[00:00:02]
I AM GONNA[1. MOMENT OF SILENCE ]
CALL TO ORDER.CAN YOU GUYS HEAR THAT? DOESN'T SMELL.
I'M GONNA CALL TO ORDER THE REGULAR TOWN COUNCIL MEETING OF MONDAY, DECEMBER 8TH.
AND WE'RE GONNA START WITH THE MOMENT OF SILENCE.
[2. PLEDGE OF ALLEGIANCE]
OKAY? NEXT, WE'RE GONNA DO OUR PLEDGE ALLEGIANCE, AND I'M GONNA ASK COUNCILMAN INGRAM TO LEAD US IN THE PLEDGE SINCE HE'S A BABY UP HERE.PLEDGE ALL ALLEGIANCE TO THE FLAG OF THE UNITED STATES OF AMERICA TO THE REPUBLIC REPUBLIC FOR WHICH IT STANDS.
ONE NATION UNDER GOD, INVIS LIBERTY, WITH LIBERTY AND JUSTICE FOR ALL.
MS. PRESLEY, CAN WE DO A ROLL CALL? MAYOR COCKRELL.
COUNCILWOMAN D DEMON PAYNE? HERE.
[4. APPROVAL OF MINUTES]
OKAY, NEXT UP ARE OUR APPROVAL OF MINUTES.MADAM MAYOR, I MOVE THAT COUNCIL WILL APPROVE THE COUNCIL MEETING.
MINUTES OF NOVEMBER 24TH, 2025.
WORK SESSION AS PRESENTED SECOND.
ANY DISCUSSION? ALRIGHT, ROLL CALL.
COUNCILWOMAN D DEMON PAYNE? YES.
[5. ADDITION/DELETION OF ITEMS FROM THE AGENDA AND/OR REVISION TO ORDER OF BUSINESS]
OKAY.NEXT UP ARE AN OPPORTUNITY FOR ANY ADDITION OR DELETION OF ITEMS FROM THE AGENDA AND OR ANY REVISION TO AN ORDER TO ORDER A BUSINESS.
I BELIEVE MR. SEA, MADAM MAYOR, I'D LIKE, UH, MAKE THE MOTION TO DELETE ITEM NUMBER NINE, REPORTS OF TOWN MANAGER, UH, COUNCIL MEMBERS AND REPORT OF THE MAYOR.
ANY DISCUSSION? WHAT WAS THE PREMISE OF THAT? SO, UM, BECAUSE THIS WAS SUCH A SHORT MEETING AND WE WERE GONNA BE DOING A WORK SESSION, THE OTHER THING THAT WE ALSO ALL RECOGNIZED THAT NOT A LOT HAD HAPPENED, UM, SINCE OUR LAST MEETING FOR FOR TOO MANY REPORTS EVEN.
SO THAT WAS THE, UM, THAT WAS THE REASON BEHIND IT.
SO ANYWAY, ANY OTHER DISCUSSION? OKAY.
COUNCILMAN D DEMON PAYNE? YES.
[6. RECOGNITIONS/AWARDS/REPORTS/PRESENTATIONS]
NEXT UP, UM, IS OUR RECOGNITIONS AWARDS, REPORTS AND PRESENTATIONS.AND TONIGHT WE'RE GONNA BE RECOGNIZING THE SERVICE, UM, OF ONE OF OUR FREEDOM MEMBERS WHO ACTUALLY BEGAN, UM, WHEN THIS FIRST STARTED FOR US.
AND SO I'M GONNA RECOGNIZE NICK BASS AND, AND NICK, I'M GONNA READ A LITTLE SOMETHING THEN WE'RE GONNA COME UP.
SO THIS IS A RECOGNITION OF SERVICE AND APPRECIATION, PRESENTED TO NICHOLAS BASS FOR THE, HIS TIME ON THE FRONT ROW ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AUTHORITY FROM DECEMBER 13TH, 2021 TO DECEMBER 13TH, 2025.
IN HONOR OF FOUR YEARS OF DEDICATED SERVICE AND COMMITMENT, AS ONE OF THE ORIGINAL MEMBERS OF THE FRONT ROW ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AUTHORITY BOARD OF DIRECTORS, YOUR LEADERSHIP AND VISION HAVE PLAYED A VITAL ROLE IN SEEKING THE ADVANCEMENT OF ECONOMIC GROWTH AND PROSPERITY OF OUR COMMUNITY.
AND WE ARE GONNA BE RECOGNIZING YOU, THE MAYOR AND TOWN COUNCIL, UM, ON THIS EIGHTH DAY OF DECEMBER.
AND I BELIEVE NICK, YOU SERVED AS VICE CHAIRMAN OF THE COMMITTEE AS WELL.
I BELIEVE SO WE'RE GONNA, IF YOU WANNA COME UP FRONT, WE WILL GO AHEAD.
AND I BELIEVE BRENDAN AND HILLARY ARE GONE.
WE'LL START WITH BRENDAN FIRST.
[00:05:04]
OKAY.I APPRECIATE THANK, THANK YOU.
I JUST WANNA SAY, I KNOW I'VE SAID THIS MANY, MANY TIMES, BUT I AM GONNA REPEAT IT.
AND THAT IS THAT WE COULD NOT DO THE BUSINESS OF TOWN WITHOUT VOLUNTEERS IN OUR COMMUNITY.
AND AS NICK WAS JUST SAYING, I KNOW THAT WHEN THIS STARTED SEVERAL YEARS AGO, I WAS, WE WERE TRYING TO THINK OF PEOPLE AND I ACTUALLY ASKED NICK'S MOM, I RAN INTO HER.
I WAS LIKE, I WONDERING IF NICK WOULD BE INTERESTED.
SO WE TALKED ABOUT IT AND, UM, HE'S BEEN A, A VITAL MEMBER.
SO NOW YOU GET YOUR MONDAY SPEC ONCE A MONTH.
YOU'LL STAY INVOLVED IN THE COMMUNITY, SO, BUT THANK YOU FOR YOUR TIME AND SUPPORT DURING THAT TIME FOR US, FOR THE TOWN CITIZENS.
UM, SO NEXT YOU GET TO WATCH MONDAY NIGHT FOOTBALL.
UM, YOU ACTUALLY GET TO HAVE LUNCH.
RIGHT? UM, SO WE DO NOT HAVE ANY PUBLIC HEARINGS TONIGHT, UM, BUT WE WILL ENTERTAIN ANY PUBLIC COMMENTS.
IS THERE ANYONE WHO WISHES TO SPEAK AT THIS TIME AS PART OF THE PUBLIC COMMENTS? OKAY.
UH, SEEING AS WE, UM, REMOVED, UH, THE REPORTS, THE TOWN MANAGER COUNCIL MEMBERS AND REPORT OF THE MAYOR, WE'RE GONNA MOVE ON TO ITEM AM NUMBER 10.
UM, 10 A, WHICH IS A PURCHASE INSTALLATION OF VARIABLE FREQUENCY DRIVE FOR FINAL CLARIFIER NUMBER TWO AT THE WASTEWATER TREATMENT PLANT.
AND, UM, I'LL JUST READ THE SUMMARY, SAVE YOU THE TROUBLE.
MS. PRESLEY COUNSEL'S REQUESTED TO APPROVE THE PURCHASE AND INSTALLATION OF A VARIABLE FREQUENCY DRIVE FOR FINAL CLARIFIER NUMBER TWO AT THE WASTEWATER TREATMENT PLANT FROM EVOQUA.
I HOPE I'M SAYING THAT CORRECTLY.
IS THAT IT? IS THAT CORRECT? WATER TECHNOLOGIES IN THE AMOUNT OF $133,094 AND 76 CENTS.
NOTE THAT EVOQUA WATER TECHNOLOGIES IS THE SOLE SOURCE SUPPLIER FOR THE DRIVE ASSEMBLY AND HAYWOOD INCORPORATED OF VIRGINIA IS THE ONLY REPRESENTATIVE IN OUR AREA THAT IS AUTHORIZED TO INSTALL THE DRIVE.
UM, THE BUDGET AND FUNDING IS, UM, COMING FROM THE WASTEWATER TREATMENT PLANT MACHINERY AND EQUIPMENT LINE ITEM.
AND WE DISCUSSED THIS AT THE WORK SESSION LAST MONDAY NIGHT.
THESE ARE CONSENT ITEMS. THESE CONSENT.
I'M GLAD CONSENT YOU BROUGHT THAT UP.
ALRIGHT, WELL GUESS WHAT FOLKS? THAT ONE WAS, WAS CONSENT.
AND THE SECOND ONE'S CONSENT TOO.
I'M, I'M JUST, THE OTHER ONE WAS THE TASK ORDER FOR THE SOLID SEA WINERY.
[10. CONSENT AGENDA ITEMS]
CONSENT AGENDA.ANYBODY? I'LL ENTERTAIN A MOTION.
MADAM MAYOR, I MOVE THAT WE APPROVE THE CONSENT AGENDA ITEMS AS PRESENTED.
COUNCILWOMAN D DEMON PAYNE? YES.
AND SO IT IS SEVEN 10, I BELIEVE.
I, I THINK I HELD THE RECORD MANY YEARS AGO, RIGHT, MS. PRESLEY? I HAD LIKE A, IT WAS LESS, LESS THAN AN EIGHT MINUTE MEETING.
I REMEMBER ROGER BIANCHINI SAYING, UM, I DON'T THINK WE'RE GONNA MAKE IT THIS
[11.A. Amendments to the Town of Front Royal Policy for Vacation of Public Rights-of-Way]
YEAR.SO 11 A, UM, ARE BUSINESS ITEMS. SO WE HAVE THREE BUSINESS ITEMS TONIGHT, AND THE FIRST ONE IS THE AMENDMENT TO THE TOWN OF FRONT ROYALS POLICY FOR VACATION ON PUBLIC RIGHTS WAY.
MS. PRESLEY, DO YOU WANNA READ THAT SUMMARY? COUNSEL'S REQUESTED TO APPROVE AND ADOPT THE RIGHTS OF WAIVE VACATION POLICY.
AS PRESENTED NOTE, THE CURRENT POLICY HAS BEEN AMENDED THREE TIMES IN THE PAST 25 YEARS.
THE DOCUMENT REFERS TO THE PROCESS TO CONDUCT THE VACATION AND CONVEYANCE WITH THE SALE PRICE BEING NEGOTIATED WITH THE APPLICANT TO CREATE A FAIR AND UNBIASED APPROACH TO DETERMINING THE FAIR MARKET VALUE OF THE SUBJECT PROPERTY.
THE DRAFT AMENDMENT SHALL DEFINE THE GUIDELINES TO DETERMINE THE PRICE PER SQUARE FOOT.
OKAY, I'LL ENTERTAIN A MOTION AT THIS TIME.
[00:10:01]
MADAM MAYOR, I MOVE THE COUNCIL APPROVE AND ADOPT THE TOWN OF FRONT ROYAL POLICY FOR VACATION OF PUBLIC RIGHTS OF WAY AS PRESENTED.THERE'S A MOTION AND A SECOND.
ANY DISCUSSION MADAM MAYOR? I HAVE DISCUSSION.
I HAVE CONCERNS WITH THE DRAFT ORDINANCE POST, UM, WORK SESSION LAST MONDAY NIGHT.
UM, THERE'S SOME LANGUAGE IN HERE, UM, REGARDING CREATING A FAIR AND UNBIASED APPROACH TO DETERMINING THE FAIR MARKET VALUE OF THE SUBJECT PROPERTY.
UM, THERE'S SOME LANGUAGE THAT I DON'T HAVE HIGHLIGHTED IN THIS DRAFT, WHICH JUST LEAVES SOME AMBIGUITY, AMBIGUITY TO, UM, THE VALUE.
I UNDERSTAND FAIR MARKET VALUE, BUT IT'S THE ADJOINING PROPERTIES AND THE PRICE PER SQUARE FOOT, WHICH, UM, ARE CHANGING AND VASTLY DIFFERENT.
SO IS IT GOING TO BE AN AVERAGE OF THOSE BASED ON THE FAIR MARKET VALUE? AND IF YOU HAVE A MILLION DOLLAR PROPERTY BESIDE A $10 MILLION PROPERTY, THAT'S GONNA CHANGE THE AVERAGE SUBSTANTIALLY.
SO FOLLOWING LAST MONDAY'S COUNCIL MEETING, AND AS I'M SURE THE PUBLIC AND STAFF ARE AWARE, COUNCIL IS NOT ALLOWED TO DISCUSS THIS AS A COUNCIL OUTSIDE OF A MEETING.
SO THERE'S BEEN NO WAY TO READ, ADJOURN, AND DISCUSS THIS DRAFT AMENDMENT.
AND I, SO I'M GONNA LET MR. PETTY SPEAK TO THIS, BUT I WILL.
UM, I I THINK YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT I THREE I WHERE IT TALKS ABOUT THE FAIR MARKET VALUES SHALL BE DETERMINED BY THE AVERAGE PRICE PER SQUARE FOOT FOR ALL BUDDING PROPERTIES AT THEIR CURRENT TAX ASSESSED VALUE PROVIDED BY THE COMMISSIONER REVENUES OFFICE.
AND THE SALE PRICE WILL THEN BE CALCULATED BY THE TOTAL AREA OF LAND TO BE PURCHASED.
MR. PETTY, DID YOU WANT TO, UM, POSSIBLY, UH, ADDRESS VICE MAYOR THOUGHTS QUESTION OR? YEAH, SO IT CAME UP AT THE LAST MEETING TO ENSURE THAT WE HAD, WE, IT WASN'T IN THERE ABOUT THE CURRENT TAX ASSESSED VALUE.
SO THE ABUTTING PROPERTY OWNERS ON THAT ABUT THE, UH, AREA TO BE VACATED.
WE WILL TAKE, THERE WERE AVERAGE PRICE.
WE WILL TAKE THIS PRICE PER SQUARE FOOT THAT'S GIVEN TO US BY THE COMMISSIONER REVENUES OFFICE, AND THEN IT WILL BE THE AVERAGE PRICE PER SQUARE FOOT OF ALL OF THOSE PROPERTIES.
SO, YOU KNOW, IT COULD RANGE LOOKING AT BOTH SIDES.
THERE COULD ALSO JUST BE ONE OF BUDDYING PROPERTY.
IT DEPENDS ON REALLY WHERE THE PROPERTY IS AND WE'LL JUST TAKE SIMILAR TO HOW WE SEND THE NOTICE OUT IN THE LETTERS.
IT WILL ONLY BE THE ABUTTING PROPERTIES.
SO TO TAKE AWAY ANY, UM, DISCREPANCY IN PICKING AND CHOOSING, UM, THAT'S SIMILAR TO WHAT WE DID FOR A RECENT, UH, VACATION.
AND THAT'S THE PRACTICE WE WOULD LIKE TO JUST TAKE FORWARD TO, UH, KEEP IT AS SIMPLE AS POSSIBLE.
SO N THREE I AS COUN OR AS MADAM MAYOR MENTIONED, THE IT DOES NOT SAY, HOLD ON, I JUST HAD MY FINGER ON IT.
THE FAIR MARKET VALUE SHALL BE DETERMINED BY THE AVERAGE PRICE PER SQUARE FOOT.
NOT, IT DOESN'T STATE IN THAT PER TAX ASSESSED VALUE.
SO LAST WEEK IT DIDN'T, WE EDITED, WE, I THINK, UM, COUNCIL MEMBER DEAMON PAYNE MENTIONED THAT.
AND SO IN THIS, THE PACKET FOR TONIGHT, UM, WE, WE DID ADD FOR ALL ABUTTING PROPERTIES OF THE CURRENT TAX ASSESSED VALUE PROVIDED BY THE COMMISSIONER REVENUES OFFICE.
THE FAIR, IT'S ONE OF THE UNDERLYING THINGS, BUT, OR IT'S CONTRIBUTORY VALUE THOUGH, STILL IN THERE.
SO I'M TRYING TO UNDERSTAND HOW THIS WILL BE RIGHT ABOVE IT.
CONTRIBUTORY VALUE RIGHT ABOVE, YES.
RIGHT ABOVE IT, IT SAYS, OR IT'S CONTRIBUTORY VALUE.
SO THERE'S TWO DIFFERENT WAYS THAT THE LAND COULD BE VALUED.
AND I WORRY WITH ALL THE CONTENTION WE'VE HAD IN THE PAST WITH VACATING ALLEYWAYS, WE COULD FACE A CASE OF DISCRIMINATION OR FAVORITISM OR BIAS BEING EITHER OR.
I FEEL LIKE IT NEEDS TO BE ONE DEFINING LINE, TWO SENTENCES ABOVE THAT.
UM, VIRGINIA CARRIES STATE NO BELOW THAT FAIR MARKET VALUE OR ITS CONTRIBUTORY VALUE TO THE ABUTTING PROPERTY, WHICHEVER IS GREATER.
BUT LOOK AT PURSUANT TO VIRGINIA CODE THOUGH BEFORE.
YEAH, THAT'S ABOVE IT CAN, CAN, YEAH.
BUT ALSO SAYS PURSUANT TO VIRGINIA CODE RIGHT HERE, PURSUANT TO PAGE 37.
YEAH, IT LOOKS LIKE THE WAY THAT IT'S WRITTEN, THAT VIRGINIA CODE, THE WAY VIRGINIA CODE STATES IT, THAT IT SHALL BE NO GREATER THAN THE PROPERTY'S FAIR MARKET VALUE OR ITS CONTRIBUTORY VALUE TO THE BUDDING PROPERTY, WHICHEVER IS GREATER THE, IF I MAY ADD, THAT'S THE WAY I READ IT, THAT IT'S THIS OR THAT.
[00:15:01]
YES.UH, IF YOU JUST CONTINUE WITH THAT SENTENCE OR THE AMOUNT AGREED TO BY THE PARTIES PERIOD, THAT'S STRAIGHT FROM TA UH, STATE LAW, WHICH AGAIN GIVES APPLICANTS THE RIGHT TO NEGOTIATE WITH COUNSEL PRIOR TO, THERE'S NO SET STANDARD WITH THE ABILITY TO NEGOTIATE THAT PRICE.
I THOUGHT THE PURPOSE OF THIS WAS TO AVOID FUTURE CONTENTIOUS NEGOTIATIONS AND TO MAKE IT CLEAR AND CONCISE WHAT THE PROPERTY WOULD BE SOLD AT A VALUE BASED ON X.
I DO THINK THOUGH, BECAUSE THE VERY NEXT LINE SAYS THE FAIR MARKET VALUE SHALL BE DETERMINED BY THE AVERAGE PRICE PER SQUARE FOOT FOR ALL BUDDING PROPERTIES AT THEIR CURRENT TAX ASSESSED VALUE PROVIDED BY THE COMMISSIONER REVENUE'S OFFICE, THEN WE SHOULD STRIKE THE AMOUNT AGREED TO BY THE PARTIES BECAUSE IT'D BE CONTRACTUALLY AGREED TO POST VACATION.
THAT'S A CONTRACT WE DON'T NEGOTIATE PRIOR TO VACATING IT.
WE DON'T, WE DON'T NEGOTIATE IT ALL NEGOTI.
WE DONATE UNTIL THE ALLEY IS VACATED.
BUT IT SAYS AT THE TOP, IF COUNSEL CONDITIONS THE VACATION OF RIGHTS OF WAY OF THE SALE OF FRACTIONAL PORTIONS OF THE PROPERTY.
SO TO ME IT MEANS LIKE AFTER COUNSEL HAS VACATED IT, THEN THAT GIVES THE, THAT GIVES THE BUYER THE ABILITY TO NEGOTIATE VERSUS SELLING IT AT THE FAIR MARKET VALUE ON THE TAX ASSESSED RATE.
IT'S EITHER OR NEGOTIATED BY PARTIES.
IS THAT THE LANGUAGE? I THINK IF I'M, IF I MAY, MADAM MAYOR, YES.
UM, AS WE WERE JUST TALKING DOWN HERE, UNFORTUNATELY, WE, I DON'T THINK WE CAN ESSENTIALLY STRIKE STATE CODE WHAT IT SAYS.
I THINK WHAT WE HAVE DONE HAS BEEN ABLE TO DETERMINE AND DEFINE WHAT FAIR MARKET VALUE IS, WHICH WAS ONE OF THE DISCUSSIONS IS HOW WE WERE CHOOSING THAT.
AND I THINK ONE OF THE BIG ONES IS WHICH PROPERTIES DO YOU CHOOSE? IS IT, UH, CUMULATIVE, AVERAGE, ALL THESE DIFFERENT THINGS.
WELL NOW WE'VE CREATED AT LEAST THE FORMULA TO SET FORTH THE FAIR MARKET VALUE, WHICH WAS THE CHALLENGING PART IN ONE OF THE MOST RECENT DISCUSSIONS BECAUSE THERE WERE DIFFERENT PROPERTIES THAT WERE PICKED.
BUT NOW THAT WE'RE STATING THAT IT'S ON SOLELY THE ABUTTING PROPERTIES, SOLELY THE TAX ASSESSED VALUE, IT'S NO AVERAGE WEIGHTED, IT'S, WE HAVE A DEFINED FORMULA.
UM, I THINK IT'LL ALLOW US, YOU KNOW, AN UNBIASED APPROACH.
NOW WE CAN JUST STICK TO THAT.
BUT I THINK AS FAR AS THE OR AND, AND NO GRAND, THE CONTRIBUTORY VALUE IS STATE CODE.
SO WE CAN'T REALLY GO AGAINST THAT.
BUT AT LEAST WE'VE DEFINED THE FORMULA TO COME UP WITH THE PRICE.
AND I WILL SAY THAT HAVING SERVED FOR AS LONG AS I HAVE NOW, THAT I DO BELIEVE THAT THE PROCESS BY WHICH THE PRICES WERE DETERMINED WERE NOT AS, UM, THEY WEREN'T, I DON'T THINK THEY WERE CONSISTENT.
UM, SO I DO THINK THAT HAVING A CONSISTENT, LIKE THIS IS HOW WE'RE GONNA DETERMINE THIS.
IT'S BY THE ABUTTING PROPERTY, NOT A PROPERTY THAT IS, YOU KNOW, THREE MILES AWAY.
I'M JUST SAYING THINGS THAT HAVE HAPPENED IN THE PAST.
SO IT DOES SEEM LIKE THAT'S A FAIR WAY TO DO IT AND I'M GRATEFUL THAT WE ARE AT LEAST LOOKING AT IT.
'CAUSE THEN IT'S, IT'S NOT UP TO WHOEVER'S SITTING UP HERE ON THE DAIS AS TO WHAT THE PRICE IS GONNA BE.
IT'S DETERMINED BY, YOU KNOW, ASSESSMENTS THE COMMISSIONER REVENUE.
AND I'M ABSOLUTELY GRATEFUL FOR THE WORK THAT TOWN STAFF HAS DONE.
UM, AND I THINK THIS IS VERY HELPFUL.
I THINK WE HAD AN UNPRECEDENTED AND RECORD NUMBER OF VACATION APPLICATIONS SINCE MY TIME ON COUNCIL.
I JUST WORRIED IN MY REREADING AND PREPARATION OF TONIGHT'S MEETING THAT, AND IF THAT'S STATE CO IT IS WHAT IT IS.
I'M HEARING GRUMBLING ON THE DICE TO MOVE FORWARD.
I JUST WANNA ECHO MY CONCERN THAT THERE'S STILL ROOM FOR NEGOTIATIONS, WHICH WE HAVE SEEN.
UM, WHAT THAT LEADS TO WITH ALLIE'S, UH, LAND IS WORTH WHAT YOU'RE WILLING TO PAY FOR IT.
UM, IF IT'S STATE CODE AND THERE'S NOTHING WE CAN DO ABOUT IT, THEN SO BE IT MADAM MAYOR.
UL, ULTIMATELY IT'S THE PRICE IS WHATEVER COUNCIL AGREES TO, RIGHT.
THERE'S, THERE'S NO OBLIGATION TO SELL.
RIGHT? BUT IN THE CASE OF A CONDITIONAL VACATION, THEN THE, THAT ORDINANCE WOULD BE VOID IF THERE'S NO AGREEMENT.
BUT, BUT THIS, THIS WHAT'S BEFORE US TONIGHT, IF IT IS, IF IT SUCCESSFULLY PASSES, IT TAKES SOME OF THE AMBIGUITY OUT OF IT BECAUSE NOW WE'RE SAYING THIS IS WHAT IT IS.
SO IF SOMEBODY COMES BEFORE THE COUNCIL WANTS TO VACATE AND
[00:20:01]
WANTS US TO VACATE A PIECE OF THE TOWN'S PROPERTY, UM, THEY WOULD KNOW AHEAD OF TIME THAT IT'S GOING TO BE, UM, THE FAIR MARKET VALUES.BA GONNA BE BASED ON THEIR PRO AB BUDDING PROPERTIES.
AND TO BE HONEST WITH YOU, THAT INFORMATION IS PUBLIC RIGHT.
OR THE AMOUNT OR THE AMOUNT, THERE IS STILL ROOM TO NEGOTIATE FOR FUTURE COUNCILS TO SHOW BIAS.
BUT IF WE CAN'T AVOID THAT DUE TO STATE CODE, THEN WE HAVE, YOU KNOW, THE EXCUSE TO FALL BACK ON THAT.
UM, BUT IT'S NOT ONE, IT'S NOT ONE OR THE OTHER, IT'S, OR SO THERE IS POTENTIAL FOR FUTURE COUNCILS TO MAKE DECISIONS.
PARTIALLY, UH, MADAM MAYOR, I THINK, I THINK IT'S A GOOD BASELINE.
UH, YOU'RE NEVER GONNA GET RID OF THE AMBIGUITY BECAUSE THE PROPERTY OWNER, YOU KNOW, HE CAN GO OUT AND HIRE HIS OWN APPRAISAL TO APPRAISE THE ABUTTING PROPERTIES AND IT MAY COME BACK DIFFERENTLY.
BUT WE HAVE, WE HAVE THIS AS, UH, A, A GOOD BASELINE TO PROVE IT OUT AGAINST THE APPRAISED THE ASSESSED PROPERTIES, UH, AS AN AVERAGE.
SO I'M, I'M, I'M PRETTY COMFORTABLE WITH IT.
UM, I APPRECIATE WHAT STAFF HAS DONE WITH IT AND, UH, I'LL END IT AT THAT.
I WILL SAY THAT WHAT YOU JUST, UH, MENTIONED ABOUT THAT THE PROPERTY OWNER COULD GO OUT AND HIRE AN APPRAISER AND THINGS LIKE THAT, THAT IS ALL TRUE.
BUT BY HAVING THIS ALREADY STATED, THEY WOULD REC, THEY WOULD AT LEAST BE AWARE OF THE FACT THAT NO MATTER WHAT YOU SAY OR DO, THIS IS WHAT WE ARE LOOKING AT TO BASE OUR, TO BASE OR WHAT THE COUNCIL'S LOOKING AT TO BASE THEIR NUMBER ON.
SO AGAIN, I DO THINK IT WAS MEANT TO CLEAN THINGS UP.
I'M SORRY THAT THERE IS SOME AMBIGUITY IN THERE, ESPECIALLY BECAUSE I'M SUSPECTING THAT VIRGINIA WANTED TO LEAVE IT OPEN TO, TO NEGOTIATE PROBABLY POINT OF INFORMATION.
UM, APPRAISERS COME BACK WITH DIFFERENT VALUES BECAUSE APPRAISERS DON'T WORK BASED ON TAX ASSESSED VALUE.
IF THAT WERE THE CASE, HOMES WOULD SELL FOR THE TAX ASSESSED VALUE VERSUS THE FAIR MARKET VALUE.
SO THAT'S NOT WHAT THE APPRAISER'S JOB IS.
AND LIKE YOU ALLUDED TO, IN SPEAKING WITH AN ATTORNEY REGARDING A DIFFERENT SITUATION BEFORE THE TOWN EARLIER THIS WEEK, VIRGINIA IS A PROPERTY OWNER'S RIGHTS STATE FOR THE MOST PART.
SO THAT IS LIKELY WHY THAT'S THERE ANY OTHER DISCUSSION.
COUNCILWOMAN D DEMON PAYNE? YES.
[11.B. Request for Water and Sewer in the Rt. 340/522 Corridor for Industrial Use from 444 Baugh, LLC on Baugh Drive]
NEXT STOP.UNDER OUR BUSINESS ITEMS IS ITEM 11 B, WHICH IS A REQUEST FOR WATER AND SEWER IN THE ROUTE 3 45 22 CORRIDOR FOR INDUSTRIAL USE FROM 4 44 BALL LLC ON BALL DRIVE.
AND THE SUMMARY IS PRETTY SHORT.
UH, I'LL READ MR. PRESLEY COUNSEL'S REQUEST TO CONSIDER APPROVAL OF A JOINT REQUEST FROM WARREN COUNTY AND 4 4 4 BALL LLC FOR WATER AND SEWER SERVICE WITHIN THE ROUTE 5 22 340 NORTH CORRIDOR.
THE PROPERTY CONSISTS OF APPROXIMATELY 71 POINT, IT'S ACTUALLY 859 10,000 ACRES IDENTIFIED AS TAX MAP 12 G DASH TWO DASH ONE DASH 10 A AND LOCATED ON THE EAST SIDE OF BALL DRIVE.
THE ATTACHED APPLICATIONS AND PRELIMINARY PLANS PROPOSED THREE BUILDINGS FOR LIGHT GENERAL INDUSTRIAL WAREHOUSE.
THE PROPOSED CONNECTIONS AND USAGE CAN BE DEFINED BELOW.
MR. MR. SONNETT? AM I, IS IS IT REQUIRED THAT I READ WHAT EACH OF THOSE BUILDINGS IN THEIR SQUARE FOOT AND STUFF IS OR NO? SINCE IT'S IN THE AGENDA, PUBLIC AGENDA? I DON'T BELIEVE SO.
UM, THERE'S NO PUBLIC HEARING FOR THIS, BUT I WILL OPEN IT UP TO COUNCIL.
MADAM MAYOR, I MOVE THAT COUNCIL BASED ON A FINDING OF SUFFICIENT ACCESS CAPACITY, APPROVE A JOINT REQUEST FROM WARREN COUNTY AND 4 4 4 BALL LLC FOR WATER AND SEWER SERVICE, NOT TO EXCEED 20,850 GALLONS PER DAY WITHIN THE ROUTE 5 22 3 40 NORTH QUARTER ON PROPERTY IDENTIFIED AS TAX MAP ONE TWO G DASH TWO DASH ONE DASH ONE ZERO A AND LOCATED ON THE EAST SIDE OF BALL DRIVE, SUPPLYING AS MANY AS THREE BUILDINGS FOR LIGHT GENERAL INDUSTRIAL WAREHOUSE
[00:25:01]
USE CONDITIONED UPON CONVEYANCE TO THE TOWN OF ANY NECESSARY EASEMENTS AND THE EXECUTION OF AN OUT OF TOWN ACCESS CAPACITY, UTILITY AGREEMENT.AND DIRECT THE TOWN MANAGER AND TOWN ATTORNEY TO EXECUTE THE NECESSARY AGREEMENT WITH THE OWNER REQUIRING COMPLIANCE WITH TOWN CODE AND WITH INDUSTRIAL RATES AND CHARGES AT 100% MORE THAN IN TOWN RATES AND CHARGES.
MS. PRESLEY, DID YOU HEAR MR. SEAL? OKAY.
IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION? MADAM MAYOR? I THOUGHT, UM, SINCE THERE'S NO PUBLIC HEARING AND THERE'S NO WAY TO HAVE COMMENTS, UM, I'LL KEEP MY COMMENTS SHORT SO WE DON'T HAVE ANOTHER WATER AND SEWER CONVERSATION LIKE THE LAST REQUEST.
HOWEVER, IT DAWNED ON ME THAT WITH THE, FIRST OF ALL, I WILL SAY I'M EXCITED ABOUT THE PROMISE OF THE JOBS IN THESE APPLICATIONS.
THAT'S EXCITING FOR OUR COMMUNITY AND THE ECONOMIC ASPECT OF IT.
HOWEVER, IF THE COUNTY WERE TO PROCEED WITH BANNING, UM, INDUSTRIAL WELLS IN THE CORRIDOR, I WOULD LIKE TO, AT THE NEXT LIAISON MEETING, BRING THESE APPLICATIONS FORWARD AND DISCUSS THE COUNTY'S CON CONTRIBUTION TO OUR INFRASTRUCTURE WATER SYSTEMS TO SUPPLY THEM WITH THESE BUSINESSES IN THE CORRIDOR.
HEARING MR. RAPPAPORT, ARE YOU, ARE YOU GESTURING THAT YOU WOULD LIKE TO SPEAK? I DON'T, I DON'T FORWARD.
WELL, THE ONLY, THE ONLY THING IS WITH CURRENTLY RIGHT NOW WE'RE, WE'RE IN THE POSITION THAT WE ARE THE, THE WATER AUTHORITY.
AND, UH, UH, SO IT, IT'S REALLY THE, THE, THE, THE ONE OF THE ISSUES THAT, THAT WE'RE ALLUDING TO IS WE, WE, WE DRAW FROM THE SHENANDOAH RIVER.
AND, UH, AS YOU KNOW, WE'VE HAD, UM, UH, SITUATIONS WHERE WE'VE HAD DROUGHTS AND THERE THERE IS SOME CONCERN ABOUT THAT.
OBVIOUSLY, UH, HOWEVER, WE ARE THE WATER AUTHORITY.
WE'VE SPENT A LOT OF, UM, MONEY WITH, UH, ESTABLISHING THE INFRASTRUCTURE OUT THERE.
AND, UH, I, I, I DO BELIEVE THAT WE, WE NEED, UH, TO PROVIDE THE ABILITY FOR GROWTH OUT THERE.
SO, UM, I AM EXCITED AS THE VICE MAYOR INDICATED THAT, UH, YOU'RE GOING TO, UH, POSSIBLY BRING IN 330 JOBS, UH, AND THE FACT THAT IT'S A WAREHOUSE AND TYPE OF ENVIRONMENT WAREHOUSES GENERALLY ARE THE LEAST USERS OF, UM, THAT'S THOMAS SQUARE FEET WATER.
SO, UM, WITH THAT, I'M FAIRLY COMFORTABLE WITH MOVING FORWARD ON THIS MAYOR COUNCILMAN RAPPAPORT, JUST BECAUSE I WANNA MAKE SURE YOU SAID 300 AND SOME JOBS.
ACTUALLY, WHAT'S IN THE APPLICATION IS 695.
I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT YOU OH, OKAY.
I'M, I, I'M NOT, YOU SAID THAT 'CAUSE COUNCILMAN SEAL WAS RIGHT.
WE WERE LOOKING IN JUST SO THAT PEOPLE, I BELIEVE THAT WAS ONE BUILDING.
IT WAS THE ONLY ONE WAS THREE 30, BUT THE TOTAL WOULD IS THE ESTIMATE IS 695.
ANY OTHER DISCUSSION FOR THIS? OH, REAL QUICK, MAD MAYOR.
YES, IF I MAY, MY, UH, UH, MY CONCERNS ARE STILL, AS I STATED LAST WEEK DURING THE WORK SESSION, UM, AND THAT'S JUST OF COURSE, OF COURSE THE, THE, THE INDUSTRIAL USE AND I MEAN, I UNDERSTAND THAT THE COUNTY HAS THEIR DEFINE THE DEFINITION OF IT.
UM, I JUST, UH, I JUST WISH IT WAS A LITTLE BIT MORE, UH, PRECISE.
I MEAN, MY CONCERN IS COUNCILMAN REPPORT SAYS, YOU KNOW, WE WE'RE, WE'VE HAD, UH, TWO DROUGHT PERIODS IN TWO YEARS, WHICH WAS BEEN UNPRECEDENTED UP UNTIL THAT POINT.
AND, YOU KNOW, I UNDERSTAND THAT IT MAY NOT BE A HUNDRED PERCENT KNOWN WHAT'S GONNA GO THERE.
BUT AT THE SAME TIME, YOU KNOW, I THINK I HAVE A LEGITIMATE CONCERN WONDERING WHAT'S GOING TO GO THERE FOR, FOR OUR WATER USE.
UH, I'LL, AND I'LL, I'LL JUST LEAVE IT AT THAT.
AND LIKE I SAID, AS, AND ALSO GO TO WHAT, GO TO SAY WHAT VICE MAYOR ENTAL SAID.
I MEAN, I THINK THIS IS SOMETHING WE SHOULD DISCUSS WITH THE COUNTY AT THE LIAISON MEETING BECAUSE,
[00:30:01]
UM, WE'RE GETTING A LOT OF THESE APPLICATIONS, UH, TO US.AND FOR INSTANCE, THE COUNTY IS VOTING TOMORROW ON ONE APPLICATION THAT THE COUNCIL HAD APPROVED IN 2022.
SO MY CONCERN IS TOO, IS THAT GETTING THESE THINGS GETTING APPROVED AND THEN GETTING SAT ON FOR SEVERAL YEARS AND ALL OF A SUDDEN, YOU KNOW, WE MAY NOT BE IN THE SAME WATER, UH, SITUATION WITH OUR WATER SUPPLY, YOU KNOW, IN THE NEXT 10 YEARS.
I MEAN, I'M JUST SPEAKING HYPOTHETICALLY, OF COURSE, BUT ANYWAYS, AGAIN, IT'S, IT'S, IT'S, I STATED LAST WEEK, IT'S NOT WITH THE APPLICATION ITSELF, IT'S JUST WITH, WITH, UM, WHAT, YOU KNOW, WHAT'S BEING DEFINED TO AND SENT TO US.
IF I MAY, I DON'T THINK ANY OF US DISAGREE THAT ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AS PLANNED IN THE QUARTER, IT COULD BRING UP, UP TO ALMOST 700 JOBS.
I THINK THAT WE NEED TO EXPAND OUR ECONOMIC BASE.
THAT WOULD CERTAINLY HELP WITH TAXES ON OUR CITIZENS.
THE BIGGER QUESTION IS WHERE ARE WE GOING TO GET OUR FUTURE WATER? UH, WE HAVE GONE THROUGH A COUPLE DROUGHT, UH, SEASONS.
WE HAVE THE CAPACITY TO PRODUCE THE WATER.
OUR ISSUE HAS BEEN WHERE DOES THE WATER COME FROM? SO WHEN MR. PETTY AND OUR CONSULTANTS LOOK AT THIS, THEY ASSURE US THAT GIVEN ALL THE PROJECTED DEVELOPMENT OUT THERE TODAY, TOMORROW, ANYTHING THAT'S BEEN APPROVED IN THE FUTURE, WE HAVE THE CAPACITY TO SERVE THIS BUSINESS.
AND OTHERS, WHAT WE DON'T KNOW AND WHAT WE NOW ARE IN THE VERY NEAR FUTURE NEED TO ADDRESS, I BELIEVE, IS WHERE'S OUR SECONDARY WATER SOURCE GOING TO BE.
SO WHEN WE GET INTO DROUGHT CONDITIONS WITH THE SOUTH FOR, WE THEN CAN TURN TO A SECONDARY SOURCE TO SUPPLEMENT OUR WATER DURING THE DROUGHT SEASON.
AND I CERTAINLY ADVOCATE THAT WE MAKE THAT A PRIORITY AS WE GO INTO 2026.
ANY OTHER DISCUSSION? SO, I, I ACTUALLY HAVE A QUESTION FOR MR. SONNET.
AND THIS WAS SOMETHING I THOUGHT OF EARLIER BEFORE GETTING HERE TONIGHT.
BUT WHEN MR. INGRAM JUST BROUGHT UP HIS COMMENTS, IT, IT, IT, IT REGISTERED WITH ME AGAIN, HYPOTHETICALLY, IF THE COUNCIL AGREES TO, UM, SUPPLY WATER FOR ANY OF THESE WATER REQUESTS THAT HAVE COME BEFORE US.
AND THEN AS HE SAID, SOMEBODY SITS ON IT FOR YEARS AND YEARS AND, UM, I KNOW THAT WE HAVE OUR CONSULTANTS THAT, THAT REPORT TO US ON WHAT THEY BELIEVE OUR EXCESS WATER CAPACITY IS.
IF SOMETHING WERE TO CHANGE IN THAT, UM, IN THOSE NUMBERS TO A POINT WHERE THE CONSULTANT SAYS, I DON'T, YOU KNOW, YOU DON'T HAVE AS MUCH AS WHAT YOU THOUGHT, AND LET'S SAY THAT SOMETHING'S GOING ON IN THE TOWN WHERE WE ARE OBLIGATED TO PROVIDE THEM WATER, UM, CAN ANY OF THAT BE CHANGED? I MEAN, CAN THE REQUEST THEN IF, IF NOTHING'S BEEN BUILT, I MEAN, IS THAT SOMETHING WE COULD GO BACK TO THE COUNTY AND SAY, YOU KNOW, IT'S BEEN TWO YEARS OR IT'S BEEN THREE YEARS AND NUMBERS HAVE CHANGED, OR THE REASON WHY I'M SAYING THIS.
'CAUSE THE CONSULTANT GAVE US STATISTICS AND THEY LISTED EVERYTHING THAT HAD THE POTENTIAL, EVEN HOUSING DEVELOPMENTS THAT, YOU KNOW, HAVE HAVEN'T HAPPENED FOR 15 YEARS.
AND THEY PUT ALL THOSE NUMBERS IN THERE.
UM, IF YOU KNOW, I MEAN, HOW LONG DO WE HAVE TO WAIT BEFORE THE NUMBERS COULD, WHAT I'M TRYING TO SAY IS I DON'T WANNA, I WOULD, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU ALL WOULD AGREE WITH ME OR NOT, BUT I WOULDN'T WANT TO SEE THE TOWN APPROVE SOMETHING AND THEN 25 YEARS FROM NOW, THEY STILL HAVEN'T DEVELOPED IT.
BUT WE ARE, WE'VE GOT THAT NUMBER TUCKED AWAY THERE THAT SAYS, WELL, WE'VE GOT THIS EXTRA, AM I MAKING SENSE AT ALL? AM I MAKING SENSE? YES, I UNDERSTAND.
UM, SO IT'S NOT A VESTED RIGHTS ISSUE.
'CAUSE IT'S NOT A LAND USE ISSUE.
UM, MY, AND IT, AND IT'S, THIS IS A VERY UNIQUE SITUATION BETWEEN THE TOWN AND THE COUNTY.
VERY UNIQUE, UM, WHERE THE TOWN SERVES OUTSIDE ITS BOUNDARIES IN THIS MANNER, UH, MY RESPONSE WOULD BE THAT THE COUNCIL WOULD HAVE TO ACT TO REVOKE THAT APPROVAL.
UM, AND I THINK THAT WOULD BE A FAIR ACTION PROVIDED.
AND AGAIN, NOT A VESTED RIGHTS ISSUE, BUT THAT WOULD BE A FAIR ACTION PROVIDED THAT THE PROPERTY OWNER HAD NOT TAKEN ANY SIGNIFICANT ACTION IN RELIANCE ON THE
[00:35:01]
ORIGINAL APPROVAL.UM, ANOTHER APPROACH WOULD BE TO, TO PUT A TIME LIMIT ON, UH, UH, SIGNING A WATER AND SEWER AGREEMENT PURSUANT TO THAT APPROVAL.
SO I'M ON THE RIGHT TRACK ABOUT LIKE A TIME LIMIT.
I'M NOT SAYING THAT'S GONNA HAPPEN WITH THIS APPLICATION, BUT I AM SAYING AS COUNCILMAN, UH, INGRAM, YOU KNOW, WE'RE GETTING READY TO HIT 2026 SOMETHING WE APPROVED FOUR YEARS AGO, YOU KNOW, DEPENDING ON, YOU KNOW, I KNOW THINGS DON'T HAPPEN OVERNIGHT AND THEY'RE PREPARING PROPERTIES AND MARKETING PROPERTIES AND THINGS LIKE THAT, AND THIS IS ALL PART OF IT.
BUT I JUST MEANT, UM, HOW OFTEN MR. PETTY DO WE PLAN TO DO THE WATER, EXCESS WATER? BECAUSE AS I TOLD YOU, WHEN WE GOT THAT INFORM, OR NOT YOU, BUT AS I TOLD THE FORMER TOWN MANAGER, WHEN WE GOT THAT INFORMATION, THAT'S REALLY THE FIRST TIME THAT ANYBODY HAD SHARED THAT INFORMATION WITH ME.
AND I'VE BEEN SITTING HERE FOR, IN JANUARY IT'LL BE SIX YEARS, SO IT SHOULD, SHOULD BE DONE ANNUALLY.
BUT WE HAVE A RELATIONSHIP NOW WITH OUR ENGINEER THAT WE'VE KIND OF CREATED THIS MODEL THAT EVEN IF WE GET, UM, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE INTERESTED IN PROPERTIES AND THEY CAN COME TO US WITH WHAT THEY PLAN TO USE, WE CAN THEN BEGIN MODELING THAT OF WHAT WE'VE, LIKE I SAID, WE HAVE WHAT'S PLANNED, WHAT'S BEEN APPROVED, AND THEN WE HAVE A WHOLE LIST OF THESE FUTURE IDEAS THAT THERE'S NO APPLICATIONS, THERE'S NO DISCUSSION, BUT WE, WE KNOW THE ZONING, WE KNOW HOW MANY ACRES IT IS, WE KNOW.
SO WE'RE CONSISTENTLY TRYING TO UPDATE THIS MODEL, UM, AS THIS LIVING DOCUMENT WITH OUR CONSULTANTS TO, TO ALWAYS BE PREPARED FOR THE NEXT APPLICATION.
SO WE HAVE VERY ACCURATE DATA RATHER THAN WAITING EVERY ANNUAL YEAR TO UPDATE IT.
WE'RE TRYING TO UPDATE IT AS APPLICATIONS COME IN.
AND YOU GOT A QUESTION? YES, GO AHEAD.
HOW THIS, THIS WOULD BE TO MR. PETAR TO, TO MR. SO, UH, THE PEOPLE OUT IN THE BLUE RIDGE SHADOWS AREA, ALL THOSE PLACES ARE ON TOWN WATER.
IF WE GO INTO A CONSERVATION OR AN EMERGENCY CONSERVATION, DO THEY HAVE TO ABIDE BY THAT? NO.
SO WE, THAT'S ACTUALLY A CONVERSATION WE'VE BROUGHT UP AT THE LIAISON NOW TWICE.
UM, SO IT'S A GOOD QUESTION AND WE CAN CERTAINLY PUT IT ON THE LIAISON MEETING AGAIN TO SAY WE, WHAT YOU JUST SAID, MADAM MAYOR, I WOULD LIKE, UH, OUR COUNSELOR TO LOOK INTO THAT BECAUSE WE ARE THE WATER SEWER PROVIDER, AND AS SUCH, WE GET INTO MANDATORY CONSERVATION.
IF YOU ARE A USER OF OUR WATER, I WOULD SUBMIT TO THE COUNCIL THAT WE CAN CONTROL THAT.
AND MAYBE IT'S A FINE ON YOUR WATER BILL FOR WASHING YOUR CAR WHEN YOU SHOULDN'T BE, OR WATERING THE GRASS.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT THAT ANSWER IS.
BUT THEY ARE CUSTOMERS OF OURS.
SO I WOULD SUGGEST AS A CUSTOMER OF OURS THAT THEY COULD BE HELD ACCOUNTABLE, PROBABLY NOT WITH, UM, US DRIVING THROUGH THE NEIGHBORHOOD AND SAYING, OH, YOU'RE WASHING YOUR CAR.
BUT BY DOCUMENTING BY THE WATER BILL.
BY THE WATER BILL, MADAM MAYOR, MR. SONNET HAS ADDRESSED THIS IN WORK SESSION WITH US.
UM, IT'S OUTSIDE OF OUR JURISDICTION, THEREFORE WE CANNOT ENFORCE IT IN THE COUNTY WHEN WE GIVE THEM THE RIGHTS, THEY DO NOT FALL UNDER THE SAME CATEGORY.
HE'S NODDING IN AGREEMENT WITH US.
WE'VE COVERED THIS IN A WORK SESSION THAT WE DON'T HAVE THE JURISDICTION OR AUTHORITY TO GO AND ENFORCE IT.
WE CAN SIMPLY ASK THE COUNTY TO ENSURE THAT THEY'RE BEING GOOD, UM, RECIPIENTS AND STEWARDS OF OUR SOURCES.
BUT THIS IS JUST A PART, I'M SORRY TO THE APPLICANT FOR HAVING ALL OF THIS DISCUSSION ON AN ITEM THAT IT'S NOT PERTAINING TO, BUT THIS IS MY CONTINUOUS AND CONSISTENT ISSUE WITH THE OUT OF TOWN WATER AND SEWER AND WHY I WILL STAY CONSISTENT IN MY POSITION ON THIS DAIS.
WE VOTE YES OR NO TONIGHT AND IT NEVER EVER COMES BACK TO COUNCIL.
WE'VE COMMITTED TO SOMETHING THAT WE WILL NEVER SEE AGAIN ONCE IT'S THROUGH THE COUNTY.
SO, UM, AND WE HAVE NO JURISDICTION, SO WELL, I WANNA SAY I APPRECIATE, OH, MR. Z YOU WANNA ADD SOMETHING TO THE CONVERSATION? YEAH, THANK YOU MATTER, MAYOR.
UM, WHILE TOWN CODE ONLY APPLIES WITHIN TOWN LIMITS, UH, WHAT IS POSSIBLE AND WHAT'S ACTUALLY IN THE AGREEMENTS, UH, IS THAT THE USER WILL COMPLY WITH TOWN CODE.
SO IT'S A CONTRACTUAL ENFORCEMENT.
IT, UH, AND THAT'S, I GUESS YOU CAN ARGUE WHETHER OR NOT HOW EFFECTIVE THAT IS, UH, IN MY OPINION.
THE BOTTOM LINE WOULD BE YOU TURN THE WATER OFF AS A WAY OF ENFORCING A CONTRACT PROVISION.
WELL, MAYBE THAT'S, SO THAT WOULD BE WHEN THEY GET THEIR WATER BILL AND WE SEE THE WATER BILL.
IF THEY'VE USED OVER THE, LIKE THE MINIMUM
[00:40:01]
ON THE, OR THE, THE MAXIMUM, I GUESS FOR THE, WE, WE CAN, WE COULD DO SOMETHING THEN.THERE'S NO MAXIMUM FOR RESIDENTIAL HOUSEHOLD.
I'M, I'M THOUGH TO MEASURE THAT THE MINIMUM CHARGE.
SO THIS SOUNDS LIKE SOMETHING WE CAN, WE CAN ENTERTAIN AGAIN AT A FUTURE WORK SESSION.
I WILL SAY I APPRECIATE ALL THE DISCUSSION UP HERE AND I, AND I'M SORRY FOR THE APPLICANTS THAT YOU HAVE TO SIT AND LISTEN THROUGH THIS.
I THINK IT DOES TELL EVERYONE THE, YOU KNOW, HOW, HOW IMPORTANT THIS CONVERSATION IS TO ALL OF US.
UM, NOT JUST, YOU KNOW, THE TOWN, BUT, BUT, UM, THOSE THAT USE THE WATER AS WELL.
SO, UM, I'M GOING TO, WE HAVE A MOTION ON THE TABLE AND WE'LL GO AHEAD AND, AND TAKE ACTION ON THAT.
MS. PRESLEY, ARE YOU READY? MM-HMM
COUNCILWOMAN D DEMON PAYNE? YES.
AND I, AND I AM GONNA, WHILE IT'S RIGHT NOW, MS. PRESLEY IN FRONT OF ME, THAT, UM, IN JANUARY WHEN WE DISCUSS THE LIAISON, UH, AGENDA, THAT WE MAKE SURE THAT WE INCLUDE, UM, WHAT VICE MAYOR VIAL TALKED ABOUT, WHICH THAT, AND YOU'LL HAVE THAT IN THE MINUTES, BUT I DO AS WELL.
AND ALSO THE CONVERSATION ABOUT ENFORCING, UM, OUR, OUR CONSERVATION STATUSES IN THE, IN THE, UM, OUTSIDE THE TOWN LIMITS THAT ARE OUR WATER CUSTOMERS.
I KNOW THE SUBJECT'S CLOSED NOW.
I JUST WANTED TO MAKE ONE COMMENT AND THEN, ALL RIGHT.
WELL, I, I DON'T, I DON'T WANNA GET TOO FAR INTO THIS 'CAUSE WE ALREADY TOOK ACTION ON IT.
NO, I'M NOT GONNA GET INTO ALRIGHT.
THERE, THERE, THERE WAS A STATEMENT IN HERE THAT, UH, THE, THE LIMIT WAS 73,000 AND, UH, NOT IN THE MOTION.
THE MOTION WAS FOR, UM, OH GOSH, 20.
I'M GONNA, I DON'T WANNA SAY IT WRONG, THE MOTION WAS WAS $20,850 EIGHT.
20,000 850 20 20,800 AND SOME ODD.
WE CAN MONITOR, WE HAVE THE ABILITY TO MONITOR, UH, THAT USAGE, CORRECT? UH, THIS IS THE JUDGE.
SO YEAH, WE TOWN MANAGER, WE OBVIOUSLY READ THEIR METERS AND AS WE ARE DEVELOPING NEW, UH, THE NEW METERS THAT WE'LL BE GETTING SOME OF, AND OUR NEW SOFTWARE, SOME HAVE REMOTE CAPABILITIES AS WE ESTABLISH THAT TECHNOLOGY, BUT WE DO MONITOR THESE FREQUENTLY.
[11.C. Retail Strategies Agreement Renewal]
ITEM 11 C IS THE RETAIL STRATEGIES AGREEMENT RENEWAL.IN OCTOBER, 2024, TOWN COUNCIL APPROVED A CONTRACT WITH RETAIL STRATEGIES, THE AMOUNT, 55,000 FOR A PERIOD OF ONE YEAR WITH THE OPTION TO RENEW FOR TWO ADDITIONAL ONE YEAR PERIODS.
TOTAL AMOUNT, INCLUDING OPTIONAL RENEWALS EQUALS 165,000 FOR A PERIOD OF THREE YEARS.
CONTRACT WAS SIGNED AND EXECUTED ON DECEMBER 14TH, 2024.
ON DECEMBER 1ST, 2025, SENIOR DIRECTOR MICHAEL WARSAW AND RETAIL DEVELOPMENT COORDINATOR JIMMY PRITCHET, PROVIDED AN END OF YEAR UPDATE ON THEIR ACTIVITIES FOR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND RECRUITMENT.
AFTER DISCUSSION, IT IS RECOMMENDED THAT MOVING FORWARD THERE WILL BE MEETINGS WITH TOWN COUNCIL AND FREEDOM REPRESENTATION AT REGULARLY SCHEDULE MEETINGS WITH RETAIL STRATEGIES OVER THE NEXT YEAR.
UM, AND THE BUDGET IS OUT OF THE DEPARTMENT OF ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, UH, FOR 55,000.
THAT WOULD BE FOR YEAR TWO IF, UM, IF THAT'S WHAT COUNCIL SO CHOOSES.
SO, UM, I WILL OPEN IT UP FOR COUNCIL.
THE COUNCIL WILL APPROVE THE OPTION OF RENEWAL WITH RETAIL STRATEGIES IN THE AMOUNT OF $55,000.
COUNCILMAN WOODS, SINCE YOU MADE THE MOTION, DO YOU HAVE ANYTHING YOU WANNA ADD? WELL PROBABLY RESTATE WHAT WE TALKED ABOUT IN OUR, OUR WORK SESSION.
UM, WE HAVE BUDGETED $50,000 A YEAR IN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT OVER THE LAST THREE YEARS, I BELIEVE.
AND WE HAVE A DEDICATED, UM, UH, GROUP OF VOLUNTEERS THAT SERVE, UH, LIKE MR. BASS ON OUR, UH, TOWN, EDA UNDER, UH, UH, MS. LEWIS.
TRUE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT USUALLY IS HEADED UP BY AN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT DIRECTOR WHO
[00:45:01]
HAS THE SKILLS, THE EXPERIENCE, THE KNOWLEDGE, THE CONTACTS, AND CAN WORK AS A REPRESENTATIVE OF THE COMMUNITY AND IT'S GOVERNING AUTHORITY TO ATTRACT, UM, BUSINESSES INTO THE COMMUNITY PER THE WISHES OF THE COMMUNITY.UH, WE NEITHER THE COUNTY AT THIS POINT HAVE THAT.
UH, WHAT WE DO HAVE IS A YEAR'S WORTH OF WORK BY THIS GROUP THAT WHEN I ATTENDED THE FBA MEETING, FREEDA, EXCUSE ME, THERE'S ANOTHER GROUP FBA.
UM, THEY WERE UNANIMOUS IN THEIR SUPPORT OF CONTINUING THIS.
AND AGAIN, THESE ARE VOLUNTEERS.
UH, I THINK MOSTLY ALL OF 'EM ARE BUSINESS PEOPLE HERE IN THE TOWN.
WE MAY HAVE A COUPLE, UH, SERVE IN THE COUNTY, HAVE TOWN PROPERTY, I'M NOT CERTAIN.
BUT, UM, THESE ARE PEOPLE THAT GIVE THEIR TIME, THEIR TALENT.
THEY MEET, THEY DISCUSS THESE THINGS WITH THE GOLD OF DEVELOPING ECONOMIC GROWTH IN THE TOWN OF FRONT ROYAL.
AND I THINK WE WOULD BE REMISS NOT TO SUPPORT THEIR REQUESTS FOR A SECOND YEAR.
WE SET THROUGH A PRESENTATION FROM RETAIL STRATEGIES.
I REALIZED THAT IT WAS SHORT NOTICE GIVEN THE FACT THAT THE CONTRACT RENEWAL THAT WE SIGNED UP FOR WAS COMING UP.
HOWEVER, I DO THINK FROM LISTENING TO THE PRESENTATION TWICE, THAT THEY HAVE GOOD THINGS GOING, UH, FOR US TO BRING BUSINESSES IN TOWN.
I WAS ESPECIALLY EXCITED ABOUT THE POSSIBILITY OF A, A THREE OR FOUR STAR HOTEL, UH, DIRECTED TOWARDS TOURISM IN CONJUNCTION WITH THE SKYLINE DRIVE AND THE GAS PARK AND OTHER TOURIST ATTRACTIONS AROUND HERE.
SO I BELIEVE AS A COUNCIL THAT WE NEED TO FURTHER SUPPORT OUR EDA, OUR APPOINTED EDA IN THEIR REQUEST, UM, TO SPEND THIS MONEY IN YEAR TWO OF THE CONTRACT AND SEE OF THE POSSIBLE 13 PROSPECTS THEY'RE WORKING WITH, IF WE CAN BRING SOME OF THEM TO FRUITION, AND AGAIN, AS WE GROW BUSINESS IN TOWN, IT DOES HELP OFFSET THE BURDEN TO OUR TAXPAYERS.
ANY, ANY OTHER DISCUSSION? MADAM MAYOR? I HAVE DISCUSSION BECAUSE, UM, WE DID DIGEST A LOT OF INFORMATION THAT IN THE PRESENTATION STATED IT WAS SUPPOSED TO BE SHARED WITH US THROUGHOUT THE FIRST YEAR OF THEIR CONTRACT.
UM, AND WE HAD A LOT TO PROCESS AND PROVIDE FEEDBACK ON IN A LITTLE AMOUNT OF TIME.
UM, AND I DON'T THINK THAT I WAS ABLE TO ARTICULATE ALL OF MY POINTS ADEQUATELY OR DO ENOUGH RESEARCH ON RETAIL STRATEGIES LLC IN THAT 45 MINUTES THAT WE HAD SITTING AROUND THE TABLE.
UM, I'VE SINCE BEEN ABLE TO LOOK UP THEIR BUSINESS, THE THINGS THAT THEY'VE ACCOMPLISHED, THE PEOPLE THAT THEY WORK FOR, AND WHAT IT LOOKS LIKE WHEN FRONT ROYAL IS ON A DISPLAY TABLE AT ONE OF THEIR EVENTS, UM, WITH VENDORS AS WELL AS ALL THE OTHER LOCALITIES THAT THEY SERVE.
I WAS ALSO ABLE TO TALK TO A LOT OF BUSINESS OWNERS DOWNTOWN, ESPECIALLY THE DAY OF THE CHRISTMAS PARADE, AND GET THEIR FEEDBACK SINCE THE ARTICLE AND THE VIDEO OF OUR MEETING HAD BEEN PUBLISHED.
UM, AND SO WITH THAT BEING SAID, I WANNA BEGIN BY SAYING THAT I FULLY SUPPORT RESPONSIBLE INTENTIONAL ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND THE LONG-TERM SUCCESS OF FRONT ROYAL.
MY CONCERN THIS EVENING, UM, IS NOT WITH THE GOAL OF GROWTH ITSELF, BUT WITH THE METHOD PROPOSED TO ACHIEVE THAT, WE ARE BEING ASKED TO ENTER INTO YEAR TWO OF A $55,000 CONTRACT OVER THREE YEARS IN WHICH WE HIRED A CONSULTANT TO RECRUIT RETAIL CHAINS, RETAIL CHAIN RESTAURANTS AND HOTELS.
HOWEVER, MANY OF THE EXAMPLES CITED AS POTENTIAL WINS ON THEIR WEBSITE.
AND THE PEOPLE THAT THEY'VE WORKED WITH PRIOR ARE RETAILERS SUCH AS HARBOR FREIGHT OR WENDY'S, WHICH ALREADY EXIST IN OUR COMMUNITY OR THE NEARBY MARKETS.
THAT RAISES A LEGITIMATE QUESTION ABOUT THE VALUE ADDED RETURN ON THIS INVESTMENT.
I ALSO QUESTION THE ECONOMIC AND FINANCIAL BENEFIT.
IF AT THE CONCLUSION OF A THREE YEAR $55,000 A YEAR CONTRACT, THE TANGIBLE OUTCOME IS THE ATTRACTION OF ONLY ONE ADDITIONAL CHAIN RESTAURANT, PARTICULARLY WHEN THAT RESULT MAY NOT MEANINGFULLY SHIFT OUR TAX BASE OR OUR EMPLOYMENT LANDSCAPE.
AT THE SAME TIME, WE CURRENTLY HAVE AN UNFUNDED ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AUTHORITY DIRECTOR POSITION.
THAT SAME $165,000 THAT WE'RE PUTTING INTO A CONSULTANT COULD HAVE BEEN SPREAD OVER A YEAR AND A HALF TO FUND A LOCALLY BASED ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT PROFESSIONAL.
SOMEONE EMBEDDED IN OUR COMMUNITY ACCOUNTABLE TO THIS COUNCIL,
[00:50:01]
AND EQUIPPED TO PURSUE OPPORTUNITIES ALIGNED WITH FRONT ROYAL'S.UNIQUE STRENGTHS, CONSULTANTS BY NATURE ARE TEMPORARY.
THEY'RE SALESPEOPLE AND THEY MAKE SALES AND THEY SELL THEMSELVES TO US.
THEY'RE NOT HERE DAY TO DAY, AND THEY DO NOT LIVE IN OUR NEIGHBORHOODS.
ENGAGE REGULARLY WITH OUR LOCAL BUSINESS OWNERS OR EXPERIENCE THE RHYTHM AND CHARACTER OF OUR TOWN THE WAY THAT THE RESIDENTS AND STAKEHOLDERS DO.
LIKE ON SATURDAY AT THE PARADE, FOR INSTANCE, THE CHARM OF FRONT ROYAL IS ONE OF OUR GREATEST ASSETS, AND IT CANNOT FULLY BE CAPTURED THROUGH A CONTRACT.
IT REQUIRES LIVED KNOWLEDGE AND ONGOING PRESENCE IN OUR COMMUNITY.
WE ALSO NEED TO BE REALISTIC ABOUT OUR CURRENT READINESS FOR THIS TYPE OF RECRUITMENT.
AS MENTIONED, WE DO NOT HAVE PAD READY SITES AVAILABLE IN THE TOWN, WHICH SIGNIFICANTLY LIMITS OUR ABILITY TO ATTRACT LARGE SCALE RETAIL OR HOSPITALITY PRO PROJECTS IN A MEANINGFUL OR TIMELY WAY.
ADDITIONALLY, I WANNA BE THOUGHTFUL ABOUT THE TYPE OF GROWTH THAT WE ACTIVELY ARE ENCOURAGING IN FRONT ROYAL FRONT ROYAL IS NOT A BIG BOX DESTINATION.
WE ARE AN ECOTOURISM GATEWAY COMMUNITY.
PEOPLE COME HERE FOR SHENANDOAH NATIONAL PARK, SKYLINE DRIVE, THE SHENANDOAH RIVER, OUR HISTORIC DOWNTOWN, AND OUR LOCALLY OWNED RESTAURANTS, SHOPS, AND SERVICE.
THAT LOCAL ECONOMY IS A PART OF OUR IDENTITY IN FRONT ROYAL.
I'M ALSO MINDFUL THAT A AGGRESSIVE RECRUITMENT OF BIG BOX OR NATIONAL RETAILERS, INCLUDING FRANCHISE GS, WHICH WAS MENTIONED, CAN UNINTENTIONALLY DISPLACE HIGHLY SUCCESSFUL FAMILY OWNED BUSINESSES THAT ARE ALREADY OPERATING HERE IN FRONT ROYAL BUSINESSES THAT MEANINGFULLY CONTRIBUTE TO OUR TAX BASE, PROVIDE LOCAL EMPLOYMENT AND HELP SHAPE THE CULTURE AND THE QUALITY OF THE LIFE THAT MAKES FRONT ROYAL SPECIAL.
I BELIEVE OUR FOCUS SHOULD BE ON STRENGTHENING AND SUPPORTING OUR EXISTING BUSINESS COMMUNITY FUNDING LOCAL E ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT LEADERSHIP, IMPROVING THE READINESS AND PURSUING A STRATEGY THAT ALIGNS WITH WHO WE ARE AND WHAT MAKES THIS TOWN THRIVE, RATHER THAN OUTSOURCING THAT RESPONSIBILITY TO PEOPLE WHO AREN'T PRIVY TO THAT INFORMATION.
FOR THESE REASONS, I DO NOT SUPPORT MOVING FORWARD WITH THIS CONSULTING CONTRACT.
AT THIS TIME, I DON'T BELIEVE BECAUSE WE'VE ALREADY SPENT $55,000 ON DATA ONE TIME, WE SHOULD SPEND 55,000 A SECOND TIME TO MAYBE HAVE A NET TANGIBLE BENEFIT.
IN THE THIRD TIME, I BELIEVE THAT OUR TAX DOLLARS WOULD BE BETTER INVESTED IN LOCAL EXPERTISE, INFRASTRUCTURE, AND LONG-TERM ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT APPROACH THAT REFLECTS FRONT ROYAL'S VALUES, CHARACTER AND SUSTAINABILITY.
WITH THAT BEING SAID, I WAS READING A FOOD BLOG TODAY, WHICH LED ME TO GATHER THOSE THOUGHTS, AND IT'S A NATIONAL FOOD BLOGGER WHO CAME THROUGH FRONT ROYAL LAST WEEK AND CHOSE LDS TO EAT AT.
THEN I THOUGHT ABOUT THE GYM DOWN BELOW MY HOUSE THAT, UM, CHRIS GRADY OPENED UP, AND HOW ALL THE LOCAL FIREFIGHTERS AND LAW ENFORCEMENT FIRST RESPONDERS HAVE REALLY BEEN WELCOMED AND EMBRACED THERE AND OFFERED DISCOUNTS AND FOUND A FAMILY WITHIN THAT GYM.
AND I THINK ABOUT THE GYM THAT WAS RENOVATED, THAT USED TO BE DOMINION HEALTH AND FITNESS, AND IS NOW OWNED BY A LOCAL FAMILY AND A BIG BOX GYM WOULD LITERALLY DISPLACE THE PEOPLE WHO MAKE FRONT ROYAL WHAT IT IS.
THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE LIVED HERE, SERVED HERE AND CHOSE HERE TO BE BUSINESS FOR THEIR HOME.
I'VE SAID IT BEFORE AND I WAS CALLED A LIBERAL FOR IT, BUT I'LL SAY IT AGAIN.
I DO NOT THINK THAT WE ARE OPEN TO ANYBODY.
I THINK THE THINGS THAT MAKE TOWNS CHARMING AND UNIQUE LIKE OURS THAT WE SEE IN THE SURROUNDING MIDDLEBURG PER SEVILLE, THAT AREA ARE THAT THEY HAVE A STANDARD.
THEY'RE NOT JUST SAYING, WE'RE OPEN FOR BUSINESS AND ANYBODY CAN OPEN THEIR BUSINESS HERE.
THEY'RE PICKING AND CHOOSING, THIS IS WHAT FITS FOR US.
THIS IS WHAT'S NOT GOING TO SHUT DOWN.
MELTING POT PIZZA, MOMS KITCHEN, LDS HOMETOWN DINER, THE GYMS THAT HAVE BEEN OPENED BY VERY YOUNG ENTREPRENEURS THAT I WENT TO SCHOOL WITH.
AND IT'S GONNA MAINTAIN THE CHARM THAT WE ALREADY HAVE.
WITH THAT BEING SAID, PAGE COUNTY JUST HAD A MARSHALS OPEN IN THEIR SHOPPING CENTER, A MARSHALS.
WE DON'T EVEN HAVE A CLOTHING STORE IN THE TOWN OF FRONT ROYAL, RURAL KING IF YOU WANNA WEAR SOME WRANGLERS OR GET A T-SHIRT.
AND SO WE HEAR THAT WE NEED MORE ROOFTOPS AND HOUSEHOLDS AND POPULATION TO GROW.
I'VE SPOKEN WITH TWO OWNERS OF SHOPPING CENTERS IN THE TOWN OF FRONT ROYAL SINCE LAST MONDAY NIGHT'S MEETING.
NEITHER OF THEM HAVE TALKED TO RETAIL STRATEGIES, LLC, AND THEY BOTH HAVE VACANT OPEN BUILDINGS SITTING IN THOSE SHOPPING CENTERS.
THE FACT OF THE MATTER IS, WE'VE BEEN ECONOMICALLY DEVASTATED SINCE THE FEDERAL GOVERNMENT DEVASTATED US BY SHUTTING AVT TECHS DOWN ONCE THEY NO LONGER NEEDED US.
AND THE EPA MADE A SUPERFUND BROWN SITE.
AND SO I'VE JUST, I SEE TIME AND TIME AGAIN, PEOPLE AREN'T COMING TO FRONT ROYAL PEOPLE DIDN'T COME TO THE CHRISTMAS PARADE ON SATURDAY TO DRINK STARBUCKS.
THEY WENT TO DAILY GRIND, THEY WENT TO DL ON MAINE.
THEY WENT TO THE LOCAL MOM AND POP SHOPS.
UM, I THINK THAT IF THIS COUNCIL CHOOSES TO MOVE FORWARD WITH RETAIL STRATEGIES, LLC, INSTEAD OF ALLOCATING THE ADDITIONAL $110,000 TOWARDS ONE YEAR
[00:55:01]
OF A PROFESSIONAL, QUALIFIED, EFFICIENT ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT DIRECTOR, WE'RE DOING A DISSERVICE TO THE PEOPLE WHO HAVE CHOSEN TO MAKE FRONT ROYAL THE HOME FOR THEIR BUSINESS.AND THEY GO TO CHURCH WITH US.
THEY SHOP IN THE GR SAME GROCERY STORES AS US.
THEIR CHILDREN GO TO SCHOOL WITH US, THEY COME TO THESE COUNCIL MEETINGS, THEY WATCH THESE COUNCIL MEETINGS.
THEY PARTICIPATE IN THE LOCAL GOVERNING BODY.
IN SHORT, I WANT GROWTH THAT IS INTENTIONAL, AUTHENTIC, AND ROOTED IN FRONT.
ROYAL NOT OUTSOURCED ANY OTHER DISCUSSION, UH, MADAM MAYOR.
SO EVERYTHING THAT THE VICE MAYOR, UH, NO ONE'S GONNA ARGUE WITH WHAT THE VICE MAYOR, UH, HAS JUST, UH, PRESENTED.
UH, THE INTENT, THE INTENT OF RETAIL STRATEGIES WAS, WAS TO TAKE AN OVERVIEW OF WHAT WE HAVE AND WHAT WE DON'T HAVE AND WHAT THEY THINK THAT WOULD WORK HERE.
WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT ROOFTOPS, THEY WERE THEY ROOFTOPS THEY WERE REFERRING TO? UH, THE CONVERSATION KIND OF CENTERED AROUND GROCERY STORES, GROCERY STORES.
THEY, THEY LOOK AT A LARGE SUPERMARKET, LOOKS AT A LARGER MARKET.
I'M NOT SURE WHAT THAT MARKET THAT, UH, IS.
WE ONLY HAVE ABOUT 15,600 PEOPLE HERE.
MAYBE IT DEPENDS ON WHO YOU BELIEVE FITNESS, SOME PEOPLE SAY JUST UNDER 16,000.
SO, UM, BUT I THINK THEIR, THEIR, THEIR INTENT IS TO LOOK AT OUR STRONG POINTS AND OUR STRONG POINTS, AS THE VICE MAYOR ALLUDED TO, ARE TOURISM, UH, THE PARK.
UH, YOU KNOW, I HAVE THIS VISION PERSONALLY OF MAN, WOULDN'T IT BE GREAT IF WE COULD GET A A, A, UH, THREE AND A HALF OR FOUR STAR HOTEL AT THE FOOT OF THE SKYLINE DRIVE, UH, IF WE COULD GET THAT.
UH, AND, YOU KNOW, THESE ARE PROFESSIONALS DOWN IN ALABAMA.
THEY, THEY KNOW THE MARKET BETTER THAN WE DO.
UH, WE DON'T HAVE, I'M NOT SURE THAT $110,000 WOULD A, WOULD ATTRACT AN EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR.
UH, WE MAY BE LOOKING AT CLOSER TO 200,000 TO TO, TO GET A PLAYER HERE.
RETAIL STRATEGIES IS, IS A PLAYER.
UH, AND, UH, THEY, THEY, YOU KNOW, UH, SO THIS IS A SORT OF A POOR MAN'S WAY OF GETTING IN, GETTING INTO THE LARGER MARKET TO SEE IF WE CAN ATTRACT ANYBODY.
I WOULD BE THRILLED TO DEATH IF WE COULD GET A MARSHALS.
I, I DID NOT HEAR, UH, IN THAT PRESENTATION THAT THEY RULED OUT A MARSHALS.
UH, THEY, THEY FOCUSED ON A, A, A FEW, A FEW ITEMS LIKE, UH, HOTELS, UM, TOURISM.
THEY DID BRING THE POINT UP THAT, THAT, UH, THAT WE WOULD HAVE TO PARTICIPATE, UH, FROM A STANDPOINT OF BEING, WE, WE KNOW OUR MARKET BETTER THAN, THAN ANYONE ELSE.
UH, SO, UH, AS BEING A PART PARTICIPANT IN IT, UH, WE WOULD HAVE A, A SAY.
UH, I THINK THE POINT THAT, UM, THERE'S SENIOR DIRECTOR OF MICHAEL WARSAW, UM, AND HIS ASSOCIATE, JIMMY PRICKETT, UM, WHERE THEY WERE GOING WITH THIS THING WAS IS, IS THAT THEY CAN GIVE US THE EXPERTISE THAT WE CAN'T AFFORD.
SO THAT, THAT IS WHAT SOLD ME ON IT.
UH, AND, UH, I'M INTERESTED TO SEE THAT THEY'VE ESTABLISHED THE BASELINE.
I'M INTERESTED TO SEE IF THEY CAN BRING SOMETHING TO US IN A YEAR THAT MIGHT, UH, MIGHT LEAD TO SOMETHING BIGGER.
AND IT MAY NOT JUST BE ONE BUSINESS, IT MIGHT BE A COUPLE OF BUSINESSES.
UH, THEY'RE, THEY'RE GONNA REACH OUT AND FIND
[01:00:01]
OUT, UH, WHO IS INTERESTED IN COMING TO FRONT ROYAL.AND THERE ARE ADDITIONAL RESTAURANTS THAT, THAT I, I CAN SEE THAT WE, WE COULD USE.
ONE OF THE THINGS ABOUT BEING A DESTINATION IS YOU NEED A LOT OF PLACES FOR PEOPLE TO GO AND EAT.
YOU NEED PLACES FOR PEOPLE TO STAY OVERNIGHT, NOT JUST COME FOR THE DAY AND GO HOME.
SO, UM, I'M WILLING TO SUPPORT THIS EFFORT, UH, JUST TO SEE WHAT THEY CAN BRING TO THE TABLE.
UM, IS THERE ANY OTHER DISCUSSION BEFORE WE TAKE ACTION? YES, MA'AM.
UM, VICE MAYOR VIAL ASKED THEM A QUESTION, WHICH I REALLY THOUGHT WAS GOOD.
I, I DON'T, I KNOW THEY, YOU KNOW, THEY HAVE OTHER WAYS TO FIND, UH, OR DO THEIR RESEARCH.
UH, BUT THE GENTLEMAN HAD BEEN IN OUR, IN FOR $55,000.
HE HAD BEEN IN TOWN THREE TIMES IN A YEAR.
UM, YOU KNOW, I DON'T KNOW HOW, I DON'T KNOW HOW THEY CAN GET, UH, A STRATEGY DOWN BY COMING OUT.
I FORGET WHERE THEY WERE, THEY'RE FROM, BUT, UH, YEAH, GEORGIA, BUT I, I DON'T UNDERSTAND, YOU KNOW, UM, YOU KNOW, THREE TIMES IN A YEAR.
WHAT HAVE YOU BEEN DOING? ONE OF THE THINGS IS, GO AHEAD.
UM, I HAD MIXED THOUGHTS ON IT.
OBVIOUSLY, I'M NOT A, I'M NOT A BIG CONSULTANT PERSON IF WE HAVE EXPERTISE ON OUR STAFF, AND I DO BELIEVE OUR TOWN MANAGER HAS A LOT OF ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, UM, BACKGROUND AND ALSO SKILL.
HOWEVER, IT'S IN HIS EARLY PERIOD WITH US.
UM, AND I THINK WE DID MISS THE OPPORTUNITY OVER THE FIRST YEAR TO NAIL DOWN DELIVERABLES TO NAIL DOWN THE INFRASTRUCTURE.
UM, AND IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING THAT IF WE MOVE FORWARD WITH YEAR TWO, THERE ARE CERTAIN THINGS THAT, UM, THAT WILL BE PUT IN PLACE IN TERMS OF A RENEWAL OF THE CONTRACT, INCLUDING DELIVERABLES, INCLUDING HOW OFTEN THEY WILL PRESENT, INCLUDING, UM, THAT WE WILL HAVE A LIAISON FROM A TOWN COUNCIL, LIKE SIMILAR TO WHAT WE DO ON OTHER GROUPS AND A MORE, UM, OVERSIGHT AND CONNECTION BETWEEN EDA AND, UM, SOME OF THE OTHER CONSTITUENTS TO MAKE SURE THAT WE DO HAVE THAT LOCAL INPUT.
UM, SOMEBODY THAT LIKES STARBUCKS, AND I'M SOMEBODY THAT LIKES DAILY GRIND, UM, I WILL DRINK FROM BOTH OF THEM.
AND I THINK IN ANY COMMUNITY, YOU NEED BOTH THE LOCAL AND, YOU KNOW, THE, THE, THE CHAINS.
YOU KNOW, SOMETIMES WHEN I GO INTO A COMMUNITY AND I DON'T SEE ANY CHAIN, IT MAKES ME A LITTLE NERVOUS.
UM, SO I LIKE TO HAVE A MIX OF BOTH OF THEM.
AND I THINK THAT WE DO HAVE SOME VERY TALENTED AND AND KNOWLEDGEABLE LOCAL BUSINESS PEOPLE HERE, BUT THEY HAVE A BANDWIDTH ALSO.
THEY'RE RUNNING THEIR OWN BUSINESS.
THESE, AND AGAIN, THIS IS A WAY TO LEVERAGE WHAT WAS COMPELLING TO ME WAS, UM, AGAIN, THE PRICE.
I THINK THAT, I THINK COUNCILMAN RAPPAPORT'S CORRECT IN, IN THE PRICING OF, YOU KNOW, THAT, THAT WHAT WE'RE PAYING THEM TO GET OVER TWO TO THREE YEARS IS GONNA, WOULD NOT BUY US, BUT ONE YEAR WITH A, WITH A STAFF.
UM, SO IT'S A WAY TO LEVERAGE AND GET A FOUNDATION TO WHERE THEN PERHAPS OUR, WE CAN GET OUR PANEL MANAGER POSITIONED TO DO MORE OF WHAT HE DOES WELL AND, AND DELEGATE OUT.
SO I THINK THAT AGAIN, WE, WE MISSED THE OPPORTUNITY TO, TO MAKE A SUCCESSFUL INFRASTRUCTURE THAT WOULD MAKE THAT CONSULTANT MONEY WORK PROPERLY.
UM, I, YOU KNOW, I DID FEEL LIKE THE RESEARCH THAT THEY PROVIDED, YOU KNOW, ANY, A LOT OF IT WE HAD SEEN BEFORE AND WE COULD DO OURSELVES, BUT AGAIN, IT, IT IS A QUESTION OF BAND BANDWIDTH AND LEVERAGING AND CREATING A STRUCTURE FOR OVERSIGHT.
AND I THINK, YOU KNOW, JOE'S BEEN HERE A WHILE.
IT'S NOT TO LAY IT ALL ON HIM.
IT, IT'S ALSO, YOU KNOW, IT'S A, AGAIN, A PARTNERSHIP WITH LIZZIE AND, AND ALL THE GROUPS.
UM, BUT WE FRANKLY, YOU KNOW, WE DON'T, YES, WE HAVE OUR, A VERY, WE DO NEED TO HAVE THAT CONVERSATION ABOUT ROOFTOPS.
I'M NOT GONNA, YOU KNOW, I DON'T WANNA MAKE A, A, AGAIN, A NEIGHBORHOOD OF $600,000 HOMES FOR ANOTHER 200 PEOPLE SO THAT WE CAN HAVE AN ALDI COME IN.
YOU KNOW? SO, UM, YOU KNOW, THERE'S SOME REAL KNOWLEDGE THAT THEY ARE MISSING IN TERMS OF HOW WE WOULD LIKE TO SEE OUR COMMUNITY DEVELOP.
UM, BUT I, I, I DO WOULD NOT FEEL COMFORTABLE WITH A TWO YEAR CONTRACT.
I WOULD, I WOULD FEEL COMFORTABLE, I THINK, WITH THE PARAMETERS THAT I'VE JUST DISCUSSED, UM, MOVING FORWARD WITH A YEAR TWO, UH, AGAIN, TO BE HEAVILY OVERSIGHT, YOU KNOW, HAVE HEAVY OVERSIGHT, HAVE
[01:05:01]
DELIVERABLES IN THE CONTRACT AND, AND HIGHER EXPECTATIONS.AND I REALLY THINK THAT SOME OF OUR FOLKS HERE ON COUNCIL WHO ARE VERY KNOWLEDGEABLE, YOU KNOW, SHOULD BE LIKE THE LIAISON, NOT ME, BUT
BUT ANYWAY, THAT'S MY COMMENTS.
YEAH, MADAM MAYOR, I'M JUST GONNA, I KNOW WE WE'RE, WE'RE TALKING ON THIS LONGER THAN PROBABLY WHAT WE PLANNED, BUT I JUST WANT TO, UH, SAY RATHER QUICKLY, I'M, I'D LIKE TO ELABORATE ON WHAT COUNCILWOMAN DEAN AND MONICA PAYNE JUST SAID.
UH, I, I DO THINK THAT THERE NEEDS TO BE SOME ACTIVE OVERSIGHT IN THIS COMING YEAR.
I MEAN, I AM SUPPORTING MOVING THIS FORWARD, BUT HOWEVER, UH, AS COUNCIL WO AS, UH, VICE MAYOR AL STATED, UH, THERE ARE LEGITIMATE CONCERNS AS TO, UH, YOU KNOW, WHAT WAS DONE IN THE FIRST YEAR AND THE INFORMATION WE GOT QUICKLY AND IN, AND, UH, YOU KNOW, DIRECT COMMUNITY INPUT.
SO, ON THAT NOTE, YOU KNOW, AS COUNCILWOMAN, UH, DEAN MONICA PAYNE SAID, UH, WE, I BELIEVE WE SHOULD ESTABLISH, UH, SOMEONE YOU KNOW FROM THIS, SOMEONE FROM THIS COUNCIL, MAYBE SOMEONE FROM FRIDA, MAYBE SOMEONE FROM CHAMBER OF COMMERCE OR SOME, OR, OR, OR, UM, DOWNTOWN BUSINESS INC.
BUT WE HAVE PEOPLE IN ORGANIZATIONS ALREADY I THINK, THAT WE CAN GET PULL FROM TO SERVE AS AN OVERSIGHT FOR THIS.
AND AS SHE SAID, YOU KNOW, UH, COME UP WITH A, A LIST OF, A LIST OF DELIBERATES AND OUTLINE WHAT WE EXPECT THIS YEAR, THIS COMING YEAR, AND, AND GO FROM THERE.
AND LIKE I SAID, I, I WOULD BE OKAY WITH THAT FOR THIS COMING YEAR.
UH, AND I DO BELIEVE THAT THERE IS VALUE IN BEING ADDED IN A SENSE THAT, UH, THE INFORMATION THAT THEY ARE GIVING US, YOU KNOW, IT IS BEING GENERATED FROM AN UNBIASED SOURCE THAT HAS TO BE CONSIDERED AS WELL.
I MEAN, WE ARE LOOKING AT IT FROM FRONT ROW STANDPOINT.
THEY'RE LOOKING AT IT FROM AN OUTSIDE STANDPOINT.
SO THEY CAN TELL US, SOMETIMES THEY GIVE US, THEY MIGHT GIVE US INFORMATION THAT WE DON'T WANT TO HEAR.
I MEAN, WE'VE ALL BEEN ASKED, YOU KNOW, WHY AREN'T YOU GUYS GETTING ANOTHER SUPERMARKET HERE? YOU KNOW, THEY EXPLAINED, AND THEIR REASONING WHY IT GOES WITH THE ROOFTOPS IS ONE REASON.
BUT AGAIN, THERE'S PROBABLY NO, THERE'S MORE THAN THAT.
BUT, UM, BUT I THINK THERE'S INFORMATION THAT THEY CAN LOOK AT 'CAUSE AND, OR THEY CAN SEND US, OR GIVE OR PROVIDE US, YOU KNOW, THAT, UH, YOU KNOW, THAT, UH, THAT WE WOULDN'T, MAY PERHAPS NOT TAKE A LOOK AT.
BUT AGAIN, I AM SUPPORTING THIS.
BUT TO ASSUAGE, UH, HOPEFULLY ASSUAGE SOME OF THE CONCERNS THAT THE VICE MAYOR STATED AND TO ELABORATE WITH WHAT ON WHAT, UH, UH, COUNCILWOMAN MEDINA, MONICA PAYNE SAID, YOU KNOW, WE DIDN'T HAVE SOME OVERSIGHT COMING INTO THIS YEAR, THIS NEW YEAR.
OKAY, MADAM MAYOR, CAN I ADD A COMMENT TO THE PUBLIC? NOT TO ANY OF THESE COUNCIL MEMBERS.
I HAD PUT IT IN MY COUNCIL REPORT, UM, WHICH I DID, I VOTED IN FAVOR OF BECAUSE IT HAD TO BE UNANIMOUS, AND I DIDN'T WANNA BE A THORN IN MY FELLOW COUNCIL MEMBER'S SIDES.
BUT I THINK THAT IT WAS, UM, PROBABLY NOT OF GOOD SERVICE TO NOT GIVE REPORTS TONIGHT, CONSIDERING IT'S THE LAST CHANCE AND OPPORTUNITY THAT WE HAVE TO SPEAK TO THE GENERAL PUBLIC AS THIS COUNCIL, UM, FOR THE REMAINDER OF THIS YEAR.
AND SO, WITH THAT BEING SAID, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT I HAD INTENDED TO TOUCH ON WAS MY COMMITMENT TO THE PEOPLE WHO ELECTED ME AND BEING FISCALLY CONSERVATIVE.
NOW, I KNOW WHEN WE'RE WRITING CHECKS OUT OF A CHECKBOOK THAT DOESN'T HAVE OUR NAME ON IT, IT HAS THE TOWN OF FRONT ROYAL'S NAME.
IT'S A LITTLE EASIER TO DO, WHICH IS WHAT A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE ECHOED REGARDING THE RETAIL STRATEGIES.
WELL, WE'VE ALREADY GIVEN 'EM 55,000, SO WE NEED TO GIVE THEM ANOTHER 55,000 TO SEE IF MAYBE IN TWO YEARS WE MIGHT GET, WE MIGHT GET ONE, OR WE MIGHT GET A COUPLE, WE MIGHT GET NONE.
AND SO THE WAY THAT WE OPERATE IN OUR HOUSEHOLD IS IF WE INVEST IN SOMETHING THAT'S PRETTY EXPENSIVE, AND YES, 165,000, WHILE IT WOULD'VE ONLY GOT US A YEAR OR A YEAR AND A HALF, THAT EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR WOULD'VE SOLELY REPRESENTED THE TOWN OF FRONT ROYAL AT TRADE SHOWS THAT EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR WOULD'VE ALREADY HAD RELATIONSHIPS BUILT JUST LIKE THE RETAIL STRATEGIST CONSULTANT.
THEY WOULD'VE SOLELY BEEN ATTRACTING AND FINDING BUSINESSES THAT ALIGNED WITH FRONT ROYAL THAT WE HIRED THEM TO DO.
WITH THAT BEING SAID, THESE CHECKS THAT WE'RE COMMITTING TO WHEN WE TAKE THIS VOTE AND SUPPORT TONIGHT ARE COMING OUT OF THE TAXPAYERS CHECKS.
THESE IS, THIS IS A TAXPAYER FUNDED INITIATIVE.
AND SO TO BE HONEST AND TRANSPARENT IN THE PEOPLE THAT I REPRESENT, I DO NOT SUPPORT THROWING AN ADDITIONAL 55,000 AND THEN POTENTIALLY MAYBE ANOTHER $55,000 OF YOUR MONEY TOWARDS A POSSIBLE TANGIBLE NET BENEFIT THREE YEARS FROM ITS INCEPTION.
I THINK THAT WE HAVE VERY QUALIFIED INDIVIDUALS, UM, AND I KNOW THAT MANY EX EXECUTIVE DIRECTORS OF ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AUTHORITIES IN FRONT ROYAL AND WARREN COUNTY, WERE NOT MAKING 200,000 PLUS, UM, IN YEARS PAST.
[01:10:02]
MANY COMMERCIAL SPOTS AVAILABLE.I HAVE SPOKEN TO SOME COMMERCIAL BROKERAGES, WHICH ONE IS NOT EXISTENT IN THE TOWN OF FRONT ROYAL.
WE DO NOT HAVE A COMMERCIAL BROKERAGE HERE.
SO THEY, UH, TALKED A LOT ABOUT HOW THEY'RE DOING OFF MARKET DEALS, WHICH I FIND INTERESTING AND A BIT CONCERNING CONSIDERING.
I'VE HAD PEOPLE THAT OWN SHOPPING CENTERS REACH OUT TO ME THAT THEY HAVE NOT SPOKEN TO.
WITH ALL OF THAT BEING SAID, MARSHALLS DIDN'T COME TO PAGE COUNTY BECAUSE THEIR EXECUTIVE DIRECTOR OF THE EDA APPROACHED THEM.
MARSHALLS DIDN'T COME TO PAGE COUNTY BECAUSE A RETAIL STRATEGIST CONSULTANT GOT PAID $165,000 TO SELL THEMSELVES TO NOT ONLY THE TOWN OF LARAY, THE COUNTY OF PAGE, BUT ALSO A RETAIL STRATEGIST.
THEY CAME BECAUSE THERE WAS A SPACE OPEN AND THEY WANTED TO BE THERE.
WE HAVE SPACES OPEN IF BUSINESSES WANNA BE HERE.
PAYING SOMEBODY 165,000 TO PUT THE TOWN OF FRONT ROYAL ALONGSIDE DOZENS OF OTHER LOCALITIES AT TRADE SHOWS IS NOT WHAT'S GOING TO BRING THEM HERE.
FURTHERMORE, AT THE END OF THIS THREE YEARS, THE PLACES THAT COULD COME MAY BE PLACES THAT WE'RE NOT EVEN INTERESTED IN HOSTING IN OUR TOWN.
I'M NOT IN FAVOR OF OPENING THE TOWN'S CHECKBOOK TO WRITE ANOTHER CHECK FOR THE POSSIBILITY THAT WE MIGHT GET SOME MEALS TAX OR LODGING TAX IN A COUPLE OF YEARS.
AND IF WE DID, HOW MANY YEARS WOULD IT TAKE TO RECOUP THE $165,000 INVESTMENT THAT WE'RE MAKING? MADAM MAYOR, I FEEL COMPELLED TO, I DON'T, CAN WE HEAR YOU? CAN I HEAR YOU? OH, I'M SORRY.
I I FEEL COMPELLED TO, TO SPEAK AGAIN ON THIS BECAUSE WE TALK ABOUT AN ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT DIRECTOR.
UM, THE VERY GOOD ONES WILL COST WELL NORTH OF 150,000.
SO LET'S PRETEND FOR A MOMENT, TWO YEARS AGO IN THE BUDGET CYCLE, WE WOULD'VE PUT $165,000 INTO ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, HIRED A DIRECTOR.
DO WE KNOW WHERE WE WOULD BE TODAY? AND THE ANSWER OBVIOUSLY IS NO.
BUT IT'S NOT JUST $165,000 IN SALARY.
THERE'S THE BENEFIT LOAD, THERE'S THE TRAVEL, THERE'S ATTENDING THESE SHOWS, THERE'S THE NETWORKING.
NOTHING HAPPENS BY SITTING IN AN OFFICE IN FRONT ROYAL AND HOPING PEOPLE WILL COME TO YOU.
YOU HAVE TO GET OUT, YOU HAVE TO MAKE THE CONTACTS.
AND I'VE BEEN ON COUNCIL THROUGH TWO BUDGET CYCLES, AND THE APPETITE OF THIS COUNCIL HAS NOT BEEN TO BUDGET THAT TYPE OF MONEY FOR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT.
AND HERE WE ARE IN YEAR TWO, WE HAVE A LITTLE SOMETHING FOR THE 55,000 WE'VE SPENT, BUT 1 65 IS ONE YEAR.
SO IS, AM I HEARING FROM THE MAJORITY OF THE COUNCIL THAT NEXT BUDGET CYCLE, WHICH IS COMING UPON US IN THE NEXT THREE OR FOUR MONTHS, WE'RE WILLING TO SET ASIDE 175 $200,000 FOR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT? I, IT, MY EXPERIENCE WITH YOU GUYS WOULD BE NO.
SO, UH, IF NOT, THEN WHAT? AND I'LL LEAVE IT AT THAT.
SO, UM, COUPLE THINGS BEFORE WE TAKE ACTION ON THIS.
ONE IS, UM, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WAS PART OF THIS AFTER DISCUSSION, IT'S RECOMMENDED THAT MOVING FORWARD THERE WILL BE MEETINGS WITH TOWN COUNCIL.
I'M FREE TO REPRESENTATION OF REGULARLY SCHEDULED MEETINGS WITH RETAIL STRATEGIES OVER THE NEXT YEAR.
SO WE'LL SEE, UM, WHERE THIS VOTE GOES TONIGHT.
BUT THAT IS SOMETHING THAT I'LL LOOK AT, UM, AND APPOINTING SOMEBODY FROM TOWN COUNCIL THAT WOULD BE ABLE TO, TO BE A PART OF THOSE DISCUSSIONS.
I DO THINK THAT LAST WEEK WE ALL WERE, UM, WE ALL WERE, UH, I WON'T SAY SURPRISED, BUT IT WAS THE FIRST TIME WE WERE GETTING LARGE CHUNKS OF INFORMATION OR A REPORT FROM THEM.
UM, AND MAYBE FRIDA DID GET A REPORT AND WE JUST HADN'T.
SO ONE THING THAT I THINK WE CAN CORRECT MOVING FORWARD WOULD BE TO MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE, UM, YOU KNOW, GET LEAST PART OF THE CONVERSATION SO THAT WE CAN HEAR WHAT'S GOING ON.
EVEN THOUGH WE ALL KNOW THAT FRIDA OPERATES AS A SEPARATE, UM, ENTITY FROM US.
WE, WE DO FUND THIS, BUT, UM, THEY, THEY HAVE THEIR OWN BOARD AND, AND SUCH.
SO THAT'S ONE THING I WANTED TO SAY.
ANOTHER THING I WANTED TO COMMENT IS, SO I KNOW MR. WOOD, UH, COUNCILMAN WOOD'S QUESTION WAS RHETORICAL IN THAT.
SO ARE WE REALLY WILLING TO, YOU KNOW, SPEND MORE MONEY IN THAT BUDGET? AND WHAT I WOULD SAY TO THAT, 'CAUSE
[01:15:01]
I'M OBVIOUSLY DON'T HAVE THE ANSWER TO THAT, BUT I WOULD SAY THAT IF THAT IS SOMETHING THAT THIS COUNCIL IS ENTERTAINING, WE CERTAINLY, UH, WOULD NOT WANT TO, UM, SPEND THE MONEY TONIGHT THAT IF WE THINK WE'RE LATER GONNA HAVE NEEDED THAT FOR A POSITION.UM, LAST BUT NOT LEAST, THE COUNTY HAS, UH, TALKED ABOUT WHAT THEY WANT TO DO WITH ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT.
I KNOW THAT THERE WAS LOTS OF DISCUSSION THERE.
THEY BROUGHT IT UP AT THE LAST LIAISON MEETING, SEEING IF THIS WAS SOMETHING THAT WE WANTED TO DO TOGETHER.
IF WE WANTED TO COLLABORATE MORE.
UM, THERE WAS NO DECISION MADE.
BUT PART OF THAT WAS WE ALL, WE ALL KNEW THAT THERE WERE GONNA BE CHANGES ON THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS.
SO MAYBE NOW THAT THEY'RE IN JANUARY, THEY WILL AT LEAST HAVE THE SAME PEOPLE FOR A COUPLE YEARS.
MAYBE THEY'LL WANNA ENTERTAIN THAT CONVERSATION AGAIN.
AND MAYBE A POSITION, UM, THAT, UH, FOR E UH, ECONOMIC DIRECTOR, UM, IF THEY DECIDE TO GO FORWARD WITH THAT, THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE WOULD BENEFIT FROM.
'CAUSE AS WE'VE ALL SAID BEFORE, ANY ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT THAT HAPPENS IN THE TOWN DOESN'T JUST BENEFIT THE TOWN CITIZENS.
IT BENEFITS THE COUNTY CITIZENS.
AND I DO BELIEVE YOU'RE RIGHT.
I DON'T KNOW THAT THEY, THAT THOSE POSITIONS WERE MORE THAN THAT, UNLESS, OF COURSE SOMEBODY STOLE MORE THAN THAT, BUT THEY WEREN'T MAKING, THEY WEREN'T MAKING THAT AS A SALARY.
SOME PEOPLE JUST HELPED THEMSELVES TO IT.
SO, MS. PRESLEY, CAN WE TAKE A ROLL CALL? COUNCILMAN WATER? YES.
BEFORE I ADJOURN TONIGHT, ONE THING THAT I DO REGRET THAT WE DIDN'T HAVE THAT OPPORTUNITY TO DO, UM, OUR COUNCIL MEMBER REPORTS AND THE MAYOR'S REPORT AND THE TOWN MAYOR'S REPORT IS I FEEL CERTAIN THAT EVERYBODY UP HERE WOULD'VE REITERATED THE SAME THING, UM, THAT WE WOULD'VE ALL WANTED TO SAY, WHICH IS THAT WE, UH, WISH ALL OF OUR CITIZENS MERRY CHRISTMAS.
AND HOPEFULLY YOU HAVE TIME WITH YOUR FAMILY.
TIME TO RELAX, ENJOY THE HOLIDAYS.
I THINK THIS PAST WEEKEND WAS DEFINITELY A KICKOFF FOR THAT BECAUSE I PERSONALLY THINK WE HAD MORE PEOPLE ON MAIN STREET FOR THE PARADE THAN WHAT I'VE SEEN IN YEARS PAST.
EVERYBODY WAS STILL TALKING ABOUT IT TODAY AT WORK, BUT THEY HAD NEVER THAT THEY WERE, PEOPLE WERE SHOULDER TO SHOULDER.
SO, UM, I DO HOPE EVERYBODY DOES, UM, ENJOY THEIR HOLIDAYS.
WE WILL NOT BE TOGETHER BACK FOR A MEETING AGAIN UNTIL THE END OF JANUARY, BUT WE ARE GOING TO AURN JANUARY.
THAT'S OUR NEXT WORK SESSION, BUT NOT REALLY.
'CAUSE WE'RE GONNA HAVE ONE RIGHT NOW.
THAT'S WHAT I WAS TRYING TO SAY, IS WE'RE GONNA ADJOURN.
YOU'RE WELCOME TO STICK AROUND.
WE'RE GONNA HAVE A WORK SESSION WITH, UH, SIX ITEMS ON IT, UH, THAT HOPEFULLY DON'T TAKE VERY LONG FOR EVERYBODY.
SO I'M GONNA ADJOURN THE MEETING AND THEN DO I JUST LITERALLY TELL MS. PRESLEY, WE'RE GONNA DO A ROLL CALL FOR THE WORK SESSION.
MS. PRESLEY ROLL CALL FOR THE WORK SESSION, OR DO I NEED TO OPEN THE WORK SESSION? YOU, YOU NEED TO OPEN.
I'M GONNA OPEN THE FRONT ROLL TOWN COUNCIL WORK SESSION FOR DECEMBER 8TH.
IT IS A NOT A REGULAR WORK SESSION.
IT'S A SPECIALLY CALLED WORK SESSION, BUT, RIGHT.
SORRY BRENDAN, YOU CAN STICK AROUND OR NOT SIT AROUND.
BUT, UM, NO, BRENDA, WE GOTTA STAY.
SO THE FIRST, SO ALL OF THIS IS NEW BUSINESS.
THE FIRST ONE IS TWO A, WHICH IS THE PURCHASE OF OF A-R-C-G-I-S ENTERPRISE SOFTWARE LICENSING.
AND MS. CAMPBELL'S GONNA BE PRESENTING ON THAT.
YOU GET A FANCY PODIUM TONIGHT.
SO HONOR, THANKS FOR STICKING AROUND AND EXCITED.
HEY, SO, UH, ITEM TWO A IS FOR THE PURCHASE OF THE, I SAY ARC, GIS.
I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S, THAT'S IT.
ARC GIS SOFT ENTERPRISE SOFTWARE LICENSING.
UM, PURCHASING RECEIVED A REQUEST FROM THE DEPARTMENT OF PLANNING AND ZONING FOR THE PROCUREMENT OF THE ENTERPRISE GIS ENVIRONMENT AND CONSULTANT TEAM FROM ENVIRONMENTAL SYSTEMS RESEARCH INSTITUTE
[01:20:01]
INCORPORATED, WHICH WE CALL ESRI.UM, AND THE AMOUNT OF $90,537 OVER A THREE YEAR PERIOD, WHICH EQUATES TO 30,000 $179 ANNUALLY.
THE SOFTWARE IS TO SUPPORT THE NEWLY CREATED GIS POSITION IN ITS DUTIES ANALYSIS AND DATA MANAGEMENT.
UH, THIS PROCUREMENT IS BEING CONDUCTED AS A SOLE SOURCE PURCHASE IN ACCORDANCE WITH THE VIRGINIA PUBLIC PROCUREMENT ACT GUIDELINES.
ESRI IS THE OWNER, MANUFACTURER AND SOLE SOURCE PROVIDER OF THE US DOMESTIC SMALL MUNICIPAL AND COUNTY GOVERNMENT ENTERPRISE AGREEMENT FUNDING TO PURCHASE THE ARC GIS ENTERPRISE LICENSING IMPLEMENTATION AND MAINTENANCE FOR ONE YEAR ARE INCLUDED IN THE PLANNING AND ZONING MAINTENANCE SERVICE CONTRACT LINE ITEMS. COUNSEL, DOES ANYBODY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR MS. CAMPBELL, OR, SINCE PLANNING AND ZONING IS NOT HERE, I'M ASSUMING YOU, UH, MR. PETTY ARE GOING TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS FOR US ON THIS.
SO ANY, IT'S GONNA BE A THREE YEAR CONTRACT WITH THEM, RIGHT? CORRECT.
ANYBODY HAVE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR THEM? I, I WAS GONNA JUST ASK, AND I HATE TO 'CAUSE IT'S LATE, BUT LIKE WHAT DID, CAN YOU JUST GIVE US A REAL QUICK SYNOPSIS OF HOW THIS WILL BENEFIT? 'CAUSE WE HAVE A NEW POSITION, SO WHAT ARE SOME THINGS THAT THIS WOULD BENEFIT MR. PETTY? SO WE HAVEN'T HAD GIS IN FIVE YEARS.
UM, AND SO AS PART OF THAT, THEY UPDATE, YOU KNOW, A LOT OF CITIZENS GO ON THAT GIS WEBSITE AND UTILIZE THAT TOOL.
UM, OUR LIFE, UH, SAFETY FOLKS AND EN 9 1 1 USE IT.
SO WE HAVE NOT BEEN ADDRESSING NEW DEVELOPMENT SINCE, UH, WE HAVEN'T HAD IT NOW.
THE COUNTY'S HELPED US SOMETIME AND WE HAD THE REGIONAL COMMISSION HELPING US.
BUT THIS ALLOWS US TO DO THAT OURSELVES, ALLOWS US TO UPDATE OUR OWN MAPPING.
WE'RE USI UTILIZING THIS PROGRAM WITH OUR ENTERPRISE, UH, FUNDS.
SO LIKE, UH, ENERGY SERVICES AND OUR SEWER MAPPING AND ALL OF THAT WE CAN PUT INTO LAYERS TO ASSIST US IN OUR DESIGN.
UM, THAT WE DON'T CURRENTLY HAVE A LOT OF THAT.
AND SO SEAN, OUR NEW GIS, UM, COORDINATOR, IF YOU HAVE NOT MET HIM IS, IS GREAT.
HE DID THE NICE LITTLE MAPS THAT YOU'LL SEE FOR THE ALLEY VACATIONS.
UM, BUT WE HAVEN'T HAD JUST THAT SIMPLE TECHNOLOGY IN MANY YEARS JUST TO BE ABLE TO UTILIZE THAT TOOL AND IT'LL OPEN UP A LOT OF OPPORTUNITIES WITH, UM, POLICE DEPARTMENT AND A LOT OF OUR NEW SOFTWARE PACKAGES.
UM, WHEN WE LOOK AT OUR INFRASTRUCTURE ITSELF IN MAPPING OUT, YOU KNOW, THE SIMPLE THINGS OF LIGHT POLES AND WATER MAINS AND EVERYTHING TIES BACK TO GIS IN SOME WAY.
HE, IF I MAY, UH, MAYOR, HE ALSO, UH, PUT TOGETHER A-A-G-I-S SIDEWALK, SIDEWALK, UH, LAYOUT.
RIGHT? UH, UH, SO, UH, NOW, NOW WITH SOMETHING LIKE THIS, WHO KNOWS WHAT IS GONNA COME UP.
AND ONE OTHER BIG COMPONENT WITH THIS GIS IS THE FLOODPLAIN MANAGEMENT, YOU KNOW, A BIG PORTION OF TOWN IS IN THE FLOODPLAIN.
AND SO THERE'LL BE, YOU KNOW, UM, SEAN WILL BE GOING THROUGH THOSE COURSES AS WELL TO BECOME A CERTIFIED FLOODPLAIN MANAGER.
SO WE CAN DO FLOOD MAPPING WHEN THERE'S DEVELOPMENT AND THINGS OF THAT NATURE TOO.
SO THAT, THAT'S GONNA BE A HUGE BENEFIT FOR US.
DOES THAT, DO ANY OTHER COUNCIL MEMBERS HAVE ANY QUESTIONS? OKAY, THEN, UM, THE, ARE YOU ALL OKAY WITH PUTTING THIS ON THE CONSENT AGENDA FOR THE JANUARY 26TH? IS EVERYBODY OKAY WITH THAT? I'M OKAY WITH IT.
WE'LL HAVE LAST CONFLICT INTEREST.
I THOUGHT YOU SAID SOMEBODY'S GONNA HAVE A CONFLICT JUDGE OFFICE.
MICHELLE, THANKS FOR HANGING IN THERE.
ALRIGHT, THE NEXT ITEM, SORRY, THOSE THINGS ARE, IS ITEM TWO B.
SO THIS IS A REQUEST OF AK, A PORTION OF THE UNIMPROVED STREET BETWEEN EAST FOURTH STREET AND LOT 16.
AND MR. UM, MR. UM, PETTY, I BELIEVE THAT YOU ARE GONNA BE TAKING CARE OF THE NEXT 1, 2, 3, 4, 5 ITEMS AND THEY ARE ALL HAPPEN TO BE VACATIONS.
SO I'LL LET YOU START WITH ITEM TWO A, LIKE, LIKE AMBER SAID, OR OR VICE MAYOR BIDEN ALL SAID EARLIER, BOY, WE GOT A LOT OF PEOPLE WHO WANT OUR ONE, THE TOWN PROPERTY
WHEN IT, WHEN IT RAINS, IT POURS.
[01:25:01]
D, UM, THEY ARE SEPARATE APPLICATIONS, BUT IF YOU LOOK AT THE MAPS, THEY ARE ALL NEXT TO EACH OTHER.UM, THEY'RE JUST SEPARATE PARCELS OF AN OLD ROAD.
THIS OLD STREET WAS ORIGINALLY PLATTED WITH THE ORIGINAL FRONT ROW IN RIVERTON IMPROVEMENT COMPANY.
UH, YOU CAN DATE IT BACK TO DEED BOOK S UM, THIS IS LATE 18 HUNDREDS WHEN IT WAS PLATTED.
UM, AND IT WAS, UH, JUST AN UNNAMED ROAD THAT RAN ALONG THE RAILROAD TRACKS OVER THE YEARS, AS YOU CAN TELL, BY LOOKING AT THESE AERIAL IMAGES AND THE ATTACHED SURVEYS, THEY HAVE THEN LATER BEEN USED BY THE ADJOINING PROPERTY, UM, FOR DEVELOPMENT AND COMMERCIAL DEVELOPMENT AT THAT FOR MANY YEARS.
AND AS IT'S JUST KIND OF GONE UNNOTICED.
AND SO RECENTLY, THE, UM, AND YOU CAN SEE IN THEIR DISCUSSIONS, YOU KNOW, FOR REASONS THAT THE OWNER RESPECTFULLY REQUESTED THE TOWN VACATE THEM, UM, THEY'VE JUST BEEN USING THEM FOR MANY YEARS AND SO THEY HAVE SUBMITTED THIS APPLICATION.
UM, YOU KNOW, OUR TOWN STAFF HAS REVIEWED IT.
OBVIOUSLY IT, I THINK MOST STAFF DIDN'T EVEN KNOW IT EXISTED.
BUT WE HAVE REQUESTED, AND YOU'LL SEE IT ON SOME OF THE PLANTS, BUT THERE'S ALSO SOME WATER, UH, DOWN THERE THAT WE WILL HAVE MAPPED OUT.
AND WE'LL HAVE OUR STANDARD 20 FOOT UTILITY EASEMENT OVER ANY PUBLIC, UH, INFRASTRUCTURE THAT'S DOWN THERE.
THEY ARE NOT VACATING ANY OF FIFTH OR FOURTH STREET.
IT IS JUST THE ABUTTING PROPERTY NEXT TO THEM.
AND I'VE ALSO REACHED OUT TO NORFOLK SOUTHERN WHO OWNS THE RAILROAD SPUR ADJACENT TO IT, JUST TO ENSURE THEY DON'T HAVE ANY FUTURE PLANS FOR THE RAILROAD THERE.
UM, AND HAVE YET TO HEAR BACK ON ANY OF THEIR, BUT IF YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS ON THIS ITEM, OR I WOULD JUST, EVEN THE NEXT TWO, I'D BE HAPPY TO ANSWER THEM.
THEY'VE BEEN SUBMITTED BY TWO OR BY ZUCKERMAN METALS.
AND THE OTHER ONE IS BY THE LLC TWO 18 EAST FOURTH STREET, LLC, WHICH OWNS THE PORTION NEXT TO THEM.
AND IS THAT JIM HEFLIN? NO, THAT IS, UM, I'M NOT, NOT OF THE OWNER ITSELF, BUT IT'S JIM, MR IS WASHINGTON AVENUE, THAT SECTION.
DRUCKERMAN MEADOWS WERE THE FIRST TWO.
AND THEN THE SECOND ONE SHOULD BE TWO 18, OR THE FIRST ONE WAS TWO 18 FOURTH STREET.
AND THEN THE SECOND, UH, UNDER, UNDER, UH, I THINK IT'S 2D MM-HMM
HAS THE APPLICANT AGREED TO, UH, DO THE TITLE, EXAMINE, EXAMINE? SO I WAS CHATTING WITH THE SURVEYOR TODAY, UM, AND I'VE BEEN TALKING WITH GEORGE A. LITTLE BIT MORE ON THAT.
UM, WE FEEL LIKE WE'VE FOUND, UH, THE DEDICATION TO PUBLIC IN THAT S UM, THE, THE TOWN HAS HISTORICALLY ALSO VACATED, UH, FRONT ROW RIVERTON IMPROVEMENT COMPANY ALLEYS.
UM, I FOUND ONE FROM 1970 ONE'S EVEN IN THE NINE, UH, IN THE TEEN, UM, 2020 TEENS.
SO IT HAS BEEN, AND WE FEEL IT'S BEEN, SO WE'RE, WE'RE STILL LOOKING INTO THAT, BUT WE'LL WORK THROUGH THAT.
IF THEY NEED TO DO TITLE, WE WILL.
BUT IN ADDITION TO THAT, IF YOU LOOK AT EVEN FI DON'T WANT TO JUMP AROUND, BUT THAT IS ALSO A UNNAMED ALLEY AS PART OF THE FRONT ROW RIVERTON IMPROVEMENT COMPANY.
AND EVEN TODAY THOSE PROPERTY DESCRIPTIONS REVERT BACK TO DEED BOOK S PAGE 300.
SO IT, IT'S, THEY'VE GONE UNCHANGED, YOU KNOW, FROM THAT TIME, LONG TIME.
AND WE HAVE THE MAP IN OUR OFFICE IF YOU WANNA CHECK IT OUT.
SO B AND C IS THE SAME APPLICANT AND THEY OBVIOUSLY JUST WANT THE PROPERTY THAT'S CLOSE TO THEIR BUSINESS.
SO THAT'S WHAT THEY'RE LOOKING THE ITEM B AND C.
SO B IS IS UM, TWO 18 EAST FOURTH STREET, LLC.
UM, C IS ZUCKERMAN AND D IS ZUCKERMAN.
AND, AND AGAIN, ALL THREE ARE RIGHT IN LINE.
I THINK MAYBE NEXT MEETING, I'LL MAKE SURE THAT YOU HAVE A MAP THAT SHOWS ALL THREE RIGHT NEXT TO EACH OTHER MAKE IT WHOLE CLEAR.
THAT'S WHAT I WAS KIND OF, I'M SAYING I'M SWITCH OUT A TOPICAL SO WE COULD SEE.
UM, AND THERE'S NO LIKE LAND DISPUTES OR ANYTHING GOING ON WITH THESE, RIGHT? IT'S JUST THEY JUST WANNA ACQUIRE NO, I WHAT'S THERE AND STAFF DOESN'T HAVE ANY CONCERNS.
THE ONLY COMMENTS FROM STAFF AT THIS TIME WAS, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE SOME UTILITIES DOWN IN THERE AND WE'LL JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT THEY ARE SURVEYED AND THEN ALSO APPLY THE
[01:30:01]
EASEMENT, WHICH YOU'LL SEE IN THE PRELIMINARY SURVEYS.THEY'VE ALREADY, UH, DEDICATED THAT 20 FOOT WIDE DRAINAGE EASEMENT OVER TOP OF THAT, UM, STORM SEWER THERE.
SO, UM, ALL OF YOUR, SO I DID SEE WHERE LIKE ROBBIE HAD LOOKED AT THINGS AND THINGS MM-HMM
THAT, UM, EVERY PROPERTY HAS BEEN VIEWED BY YOUR STAFF AND ASSESSED FOR THE UTILITIES.
AND AGAIN, WITH THESE ITEMS HERE ON THE NEXT STEP WOULD BE THAT, YOU KNOW, THEY CAN BE ADVERTISED FOR A PUBLIC HEARING.
WE STILL HAVE ANOTHER OPPORTUNITY, UM, WHICH I WILL LIKELY JUST PUT ON THE AGENDA JUST IN CASE WE NEED TO ON, UH, JANUARY 5TH AS ONE MORE ADDITIONAL TIME FOR A WORK SESSION BEFORE YOU ADVERTISE FOR THE PUBLIC HEARING, TO ENSURE WE'VE, IF THERE'S ANY OTHER DETAILS THAT WE DISCOVER BETWEEN NOW AND THEN THAT WE NEED TO DISCUSS BEFORE MAKING THAT ADVERTISEMENT FOR THE PUBLIC HEARING AND ALL THE, SO WHEN WILL THE NEARBY PROPERTY OWNERS BE MADE AWARE? ONCE IT'S, ONCE IT'S ADVERTISED FOR THE PUBLIC HEARING? THE PUBLIC HEARING.
SO THEY, SO THEY WOULDN'T KNOW ABOUT THE A WORK SESSION? LIKE IF WE PUT THIS ON THE JANUARY 5TH WORK SESSION TO DISCUSS AGAIN, THAT STILL ISN'T, THAT WOULD YOU, COULD THEIR OPPORTUNITY TO TALK IF IT MOVES WAR WOULD BE JANUARY 26TH? CORRECT.
AND THE ADVERTISEMENT, AND I'LL ASK THE CLERK JUST TO CONFIRM, IT CAN BE NO LONGER THAN 28 DAYS PRIOR TO, I, I THOUGHT VACATIONS REQUIRED 30 DAYS.
BUT DON'T THEY HAVE A DIFFERENT IN YOUR POLICY OR DID YOU CHANGE THEM? UH, IT'S, IT'S A STATE CODE REGULATION AND I THINK IT'S NO LONGER THAN 28 DAYS.
IT CAN'T BE, YEAH, THAT PART CAN'T BE FURTHER.
AND THEN IT HAS TO BE BEFORE TWO AFTER.
BUT I THOUGHT VACATIONS REQUIRED PROPERTY OWNER NOTICES 30 DAYS IN ADVANCE OF A PUBLIC HEARING.
AND IF THAT'S THE CASE, THEN WE WOULDN'T BE HAVING A PUBLIC HEARING UNTIL FEBRUARY.
UM, ADVERTISE VACATIONS WERE DIFFERENT.
UM, SOMEBODY ASKED THE QUESTION, UNLESS WE DECIDED TO ADVERTISE NOW, BUT WE CAN'T.
YES OR NO? LIKE, IS THAT SOME, OR DO WE, DO WE NEED TO, SHOULD WE HAVE TWO PUB? SHOULD WE HAVE TWO WORK SESSIONS ON THIS? FIRST YOU DON'T NEED TO.
I MEAN, WITHIN THAT WINDOW IT WOULD STILL HAVE TO BE WITHIN THE WINDOW OF, OF WHAT WE WOULD BE, WE CAN'T ADVERTISE TOO EARLY.
I I'M NOT SUGGESTING THAT WE PUSH THIS FORWARD QUICKER THAN ANYBODY IS.
'CAUSE I KNOW WE'RE JUST HEARING ABOUT IT TONIGHT, BUT THE ONLY REASON WHY I SAID IT IS BECAUSE IT, IT'S NOT PROPERTY THAT ANYBODY'S BEEN USING OBVIOUSLY.
AND WE ALREADY HAVE, WE ALREADY HAVE UTILITIES THERE.
SO THERE'S NOT A PREDICTION OF UTILITIES NEEDING TO BE THERE IN THE FUTURE.
WE ALREADY HAVE 'EM THERE, WHICH MEANS WE WILL HAVE THE EASEMENT ALREADY SET, YOU KNOW, WE, NOTHING'S GONNA CHANGE IS WHAT I'M TRYING TO SAY.
IT LOOKS LIKE THERE'S NO, IF I'M READING THIS CORRECT, IT LOOKS LIKE THERE'S NO OTHER ABUTTING OWNERS OTHER THAN THE RAILROAD.
NO, BUT THERE, I THINK THERE HAS BEEN A LITTLE BIT OF ENCOURAGEMENT, RIGHT? WHERE THAT'S OH, WE HAVE ABILITY.
SO IT'S MORE THAN A LITTLE BIT.
SO, SO MY QUESTION WOULD BE WHAT HAPPENS IF THAT ENCROACHMENT, UM, IN, IN TERMS OF EASEMENTS? OR ARE THERE ANY CONCERNS IN THAT REGARD THAT, IS THERE ANY, ANY CONFLICT IN THAT REGARD? UH, ONE MORE TIME, YOU MEAN? SO IF, IF, IF THEY HAVE, IF THEY HAVE ALREADY PUT SOME STRUCTURES OR OTHERWISE ENCROACHED ON THE ALLEY, WHICH APPARENTLY HAS HAPPENED MM-HMM
SIGNIFICANTLY, THEN WHAT DOES THAT DO TO OUR REQUEST THAT WE HAVE A CERTAIN, YOU KNOW, UH, LENGTH OF EASEMENT OR WHAT, YOU KNOW, WHAT HAPPENS, WHAT I MEAN IN THAT CASE, RIGHT? SO IF THERE'S AN ENCROACHING STRUCTURE, UH, WITHIN THE AREA WHERE WE WANT AN EASEMENT, THAT IS A PROBLEM.
UM, AND DO WE KNOW WE DON'T KNOW THAT YET.
I GUESS DO WE KNOW, DO WE KNOW THAT? I DON'T KNOW THAT KNOW.
DO WE KNOW THAT? DO WE KNOW IF THERE'S A CONFLICT YET? OR DO WE HAVE TO LOOK AT THAT ARD THAT THEY'RE IN THE EASEMENT? YEAH, THEY'RE IN IT.
I MEAN, THEY'RE IN THE, THEY'RE IN THE RIGHT OF WAY NOW.
BUT ARE THEY, LIKE IF WE SAID THE UTILITIES, OH, YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN? SO IF IT'S A, IF IT'S A UTILITY, WE DO A HOME HAR HOLD HARMLESS FREE, UM, UTILITY EASEMENTS.
I DON'T THINK IT'S ON TOP OF ANY INFRASTRUCTURE.
IT MIGHT ENCROACH ON THE EASEMENT AT THAT POINT.
WE WOULD DO IS WE CURRENTLY DO IS PEOPLE CAN PUT FENCES WITHIN OUR UTILITY EASEMENTS.
THEY HAVE TO SIGN A HOLD HARMLESS THAT IF WE HAVE TO REPAIR THOSE, THEN IT'S AT THE OWNER'S EXPENSE.
[01:35:01]
WE WOULD, WE WOULD OBVIOUSLY INCORPORATE THAT INTO ANY APPROVALS IF THERE'S ENCROACHMENT ON IT.I BELIEVE THE FAR SOUTH ONE DOES HAVE A BUILDING THAT MAY ENCROACH ON THAT.
AND THERE IS NO DESIRE BY THE TOWN TO CONNECT THOSE ALLEYS RUNNING ALONG THE, UH, RAILROAD.
THE FURTHER SOUTH YOU GET, UM, IT DISAPPEARS AND SO THERE IS NO ALLEY FURTHER SOUTH DOES, SO IT'S, IT DOESN'T CONNECT, UH, TO COMMERCE AVENUE IN THEORY.
IT, IT ENDS JUST SOUTH OF FOURTH STREET MM-HMM
AND THEN IT, AS THIS WOULD END, IT ENDS AT THE CREEK.
UM, SO TO GO FURTHER NORTH, YOU WOULD NEED TO DEVELOP ANOTHER BRIDGE TO GET OVER HAPPY CREEK.
SO THERE'S NO WAY TO LOGICALLY CONNECT THIS STREET ANYMORE.
SO IF I CAN ADDRESS THE NOTICE REQUIREMENT MM-HMM
SO WE NEED TO REMEMBER THAT STEP ONE INVOLVES THE INTEREST OF THE PUBLIC AT LARGE.
SO IT'S THE PUBLIC AT LARGE BEING PUT ON NOTICE OF THE VACATION.
UM, WE GO AHEAD AND NOTICE A BUDDING OWNERS FOR THE REASON THAT COUNCIL'S APPROACH, UH, HAS ALWAYS BEEN THAT THE VACATION'S GONNA BE CONDITIONED ON A BUDDING OWNER'S PURCHASING, UH, UH, THE ENTIRETY OF THE RIGHT OF WAY SO THAT THERE IS NOT A FRAGMENT OF LAND REMAINING.
THERE COULD BE A SCENARIO WHERE THE PUBLIC'S RIGHT OF INGRESS AND EGRESS IS VACATED WITHOUT ANY INTENT OF SELLING.
UH, WE HAVEN'T SEEN THAT SCENARIO.
SO, UM, SO A BUDDING OWNERS ARE GIVEN ACTUAL NOTICE IN THE BELIEF THAT, UH, THE VACATION'S GONNA BE CONDITIONAL, AND IF THERE'S NOT A COMPLETE SALE, THEN THE VACATION WILL BE VOID.
SO THAT'S WHY, UH, CERTIFIED LETTERS IS THAT, IS THAT WHAT'S CERTIFIED OR? WELL, IN THE PAST WE'VE ALWAYS DONE 'EM, UH, WE DIDN'T DO 'EM CERTIFIED.
BUT, BUT, BUT IT WAS TO RECEIVE PUBLIC COMMENT.
IT WASN'T AN ACTUAL PUBLIC HEARING.
WHEN WE SENT THOSE LETTERS TO THE PROPERTY OWNERS, THEY WERE JUST TO ALLOW THEM TO COME AND GIVE PUBLIC COMMENT.
AND WE DID THAT 30 DAYS IN ADVANCE OF THE PUBLIC HEARING.
SO IF YOU'RE GOING ON THE 26TH, THE LETTERS WOULD GO OUT MM-HMM
BUT AT THAT POINT THEY'LL ALSO BE PUT ON NOTICE THAT YES.
OF THE COUNSEL'S INTENT TO SELL.
IT'S THE LE IT'S IN THE LETTER.
ONE THING I'LL SAY, I KNOW YOU JUST SAID THEY AREN'T CERTIFIED.
UM, I WILL, I DO REMEMBER WE USED TO, YEAH.
I, AND I DON'T KNOW IF THIS IS THE PLACE FOR THIS CONVERSATION,
I THINK THAT MIGHT HAVE BEEN WHEN WE DID TWO PUBLIC HEARINGS.
BUT ANYWAY, THIS IS, I, I, I KNOW EXACTLY WHERE IT WAS AND I KNOW EXACTLY WHO THE CITIZEN WAS.
UM, AND SHE, SHE FELT LIKE SHE DIDN'T HAVE ENOUGH PROPER NOTICE.
AND HAD SHE KNOWN, YOU KNOW, SOONER, SHE WOULD'VE GATHERED MORE INFORMATION.
SO I DON'T KNOW HOW, HOW MUCH MORE COSTLY IS IT TO DO CERTIFIED? WELL, I, I WILL HAVE TO DEFER EITHER TO THE TOWN MANAGER OR THE EXECUTIVE ASSISTANT.
I NO LONGER DO THOSE FOR THE VACATIONS.
THEY STAY IN THE TOWN MANAGER'S OFFICE.
WELL WE CAN TALK ABOUT IT LATER.
I ONLY SAY THAT 'CAUSE I, I, I, I DON'T HAVE A WHOLE LOT OF FAITH IN SNAIL MAIL RIGHT NOW.
LIKE, PEOPLE ARE NOT GETTING THINGS.
NOT AT ALL, YOU KNOW, WEDDING INVITATIONS, I NEVER GOT THERE AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
I JUST WOULD, I JUST WOULDN'T WANT ANYBODY TO, I WOULDN'T WANT ANYBODY TO SHOW UP IN A MEETING AFTER THE FACT AND SAY, WELL, Y'ALL NEVER LET ME KNOW.
NOW GRANTED, WE PUT UP SIGNS AND WE DO ALL KINDS OF OTHER THINGS TO LET PEOPLE KNOW, BUT IF THERE'S A WAY TO MAKE SURE THAT SOMEBODY SIGNED FOR THE LETTER, I WOULD PROBABLY FEEL MORE COMFORTABLE WITH THAT IN THE FUTURE.
LOTS OF QUESTIONS JUST CAME UP AND WE WERE KIND OF JOINTLY ASKING THESE QUESTIONS ACROSS, ACROSS THREE PROPERTIES.
UM, DO WE HAVE SO MANY QUESTIONS AT THIS POINT THAT WE WOULD FEEL MORE CONFIDENT IF WE BROUGHT IT BACK TO THE WORK SESSION FOR JANUARY 5TH? OR DO PEOPLE FEEL LIKE THEY FEEL CONFIDENT THAT WE COULD, THAT, THAT YOU'RE COMFORTABLE WITH SAYING WE'RE GONNA HAVE A PUBLIC HEARING IN JANUARY? THAT'S WHAT I NEED TO KNOW.
[01:40:01]
WEIRD 'CAUSE WE'RE UP HERE INSTEAD OF AT A WORK SESSION WHERE I CAN BE LIKE, WHAT DO YOU THINK? WHAT DO YOU THINK MADAM MAYOR? YES.UM, I, I JUST TO PIGGYBACK ON THE MAIL ISSUE, IS THERE, ARE YOU ALLOWED TO PUT THE NOTICE WITH THEIR UTILITY BILL AT ALL? I DON'T THINK SO.
'CAUSE SOMEBODY MIGHT RAN AND THOSE ARE ON, UH, SET TIMELINE AND THEY DO THEM, IT, IT MIGHT BE JUST TRICKY TO, SO YEAH, WE WOULD DO THEM INDIVIDUALLY.
AND FOR THESE, FOR THESE EXACT ONES, IT'S VERY, YOU'RE TALKING FIVE LETTERS AND ONE OF 'EM, YOU KNOW, BY LAW IS ZUCKERMAN METAL IS THE BUDDING PROPERTIES.
SO THEY'RE GETTING A LETTER ABOUT THEMSELVES.
IT'S, IT'S VERY FEW FOR THESE, IT'S, IT'S PRETTY MINIMAL.
PLUS IT'S THE PROPERTY OWNER AND SOMETIMES THERE'S A RENTER THAT'S GETTING THE ELECTRIC BILL.
NOT THE TRUE, NOT THE, WE'RE TYPICALLY LOOKING AT FOUR OR FIVE LETTERS FOR SOME OF THESE.
I'M NOT SAYING NECESSARILY THIS SITUATION, MR. PETTY, I'M SAYING MOVING FORWARD, LIKE, UM, I KNOW IT COSTS A LITTLE BIT MORE, BUT I JUST, I FEEL LIKE, I JUST FEEL LIKE WE CAN'T COUNT ON, DON'T HAVE THAT SAME KIND OF CONFIDENCE.
IT USED TO BE YOU GOT, YOU KNEW YOU GOT YOUR MAIL AND YOU GOT IT WITHIN TWO TO THREE DAYS.
SO COUNSEL, I JUST NEED TO KNOW WHAT YOUR THOUGHTS ARE AND I'M GONNA START WITH YOU, MR. RAP, OR GO AHEAD.
I JUST, I JUST BEEN TRYING TO ASK ONE QUESTION HERE.
UM, AND I KNOW THIS HAS MUST HAVE BEEN TOUCHED ON, BUT, UH, WITH THE EXCEPTION OF THE, UH, UM, UTILITY POSSIBLE UTILITY ENCOURAGEMENT WITH, WITH THE EXISTING INFRASTRUCTURE THAT'S ALREADY THERE, IS THERE ANY OTHER CON ARE THERE ANY OTHER CONCERNS THAT, THAT THE EXISTING STRUCTURES THAT ARE THERE, UH, WOULD CAUSE AN ISSUE OR ANY, OR ANY OTHER SCENARIOS THAT ARE THERE? I MEAN, LIKE, SAY IF, I MEAN, TECHNICALLY THEY'RE ON TOWN PROPERTY NOW BY LAW, I GUESS, BUT ALTHOUGH AGAIN, IT'S BEEN A BLIND EYE FOR A HUNDRED PLUS YEARS.
BUT I THINK THAT'S KIND OF WHERE WE LOOKED AT IS IT'S, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE INFRASTRUCTURE IN THE GROUND AND, UM, THEY REALLY HAVEN'T, THEY'VE BEEN THERE FOR QUITE A WHILE AND HAVEN'T REALLY IMPACTED US AT THIS POINT.
AND NOW AT LEAST WE WILL HAVE PLANTED EASEMENTS AND, AND A RIGHT OF WAY AND, AND SETBACKS AND I, I DO BELIEVE IT MEETS MOST OF THOSE.
AND IF THERE WERE TO BE A NEED TO ACCESS THOSE UTILITY, IT WILL BE IN THE CONTRACTOR OR WHATEVER IT IS THAT STATES THAT IF WE, IF WE HAVE TO MOVE THEIR STRUCTURES MM-HMM
TO GET TO THEIR, THAT, THAT WE WON'T BE REPLACING THE STRUCTURE.
THAT THE STRUCTURES WILL BE MOVED AT AT THEIR EXPENSE.
UM, THE LETTERS ARE MAILED CERTIFIED.
COUNCILMAN RAPPAPORT, HOW DO YOU FEEL ABOUT BC AND D? YEAH, I'M READY TO MOVE FORWARD.
SO YOU WOULD BE OKAY WITH SENDING LETTERS FOR A PUBLIC HEARING IN JULY? JANUARY 22ND? JULY? NO, I'M MOVING RIGHT ALONG.
UH, COUNCILMAN INGRAM, DO YOU HAVE ANY, DO YOU NEED MORE, MORE TIME OR ARE YOU OKAY WITH GOING FOR A PUBLIC HEARING IN JANUARY FOR NOW? YEAH, I'M OKAY WITH.
I AM, I'M JUST GONNA LOOK BACK AND SEE HOW MANY OTHER PUBLIC HEARINGS WE HAVE.
I KNOW, THAT'S ACTUALLY WHAT I WAS GONNA ASK.
BUT WE WON'T, WE ALREADY HAVE A COUPLE, WE HAVE TWO SO FAR.
WE STILL HAVE JANUARY 5TH THOUGH, THAT WE COULD POSSIBLY BE ADDING SOME MORE PUBLIC HEARINGS.
UM, MR. COUNCILMAN SEAL FINE, AS IN FINE TO HOLD A PUBLIC HEARING AT THE END OF JANUARY.
SO FOR B, C, AND D, THE PUBLIC HEARINGS WILL BE ON JANUARY 25TH NOW E 26TH.
E UH, MR. PETTY, THAT'S A REQUEST TO VACATE A PORTION OF THE UNIMPROVED RANDOLPH AVENUE BETWEEN WASHINGTON AVENUE AND LOT FIVE.
THIS ONE ALSO ABUTS RAILROAD TRACKS.
UH, BUT, UM, SO THIS ONE, IT, WE HAVE, UH, STAFFS REVIEWED IT.
UM, THERE IS TECHNICALLY ONLY ONE ABUTTING PROPERTY OWNER FOR THIS ONE, AND THAT IS THE PERSON MAKING THE REQUEST.
UM, RECENTLY THE TOWN CREATED A CUL-DE-SAC AT THE END OF THIS ROAD, UH, THAT ALLOWS OUR REFUGE TRUCKS TO MAKE APPROPRIATE TURNS WHEN THEY'RE PICKING UP, UH, SOLID WASTE.
AND THERE WE HAVE CALLED OUT SOME SPECIFIC, UH, DRAINAGE EASEMENTS THAT WE WILL BE SEEKING THOSE.
IF YOU LOOK AT THE SURVEY THERE, YOU ONLY ILLUSTRATE 10 AND SIX FOOT.
SO WE PLAN TO EXTEND THOSE TO 20 FOOT AS STANDARD WITH ALL OF OUR OTHER EASEMENTS.
UM, YOU KNOW, AT THIS POINT, IF WE WERE ABLE
[01:45:01]
TO GET THOSE DRAINAGE EASEMENTS AND INFRASTRUCTURE WE'VE ALREADY DONE, THE CUL-DE-SAC LOOKS GREAT IF YOU'VE BEEN UP THERE, YOU KNOW, WE'VE UTILIZED ABOUT AS MUCH AS WE CAN OUT OF THIS.SO THIS IS ANOTHER ONE THAT, YOU KNOW, STRATEGICALLY, WE'VE, WE'VE DONE WHAT WE CAN AND WE'VE PROTECTED OUR, UH, INFRASTRUCTURE NEEDS.
AND, YOU KNOW, WE DEFINITELY LOOKED AT, ONE OF THE BIG THINGS WE LOOKED AT IS, UH, THE EAST WEST CONNECTOR ROAD THAT WOULD CONNECT TO CHAND SHORES.
YOU KNOW, IT WOULD COME CLOSE TO THIS, BUT WE, WE DIDN'T FORESEE ANY CONFLICTS IF THAT WERE TO EVER BE ESTABLISHED THAT THIS AREA WOULD BE NEEDED AT THAT TIME.
'CAUSE IT'S A, IT'S A BLOCK SO OVER.
SO, UM, WE, WE DID LOOK INTO THE FUTURE JUST TO MAKE SURE THAT THERE WASN'T ANY OTHER COMMENTS.
SO STAFF WAS PRETTY GOOD ABOUT MOVING THIS ONE FORWARD.
SO JOE, MY ONLY QUESTION IS THAT, UM, I SHOWN RIGHT HERE ON THIS MAP, UH, LOOKS LIKE THIS VACATION COVERS THE TWO LOTS, BUT LIKE I SAID, IT'S THE APPLICANT'S LOT IS, UH, THE CORNER SECTION OF IT.
NOW, DOES THIS, DOES THIS UM, UH, ALLEYWAY, IF WILL DOES, DOES THIS CONTINUE SOUTH? OR, OR, OR I GUESS YOU CAN, DOES THIS CONTINUE ALONG THE RAILROAD TRACK? IT, IT, IT DOES, IT GO, GOES FURTHER DOWN.
I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE IT'S, IT LOOKS LIKE, LOOKS LIKE IT DOES.
AND WE HAVEN'T DONE ANYTHING TO THE EAST AND LIKE I SAID, YOU KNOW, WE'VE, AS YOU CAN TELL FROM THE AERIAL PICTURE, THE CUL-DE-SAC DOESN'T EXIST AND WE'VE SINCE RIGHT.
SO WE'VE DONE WHAT WE FEEL LIKE WE'VE CAN.
WELL MY, MY OTHER QUESTION WAS, IS LIKE THIS OTHER LOT RIGHT OVER IN THE CORNER, WE REALLY CAN'T SEE IT, BUT THERE STILL IS, THERE'S, THIS WOULD NOT BE LANDLOCKED, THERE WOULD STILL BE ACCESS TO THIS WITH ADJACENT PROPERTY IF, IF IT WAS EVER NEEDED FOR THE, FOR THE REMAINING PORTION OF IT.
I'M JUST SAYING IT'S BECAUSE, YOU KNOW, WAS IT LA YOU KNOW, WE HAD THAT APPLICATION IMPOSED WHERE WE WERE QUOTE UNQUOTE LAND LAND LOCKING IF YOU WILL.
BUT THIS WOULD NOT BE LANDLOCKED.
WHICH WOULD BE LIKE THE BACK OF 7 0 4.
AND THAT'S THE NUMBER ONE THING THAT ZONING SHOULD BE REVIEWING WHEN THEY LOOK AT THESE IS TO OBVIOUSLY MAKE SURE THAT NO PROPERTY WILL BE LANDLOCKED.
IS THIS WHAT JOE, THIS TOP OF THIS MAP, THAT'S THE WASTEWATER TREATMENT PLANT, RIGHT? OH, UM, IT IS ACROSS THE STREET IS ENERGY SERVICES.
THOSE TWO BUILDINGS THAT YOU SEE ARE ENERGY SERVICES DEPARTMENT.
I KNOW, TRUST ME, I LOOK AT THE ONES BY MY HOUSE.
I'M LIKE, WHAT
WELL WHEN YOU'RE, IT LOOKS, IT LOOKS DIFFERENT ON THIS WHEN, WHEN YOU'RE DOWN ON THE GROUND AND LOOK AT IT, YOU KNOW, VERY DIFFERENT.
THERE'S THE TREES AND THEN IT LOOKS CLOSER AND THEN THESE ACTUALLY TO ME IT LOOKS FURTHER, BUT YOU KNOW, YOU CAN WALK, YOU KNOW, YOU CAN WALK THE DISTANCE OF THIS THAT YOU SEE IN A MATTER.
YEAH, I CAN WALK THIS IN A COUPLE SECONDS, BUT, UM, YOU KNOW, BUT HERE, YOU KNOW, IT LOOKS, IT LOOKS LIKE IT'S, YOU KNOW, ALLOW ALONG ALMOST.
COUNSEL, DOES ANYBODY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR STAFF ABOUT EI MEAN, YOU'VE ALREADY BEEN ASKING QUESTIONS, BUT ARE THERE ANY ADDITIONAL QUESTIONS?
SO AS WE, EXCUSE ME, UM, WE HAVE DEFINED, SO THERE WAS AN EASEMENT ALREADY PLATTED IN THE BACK.
WE'RE GONNA ASK TO ACTUALLY EXTEND THAT OUT A LITTLE BIT MORE TO MEET OUR CURRENT STANDARDS AND THEN THE 10 FOOT DRAINAGE AND UTILITY EASEMENT, UM, THAT THEY WOULD GRANT WITH THIS ONE THAT YOU SEE ON THE UPPER END, WE'RE ACTUALLY ALSO GONNA ASK THEM TO, THAT'D BE 20 FOOT.
THAT WOULD, THAT'S OUR STANDARD.
UM, SO THAT WAS IN THE STAFF COMMENTS AS WELL.
SO WE, WE WILL BE REQUESTING THAT AS PART OF THE ORDINANCE.
SO THE APPLICANT WOULD KNOW THAT THERE WOULD BE THAT.
THEY WOULD HAVE TO PROVIDE MORE.
WE'RE NOT THE APPLICANT BUT WHOEVER ENDS UP PURCHASING IT.
SO MY QUESTION IS STAFF, I MEAN NOT STAFF COUNSEL, DO YOU ALL WANNA ADD THIS TO THE JANUARY 26TH AS WELL? MAY AS WELL.
ARE YOU GUYS OKAY WITH THAT? HOW MANY PROPERTY OWNERS NEED TO BE NOTIFIED FOR THIS ONE? TWO.
I THINK IT'S JUST HIM AND IT'S JUST, IT'S JUST HIM.
IS IT HE AND NOR NORFOLK SOUTHERN OR NO? YEAH.
WE'LL REACH OUT TO NORFOLK SOUTHERN.
UM, THEN OBVIOUSLY INSURER AND I'VE ALREADY BEEN IN EMAIL CONTACT WITH THEIR LAND DEVELOPMENT DEPARTMENT.
YEAH, THERE'S ONLY ONE, I WAS JUST THINKING OF HOW MANY POTENTIAL SPEAKERS FOR I KNOW.
'CAUSE WE'RE UP TO NOT EVEN HAVING OUR NEXT WORK SESSION.
[01:50:01]
YEP.ONE THING I WILL SAY, IT DOES FEEL LIKE THESE THOUGH THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT DOESN'T SEEM LIKE THIS IN PARTICULAR REALLY DOESN'T SEEM TO IMPACT ANYONE THAT I CAN IMAGINE.
UNLESS THEY JUST, UNLESS PEOPLE JUST IN GENERAL DON'T WANT US TO, TO SELL TOWN LAND.
IS, YOU KNOW, IT MIGHT BE THAT THEORY TOO.
SO HEARING NO OBJECTION, WE WILL MAKE THAT AS A PUBLIC HEARING ON THE 26TH, WHICH MEANS NOW WE'RE UP TO SIX PUBLIC HEARINGS THAT NIGHT.
I CAN I RE CAN WE RESERVE THE RIGHT TO CHANGE SOMETHING? NO, I GUESS WE CAN.
I WAS GONNA SAY, CAN WE RESERVE THE RIGHT, LIKE IF WE GET THERE JANUARY 5TH AND YOU'RE LIKE, OKAY, WE HAVE LIKE FIVE MORE PUBLIC HEARINGS THAT WE'RE LIKE, WAIT, HOLD UP.
NO, NOT ONCE WE SEND THE LETTERS OUT.
I CAN'T IMAGINE THAT MUCH INTEREST.
NOT IN THE ONES WHERE, YEAH, I WOULD THINK THE FIVE ON JANUARY 5TH THOUGH IS THE CONCERN.
WELL WE'RE NOT GONNA ENTERTAIN ANY VACATIONS FOR A MONTH.
HOW ABOUT THAT? WE'LL JUST SAY THAT.
F SO, UM, THIS IS AN UNIMPROVED ALLEY BETWEEN WEST 13TH AND 14TH STREET.
HOLD ON, LET ME FIND MY MAP OF IT.
SO YEAH, UNLIKE THE OTHER TWO IN WHICH HAVE BEEN UTILIZED AND THERE'S UTILITIES, THIS IS, UH, A PORT A, YOU KNOW, HALF OF THE ALLEY IS IMPROVED AND IT'S UTILIZED TODAY.
UM, SO, YOU KNOW, STAFF REVIEWED THIS QUITE A BIT.
UM, WE FEEL LIKE THERE MAY BE ADDITIONAL COMMENTS.
UM, YOU KNOW, IT ABUTS, THIS ONE ACTUALLY ABUTS PRETTY ACTIVE COMMERCIAL SITES.
UH, ONE'S VACANT, ONE'S CURRENTLY IN CONSTRUCTION.
COULD YOU TELL ME WHAT THOSE COMMERCIAL SITES ARE? SO THE ONE IS AN ABANDONED SEVEN 11 AND THE OTHER IS THE, UM, FORMER BANK AT SHENANDOAH AND 14TH.
SO THIS RUNS, UH, NEXT TO A RESIDENTIAL PROPERTY MM-HMM
BUT AS YOU ARE, AND THEN IT CONNECTS TO AN ALLEY THAT RUNS BEHIND THE FORMER SEVEN 11 AND MELTING POT AND THEN G AND M AUTO.
AND SO, YOU KNOW, THE QUESTION IS, IS TO REALLY GET A BETTER UNDERSTANDING OF, UH, IF THIS WERE TO BE FULLY IMPROVED, PLANNING'S COMMENTS WERE TO PAVE THE ENTIRE ALLEY.
UM, AND IN SPEAKING WITH PUBLIC WORKS, HOW WOULD WE ADDRESS ITS INTERSECTION AT 14TH STREET? YOU KNOW, OR DO WE, WOULD WE MAKE IT A ONE WAY? SO I THINK THERE'S DEFINITELY SOME QUESTIONS THAT WE'RE GONNA BE REVIEWING FROM A STANDPOINT AS WE CONTINUE TO MOVE THIS FORWARD.
UM, BUT AGAIN, SINCE IT'S, AND WE ALSO DON'T REALLY KNOW WHAT'S GONNA BE GOING INTO THE COMMERCIAL SPACE THAT'S CURRENTLY UNDER RENOVATION OR THE, THE FORMER SEVEN 11.
SO DEPENDING ON THE TYPE OF TRAFFIC VOLUME THAT THOSE USES MAY CREATE, UM, THIS MAY ALLEVIATE SOME TRAFFIC ON 14TH AND SHENDO, THINGS LIKE THAT.
SO, YOU KNOW, THIS ONE UNLIKE THE OTHERS, IS SOMETHING THAT'S GONNA TAKE A PRETTY THOROUGH REVIEW FROM, FROM STAFF AS WE CONTINUE TO MOVE THIS FORWARD.
UM, AND OBVIOUSLY LOOKING FORWARD TO ANY PUBLIC COMMENTS AS THIS GOES OUT AS WELL TO SOME OF THOSE ADJOINING PROPERTIES.
YEAH, MY THOUGHT WAS ON THIS, 'CAUSE GIVEN THE AREA THAT IT'S IN AND, UH, YOU KNOW, THE SURROUNDING SURROUNDING BUSINESSES AND WHAT'S GOING ON THERE, MY QUESTION IS SHOULD WE, SHOULD WE TABLE THIS PERHAPS TILL WE GET SOME MORE INFORMATION, MAYBE SAVE IT FOR ANOTHER WORK SESSION OR LORI'S GOT QUESTIONS OR, UH, YEAH, I, YEAH, SO I'LL JUST, I'LL JUST LEAVE IT.
YEAH, I WAS JUST GONNA SAY, UM, UH, THIS ONE I FEEL LIKE I, FOR ME, I'D LIKE, I'M PROBABLY EVEN GONNA HAVE SOME MORE QUESTIONS.
I PROBABLY WANNA GO OUT THERE AND VISIT THAT SITE MM-HMM
UM, SO, AND, AND I, I BELIEVE WE'LL PROBABLY HAVE MORE PEOPLE COME AND TALK ABOUT THIS ONE.
SO I FEEL LIKE IF, IF COUNSEL'S OKAY WITH THIS, I'D RATHER, UM, AND WE CAN ADD THIS AGAIN TO THE JANUARY 5TH OR WE CAN, YOU KNOW, WE CAN ALWAYS ACTUALLY, WE COULD HAVE IT ON THE JANUARY 12TH WORK SESSION MAYBE, AND WE WOULDN'T BE, EVEN IF MOVING FORWARD, WE WOULDN'T HAVE THIS PUBLIC HEARING UNTIL FEBRUARY.
I WOULD SAY, EVEN IF, YOU KNOW, IS EVERYBODY OKAY WITH THAT? I JUST FEEL LIKE THIS ONE IS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT.
THE OTHERS WERE, THERE'S PLACES THAT NOBODY'S USING IT.
UM, I COULD BE WRONG, BUT I, I THINK THAT PROBABLY PEOPLE WAS, I BELIEVE
[01:55:01]
MR. PETTY SAID PEOPLE USED WEST 13TH STREET, THEY, THEY TURN OFF THAT ALLEY AND GO UP THERE TO GO IN BEHIND WHERE THE SEVEN 11 WAS.THE MOUNTAIN POD AND G AND M MOTORS, YOU KNOW, I THOUGHT IT WAS CLOSED.
CURRENTLY YOU CAN'T, YOU CAN'T DO, IT'S CURRENTLY BEING UTILIZED BY THE NEIGHBORING RESIDENCE IS ESSENTIALLY A DRIVEWAY AND THEN IT'S A GRASSY HILL.
SO WE WILL, AS PART OF OUR PREPARATION FOR THE SIX, WE CAN GET SOME YEAH.
WE WILL GET SOME PHOTOGRAPH, YOU CAN GO ON STREET VIEW, BUT WE'LL GO OUT, TAKE SOME PHOTOGRAPHS AND, AND DO A, AND PROVIDE YOU WITH SOME MORE INFORMATION IF YOU'D LIKE ON CURRENT CONDITIONS.
MAD A MAYOR, WHEN YOU ASK, I MEAN, WHEN YOU JUST SAID USED AS A DRIVEWAY, DID YOU JUST SAY THAT IT ON THE 13TH STREET SIDE HERE, IF YOU LOOK AT THAT DRIVEWAY OFF 13TH STREET, IT'S A GRASSY AREA.
YEAH, I KNOW I WHEN YOU'RE IN BEHIND THE MELTING POT UNDER, I UNDERSTAND WHERE IT IS AT THAT CURB YEAH.
WHAT I WAS SAYING, THAT'S THE ALLEY TO THE LEFT.
THE REASON WHY I WAS ASKING ABOUT BEING USED AS A DRIVEWAY, WE HAD THIS CONVER, YOU KNOW, WE HAD ANOTHER SITUATION WHERE RIGHT.
SOMEBODY WAS USING THE TOWN'S PROPERTY AS A DRIVEWAY.
AND YEAH, WHICH WE SHOULD HAVE NEVER DONE.
UM, WE FOUND OUT LATER THAT SHOULDN'T HAVE THAT.
THERE SHOULD HAVE NEVER BEEN A LEASE TO LEASE IT, IS WHAT I'M TRYING TO SAY.
UM, SO LIKE I SAID, I, I THINK THIS ONE WE WILL HAVE SOME MORE QUESTIONS WITH.
SO WE'LL JUST, AND, AND MR. PETTY, WE CAN TAKE A LOOK AT THIS LATER AS TO WHETHER OR NOT WE WANNA BRING IT BACK ON THE 12TH OF JANUARY OR IN FEBRUARY AND WE WILL NO MORE THAN COURT SESSION ON JANUARY 5TH.
MADAM MAYOR, IF I COULD, WELL LET'S WAIT.
COULD WE, COULD WE PUSH IT 90, LIKE 90 DAYS? AND I'M JUST SAYING THAT BECAUSE OF THE, THE DEVELOPMENT THAT IS GOING ON ON THE CORNER THERE, I FEEL LIKE THAT THERE'S NOT GONNA BE MUCH HAPPENING PROBABLY OVER THE HOLIDAYS AND THAT WE'LL HAVE A MUCH BETTER SENSE IN 90 DAYS OF WHAT IS ACTUALLY GONNA BE IN THAT BANK, FORMER BANK AND THAT, AND IT WILL ALSO, UM, GIVE THEIR STAFF TIME ENOUGH TO, YOU KNOW, TO SEE THE NEW TRAFFIC NEEDS OF THE AREA.
I DON'T HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT EXCEPT IS 90, IS THERE A RULE ABOUT VACATIONS, MR. SONIC, THAT WE HAVE TO ENTERTAIN 'EM IN A CERTAIN TIMEFRAME? TIMELINE HONOR, I'M LOOKING AT THAT RIGHT NOW.
I'VE SPOKEN INTO SOMEBODY LEASING THEM.
THEY'RE, THEY DON'T HAVE BUSINESSES LINED UP FOR THEM.
SO IT COULD BE TWO VAPE SHOPS, WHO KNOWS.
WE DON'T HAVE ANY APPLICATIONS.
THAT'S MY GOSH, BRENDAN KNOWS, BELIEVE THERE'S FOUR DIFFERENT RECORDS.
I THINK IT'S FOUR DATA CENTERS.
YEAH, I THINK THEY MADE THAT BACKGROUND.
I REALLY SHOULDN'T WATER COOLER ABOUT THAT BECAUSE SOMEBODY, IT'S FOR DATA CENTERS.
DON'T YOU JUST THIS WE WERE JOKING.
THIS IS OUR HOLIDAY KNOW FUN
SO LOOK AT THE CAMERA AND SAY, WE'LL, SO MR. SONIC, CAN WE WAIT A LITTLE BIT? SO I DON'T SEE ANYTHING SPECIFIC.
IN THE, IN THE STATE STATUTES, UM, IT DOES REQUIRE ACTION AT SOME POINT.
SO WHAT I LIKE TO DO IN THIS CASE IS SAY A REASONABLE TIME OKAY.
ACT ON IT WITHIN A REASONABLE TIME.
YOU HAVE FOUR DIFFERENT RECOMMENDATIONS FROM STAFF IN HERE AS WELL, SO, RIGHT.
IT'S A LOT MORE TO THINK ABOUT.
YEAH, I, I WAS, THAT'S, I FEEL LIKE THIS ONE'S NOT QUITE THE, I THINK WE'LL HAVE MORE SPEAKER.
UM, MR. PETTY, WELL, I'LL LET YOU KNOW FEBRUARY SESSION MEETING.
WELL, I, I, WE'LL, I'LL DETERMINE WHEN IT'S GONNA GO IN THE AGENDA WHEN, 'CAUSE I, I'LL SET THE AGENDA.
IT'S, IT'S NOT GONNA BE IN JANUARY.
I'LL KNOW THAT, THAT MUCH NEXT YEAR.
IT'LL BE 2026 SOONER RATHER THAN LATER.
WE WON'T SEE YOU GUYS NEXT YEAR.
UM, AND THAT'SS IT, THAT'S IT, RIGHT? YEP.
WELL, WE SQUEEZED IN A MEETING IN A WORK SESSION IN TWO HOURS.