, ISSUES ARE A LOT OF TIMES TRAFFIC ACCIDENTS,

[00:30:01]

UH, REASSURANCE PURPOSES.

THAT'S A LOT ON SOMETIMES HOMEOWNERS OR WOULD BE, UH, PROSPECTIVE HOMEOWNERS, PROSPECTIVE BUSINESS PURCHASERS DOING YOUR DUE DILIGENCE THAT IT COMES UP A LOT LAWSUITS, UH, THAT COMES UP A LOT.

UM, SO THERE'S A MYRIAD OF ISSUES THAT, UH, UH, SEEMED TO BE, UH, OF, UH, CATEGORIES THAT COME UP A LOT.

BUT, UM, SOMETIMES IT'S, UH, UH, NEWS, UH, INVESTIGATIONS, JUST TRYING TO FIND OUT WHAT'S GOING ON THE BACKGROUND OF IT.

OKAY.

ANYBODY ELSE? OKAY, THANKS.

I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE, SO THE QUESTIONS OF, OF SEEKING INFORMATION WHEN IT COMES TO THIS NUMBER OF POINTS COMPARED TO LAST YEAR COST COMPARED TO THE COSTS AND HOW MANY DO WE WANT TO COMPARE? UH, MY UNDERSTANDING, UH, WE'LL WORK WITH, UH, UH, COUNCILMAN MCFADDEN TO JUST ONE-ON-ONE OR, OR OPEN THERE TO MAKE SURE.

WELL, I MEAN, I WAS TRYING TO ASK THE QUESTION BECAUSE I DON'T, I DON'T NEED THE INFORMATION UNLESS WE'RE TRYING TO WORK TOWARDS SOMETHING.

RIGHT.

I'M JUST TRYING TO GET THE INFORMATION TO HAVE INFORMATION.

SO, I MEAN, YOU WANT TO BE, YOU WANT TO KNOW EVERY REQUEST AND YOU WANT TO KNOW ALL THE DETAILS ON EACH WAY REQUEST.

IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING? UM, NOW I JUST WANT TO SEE THAT HISTORICAL STATISTICAL DATA.

SEE WHAT THAT MEANS.

OKAY.

THANK YOU.

HANG IT UP.

A STRANGE QUESTION IS SOMEBODY'S FOYER REQUEST FOIBLE NO, I'M JUST SAYING LIKE, FOR US, FOR, FOR, UM, COUNSELING FAD TO ASK, LIKE, YOU KNOW WHAT THEY WERE SO IT, SO THE PUBLIC COULD KNOW WHO WAS DOING ALL THE REQUESTING.

OKAY.

ALL RIGHT.

THANKS THOUGH.

OH, I'M SORRY.

I FORGOT YOU.

UH, WE HAVE AN ADDITION TO THE AGENDA AND I FORGOT TO ADD IT ON THE, UH, CHRIS ADD ADDITION FOR US AS WELL.

SHE'S NOT WATCHING THE RESOLUTION AND THEN THE STIPENDS FOR THE BOARD AND COMMISSIONS.

SO IT HAS TO BE UNANIMOUS TO ADD.

SO YOU WANT TO READ, YOU WANT TO READ THE SUMMARY AND THEN WE'LL READ A SUMMARY AND THEN TAKE A ROLL CALL.

AFTER STAFF'S REVIEW OF THE CURRENT STIPENDS FOR THE VARIOUS BOARDS, IT WAS DETERMINED THAT THE VARIOUS BOARDS HAD NOT HAD AN INCREASE IN 2011 TOWN MANAGER HICKS, A SUGGESTED AMENDING THE SPANKINGS TO MAKE THEM INLINE WITH THE COUNTY OF WARREN COUNTY DOES NOT HAVE A BAR AT THE JANUARY 11TH, 2021 WORK SESSION CLOSED MEETING COUNSEL DISCUSSED THE STIPENDS OF THE PLANNING COMMISSION BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS AND BOARD OF ARCHITECTURAL REVIEW.

THEY AGREED TO MAKE THE STIPENDS IN LINE WITH THE COUNTY OF WARREN'S PLANNING, COMMISSION AND BOARD OF ZONING APPEALS AND TO LEAVE THE BAR THE SAME.

IT WAS AGREED TODAY.

MEND THE STIPENDS AS FOLLOWS.

UM, THE PLANNING COMMISSION WOULD BE $100 PER MONTHLY MEETING ATTENDED THE BZA WOULD BE $75 PER MONTHLY MEETING ATTENDED, AND THE BAR WOULD STAY THE SAME AT $50 PER MONTHLY MEETING ATTENDED.

THERE WILL BE NO STIPEND FOR ADDITIONAL MEETINGS AND MEMBERS MUST ATTEND THEIR MONTHLY MEETING TO RECEIVE THEIR STIPEND.

DID SOMEBODY WANT TO MAKE A MOTION TO ADD, DO YOU HAVE TO DO THAT? UM, MAYOR I MOVE, WELL, HERE YOU GO.

I GUESS I WOULD MAKE IT THREE B CAUSE WE ALREADY DOWN, WE HAVE ZONING ORDINANCE AT THREE.

SO WE CAN WE MAKE THIS THREE B YES.

THAT'D BE A GOOD MOVE TO ADD TO THE AGENDA FOR THE WORK SESSION ON JANUARY THE 19TH, 2021, ITEM THREE B THE RESOLUTION TO AMEND STIPENDS FOR BOARDS AND COMMISSIONS AND THEN VICE MAYOR COCKREL YES.

COUNCILMAN GILLESPIE.

YES.

COUNCILMAN LOYD.

COUNCILMAN MCFADDEN.

YES.

COUNCILMAN MEZA YES.

COUNCILMAN THOMPSON.

YEAH, NO, WE JUST EDITED.

SO WE'RE GOING TO, UH, 20, 21 REVENUES CONTINGENCIES, MR. WILSON.

SO HE CAN SEE YOU SO WE CAN SEE SOME OF THE COUNCIL HERE FOR A MONTHLY REPORT FOR A REMEDIES EXTENDED SEASONS TO WHERE WE STAND.

UM, BACK WHEN THAT COVID FIRST HIT, WE PUT THE MONEY OVER INTO CONTINGENCIES TO KEEP IT ON THE SIDE, IN CASE OUR REVENUES COME IN LOWER THAN WHAT WE ANTICIPATED.

IS IT JUST TO KIND OF A MONTHLY REVIEW, QUICK OVERVIEW? THESE ARE NOT ALL OF OUR REVENUES, UH, APPROXIMATELY 78% OF OUR REVENUES.

SOME OF THE OTHER REVENUES

[00:35:01]

THAT ARE NOT SHARING ON HERE SUCH AS THE WHOLE REAL ESTATE PROPERTY TAX RECEIVERS UNTIL LATER IN THE YEAR.

UM, BUT OVERALL WE'RE KEEPING AN EYE ON IT.

WE'RE OVER IN SOME PLACES UNDER, UH, AND OTHERS.

UH, AS FAR AS THAT GOES, I'M HAPPY TO GO INTO MUCH DETAILS, UH, ON THESE ITEMS. UM, BUT OVERALL, NOTHING OF HUGE CONCERN AT THIS POINT, OR JUST CERTAINLY KEEPING A GOOD EYE ON SOME OF THESE ITEMS THAT CONTINGENCY AMOUNTS THAT WE HAVE SET ASIDE SHOULD INDEED COVER US, UH, THROUGH THE YEAR END.

UM, I WILL BE COMING BACK TO COUNCIL AS WE MOVE FORWARD TO REQUEST RELEASE.

AND SOME OF THE OTHER PHONES RIGHT NOW THAT ARE, UH, REQUESTS THAT I PRESENTED TO COUNCIL IS TO RELEASE THE STREET FUNDS.

THE STREET FUNDS IS FROM, WE HAVE RECEIVED TWO PAYMENTS FROM VDI.

UH, EVERYTHING'S ON TRACK TO RECEIVE THE REST OF THE PAYMENTS FOR THIS YEAR.

SO WE'D LIKE TO GO AHEAD AND RELEASE THE, UH, THE CONTINGENCY AMOUNTS FOR $187,365 THERE.

UM, MOVING ON TO THE LAST PAGE, THEY ARE DELINQUENT UTILITY ACCOUNTS.

WHAT WE DID YESTERDAY, I'M SORRY.

SORRY.

THE, UM, I JUST REALIZED TOO, WE USED TO HAVE A CONTENT LIKE THE ITEMIZED LIST OF CONTINGENCY ITEMS THAT CORRESPONDED WITH THESE ACCOUNTS.

UM, I'M NOT SURE IF, UM, THE NEW COUNCIL MEMBERS HAD SEEN THAT WE CAN CERTAINLY PUSH THAT DOWN, PUSH THAT OUT.

SO I WAS JUST GONNA REITERATE TO, YOU MAY HAVE HEARD THIS FROM PRIOR MEETINGS, BUT WHEN COVID HIT THIS COUNCIL WENT THROUGH, UH, AN EXHAUSTIVE LIST OF ITEMS THAT WE COULD TAKE OFF THE TABLE FOR THE YEAR, UM, THAT WERE BUDGETED AND WE WERE READY TO SPEND THE MONEY.

UM, BUT WE WANTED TO REMOVE IT AND WAIT TO SEE HOW OUR REVENUES TRENDED.

AND THEN WE WOULD SLOWLY ADD BACK THINGS IN FROM THAT LIST IN PURCHASE AS A, AS OUR REVENUES TRENDED, WHERE WE THOUGHT THAT WAY, IF THEY DIDN'T, OBVIOUSLY WE DIDN'T SPEND THE MONEY AND WE KEPT THE TOWN GOOD SHAPE.

UM, THEN WE HAVE RELEASED SOME OF THE ITEMS, SOME OF THE ITEMS THAT, UH, UM, YOU'LL SEE IN THE PURPLE, THERE ARE THINGS THAT WE'VE, UH, USED ON CONTINGENCY.

UH, THE STREET FUNDS IS MAINLY THE PAYMENT, OBVIOUSLY, UH, YOU'D HAVE MAINTENANCE, SO IT'S GOING TO GO FORWARD.

UM, UNFORTUNATELY IT'S GOING A GOOD PAVING.

UM, BUT I CAN CERTAINLY PUSH OUT THE, UM, UM, THE DETAILED LIST ON THAT.

THAT'S NOT A PROBLEM.

SO CAN YOU PUSH OUT THE ORIGINAL ONE THAT HAD LIKE THE WHOLE KITTEN CABOODLE? YEP.

OKAY.

UM, DID YOU, CAN I ASK YOU A QUESTION ABOUT WHAT MERIT AND COMP STUDY IS THE THIRD YEAR OF OUR COMPENSATION STUDY FOR OUR PULLEYS AND THE MERIT RAISES THIS YEAR, WE DID GO BACK TO JULY 1ST AND IMPLEMENT THAT, UM, FOR ALL EMPLOYEES, THE MERITS ARE BASED ON YOUR EVALUATION DATE.

UM, AND IT'S NOT A SPECIFIC AMOUNT BASED ON THEIR PAGE GRADE, BASICALLY ON JANUARY.

WE HELD THAT FOR ABOUT ALMOST FIVE MONTHS WITH ACTUALLY YEAH, THE, UM, THE COMPENSATION STUDY WAS PAID OUT.

UM, LET ME THINK ABOUT THIS COMPENSATION WAS PAID UP IN DECEMBER AND THEN THE, UM, THE MERITS THAT I SHOULD BE, UH, FINGERS CROSSED OUR NEXT PAYABLE.

SO WE HELD OFF ON THIS INSTEAD OF HITTING OUR IMPLEMENTATION DATE AS PART OF THE CONTINGENCY PLANS AS WELL.

I'M SORRY.

I WAS GETTING THERE.

YES.

SO THE, UM, UH, UTILITY ACCOUNTS AND THIS, THIS IS, UH, CERTAINLY A GOOD ITEM HERE.

THE, UH, THE NUMBER OF ACTIVE UTILITY ACCOUNTS, UH, THAT ARE DELINQUENTS THAT HAS BEEN INTRODUCED IN NOVEMBER OF 2020.

WE WERE WITH 1,083, RIGHT NOW WE'RE AT 722.

UM, AS WELL AS THE DOLLAR AMOUNT WITH THAT, UM, WENT DOWN, UH, AS WELL, NOVEMBER, UH, 2020 WAS 576,000, DECEMBER, 2020 IS 482,000.

A LOT OF THAT HAS CONTRIBUTED TO THE, UH, THE FUNDS THAT WE RECEIVED FROM SOCIAL SERVICES FOR PEOPLE ASSISTANCE.

UM, THE FUEL ASSISTANCE FUND, UH, SOCIAL SERVICES PAYS A PORTION OF THE UTILITY BILL.

WHEN I SAY PORTION, THEY'LL PAY THE, UM, THE ELECTRIC PORTION OF YOUR BILL.

AND, UM, WE HOLD ON TO THAT MONEY UNTIL ABOUT MARCH AND IT'S APPLIED AS WE MOVE ALONG.

SO, UH, SOME CUSTOMERS, YOU KNOW, YOU USE IT UP RIGHT OFF THE BAT, OTHERS THAT'LL LAST THEM.

UM, ANY QUESTIONS ON THIS? I'M HAPPY TO DIG INTO ANYTHING, A LITTLE DEEPER IF YOU'D LIKE IT, IS IT A RIGHT LINE OF THINKING? I THINK WITH HER ENTERPRISE FUNDS, IF ANY OF THEM ARE SIGNIFICANTLY OFF THIS YEAR AND WE HAVE A DEFICIT, WE HAVE COSTS THAT WE HAVE TO OVERCOME NEXT YEAR, THAT WE WOULD ADJUST THE RATES TO DO THAT.

UM, THAT ISN'T THE CORRECT.

THE, UM, UH, SO THE, UH, YOU MAY REMEMBER, UH, SOME OF THE OTHERS MAY NOT OBVIOUSLY, BUT THE, UH, UM, WE HAD A COST OF SERVICE STUDY DONE FOR THE WATER AND SEWER.

UH, WE DID PUSH OFF THE WATER, RAISING THE WATER RATES LAST YEAR.

WE DIDN'T HAVE AT 19, UH, THIS YEAR, UH, THE ISA THIS YEAR, UH, EFFECTIVE JULY 1ST, THE A, IT WOULD BE A 2% INCREASE.

[00:40:01]

SO IT WILL BE 3.5% INCREASE BASED UPON THE COST OF SERVICE STUDY.

THAT WAS DONE.

POINT THAT OUT TOO.

CAUSE WE HAVE A LITTLE BIT MORE CONTROL ON ENTERPRISE, UM, GENERAL FUND.

UM, IT'S NOT LIKE WE CAN JUST GO BACK TALK TAX BASE AND RAISE TAXES, OVERCOME DEFICIT.

SO THE ONLY THING YOU COULD DO TYPICALLY WHEN YOU'RE IN A SITUATION LIKE THIS, AND WE ALSO DID WHEN WE WERE IN A MALL RECESSION BACK IN THE DAY IS YOU ALWAYS TAP INTO YOUR UNASSIGNED FUND BALANCE TO MAKE UP THE DIFFERENCE, WHICH AGAIN IS JUST DEPLETING.

YOUR SAVINGS WAS GENE.

IS IT YOUR UNDERSTANDING THAT FUNDS BALANCE IS THAT USUALLY REFERRED TO AS THE, EACH, EACH ACCOUNT HAS A, ON A SIGN AND FUND BALANCE AND WHAT IT IS IS PRETTY MUCH RESERVED.

AND TYPICALLY IN THE GENERAL FUND, WE TRY TO MAINTAIN AT LEAST SO 30% OF YOUR TOTAL OPERATION FOR UNFORESEEN, THEN YOU TRY TO DO THE SAME, OR YOU ALSO USE IT AS A WAY TO USE IT FOR ONE TIME, CAPITAL PURCHASES THAT'S APPROPRIATE, BUT YOU KNOW, YOU WANT TO REFRAIN AS MUCH AS YOU CAN USE IT.

ANY IDEA OF THAT, THAT SHE CAN WHAT'S OUR CURRENT.

AND WHAT PERCENTAGE IS OUR CURRENT RESERVE AT EACH FUND? EACH FUND IS A LITTLE NOW HE FUNDS A LITTLE DIFFERENT, I BELIEVE HE'S AND ELECTRICAL POLO, THE RESERVE AMOUNTS, UM, GENERAL MINE DEPENDS ON IF YOU TAKE THE INTO ACCOUNT, THE OTHER ONE, UM, THAT'S A KIND OF A GRAY AREA.

UH, WE COULD HAVE AN ENTIRE SUBJECT ON THIS.

IF I WANT TO STOP THREE MONTHS, ROUGHLY THREE MONTHS, THREE MONTHS WHAT'S RECOMMENDED BY THE STATE, RIGHT? YES.

YEAH.

THE, UM, IT'S SOMETHING WE'D GO INTO DETAIL WITH FINANCE MAY REVIEW.

OKAY, GREAT.

THANK YOU.

ANYBODY ELSE THERE? JUST FOR SOME HISTORY THERE TOO, THERE'S BEEN SIGNIFICANT DEBATE AROUND THIS TABLE AND THAT'S WHY PEOPLE ARE LAUGHING ON WHETHER OR NOT WE SHOULD TAP INTO THOSE.

YOU ROLL YOUR EYES AT THAT ONE, YOU KNOW, YOU KNOW, YOU KNOW, THERE WAS, UM, LIKE WHAT DO YOU DO ONCE YOU START DATING FOUR MONTHS, FIVE MONTHS? LIKE, DO YOU HOLD ONTO THAT MONEY FOR RAINY RAINY DAYS? OR CAN WE START SPENDING IT? OR ANYWAYS, IT'S A BALANCING ACT.

AND I THINK A LOT OF THAT IS BASED ON, AND I ENCOURAGED IS BASED ON THE PROJECTED REVENUES OF HOW THE FYI 2223 ALSO KEEP IN MIND THAT ASSESSMENTS ARE GOING UP.

BUT AT THE SAME TIME, YOU KNOW, THAT SOME ECONOMISTS ARE SAYING TWO YEARS, YOU KNOW, THINGS MAY NOT BE THE SAME.

SO, YOU KNOW, YOU SAVE NOW AND EITHER YOU DON'T HAVE TO SPEND IT, BUT, UH, AT THE, UH, AT THE NEXT, UH, REP WORK SESSION, WE ARE GONNA, I AM GONNA SHARE MY RECOMMENDATION FOR THE UPCOMING BUDGET PROCESS.

JUST GIVE YOU A SENSE, WHAT WE'RE THINKING.

SO I KNOW I'M TAKING, I ASK A LOT OF QUESTIONS IN THESE SESSIONS.

THERE MIGHT BE AN OPPORTUNITY TO JUST KIND OF PUT TWO AND TWO TOGETHER.

IF I WERE TO MAYBE MAKE AN APPOINTMENT WITH LIKE BJ AND MEET WITH HIM AND ASK THESE QUESTIONS.

IS THAT SOMETHING THAT'S PROBABLY A BETTER WAY FOR ME TO BE DOING THIS THAN JUST WAITING TO WORKSPACE? YEAH.

MAYBE, MAYBE NOT.

UM, THAT'S A GOOD THING.

I'M NOT SURE HOW THAT ALL WORKS.

SO, UM, YEAH, MAYBE I'LL AFTER THE MEETING, I CAN ASK YOU WHEN'S A GOOD TIME.

THANKS.

I CERTAINLY SPENT MY TIME AND ALL THE DIRECTORS OPPOSITES, I JUST DIDN'T REALIZE THAT WAS A THING.

SO, AND BJ IS A GREAT TEACHER.

ANYBODY ELSE? ALRIGHT.

SO ANY WARNINGS, TIM, WE ALL LAUGH.

WHAT ARE Y'ALL LAUGHING AT? HOW'S IT GOING? YES, I CAN BE RIGHT IN THERE.

READY TO, YEAH.

PREVIOUSLY I BROUGHT THE COUNCIL'S DETENTIONS, UM, UH, PROBLEMS THAT I HAD ENCOUNTERED WITH APARTMENT PERMITTING AND THOSE PROBLEMS WERE PRIMARILY TARGETED IN THE DOWNTOWN BUSINESS DISTRICT.

SO WHAT I'VE PREPARED SINCE OUR LAST MEETING IS A PROPOSAL SET OF, UH, RECOMMENDED CHANGES.

AND I, AND I DID MAKE THESE SPECIFIC TO THE C2 DOWNTOWN BUSINESS DISTRICT, BECAUSE THAT IS WHERE EACH OF THE PROBLEM ACTUALLY DID OCCUR.

[00:45:01]

AS I TRIED TO BE PRECISE, UH, TO WHERE THE PROBLEM WAS, WHAT I LOOKED AT DOING.

AND WHAT YOU HAVE BEFORE YOU IS IN TERMS OF THE SEAT RESIDENTIAL DISTRICTS.

ONE OF THE CHANGES I MADE WAS IT DOES ALLOW BY RIGHT TO CONVERT BUILDINGS WITH A GREATER NUMBER OF UNITS.

AND I PUT THAT NOT TO EXCEED SIX, AND THAT WOULD JUST BE CONSIDERED A MULTI-FAMILY DWELLING BY, BY OUR DEFINITION.

SO THAT WOULD KIND OF KICK YOU OUT OF THE APARTMENT AND LET YOU DO UP TO SIX UNITS IN THE DOWNTOWN AREA BY RIGHT ALSO IN, UM, SECTION ONE 75, 48, UH, I CAN LEAVE IT APART.

UH, A PORTION PREVIOUSLY, RENT, APARTMENTS LOCATED, AND BUILDINGS CONSTRUCTED AFTER JANUARY ONE, 1999 HAD TO OCCUR.

I RESEARCHED COULD NOT FIND THE SIGNIFICANCE OF WHAT THAT DATE MEANT.

SO I DID STRIKE THAT, THAT DATE FROM THERE AND JUST KEPT IT SIMPLE TO, UH, APARTMENT USE, UH, REGARDLESS OF THE YEAR OF, OF WHAT THE YEAR WAS AND LET SOMEONE ON COUNCIL HAS SOME SIGNIFICANCE FOR THAT.

ONE OF THE BIGGEST, UH, OBSTACLES, UH, FOR A MAJOR PROJECT WE HAD WAS LOT SIZE.

SO UNDER SECTION ONE 49 AREA REGULATIONS OF C2, WHAT I DID WAS SIMPLY MAKE IT THAT, UM, THERE ARE NO AREA REQUIREMENTS EXCEPT IN THE CASE OF APARTMENTS, UH, WHEREBY THE LOT MUST BE 3000 SQUARE FEET.

AND AFTER THAT I DELETED LANGUAGE, WHICH ADDED 1000 SQUARE FEET FOR EACH INDIVIDUAL DWELLING UNITS.

WHAT I'M DOING THERE IS JUST LETTING THE SIZE OF THE PARCEL, THE MINIMUM SIZE OF APARTMENT HEIGHT, ALL THESE OTHER FACTORS.

I GOT A GOOD CONTROL, DID IT THAT DENSITY.

SO I DID NOT SEE A NEED FOR AND EXPRESS THE DENSITY REQUIREMENT JUST GIVES A LITTLE BIT MORE LATITUDE AND WHAT THAT DOES, YOU KNOW, I I'VE ALSO, UH, MADE IT THAT PUTS IT UNDER A, THIS IS A SPECIAL USE PERMIT CONDITION.

AND, UM, ONE OF THE LARGEST CHANGES, UM, THAT I HAVE IN HERE IS THAT WHAT I DID DELETE WAS, AND YOU'LL SEE IN SECTION ONE 75, UM, DASH ONE 33 SAYS ALL APARTMENT DEVELOPMENTS, EXCEPT FOR THE APARTMENT, UH, DEVELOPMENT OCCURRING IN THE DOWNTOWN C2 BUSINESS DISTRICT SHALL COMPLY WITH THE FOLLOWING REGULATIONS.

AND JUST TO REFRESH YOUR MEMORY CARE, WERE THEY THREE OR FOUR PAGES OF VOLUMINOUS REGULATIONS CONCERNING APARTMENTS? AND WHAT I'VE DONE BY REMOVING THAT FROM THE C2 DISTRICT HAS REMOVED THOSE CONSTRAINTS.

THE LARGEST ONE WAS THE 10,000 SQUARE FOOT LOT SIZE, WHICH WAS THE DEPTH.

NOW ONE PROJECT THAT WE HAD IN THE DOWNTOWN AREA, THAT THE COUNCIL WOULD STILL BE FREE TO USE THESE AS A GUIDELINE AND THE C2 DISTRICT.

BUT, BUT WHAT I'M DOING IS PROVIDING YOU WITH AS MUCH FLEXIBILITY AS POSSIBLE TO TAKE A LOOK AT APARTMENT DEVELOPMENT ON A CASE BY CASE BASIS, BECAUSE THE LOT SIZE IS THE EXISTING DEVELOPMENT.

IT IS A DIFFERENT ENVIRONMENT THAN WHAT YOU FIND IN OTHER AREAS OF THE TOWN AND THE CONCEPT OF THE ONE SET OF APARTMENT REGULATIONS.

IT'S ALL JUST DOESN'T WORK REAL WELL.

AND IT WORKS PROBABLY WORST OF ALL AND THAT, SO WHAT I'VE DONE IS ELIMINATE THOSE OR RECOMMENDED THE ELIMINATION OF THOSE IN THEIR ENTIRETY.

SO YOU WOULD NOT BE CONSTRAINED BY THOSE, BUT YOU COULD CERTAINLY USE THESE AS GUIDELINES.

AND THOSE AREN'T THE RECOMMENDATIONS THAT I DO HAVE AS I EXPRESSED BEFORE.

UH, I WANTED TO, UH, PROVIDE YOU THIS COUNSEL WITH AS MUCH FLEXIBILITY AND LOOKING AT INDIVIDUAL PROPOSALS, UNFETTERED BY, UH, MANDATORY REQUIREMENTS AND THAT YOU COULD IMPOSE WHATEVER REQUIREMENTS THAT YOU DEEMED NECESSARY FOR THE PROJECT OR FOR THE BETTERMENT OR SO THERE'LL BE NO ADVERSE IMPACTS FOR OTHER BUSINESSES OR SO FORTH IN THE DOWNTOWN AREA.

AND I DO SUPPORT THESE.

IF THE COUNCILS SUPPORT THESE AS WRITTEN, THE NEXT STEP WOULD BE, UH, I WOULD PREPARE A RESOLUTION BY WHICH THAT'S HOW YOU WOULD OFFICIALLY ADOPT THAT, AND THAT WOULD KICK OFF THE TRADITIONAL PUBLIC HEARING PROCESS.

THEY WOULD SEND IT TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION RECOMMENDATION, THEN BACK TO THIS COUNCIL FOR FORMAL ACTION, OR IT COULD BE READINGS.

I THINK IT DOES START STORE.

I THINK YOU'VE DONE THE TWO, TWO RATINGS ON, ON, ON THE ZONING, JAKE.

YEAH, I WAS JUST GOING TO SAY IT A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENTLY.

YOU'RE SAYING YOU'RE GIVING COUNSEL THE MOST FLEXIBILITY IN DEALING WITH IT.

UM, WHERE I WOULD SAY IT A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENTLY AS YOU KNOW, WE WANTED YOU

[00:50:01]

TO HAVE THE MOST FLEXIBILITY TO WORK WITH INDIVIDUALS, TO DEVELOP OUT DOWNTOWN AND APARTMENTS AND EVERYTHING, UM, AND NOT HAVE SO MANY, SO MANY CONSTRAINTS PREVENTING THEM FROM BEING CREATIVE AND THINKING ABOUT WAYS TO, UM, COME UP WITH, UH, APARTMENT SPACING.

UM, THAT'S WHAT WE WANT, UM, QUITE NUANCE, BUT TRYING TO MAKE IT, YOU KNOW, AS YOU'VE DONE, TRYING TO MAKE THIS EASIER FOR PEOPLE TO DEVELOP DOWN THERE AND NOT SO RESTRICTIVE.

YEAH, VERY WELL NOTED.

AND WHAT I DID, WHAT I DID, I BUMPED THAT UP TO SIX BY RIGHT.

CAUSE BEFORE THE TRADITIONAL NUMBER TO TRIGGER APARTMENT WOULD BE, IF YOU HAD THREE UNITS, YOU WOULD BE APARTMENT.

SO I DID PROVIDE A LITTLE BIT MORE LATITUDE ON ADMINISTRATIVE, BUT AS IT BECAME A LARGER PROJECT, I THOUGHT IT WAS PROBABLY BEST LUCK WITH, WITH, WITH THE COUNCIL TO, TO TAKE A LOOK ON A CASE BY CASE.

BUT ONE MORE THING ON THAT.

IT DOES GET HARD IF THERE'S, IF THERE, I CAN'T THINK OF THE SITUATION NECESSARILY OFF THE, OFF THE CUFF, BUT IF, IF EVERY PERMIT THAT'S COMING THROUGH IS DIFFERENT AND THEY EACH COME UP TO COUNCIL, THEN ONE COUNCIL MIGHT APPROVE ONE, WHEREAS THE NEXT COUNCIL MIGHT NOT APPROVE THE OTHER ONE.

AND SO THAT'S WHERE I'M TRYING TO PUSH BACK MORE ON THE PLANNING COMMISSION AND, UM, IN YOUR ROLE, UM, SO THAT THERE'S CONSISTENCY IN HOW WE'RE APPROACHING IT AND APPROVING.

UM, AND PERHAPS, MAYBE THOSE ONE-OFFS THAT ARE STRONGLY APPROVED BY THE PLANNING COMMISSION IN YOU ARE SUPPORTED BY THE PLANNING COMMISSION IN YOU COUNCIL CAN ADOPT KNOWING THAT YOU GUYS WENT THROUGH THAT PROCESS.

IF THAT MAKES SENSE.

I JUST, JUST TRYING TO PREVENT COUNCIL TO REMAIN IN THAT SITUATION WHERE WE'RE CONSTANTLY TRYING TO DECIDE THE ONE-OFFS.

YEAH.

ESPECIALLY.

SO WHILE MASSAGE IN THE US IS COUNSEL AND SUPPORTIVE OF THE SIX EXISTING ON 12 LANES IN A COMBINE, OR WOULD YOU WANT MORE FLEXIBILITY FROM AN ADMINISTRATIVE APPROVAL STANDPOINT, WE CAN MAKE THAT LARGER.

AND, AND JUST THE OTHER REASON WHY I LOOKED AT THE STRIKING THAT SECTION ONE 13 IN ITS ENTIRETY IS THAT THAT GIVES YOU THE MOST LATITUDE THAT PUBLIC HEARING.

IF THERE ARE CERTAIN ELEMENTS OF ONE 13, AND YOU MAY WISH TO RETAIN, YOU CAN DO IT BY SAYING, BUT BY SAYING THAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT RESCINDING THE ENTIRE SECTION, THAT GIVES YOU GREAT FLEXIBILITY TO, IF YOU WANT TO HANG ON TO CERTAIN PORTIONS OF THAT, AFTER YOU GO THROUGH YOUR HEARING PROCESS, YOU HAVE THE ABILITY TO DO SO.

I LIKE TO SEE IT'S INCREASED OR NOT EVEN HAVE A NUMBER, OR, YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN, IS THERE A WAY WE COULD, UH, WELL, A CASE BY CASE BASIS, MAYBE I THINK, I THINK THE BEST THERE NEEDS TO BE SOME PARAMETERS, RIGHT? I MEAN, AND I WOULD, I'D BE COMFORTABLE WITH EIGHT BECAUSE OUTSIDE OF THAT, YOU'RE STARTING AND YOU'RE LOOKING AT A LITTLE BIT MORE, FIRST OF ALL, THE NET LAND FOR THEM TO BUILD THAT MANY WILL BE LIMITED ANYWAYS.

AND THEN DEPENDING ON THE SIZE AND DUPLEX, I THINK COUNCIL SHOULD WEIGH IN BASED ON SOMEWHAT THE CONSTITUENTS CONCERNS AND GO WE'LL HAVE TRIGGER POINTS WHERE AS PART OF THE SUP WE'LL BE ABLE TO KIND OF WORK WITH THE DEVELOPER BECAUSE YOU'LL BE ABLE TO HAVE SOME INPUT ON IT.

I JUST WANT TO SAY, THANKS.

UM, THIS IS PERFECT BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, IT GIVES A FUTURE OF INVESTORS, DEVELOPERS, A WAY TO PUT USE A LOT OF THE UPSTAIRS SPACE IN THESE BUILDINGS HERE ON THE DOWNTOWN AREA.

AND, YOU KNOW, AT 300 SQUARE FEET, THAT'S A PERFECT STUDIO APARTMENT.

YOU KNOW, WE NEED MORE OF THOSE.

SO THANK YOU.

ARE WE GOOD WITH EIGHT, CHANGING THAT TO EIGHT AND GET RID OF ONE 13? YEAH, I'VE GOT TWO QUESTIONS.

SO WHAT IMPACT WOULD THIS HAVE ON THOSE UNITS THAT ARE CURRENTLY LIKE NON-CONFORMING IN THE DOWNTOWN AREA? WOULD IT HAVE ANY IMPACT? BECAUSE I KNOW THERE'S A LOT OF COMMON ISSUES WHERE YOU'VE GOT, UM, JUST REALLY BAD LIVING CONDITIONS, OTHER THINGS LIKE THAT, WOULD THIS, WOULD THIS ALLOW ANY, IS THIS GOING TO IMPACT THAT AT ALL OR NO? AND THE SECOND ONE WAS, UM, SO IF I WENT TO THE PUB, THE PLANNING COMMISSION, WHAT JAKE WAS SAYING TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION, IT WOULD GO THROUGH A PUBLIC HEARING THERE AS WELL.

SO I GUESS THE LAST COMMENT THEN, I MEAN, YOU'RE MORE OF A COMMENT THAN A QUESTION.

SO IF YOU WERE STANDING, YOU WOULD COME TO COUNCIL FOR A PUBLIC HEARING, BUT IT WAS GOING THROUGH THE PLANNING COMMISSION ALREADY FOR THAT.

SO WE ALMOST HAVE LIKE DOUBLE LAYER OF PUBLIC HEARING ON THAT FOR THE CITY.

UH, SORRY.

IF, IF WE HAD AN SUP OR AN APPROVAL ON SOMETHING OUTSIDE OF SEVEN OR HEY, WE'RE GOING WITH IT, RIGHT? YEAH, YEAH, YEAH.

OKAY, GOOD.

THANKS, TIM.

WE'LL HAVE THAT RESOLUTION FOR YOU, RIGHT? YOU WANT THIS

[00:55:03]

RESOLUTION BECAUSE A MISTYPE IS FOR BOARDS AND COMMISSIONS.

WE, I THINK WE TALKED ABOUT THIS AT THE LAST WORK SESSION AND THIS IS WHAT WE ALL PRETTY MUCH AGREED ON.

OKAY.

I WAS CONFUSED WHEN THIS WAS BEING ADDED TO THE AGENDA OR DID WE ADD IT TO THE AGENDA TO VOTE ON THIS? OR I DON'T THINK WE COULD VOTE WITH THIS.

IS THERE A REGULAR MEETING? I WAS A LITTLE CONFUSED WHEN I SEEN IT TOO, BECAUSE IT'S LIKE A TEST.

THE VOTE ARE THE ONES THAT I WOULD HAVE THOUGHT THIS WOULD HAVE BEEN AT A REGULAR MEETING.

YOU KNOW WHAT, ACTUALLY, YEAH, IT WAS A CLOSED SESSION.

IT WOULD COME OUT.

OKAY.

ANY MORE DISCUSSION ON IT.

SO W AND TO THE NEXT STEP, YES.

SET AGENDA.

YEAH.

I DON'T KNOW IF THIS IS, SO THIS ISN'T THE TIME TO, I WAS JUST GOING TO SAY, AS FAR AS THE PUBLIC'S KNOWLEDGE.

YES.

WE'RE INCREASING IT.

BUT WHEN WE LOOK AT THE OVERALL PICTURE WITH THE AMOUNT OF PEOPLE, IT'S NOT GONNA MAKE A HUGE IMPACT IN OUR BUDGET TO INCREASE THESE STIPENDS.

AND WE'RE HOPING THAT THAT WILL INCREASE THE, YOU KNOW, THE PEOPLE INTERESTED IN SERVING FOREST, BRINGING US UP TO PAR WITH THE COUNTY AND ENCOURAGING ANYBODY.

I DON'T THINK THE A HUNDRED DOLLARS OR $50 MEETING FEES ENCOURAGING ANYBODY ONE WAY OR THE OTHER.

NO, BUT I THINK WE FIGURED OUT WAS LIKE $1,800 MORE.

IT WAS LIKE, WE CAN PUT THAT IN THE, IF IT'S GOING TO ON CONSENT, PERHAPS YOU CAN PUT IT IN THE SUMMARY.

CAN WE PUT THAT IN CONSENT? DOUG, CAN WE PUT THIS IN CONSENT SINCE IT'S? OR SHOULD WE, YOU CAN, AS LONG AS YOU HAVE THE REQUISITE VOTE, UM, UM, WELL, DID ME DO THAT? I AGREE WITH JAKE, I THINK PUTTING IN THE SUMMARY, WHAT, HOW MUCH MONEY THIS WOULD IMPACT IS A GOOD THING FOR, FOR THE PUBLIC TOO.

ALL RIGHT.

WHAT WAS IT FOR YOU CAN DISCUSSION OVER LIMIT TO DO, WHEREAS LIKE YOUR REGULAR MEETING AGENDAS.

I KNOW WE TALKED ABOUT THIS A COUPLE OF DIFFERENT TIMES.

DO YOU REMEMBER, WAS THERE, WAS THERE AN OPTION FOR WHAT YOU MIGHT THINK THE ORDER OF BUSINESS WOULD BE ABLE TO TURN OUT? WELL, I THINK AT THE FIRST REGULAR MEETING OF EACH YEAR, I THINK WE'RE, WE WOULD SET THE AGENDA AS WE SEE FIT FOR THE YEAR, BUT I BELIEVE WE COULD ALSO CHANGE IT IN MY RIGHT STEVEN.

WE COULD CHANGE IT FIRST, REGULAR SCHEDULED MEETING.

YOU WOULD SET HOW OFTEN COUNCIL WANTS TO MEET AND GIVES YOU THE FLEXIBILITY.

AND THEN YOU WOULD SET, UM, THROUGHOUT THE, THE DATES AND TIMES.

AND THEN IF FOR SOME REASON YOU ALL WANT TO CHANGE THAT.

AND IN THE MIDDLE OF THE YEAR, IT GIVES YOU THAT FLEXIBILITY.

YOU WANT IT TO BE, IF IT'S NOT GOING, IF, IF THE IDEA TO CHANGE THE ORDER OF THE MEETING, DO YOU HAVE A PROPOSED IDEA OF HOW YOU WOULD LIKE THE MEETING TO RUN VERSUS HOW IT'S RUN NOW? RIGHT NOW? UH, STEPHEN AND I, WE HAD TALKED ABOUT POSSIBLY DOING A ONE WORK SESSION A MONTH, UH, AND THEN DOING A REGULAR ONE REGULAR MEETING A MONTH ALSO, UM, AT, UH, THE REGULAR MEETINGS.

MAYBE WE CAN START AT SIX 30 AT PUBLIC COMMENTS, SIX 30 AND START A REGULAR MEETING AT SEVEN O'CLOCK.

THAT WAY CITIZENS CAN COME IN AND HAVE PLENTY OF TIME TO TALK, UM, AT SIX 30 AND THEN SEVEN O'CLOCK, UH, OR MAYBE A LITTLE AFTER, OR HOWEVER LONG IT TAKES THAT WE CAN START A REGULAR MEETING AND THEN NEGATIVELY, THEY DON'T HAVE THIS HANG AROUND.

SURE.

UM, I THINK GOD SHOULD COME BEFORE THE COUNTRY ONE YEAR AND YOU KNOW, IT BLOWS MY MIND.

IT ALWAYS HAS.

I, YOU KNOW, I THINK THE MOMENT OF SILENCE SHOULD DO BEFORE THE PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE.

I NEVER REALLY THOUGHT EVERYBODY GATHERING MY PAIN.

UM, JUST A THOUGHT ABOUT SOME OF THIS TOO, IS, UH, ADAM HAD SOME PEOPLE REACH OUT TO ME AND I HAD NEVER THOUGHT OF IT THIS WAY, BUT I THINK IT'S, IT, IT, IT COULD BE A CONCERN.

I HAD SOME CITIZENS SHARE THAT THEY FELT UNCOMFORTABLE SHARING THEIR ADDRESS.

UM, YOU KNOW, THAT IT'S RECORDED AND THAT ANYBODY CAN SEE IT.

UM, AND THEY SAID, THEY FELT LIKE, YOU KNOW, THEY WERE SHARING THEIR ADDRESS AS THEY BEGAN TO SPEAK.

AND IF IT WAS SOMETHING CONTROVERSIAL OR SOME THAT THEY FELT LIKE THAT, THAT THEN, UM, YEAH, THAT IT BASICALLY ANNOUNCED TO THE PUBLIC, THIS IS WHERE I LIVE.

AND IF IT'S SOMETHING THAT SOMEBODY DIDN'T AGREE WITH, THEY, THEY FELT THEY MADE THEM FEEL UNCOMFORTABLE AND I NEVER REALLY THOUGHT ABOUT IT.

BUT, UM, YOU KNOW, I'M GOING TO BE HONEST WITH YOU.

I THINK THAT WE SHOULD THINK ABOUT THAT.

MAYBE EVEN MAYBE THE PUBLIC PORTION SHOULDN'T

[01:00:01]

BE THE, IT SHOULDN'T BE PART OF THE VIDEO TAPING BEFORE THE MEETING, RIGHT.

THE PRESENTATION.

SO THE PUBLIC, WHEN PEOPLE ARE SPEAKING, BECAUSE THEY'RE REALLY SPEAKING TO US, THEY'RE NOT SPEAKING TO THE PUBLIC THERE, THEY'RE ADDRESSING THE COUNCIL WITH THEIR CONCERNS, THAT PART WOULDN'T BE PART OF THE VIDEO.

AND THEN IF THEY WANT TO SAY WHERE THEY LIVE, THEN IT'S JUST HARD OF OUR MINUTES.

I DON'T KNOW.

HOW DO YOU WANT, I WOULD THINK THING FOR ROYAL BROWN COUNTY, I WOULD GIVE A LATASHA'S ADDRESS.

BUT TO ADDRESS THAT SPECIFIC AGENDA, WHY NOT JUST HAVE THEM STATE WHETHER OR NOT THEY'RE A RESIDENT IN TOWN OR FOR A WHILE, OR RESIDENT OR COUNTY OR WHATEVER RESIDENCY, BUT NO WAY.

YEAH.

YEAH, THAT'S FINE.

I THINK THAT'S GOOD.

MAYBE THERE'LL BE SPEAKING BEFORE A MEETING ANYWAY, SO IT'S NOT GOING TO BE OUT FOR THE WHOLE PUBLIC.

I WASN'T BEING RECORDED.

LIKE OUR MEETING WAS GOING TO START AT SIX 30 AND INCLUDE THEIR COMMENTS OR COMMENTS WILL BE BEFORE OR RECORDED.

RIGHT.

I TH I THINK THAT THE, I WOULD BE A VOTE FOR KEEPING THE PUBLIC COMMENTS AS PART OF THE PUBLIC RECORD SO THAT THE PUBLIC IS GENERALLY AWARE OF WHAT OTHER PEOPLE ARE BRINGING TO THE COUNCIL.

UM, YEAH, I'VE FOUND IT USEFUL TO, TO HEAR THE COMMENTS MYSELF, JUST AS A CITIZEN.

I DON'T THINK THAT THAT'S, UM, LIKE A SEPARATE PART OF THE PROCESS OF GOVERNING PERSONALLY.

I AGREE.

WE HAVE TO ATTEND THAT SIX 30 SESSION, OR IF WE JUST SHOW UP AT SEVEN, MEANING WE WOULD SHOW UP AT SIX 30 FOR THE PUBLIC COMMENTS, BECAUSE THE PUBLIC IS THE PUBLIC PORTION OF THE MEETING NOT GOING TO HAPPEN BECAUSE THE PUBLIC PORTION OF THE MEETING AS REALLY THE PUBLIC ADDRESSING THE COUNCIL WITH THEIR CONCERNS, I THINK SOMETIMES IT GETS MISCONSTRUED THAT PEOPLE THINK IT'S THE PUBLIC SPEAKING TO THE PUBLIC.

THEY'RE REALLY SPEAKING US.

THEY'RE SHARING WITH US.

THESE ARE CONCERNS THAT I WANT TO BRING BEFORE YOU.

SO I THINK MIGHT HAVING, WE, WE SHOULD PROBABLY BEAT HER HERE TALKING TO US.

I MEAN, UNLESS, UNLESS SOMEBODY FOR AND, UM, UH, BEFORE OUR REGULAR SCHEDULED MEETING, I GUESS TODD AND THAT KIND OF STUFF.

YEAH.

THAT WAS GONNA BE TIGHT FOR YOU.

AND YOU WERE JUST SAYING LIKE, IF IT'S, I GUESS IT'S ONCE A MONTH, I MIGHT BE ABLE TO PLAN AHEAD OF THAT.

BUT MOST TIMES I COME STRAIGHT FROM WINCHESTER TO THESE MINIONS.

ALL RIGHT.

EITHER BEFORE OR AFTER THE MEETING, ALLOWS THE PUBLIC OPPORTUNITY, YOU KNOW, FOR THEM TO GET THERE AS WELL.

SO, YEAH.

YEAH.

THAT'S FINE.

IT'S A CAT.

YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE SOME PEOPLE WHO CAN'T MAKE IT IN TIME.

IF THEY'RE COMING FROM WINCHESTER AT 30 TO 40 MINUTES, IF YOU'RE LIVING DOWN THERE WORKING ON THE CITY, YOU'RE NOT GONNA BE ABLE TO MAKE IT, IT'S GOING TO BE THE SAME THING EITHER WAY.

IT'S THAT IT'S, THAT PEOPLE ACTUALLY HAVE TO HAVE AVAILABILITY TO COME.

RIGHT.

YOU KNOW, VERSUS LIKE DOING WORK SUPERVISOR MEETING THEN NINE O'CLOCK IN THE MORNING.

YES.

NO.

SO WHEN WE DO HAVE A REGULAR SCHEDULED MEETING, ARE WE GOING TO BE TAKEN OUT FOR PUBLIC COMMENT? ALL RIGHT.

SO MY QUESTION IS THERE'S A FEW, UH, THERE'S TWO THINGS THAT ONE, WHAT THEY ADDRESS, ALL YOU HAVE TO DO IS SAY WHAT TIFFANY, YOU KNOW, YOUR PHONE TOWN, ROYAL WARRANT HIM, PUT A PUBLIC ANNOUNCEMENT