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TOWN COUNCIL REGULAR WORK SESSION
[Town Council Work Session on July 14, 2025.]
FOR MONDAY, JULY 14TH TO ORDER.AND MS. PRESSLEY, IF WE CAN DO A ROLL CALL.
OUR VERY FIRST ITEM IS THE WATER SUPPLY PLAN, EXCESS VOLUME DETERMINATION.
AND WE HAVE A PRESENTATION AND FOR COUNSEL'S KNOWLEDGE, UM, THERE, UH, MS. PRESLEY SENT OUT A POWERPOINT PRESENTATION EARLIER TODAY AND SHE ALSO PUT IT IN BOX.
SO IF YOU ALL WANT TO PULL THAT UP TO FOLLOW ALONG OR IF YOU JUST WANNA WATCH UP HERE, WHICHEVER WORKS.
SO HOW ARE YOU, SIR? DOING WELL, THANK YOU FOR, UH, SWIMMING ON OVER TO US FOR THE NIGHT.
I DID, WE DID NOT HAVE THIS ISSUE LAST YEAR.
NO, WE'RE, WE'RE ACTUALLY ALL OKAY WITH IT BECAUSE NOBODY'S TALKING ABOUT A DROUGHT THIS YEAR, SO WE'RE LIKE, WE'LL TALK ABOUT THAT SOME TOO.
SO I, I KEPT THE SAME FORMAT THAT I DID LAST YEAR.
I DON'T KNOW HOW MANY COUNCILS FOLKS ARE NEW.
SO I WANTED TO KEEP IT IN THAT SAME FORMAT THAT APPEARED TO GIVE YOU THE ANSWERS THAT YOU WANTED ABOUT WHAT GENERAL POSITION YOU WERE IN WITH RELATION TO THE WATER AND SEWER AND WHAT DEVELOPMENT YOU CAN DO.
WE WENT A LITTLE STEP FURTHER AND TOOK SOME OF THE ONES THAT WE ARE CONSIDERED AGO.
GO AND INCLUDED THOSE IN AND TELL YOU WHAT'S LEFT AFTER THAT.
SO THAT WILL GIVE YOU A LITTLE BETTER PERSPECTIVE.
WE KNOW ALL THESE ARE PROBABLY GONNA HAPPEN IF THEY DO, WHAT DO WE HAVE LEFT, IF ANYTHING, FOR SOMETHING THAT'S NOT EVEN ON THE HORIZON YET.
SO I DO, I UNDERSTAND YOU TO SAY THAT EVERYTHING THAT'S BEEN APPROVED IN THE LAST, UM, SINCE YOU'VE BEEN HERE LAST, YOU'VE INCLUDED IN THESE CORRECT STATS.
SO A LITTLE BIT OF CONTEXT, THE, I GUESS WHAT BROUGHT THIS ABOUT WAS THE TOWN MUNICIPAL CODE SECTION 1 34 0.1 POINT C SAYS THAT THE TOWN WILL, ANNUALLY, ANNUALLY DETERMINE THE ANTICIPATED EXCESS VOLUME OF WATER AND SEWER IS AVAILABLE FOR RESIDENTIAL, COMMERCIAL, OR INDUSTRIAL USE.
I'M NOT GONNA READ THAT WHOLE CODE, BUT THAT WAS THE, WHAT BROUGHT THIS ABOUT.
AND THEN I THINK WHAT WE DID WAS CAPITALIZE ON THAT.
IF WE WERE ALREADY GONNA HAVE TO DO SOMETHING TO BE CODE, WHAT CAN WE DO THAT WILL ACTUALLY BENEFIT THE PLANNING PURPOSES AND THE VISIONING THAT YOU'RE RESPONSIBLE FOR BASED ON YOUR CONSTITUENTS DESIRES AND IN THE BEST INTEREST OF THE TOWN? SO WE MEET TWO, TWO THINGS.
BY DOING THIS, WE MEET THE CODE AND WE ALSO GIVE YOU A PRETTY GOOD IDEA OF, OF HOW YOU'RE PERFORMING IN BOTH WATER AND SEWER SYSTEM.
SO THESE ARE THE DEVELOPMENTS THAT WE WERE GIVEN, THAT WE HAVE INCLUDED IN AS EITHER APPROVED OR DEFINITELY COMING.
SO WHEN YOU SEE THE BOLD NUMBER AT THE BOTTOM OF EACH SERVICE AREA, WHETHER THAT BE WATER OR SEWER, THAT BOLD NUMBER ASSUMES THAT THESE HAVE ALREADY BEEN ACCOUNTED FOR.
SO IF YOU TAKE THESE OUT IN THAT BOLD NUMBER, YOU SEE WHEREVER THEY ARE PLANNED TO BE BUILT IS GONNA BE HIGHER.
SO IF, IF, IF COUNSEL DESIRES ME TO LEAVE IT LIKE THIS AND ALSO TAKE THESE OUT TO SHOW WHAT YOU HAVE BEFORE ANY OF THESE EVEN HAPPEN, IT'S VERY EASY FOR ME TO EBB AND FLOW WITH THAT BASED ON YOUR REQUESTS.
I CAN TAKE SOME OF 'EM OUT, ONE OF 'EM OUT, LEAVE 'EM ALL IN.
IF THAT'S ALREADY BEEN PROMISED, THEN I NEED AS YOUR ENGINEER TO TELL YOU WHETHER YOU'RE IN TROUBLE OR NOT.
IF, IF ONE OF THESE CAN'T HAPPEN.
AND WHAT INFRASTRUCTURE WOULD NEED TO HAPPEN FOR THAT TO OCCUR? YOU ASK THE QUESTION, CAN YOU ADD THEM? YES, YOUR HONOR.
WE DON'T HAVE A HANOCK LLC UP THERE, WHICH IS NINE FOUR RESIDENCE AS WELL.
IS THAT THE APARTMENTS BEHIND ROYAL KING AND THAT'S OFF THE HEAVY CREEK ROAD.
UM, AND THAT WAS, THAT WAS ACTUALLY A PRETTY BLAST.
UM, WAS IT BEFORE AUGUST? YOU MIGHT, THEY MIGHT ALREADY BE PART OF YOUR, MAYBE.
SO THERE'S A MAP SHOWING WHERE EACH ONE OF THOSE DEVELOPMENTS IS PLANNED.
AND THAT'S IMPORTANT BECAUSE FOR ME TO TAKE OR ADD IN ANY OF THESE AREAS THAT WILL IMPACT DIFFERENT ASSETS WITHIN YOUR SYSTEM.
SO EACH PUMP STATION, ONE PUMP STATION MAY HANDLE THREE OR MORE OF THESE.
ONE PUMP STATION MAY ONLY HANDLE ONE.
AND SO THAT'S, THAT GETS A LITTLE MORE COMPLICATED.
BUT I CAN TAKE OUT OR ADD, AND WE DO THAT ALL THE TIME.
IF SOMEBODY COMES, IF, IF ROBBIE OR BJ OR JOE CALL AND SAY, WE'RE NOT THAT FAR INTO
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THE NEGOTIATION YET, BUT WE'VE, WE'VE GOT, UH, SOMEBODY THAT'S INTERESTED AND THIS IS THE AMOUNT OF WATER AND SEWER AND THIS IS WHERE THEY THINK THEY'RE GONNA GO, I CAN QUICKLY GO INTO THOSE WATER AND SEWER MODELS AND SAY, YOU'RE FINE.OR IN YOUR NEGOTIATION, YOU NEED TO KNOW THAT YOU'RE PROBABLY GONNA HAVE TO INVEST THIS MUCH TO GET THEM HERE AND DO THAT, SHARE IN THAT ASSET CONSTRUCTION.
AND THEN THE TOWN TAKES US OVER.
YOU NEED ALL THOSE TOOLS TO KNOW WHAT NEGOTIATION YOU NEED TO, TO, TO ENTER INTO.
IF YOU'VE GOT AN OPPORTUNITY, IT JUST COMES OUT OF, OUT OUTTA THE THIN AIR.
WELL THEN THE HA THE ONE THAT COUNCIL MEMBER WAS JUST TALKING ABOUT, UM, WOULD BE IN, UM, IT'S REALLY CLOSE TO WHERE HAPPY RIDGE DRIVE PRDI DON'T KNOW IF YOU CAN SEE IT'S NEAR THE TWO.
ISN'T THAT WHERE YOU WOULD ESTIMATE THAT IT WOULD BE? YEAH, IT'S RIGHT IN THERE.
BUT WE'RE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT IF YOU COULD APPLY.
I DON'T, IT MAY BE YOU'VE ALREADY COUNTED FOR THAT.
WHEN DID YOU COME MARCH OF LAST YEAR I THINK BEEN, NO, 'CAUSE THAT WAS THE END OF THE SUMMER TO SWAN STATES.
BUT I WAS JUST SAYING IT'S, I CAN CHECK AND SEE IF IT'S IN THE EXISTING OR IF WE NEED TO ADD IT TO THIS LIST.
I, ONE OTHER QUESTION, I, I LOOKED THROUGH THIS ALREADY, BUT I'M GONNA ASK YOU THE QUESTION.
I DON'T SEE ANYTHING ON THE CORRIDOR THAT WE KNOW IS COMING.
WE HAVE, I'M TOLD IN A PLANNING MEETING, A SHEATH, CHICK-FIL-A, WE DO HAVE TO SERVE ALL COMMERCIAL, BUT WE HAVE THE RIGHT TO REFUSE ON INDUSTRIAL.
AND I'M JUST, UH, I I'M A LITTLE CONCERNED THAT WE DON'T HAVE ANYTHING IN THE COURT FIGURED INTO THIS PLAN THAT WE KNOW THAT IT'S COMING.
SO AT THE TOWN COUNCIL'S PLEASURE, ANYTHING THAT COMES OUT OF THE WORK SESSION TODAY, I CAN REVISE THIS TO INCLUDE AS MUCH AS YOU WANT AND THEN RECAST THE NUMBERS.
SO, BECAUSE SOME OF THESE ON HERE, LIKE THEY HAVEN'T EVEN, LIKE NUMBER SEVEN THAT HASN'T EVEN, THAT HASN'T EVEN COME BEFORE COUNCIL YET OR ANYTHING.
I MEAN I I BUT I KNOW I RECOGNIZE THESE WERE IN, THAT'S ALREADY APPROVED.
THAT WAS FREE ZONE BACK IN 2008.
SO WE WORKED, WE TALKED WITH PLANNING, UM, AND KIND OF WENT THROUGH EVERYTHING IN TOWN.
'CAUSE OBVIOUSLY IN TOWN BEING PRIORITY OF WHAT HAS BEEN APPROVED FROM THIS STANDPOINT.
UM, BUT WE CAN OBVIOUSLY REACH OUT TO THE COUNTY AS WELL AND LOOK AT KIND OF WHAT'S IN PLAN AND GET WITH ROBBIE IN PUBLIC WORKS ABOUT ANY SITE PLAN, UH, APPLICATIONS THAT HAVE BEEN PUT FORTH THAT PUT THOSE NUMBERS IN THERE.
BUT WHEN TALKING WITH PLANNING, WE LOOKED THROUGH AND UM, LOOKED AT ALL THE DEVELOPMENT THAT WAS OCCURRING OR PLANS THAT THEY'VE BEEN REVIEWING TO MAKE SURE WE'RE ACCOMMODATED FOR ALL OF THAT BOTH BY RIGHT.
LIKE THAT HAD BEEN PROFFERED OUT YEARS AGO, LIKE THE ANNEXATION AREA, JUST TO MAKE SURE WE'RE ACCOUNTING FOR, LIKE I SAID, EVERYTHING IN TOWN THAT WE KNOW.
SO AT THE END OF THE DAY, I'LL TAKE DIRECTION FROM, FROM JOE ROBBIE AND BJ ON, ON HOW YOU WON'T BE TO PROVIDE THIS, IF AT ALL, ONCE I GET THROUGH THE PRESENTATION.
SO STRAIGHT TO THE WATER SYSTEM, EXCESS VOLUME.
AND I USE THAT WORDING BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT'S IN THE CODE.
I, IT'S ACTUALLY BETTER FOR ME TO SAY AVAILABLE CAPACITY, BUT THAT'S WHY I USE THAT WORDING.
SO I'VE GOT A LOT OF STUFF ON THIS SLIDE, BUT I WANT IT TO BE A KIND OF ONE, ONE STOP SHOP FOR HOW YOUR WATER SYSTEM IS HANDLING THE CAPACITY THAT YOU HAVE.
SO THE FIRST LINE IS THE ZONE THAT IT SERVES AND YOU CAN REFER BACK ALL THOSE SHADED AREAS OF THE DIFFERENT ZONES.
AND SO THAT'S, THAT'S WHY THAT'S THERE.
SO FOR INSTANCE, IF YOU WANTED TO KNOW WHAT A PARTICULAR DEVELOPMENT IMPACT IS ON THE WATER AND SEWER INFRASTRUCTURE, EACH OF THESE DIFFERENT ASSETS WOULD HANDLE A DIFFERENT GEOGRAPHIC LOCATION WITHIN THE TOWN.
SO YOU WOULD HAVE TO KNOW WHERE THAT DEVELOPMENT'S GONNA OCCUR.
AND THEN I WOULD DROP IT INTO EITHER THE GUARD HILL ZONE, THE GUARD HILL PUMP STATION, FUTURE MANASAS AVENUE, JAMESTOWN, ET CETERA.
SO WHEREVER THAT DEVELOPMENT HAPPENS, IT'S GOING TO IMPACT ONE OR MORE OF THOSE ASSETS DIFFERENTLY.
SO THAT'S WHY I HAVE ALL OF THEM BROKEN OUT.
AND SO WITH EACH OF THESE, THE BOTTOM LINE OF
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WHAT YOU NEED TO KNOW IS THE AVAILABLE DAILY EXCESS CAPACITY AFTER DEVELOPMENT, WHICH INCLUDES ALL OF THOSE AREAS THAT WE TALKED ABOUT EARLIER.AND SO THESE NUMBERS WOULD CHANGE IF YOU WANTED ME TO ADD SOMETHING ON THE 5 22 CORRIDOR, IT WOULD, IT WOULD CHANGE ONE OF THESE NUMBERS ACCORDINGLY.
IT NEEDS TO BE, THIS WAS ALWAYS INTENDED TO BE A PLANNING TOOL.
THE LAST TIME I PRESENTED COUNSEL WAS VERY PERCEPTIVE TO THE FACT THAT IF THEY NEEDED A QUICK ANSWER ON WHAT A POTENTIAL DEVELOPMENT WOULD HAVE IMPACT-WISE, THAT THIS TOOL IS SOMETHING YOU'VE ALREADY PAID FOR.
AND I JUST, I DROP THAT NUMBER IN AND IT TELLS ME WHETHER WE'RE IN TROUBLE OR NOT.
SO THE RAW WATER INTAKE, OBVIOUSLY THAT'S IMPORTANT TO EVERYTHING.
THAT'S WHERE ALL THE WATER COMES THAT GETS TREATED BY THE WATER TREATMENT PLANT.
SO ANY DEVELOPMENT THAT HAPPENS IS GONNA IMPACT THAT, BE IMPACTED BY THAT.
SO THERE'S 209,000 GALLONS A DAY OF EXCESS CAPACITY AFTER ALL OF THOSE ALREADY APPROVED ITEMS ARE ACCOUNTED FOR.
SAY THAT NUMBER AGAIN, 290,000 GALLONS A DAY EXCESS, RIGHT? YES.
SO WHEN YOU'RE THINKING ABOUT THAT AS A PLANNER, EACH DIFFERENT TYPE OF DEVELOPMENT IS GOING TO REQUIRE A DIFFERENT LEVEL OF GALLONS PER DAY.
AND SO A COMMERCIAL BUSINESS THAT ONLY HAS A COUPLE OF RESTROOMS, YOU CAN HAVE A WHOLE LOT OF THOSE AND STILL NOT CHEW UP THAT 290,000 GALLONS A DAY.
YOU HAVE SUPER DENSE HOUSING, THAT'S WHEN IT STARTS WORKING.
OR YOU'VE GOT A BUSINESS THAT'S SUPER WATER DEPENDENT.
SO IT REALLY DEPENDS ON HOW MUCH THAT'S, THAT'S THE FIRST QUESTION THAT I'M GONNA ASK.
HOW MUCH WATER ARE THEY GONNA USE? AND THEN THAT ALREADY TELLS ME HOW MUCH SEWER CAPACITY THEY'RE GONNA NEED.
'CAUSE IT'S, IT'S GOTTA GO INTO THE PIPE RIGHT BESIDE IT.
SO THINK ABOUT IT IN THAT REALM, WHEN I TELL YOU THESE NUMBERS, YOU'RE GONNA SAY, WELL HOW MUCH DEVELOPMENT CAN WE, CAN WE HANDLE WITH THAT NUMBER? IT REALLY DEPENDS ON WHAT KIND OF DEVELOPMENT THAT IS.
THAT'S THE SAME QUESTION WE ASK TOO.
WE GENERALLY ASK LIKE THAT'S ALL WE GENERALLY ASK THAT TOO.
SO THE WATER TREATMENT PLANT IN A LITTLE BETTER SHAPE, 900,000 GALLONS A DAY OF AVAILABLE CAPACITY.
THE GUARD HILL AND MANASAS PUMP STATIONS RIGHT AT 300,000 GALLONS A DAY.
AND SO THESE ARE THE TWO THAT ARE GONNA START MAKING YOU A LITTLE NERVOUS.
SO JAMESTOWN PUMP STATION AND FOUR H PUMP STATION ARE CLEARLY, WELL JAMESTOWN IS ALREADY NOT MEETING WITH ALL THE STUFF THAT'S, THAT'S GONNA COME DOWN THE PIPE.
UH, IS CARD HILL THE SAME AS RIVERTON? 'CAUSE I WAS THINKING, I MEAN I THOUGHT THERE WAS A RIVERTON PUMP STATE.
WHERE WHERE IS THAT? IT'S IT'S SEWER.
THAT THAT'LL BE THE NEXT SLIDE.
SO THE GOOD NEWS, THESE ARE ALREADY UNDER WORKS AND BEING DESIGNED RIGHT NOW.
YOU UPGRADE TO THOSE TWO PUMP STATIONS.
WE PUT IN A-V-D-H-S-R-F FUNDING APPLICATION TO GET FUNDING FOR THE CONSTRUCTION OF THOSE.
AND STAFF HAS DIRECTED US FULL STEAM AHEAD TO GET THOSE READY TO, TO GO OUT TO BED ASAP FOR THIS VERY REASON.
SO OF ALL THE ASSETS IN THE WATER SIDE, THE ONLY ONES THAT I THINK WE NEED TO BE ADDRESSING ARE THE TWO THAT ARE ALREADY PLANNED FOR UP UPGRADE.
WHICH YOU SAID THESE NUMBERS ARE TAKING INTO CONSIDERATION THE DEVELOPMENT THAT YOU SHOWED US ON THE PREVIOUS SLIDE, CORRECT? YES.
WHICH I BELIEVE SEVERAL OF THOSE LARGE ONES WOULD BE JAMESTOWN.
ROBBIE, LIKE THE LEACH RUN, SWAN RABBIT, HANOCK, THAT WOULD ALL BE JAMESTOWN 55 AND GRAVITY FEEDBACK SOME OF THAT.
SO, SO THAT NUMBER COULD BE A LOT LESS BECAUSE OF HOUSES WE THINK, YOU KNOW, THAT ARE, THEY'RE, THAT COULD BE BUILT TOMORROW.
BUT WE ALL RECOGNIZE THE MIGHT BE BUILT TOMORROW BUT 'CAUSE IT'S ALMOST LIKE 1300 IF YOU ADD IT'S 15.
IS IT 15 BETWEEN THOSE 8 18, 4 15, 3 20.
SO IF YOU WANNA KNOW WHAT HAPPENS IF WE TAKE THOSE OUT THIS ROW IS THE NUMBER THAT WE ARE USING FOR WHAT THAT DEVELOPMENT'S GONNA REQUIRE.
SO FOR FUTURE PROJECTED DEVELOPMENT FOR THE JAMESTOWN PUMP STATION, 230,000 GALLONS OF THOSE THAT WE'VE ALREADY ACCOUNTED FOR, WHICH DROPS THAT TO A NEGATIVE NUMBER.
IF THAT GOES AWAY, THEN JAMESTOWN IS FINE.
I MEAN, YEAH, I'LL TAKE THAT BACK.
JAMESTOWN AND FOUR H ARE NOT FINE.
THEY'RE OLD ENOUGH THAT THEY NEED TO BE, THEY NEED TO BE UPGRADED ANYWAY.
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AND SO IF WE'RE IN THERE DOING THE WORK, WHY NOT PLAN FOR THE FUTURE AND MAKE SURE THAT YOU HAVE THE CAPACITY YOU NEED MOVING FORWARD.SO THAT'S PART OF WHAT BROUGHT THIS ABOUT AS WELL.
AND OUR URBAN DEVELOPMENT AREA IS ALL GONNA BE JAMESTOWN, RIGHT? WHICH IS WHERE THE BULK OF OUR GROVER IS GONNA BE IN TOWN.
SO WHEN WE GET IN THE, IN THE, THE WEEDS WITH THAT, WE BE SPENDING A LOT OF TIME WITH THE PLANNING FOLKS TO MAKE SURE THAT WE SIZE THESE PUMP STATIONS TO BE AS FAR OUT IN THE FORESEEABLE FUTURE AS WE CAN.
THAT IS REASONABLE TO MAINTAIN AN OPERATE.
WE OBVIOUSLY DON'T WANNA PLAN FOR 50 YEARS OUT BECAUSE THE PUMP STILL BURN OUT BEFORE THEN.
BUT WE ALSO DON'T WANT TO HAVE TO TOUCH 'EM AGAIN BEFORE THEY'VE LIVED THEIR FULL LIFE.
AND THE TOWN AND THE RATE REPAIRS GET THE FULL VALUE OUT OF THAT ASSET.
SO YOU GOTTA FIND A BALANCE TO MAKE SURE IT'S, IT, IT DOESN'T RUN FOR TWO SECONDS AND THEN STOP BECAUSE IT'S SIZED FOR 30 YEARS FROM NOW.
SO THAT, THAT'S SOMETHING WE'LL SPEND A LOT OF TIME WITH THE PLANNING FOLKS TO MAKE SURE THAT ALL OF THE, AND WE BASE THAT ON LAND USE TOO.
SOMETIMES YOU DON'T HAVE ANY IDEA OF WHAT MAY COME, BUT DEPENDING ON WHAT THE LAND USE AND UH, THE OTHER THINGS, THE ZONING WE CAN, WE CAN KNOW WHAT TYPE OF DEVELOPMENT MAY COME.
AND SO FOR INSTANCE, IF IT'S A HOUSING AREA, WE WOULD GO WHERE WE FOUND THE MOST DENSELY POPULATED HOUSING AREA IN THE TOWN AND GET ACTUAL METER RECORDS FROM THAT.
AND THEN PER ACRE WE KNOW WHAT THE MOST DENSE HOUSING DEVELOPMENT WOULD NEED FROM A WATER STANDPOINT.
AND THEN WE TAKE THAT AND WE SWELL IT INTO THAT ENTIRE ACREAGE.
AND THEN WE KNOW WORST CASE IF YOU BUILT THAT ACREAGE OUT FULL, THIS IS HOW MUCH WATER YOU MAY NEED.
AND WE WOULD WORK THROUGH THAT WITH, WITH THE PLANNING AND ZONING FOLKS.
THE FOUR H PUMP STATION IS THE FUTURE PRODUCTION IS ZERO.
'CAUSE PROBABLY THERE'S NOT A LOT OF THAT.
WE THERE'S NOTHING COMING THERE.
IS THAT THE IDEA? YEAH, NO, IT'S UH, MAYBE LIKE FOUR H AND I'M LOOKING BACK AT HIS MAP 'CAUSE ROBBIE MIGHT BE ABLE TO HELP.
'CAUSE I KNOW SOME OF IT BY LOOKING AT THE MAPS.
BUT MOST OF THAT IS ALREADY DEVELOPED OUT.
THE LIBRARY, THE ONE BY THE LIBRARY SHOULD BE AT FOUR H SHOULDN'T THE BIG THING FOUR H ARE LIKE 1982 VOLTS.
OH, I'M NOT SAYING WE DON'T NEED REPLACING.
I WAS LOOKING AT THAT FUTURE PROJECTED AND THAT'S WHAT I WAS THINKING IS WE GOT 92 APARTMENT AND THOSE ARE ACTUALLY BEHIND THE APARTMENT KING AND STUFF.
IS THE WATER TREATMENT PRESSURE ZONE? IT'S NOT FOUR H.
SO FOUR H BEING UPGRADED BECAUSE IT'S, IT'S WORN OUT.
BUT WE WILL CERTAINLY LOOK TO SEE IF THERE IS ANY AVAILABLE DEVELOPABLE PROPERTY THERE THAT WE WOULD NEED TO, TO UPGRADE THAT TO DO MORE THAN HANDLING WHAT IT'S HANDLING RIGHT NOW.
IF NOT, THEN WE'LL WE'LL STILL GIVE A LITTLE BIT OF A BUFFER.
BUT WE'RE NOT SHOWING ANYTHING SIGNIFICANT IN THAT PARTICULAR AREA AS OF NOW.
IF YOU REMEMBER HE, THEY TOLD US THAT THE LAST TIME THAT THE RIVERTON, THAT BASICALLY EVERYTHING LIKE ON THAT END OF TOWN, LIKE WHAT I WOULD CALL RURAL VILLAGE AND BISCO CITY, BICO CITY, ALL OF THAT WAS PART OF RIVERTON.
MM-HMM
YEAH IT, WE WERE LIKE, THAT'S ACTUALLY RIVERTON.
UM, OR LISA, I REMEMBER THAT WAS PART OF THE CONVERSATION CROSSES THE RIVER AT LOURAY BOW LANDING.
IT GOES TO COUNCIL CATLAN NOW.
BUT Y'ALL VISCO Y'ALL, THAT'S RIVERSIDE, THAT'S IN THE RIVER BOAT.
AND CROOKED RUN FALLS TO RIVERTON 5 22 ALSO GOES, I'M NOT SAYING THAT BEFORE THAT THAT DIDN'T, THAT WAS AN ODD THINKING ABOUT IT.
BY THE WAY, THE CROW CLOUD, AS YOU COULD SEE ALL VISCO CITY BEING WAY COUNTY, IT'S KIND OF, YEAH.
SO ANY QUESTIONS ABOUT THIS SLIDE? WHEN YOU TALK ABOUT THE WITHDRAWAL AND CAPACITY WITHDRAWAL, IS THAT JUST OUT OF THE SOUTH WATER? YES.
AND I DON'T WANNA MUDDY THE WATER TOO MUCH, BUT THE, THE RAW WATER INTAKE, THE PUMPS ARE ALREADY DESIGNED TO WITHDRAW 8 MILLION GALLONS A DAY.
SO WITH PERMITTING AND WHATEVER OTHER PAPER EFFORT WE WOULD NEED TO UNDERTAKE, YOU
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WOULD NOT HAVE TO DO ANY CONSTRUCTION TO PULL MORE OUT OF THE RIVER WITH THE PUMPS YOU HAVE RIGHT NOW.SO JUST FOOD FOR THOUGHT THAT IS A PAPER EXERCISE TO EXPAND WHAT YOU CAN PULL OUT OF THE RIVER, WHICH IS RAW WATER.
DOESN'T MEAN WE CAN TREAT IT ALL.
BUT THAT ASSET IS GOING TO LAST YOU FOR A VERY LONG TIME AS FAR AS WHAT THE CAPACITY IS OF THE PUMPS.
AND CLEARLY THIS IS GONNA BE A, A PLANNING TOOL FOR A LONG TIME.
SO THIS IS NOT THE ONLY CHANCE YOU GET TO ASK QUESTIONS, SEND STUFF THROUGH, UH, PROPER CHANNELS.
AND AS YOU DIGEST ALL THIS INFORMATION, IF SOMETHING LOOKS CONFUSING, JUST LET ME KNOW AND I HOPE TO GET IT A LITTLE MORE USABLE EACH EACH YEAR THAT WE, WE DO THIS WORK.
SO SOMETHING THAT I WANT TO HIGHLIGHT.
SO THESE ARE THE FLOWS THAT ARE RECEIVED AT THE PLANT AND THESE ARE PEAK.
AND I WANNA MAKE SURE EVERYBODY UNDERSTANDS WHY WE USE PEAK.
SO IF I ONLY USE THE PEAK FLOW AND I TELL YOU WHAT CAPACITY YOU HAVE DURING AVERAGE FLOW, I'M DOING YOU A HUGE DISSERVICE.
WE CANNOT DESIGN OR PLAN BASED ON AVERAGE FLOW.
'CAUSE WE GET A HEAVY WEATHER SEASON AND WE DESIGN A SYSTEM ON AVERAGE FLOWS.
WE'RE GONNA HAVE OVERFLOWS AND BYPASSES AND YOU'RE GONNA ASK ME WHY.
AND I'M GONNA SAY, I TRIED TO TELL YOU WHAT YOU WANTED TO HEAR AND NOT WHAT THE ENGINEERS WANTS TO TELL YOU.
SOMETHING THAT I WANNA BRING ATTENTION TO.
SO THIS NUMBER WAS, IN MY OPINION, IN OUR ENGINEER'S OPINION THAT LOOKS LIKE IT, IT'S JUST AN OUTLIER.
'CAUSE YOU HAD 11.6 AND YOU DROPPED TO 9.74 BACK UP TO 10.8.
WHAT HAPPENED? CLEAN HAPPENED.
SO I MEAN WHATEVER MASSIVE STORMS CAME THROUGH HERE MADE THAT NUMBER AN UNUSUAL NUMBER FOR THAT YEAR.
SO WHAT, WHAT SHOULD, WHAT THAT NUMBER WOULD'VE BEEN WITHOUT THAT HUGE STORM OUTLIER WOULD YOU'D SEE A SLOW PROGRESSION 11 TO NINE TO EIGHT THEN TO SIX.
SO THAT'S WHY THAT TOOK, THAT DOESN'T MAKE SENSE IF YOU THINK ABOUT IT.
WELL WHY, WHY DIDN'T WE KEEP GETTING BETTER? BECAUSE YOU HAD AN OUTLIER YEAR WHERE YOU HAD A MASSIVE AMOUNT OF RAIN THAT ELEVATED THAT NUMBER.
ALL THAT TO SAY YOU HAVE SPENT AN ENORMOUS AMOUNT OF MONEY ON SSES, SANITARY SEWER ABATEMENT IN YOUR PIPES, IN YOUR MANHOLES.
AND WE HAVE TO EXPLAIN THAT THE NUMBERS ARE SAYING THAT THAT'S ACTUALLY RESULTING IN A BENEFIT.
SO WHAT, WHAT THIS SHOWS IS IT HAS, SO THAT NUMBER IS DOWN TO 6 MILLION GALLONS A DAY AT PEAK.
AND THAT'S LIKE DURING YOUR WORST STORM EVENT.
SO YOU'RE AT, YOU'RE COMING DOWN THAT PEAK NUMBER SHOULD KEEP COMING DOWN AS YOU KEEP FIXING YOUR SEWER.
NOW WE JUST FINISHED WHAT I'M GONNA CALL POST CONSTRUCTION FLOW MONITORING AND THE ENTIRE SEWER SYSTEM TO PROVE THAT THE MONEY INVESTED IN REPAIRING THE SEWER PIPES IS ACTUALLY MAKING A DIFFERENCE.
SO WE, WE, WE DID FLOW MONITORING FROM JANUARY THROUGH MARCH BEFORE WE DID ALL THE CONSTRUCTION AND FIGURED OUT WHAT AMOUNT OF WATER WAS COMING INTO THOSE PIPES DURING A TWO YEAR RAIN EVENT.
WE JUST FINISHED DOING THAT AGAIN AFTER YOU INVESTED MONEY.
AND THOSE FLOWS SHOULD BE REDUCED 'CAUSE YOU HAVE PLUG HOLES AND PIPES AND MAS.
AND SO THAT REPORT'S FORTHCOMING AND THAT'S GONNA TELL YOU, WE DO THIS ALL THE TIME.
AND I TELL EVERYBODY, IF YOU DON'T USE CHA THAT'S FINE, BUT YOU NEED TO DO POST FLOW MONITORING.
'CAUSE THAT IS THE ONLY WAY TO PROVE TO RATE PAYERS AND PEOPLE IN THE COMMUNITY THAT YOU'RE MAKING UP GROUND.
BECAUSE THE NUMBERS ARE THE NUMBERS.
AND SO THAT REPORTS COMING OUT.
BUT THIS ALREADY TELLS ME THAT YOU'RE, YOU'RE MAKING, YOU'RE MAKING UP GROUND.
SO IS THAT LIKE 2025 IS THIS YEAR, RIGHT? SO AS OF NOW OR WAS THAT LIKE OUR FISCAL YEAR? 24 TO 25? WE, I THINK IT'S, IT'S THE, FROM JANUARY TO NOW TO NOW IT WAS TYPICALLY THE HEAVY RAIN EVENTS OR NOT.
I MEAN WE'RE IN THE, SHOULD BE IN THE DRIEST PART OF THE YEAR.
BUT YOU GUYS ARE VERY HAPPY TO TO NOT HAVING THAT BE THE CASE
THAT'S WHAT'S KIND OF THROWING ME UP.
'CAUSE THOSE A DROUGHT HERE, RIGHT? MM-HMM
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BUT HE WAS TALKING ABOUT HE SAID IT RIGHT.HE SAID IT WAS THE BUT IT IS THE, IT, IT'S NOT THE AVERAGE OF ALL THE DAYS IN THE YEAR.
IT'S, IT'S, IT'S ONE EVENT IN TIME WHEN IT WAS THE WORST.
IT COULD BE ON THE SEWER SYSTEM.
SO YOU COULD HAVE 300 AND 349 DAYS OF NO RAIN AT ALL AND HAVE ONE DAY WHERE YOU GET FOUR INCHES PER HOUR FOR A SOLID FOUR HOURS.
AND THAT'S THE NUMBER THAT I WOULD HAVE ON THAT SCREEN.
THE PEAK WORST FLOW CONDITION YOU HAD.
SO JUST ONE INCIDENT, NOT THE RIGHT, I THINK OF THE AVERAGE OF THE WORST.
SO THAT'S WHAT I, SO, AND I THINK I CONFUSED COUNSEL SOME LAST TIME BECAUSE I THINK I HAD AVERAGE AND PEAK UP THERE AND THAT WAS CONFUSING BECAUSE AVERAGE DOES LOOK BETTER.
BUT IF YOU DON'T TAKE INTO ACCOUNT THAT ONE MAIN EVENT, THAT'S WHAT YOUR SYSTEM HAS TO BE ABLE TO HANDLE.
AND WE DON'T USE HURRICANE LEVEL EVENTS BECAUSE DEQ ONLY TAKES MEASURE OF WHAT YOUR SYSTEM CAN CONVEY AT A TWO YEAR EVENT.
ANYTHING PAST THAT IS CONSIDERED AN ACT OF GOD.
SO IF YOU HAVE SOMETHING LIKE A DE RATIO THAT COMES THROUGH, ALL THE PLANTS IN THE NANDO VALLEY ARE GONNA OVERFLOW THE SEWER GONNA COME OUT OF THEIR MANHOLES.
'CAUSE WE, WE DESIGNED FOR TWO YEAR EVENTS.
WE CAN DESIGN FOR A 10 YEAR EVENT, BUT YOU WOULD ONLY USE THAT SEWER SYSTEM ONCE EVERY 10 YEARS.
THAT IS NOT A A, A REASONABLE ASK OF YOUR RATE PAYERS TO DESIGN SOMETHING AND D EQ IS ON BOARD WITH THAT.
SO WE BUILD SYSTEMS THAT CAN CONVEY A TWO YEAR EVENT.
ANYTHING BEYOND THAT, THE SYSTEM'S NOT GONNA BE ABLE TO HANDLE IT.
BUT DEQ ALSO DOESN'T SEND YOU FINES AND WARNINGS.
EVERYBODY'S JUST HANGING ON FOR DEAR LIFETIME TO GET THROUGH BEST IT CAN.
BUT IF A TWO YEAR OR LESS CAN'T CONVEY, THEN THEY'RE, THEY'RE GONNA SITE.
SO GETTING INTO THE, THE DIFFERENT AREAS, 950,000 GALLONS A DAY AT THE WASTEWATER TREATMENT PLANT, 1.9 MILLION AT THE RIVER RIVERTON PUMP STATION AND WE CAN GO ALL THE WAY ACROSS CROOK AND RO 1.4, KELLY INDUSTRIAL PARK, 280,000 STEVENS PUMP STATION 1.4 ABBEY CREEK 200,000 AFTER CREEK TWO 320,000 AND FEDERAL IT PUMP STATION 200,000.
AND THIS, THIS GIVES YOU A LITTLE IDEA OF WHY THAT, SO THERE'S TOTAL RAINFALL IN THE YEAR.
YOU CAN SEE HOW MUCH HIGHER IT WAS IN 24 THAN IN, IN 25.
ANY SPECIFIC QUESTIONS ABOUT, SO WHAT DOES THAT TELL YOU? WHAT'S YOUR, WHAT'S YOUR ANALYSIS OF, OF THIS, THESE NUMBERS? HAPPY CREEK IS HAPPY CREEK PUMP STATION IS BECAUSE I SEE PEAK DAY EXCESS CAPACITY IS THE ONE THAT I'M NOT SURE.
UM, IS THAT, IS THAT ONE THAT WE SHOULD BE THE MOST CONCERNED ABOUT? I MEAN I CAN SEE WHY IT FEDERAL DOESN'T HAVE ANYTHING CHANGING FROM THERE TO THERE.
'CAUSE THERE'S NOTHING BEING DEVELOPED OUT THERE ANYWAYS AT, AT THE CURRENT DATE THAT IT'S IN.
UM, BUT I JUST WAS CURIOUS IF, AND I THINK NONE OF THE NUMBERS LOOK LOW OTHER THAN HAPPY CREEK
BUT WHAT'S YOUR, I I DON'T HAVE ANY MAJOR CONCERN OTHER THAN THIS IS WHERE I NEED TO, TO HELP YOU BE PROACTIVE IN LISTENING TO WHAT YOU'RE HEARING AND ALSO TALKING TO THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT FOLKS IN THE PLANNING GROUP.
EVEN THOUGH WE LOOK LIKE WE'RE OKAY WITH THE THINGS THAT HAVE ALREADY BEEN APPROVED.
IF THERE'S A SPECIFIC AREA THAT'S GONNA BE THE TARGET FOR WHERE YOU SELL DEVELOPMENT TO OCCUR, THEN I NEED TO MAKE SURE THAT YOU ARE ROBUST IN THE ASSETS THAT SERVE THAT PARTICULAR DEVELOPMENT ZONE, WHICH IS GONNA BE THE COMMERCIAL CORRIDOR.
AND IF YOU THINK THAT IS THE MOST LIKELY LOCATION FOR DEVELOPMENT TO OCCUR, THEN I THINK THAT'S WHERE I WOULD FOCUS.
I THINK IT'S THE SCALE OF DEVELOPMENT.
SO FOR INSTANCE, WE CURRENTLY HAVE BEEN SEEING REZONING APPLICATIONS AT THE COUNTY LEVEL FOR SOMETHING TO BE A DISTRIBUTION CENTER OR WAREHOUSE OR INDUSTRIAL USE AS A ZONING MM-HMM
[00:30:01]
DON'T KNOW.AND THOSE DEVELOPERS HAVEN'T DECIDED WHAT THEY'RE DEVELOPING THERE.
SO, YOU KNOW, A STORAGE FACILITY VERSUS A DATA CENTER THAT'S OUT IN THE CORRIDOR, ONCE WE AGREE TO PROVIDE THEM WITH WATER, IT DOESN'T COME BACK TO US AFTER MM-HMM.
WE'VE AGREED WE AGREE TO PROVIDE THEM WATER AT THEIR REZONING TYPICALLY.
AND THEN WHATEVER THE USE INTENDED USE IS, WE DON'T, IT DOESN'T COME BACK TO US BEFORE WE COMMIT.
BUT THEY DO ON THE APPLICATIONS DO HAVE TO ESTIMATE THE WATER USAGES, BUT THE ESTIMATIONS FOR WILDLY YEAH.
AND COMPARABLE TO THE OTHER WAREHOUSES AND INDUSTRIAL USE OUT THERE THAT WE'VE SEEN RECENTLY.
AND MAYBE IT'S THE PEOPLE THAT ARE APPLYING DON'T UNDER IT COULD BE THAT THEY, I FEEL LIKE THE ONE GROUP THAT CAME IN, THEY WERE LIKE, THEY USED SOME, THEY EXPLAINED TO US HOW THEY PICKED THE NUMBER THAT THEY PICKED.
SO MAYBE THEY, MAYBE THERE'S SOME ASSISTANCE AND RESOURCES WE COULD PROVIDE THEM ON THAT.
FOR, FOR GLEN IT WAS BASED ON A, ON A THREE SHIFT.
I BELIEVE IT WAS THREE SHIFTS WITH 50 PEOPLE ON A SHIFT.
UM, AND IT WAS, UH, SUPPOSED TO BE A DISTRIBUTION CENTER, WHICH SUPPOSEDLY ONE OF THE LEAST MM-HMM
AND THEIR NUMBERS WERE WILDLY AND COMPARABLE TO THE OTHER DISTRIBUTION.
WE HAD GOTTEN LIKE A COUPLE DIFFERENT APPLICATIONS MM-HMM.
AND IT APPEARED ON THE OUTSIDE THAT THEY WERE THE SAME USE BUT THE NUMBERS WERE OFF.
WHICH THEY HAVE THEIR RIGHT AS TO ONCE THEY HAVE IT REZONED TO SELL IT TO A DEVELOPER MM-HMM
WHICH IS TYPICALLY WHAT THEY'RE DOING WHEN THEY COME TO US.
UM, SO WE, THEY DO IT SIMULTANEOUSLY.
THEY, THEY PUT THEIR REZONING APPLICATION AT THE COUNTY.
THEY ASK US IF WE'LL COMMIT TO PROVIDE THEM SERVICES OUTSIDE OF THE TOWN LIMITS.
AND THEN IF THE COUNTY REZONES IT AND WE SAY YES, IT, WE NEVER SEE IT AGAIN.
WE JUST HAVE TO PROVIDE WATER.
SO IS THERE A MECHANISM IN PLACE FOR THE TOWN TO RECOUP PLANNING AND ENGINEERING THAT'S NECESSARY TO CONSIDER THEIR SUGGESTIONS OR, OR REQUEST? NOT TO MY KNOWLEDGE.
WE, THEY PAY A PILOT FOR THE COST OF THE WATER, BUT THAT'S JUST TO GET THE WATER TO THEM.
SO IN OTHER PLACES I WORK, THERE'S A MECHANISM THAT PART OF THE APPLICATION PROCESS, THEY HAVE TO PAY A FEE THAT COVERS ENGINEERING AND PLANNING EFFORTS TO EVALUATE THE SYSTEM TO SEE IF HE CAN ACTUALLY HANDLE IT.
AND SO IF THEY'RE GONNA THROW PIE IN THE SKY NUMBERS OUT, THEN THAT'S FINE 'CAUSE THEY'VE ALREADY PAID FOR ME TO, TO LOOK THROUGH AND TURN THROUGH FOUR OR FIVE DIFFERENT SCENARIOS THAT MAY OR MAY NOT HAPPEN.
BECAUSE IF, IF YOU GIVE ME A RANGE THAT SAYS A HUNDRED THOUSAND GALLONS A DAY TO A MILLION GALLONS A DAY, I'M GONNA TELL YOU ONCE YOU GET TO A HALF A MILLION GALLONS, THEN YOUR INVESTMENT IN INFRASTRUCTURE IS GOING TO INCREASE SIGNIFICANTLY.
AND SO YOU CAN TELL 'EM ALL DAY LONG YES, UP TO A HALF A MILLION GALLONS A DAY.
BUT IF THEY COME BACK AND THEY'VE SWELLED INTO THAT 500 TO A MILLION, YOU ARE GOING TO HAVE TO INVEST X AMOUNT OF DOLLARS IN ORDER TO SUPPORT THAT.
WELL OUR OUR ONLY WAY OF MITIGATING THAT IS AFTER THE FACT WHEN WE WRITE OUR AGREEMENTS.
BECAUSE IF THEY, IF WE DO FIND OUT THAT THEY'RE GOING BEYOND WHAT WAS AGREED TORE LEVEL, YEAH.
I MEAN WE CAN GO UP AND, I MEAN FIRST COME TO SHOW WE CAN SHUT THE WATER OFF BECAUSE WE HAVE IT IN OUR ORDINANCE TO WHERE WE HAVE TO PROVIDE WATER PER TOWN FIRST AND FOREMOST.
AND THAT'S BASICALLY ON A CASE BY CASE BASIS.
BUT, UH, WHEN WE DO APPROVE IT, YOU KNOW, EXCEPT WE NEVER SEE IT.
SO UNLESS THERE'S AN ISSUE, I MEAN WE, WE WON'T, IT WOULDN'T BE AN ISSUE TO US UNTIL ALL THE INFRASTRUCTURE WOULD BE IN PLACE, WHICH COULD BE SIX MONTHS A YEAR DOWN THE ROAD.
AND THEN AGAIN, IT WOULDN'T BE UNTIL, YOU KNOW, LIKE A YEAR OR SO EVEN AFTER THE USE OF IT BEFORE WE PROBABLY START NOTICING IT.
BUT AGAIN, WE HAVE TO MITIGATE THAT TWO WAYS.
ONE, YOU KNOW, THE RATE IS TWICE WHAT TONE RATE IS, UH, WHICH DOESN'T EVEN RECOUP OUR COSTS FOR SERVICES.
I MEAN WE'RE, YOU KNOW, WE JUST BUILT A, YOU KNOW, MULTIMILLION DOLLAR WATER LINE THAT'S KIND OF COMPLETE THROUGHOUT THERE, YOU KNOW MM-HMM
BUT, BUT ALSO TOO, YOU KNOW, IT IS THAT, UM, IT, IT WOULD JUST BE US ENFORCING US, BUT IT WOULDN'T BE UNTIL AFTER THE FACT.
OTHER LOCALITIES CHARGE AN ENGINEERING FEE UPFRONT WITH APPLICATION YEAH.
TO ASSESS WHAT THEIR USE WOULD IMPACT IS.
WHICH WOULD BE HELPFUL BECAUSE I ALSO DON'T THINK AS MANY DEVELOPERS WOULD COME FORWARD WITH FLIPPANT NUMBERS.
JUST, YOU KNOW, THROWING A DART AND SEEING WHAT STICKS.
BECAUSE OBVIOUSLY FROM WHAT YOU DO FOR CHA, YOU UNDERSTAND THAT IT WAS, IT IS REALLY HARD FOR US TO MAKE A DECISION TO PROVIDE THEM FOR THOSE SERVICES
[00:35:01]
WHEN WE ACTUALLY HAVE NO IDEA WHAT THE SERVICES ARE GONNA BE INTENDED FOR.I MEAN A DATA CENTER WOULD BE A LOT DIFFERENT THAN A WAREHOUSE OR A DISTRIBUTION CENTER.
UM, I THINK THAT'S A REALLY GOOD TOPIC.
GEORGE, YOU WERE NODDING YOUR HEAD BACK THERE.
SO WHAT WERE YOU GONNA SAY? WELL, UM, I'M NOT SURE I CAN ADDRESS WHAT'S BEING KICKED AROUND, BUT I ALWAYS LOOK AT THE CONNECTION.
I MEAN, YOU CAN'T PUSH A MILLION GALLONS THROUGH A THREE QUARTER INCH CONNECTION AND THE CONNECTION SIZE IS ESTABLISHED UPFRONT WITH THE FIRST USE PROPOSED USE.
SO IT SEEMS LIKE THAT'S THE SAFETY OF THE TOWN.
BUT IF IT'S A, IF IT'S A SIX, THEN I WOULD, MY SUGGESTION WOULD BE TO ASSESS THE MAXIMUM AMOUNT OF WATER THAT THEY COULD PUSH THROUGH THAT SIX INCH PIPE.
YOU'RE NOT A 30,000 FEET ANYMORE.
BUT IF THEY ASK FOR A SIX AND THEY ONLY USE HALF OF THAT CAPACITY, THEN THAT'S ONE THING.
BUT IF THEY SWELL INTO THE FULL AMOUNT, WE NEED TO HAVE ASSESSED WHETHER OR NOT THAT'S GONNA PUT UNDUE PRESSURE ON THE EXISTING ASSETS.
ROBBIE, YOU AND ONE ISSUE, LIKE THE ONE THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT, THEY TOOK THE SCAT RIGHT.
FOR INDUSTRIAL AND JUST TOOK THE SQUARE FOOTAGE IS WHAT THEY DID.
INSTEAD OF BEING REALISTIC, YOU JUST KIND OF THREW IT OUT.
YOU KNOW, THAT'S PART OF THE PROBLEM TOO IS YOU JUST THROW IT OUT INSTEAD OF ACTUALLY A REALISTIC NUMBER A LOT OF TIMES IS TAKE THE SCAT REGS TALKING ABOUT ENGINEER 220,000 SQUARE FOOT I BELIEVE, AND IT WAS 4,200 PER COUPLE BALANCE PER DAY THAT THEY WERE ESTIMATING WITH A TWO INCH PIPE AND A 10 10 INCH.
UH, UH, IS THERE SOMETHING, IS THERE SOMETHING ON STAFF, LIKE YOU WERE SAYING, LIKE HOW THEY JUST SCREWED OUT THERE? WE, WE HAVE SEEN SOME WHERE IT DID JUST SEEM LIKE THEY WEREN'T REALLY SURE THEY THOUGHT THEY WERE PICKING THE RIGHT NUMBER.
IS IS THAT SOMETHING THAT, THAT, DOES OUR STAFF HELP THEM DETERMINE WHAT THEIR NUMBERS ARE OR DO THEY JUST PUT IT IN THERE AND THERE'S AND THERE'S NO, THEY'LL PUT IT IN THERE.
A LOT OF TIMES WE TRY TO SITE PLAN, YOU KNOW, ASK IF IT'S REAL HIGH LIKE THAT IF THEY JUST DID THE REGULATIONS AND SOME OF 'EM WILL KEEP SENDING 'EM BACK HIGH.
I GUESS JUST TRYING TO SEE WHAT THEY CAN GIVE.
SO MY OTHER CONCERN IS WE HAD BEFORE MY TIME, MAYBE BEFORE ANY OF OUR TRIBAL COUNSEL THAT MAYBE YOU LORI, UH, A COMMERCIAL CONNECTION IN THE CORRIDOR WHO COMMITTED TO WATER, WHICH THEY PAID TWO TIMES THE RATE, WHICH IS A LITTLE SOMETHING TOWARDS IMPROVEMENTS TO THE INFRASTRUCTURE.
IT DOESN'T RECOUP OUR COSTS, BUT THEY THEN IMPLEMENTED WATER RECYCLERS SO THEY WERE NO LONGER UTILIZING WHAT WE HAD QUOTED THEM FOR.
SO THEN THAT TOOK OUT OF WHAT THEY WERE PAYING.
SO I WOULD BE IN FAVOR OF PUTTING ON A FUTURE WORK SESSION AND A FUTURE LIAISON SINCE IT'S TOO LATE NOW TO DISCUSS RECOUPING OUR ENGINEERING COSTS FOR CONSIDERING CORRIDOR WATER.
LIKE AN APPLICATION FEE FOR AN OUT OF TOWN UTILITY.
THAT, THAT'S AN APPLICATION FEE THAT'S, YOU KNOW, COVERS MM-HMM
BECAUSE WE HAVE STAFF INVOLVEMENT, WE HAVE THE COMMITMENT TO DO THAT.
WE HAVE THE INFRASTRUCTURE UPGRADES, THE WATER, THE ACTUAL COST OF THE WATER, BUT THEN ALSO, YOU KNOW, THE MONEY WE'RE PAYING PEOPLE LIKE CHA MM-HMM
UM, AND I MEAN CERTAINLY WE'RE PAYING TO DUMP OUR OWN TRASH IN OUR OWN COUNTY SO IT DOESN'T SEEM UNREASONABLE IN PERSPECTIVE I THINK, I THINK IF WE COULD GET THE BEST, WHATEVER IT TAKES TO GET THE BEST INFORMATION WHEN YOU'RE MAKING THAT DECISION.
I DAD ALWAYS SAID YOU CAN'T MAKE A DECISION UNTIL YOU HAVE ALL THE INFORMATION.
AND I WAS GONNA SAY, SOMETIMES I DO FEEL LIKE SOME OF THE APPLICATIONS WE'VE GOTTEN, WE, WE ASK A LOT OF, WE'VE ASKED A LOT OF QUESTIONS AND YOU KNOW, MAYBE, MAYBE WE DO NEED TO, I'M SURE IT MAKES IT MORE ATTRACTIVE FOR RESALE FOR THEM IF THEY GET THIS HIGH NUMBER THAT THEY DON'T ACTUALLY NEED.
SO YEAH, IF I'M NOT PAYING AN APPLICATION FEE, I'M GONNA ASK, I MEAN IT'S LIKE MY KIDS, THEY DON'T PAY FOR IT SO THEY'RE GONNA ASK FOR ALL OF IT, YOU KNOW, AND SEE WHAT STICKS.
WHAT DO YOU THINK? SO OTHER LOCALITIES YOU THAT THEY, THAT'S PART OF THEIR APPLICATION PROCESS THAT THEY HAVE TO HAVE AN ENGINEER THAT, THAT GIVES A GOOD SOLID ESTIMATE OF THE WATER USED.
MOST OF THE NORTHERN, I WOULD SAY NOVA AREAS THAT I WORK WHERE LAND IS VERY VALUABLE AND I'D SAY MEDIAN HOUSEHOLD INCOME IS PUSHING $180,000 A A YEAR.
THEY, THEY'RE SERIOUS ABOUT ME GIVING THEM REALLY GOOD QUALITY
[00:40:01]
DATA.BUT IF YOU GET SIX OF THOSE REQUESTS AND I GOTTA WORK ON IT FOR A MONTH AND THEN NONE OF THEM PAN OUT, HOW DOES THE TOWN RECOUP THAT MONEY? RIGHT.
THE OTHER WAY TO HANDLE THAT IS PROBABLY THROWS IT OVER THE FENCE TO ME AND SAYS, GIVE A QUICK LOOK AT THIS.
AND I GIVE IT A LITTLE GLANCE AND THEN IT HAPPENS AND I'M, I DIDN'T SPEND ENOUGH TIME ON IT AND NOW HERE WE ARE, YOU GUYS ARE ASKING ME WHY I DIDN'T SPEND MORE TIME BUT BJ'S SAYING THAT YOU'RE KILLING ME WITH, WITH INVOICES THIS YEAR.
WHAT'S, WHAT'S WHAT'S HAPPENING? SO, BUT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS, IS THAT WE CAN ALLEVIATE THAT BY SAYING WHOEVER'S DOING THE APPLICATION NEEDS TO BE PAYING THE FEE FOR YOUR TIME.
AND WE'D HAVE TO FIND THE SWEET SPOT.
BUT I THINK THE WATER MODEL SET UP, THE SEWER MODEL IS, IS SET UP.
SO LITERALLY I GO IN THERE AT THE PROPERTY AND I ADD THAT WATER DEMAND AND I'LL RUN THE MODEL AND THE PUMP STARTS SCREAMING AT ME SAYING THAT'S TOO MUCH.
THEN I SAY, OKAY, WE'RE, YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE TO SPEND MONEY IF YOU'RE GONNA SAY YES TO THIS AMOUNT OF WATER.
AND THAT MAY BE OKAY DEVELOPER, OUR ENGINEER LOOKED AT IT AND I KNOW YOU ASKED FOR 800,000, WE CAN PROBABLY DO SIX.
DOES THAT WORK FOR YOU? WE, YOU KNOW, DO YOU NEED TO DO SOME MORE NUMBER CRUNCHING INTERNALLY? 'CAUSE IS THIS JUST LIKE A WIDE NET THAT YOU'RE CASTING? 'CAUSE IF WE HAVE TO DO MORE THAN THAT, WE'RE GONNA START TALKING ABOUT INFRASTRUCTURE INVESTMENT AND THEN IF WE GET THOSE BALLS ROLLING, THEN WE'RE SPENDING MONEY ON ENGINEERING PERMITTING AND THEN YOU DECIDE NOT TO COME, THEN THAT MONEY'S ALREADY BEEN SPENT.
SO IT'S, IT'S JUST A BALANCE AND YOU, YOU GOTTA HAVE THE TOOLS YOU ALREADY HAVE, WHICH A LOT OF FOLKS DON'T HAVE ANY OF THIS.
AND THEY ASK ME, CAN WE HANDLE THIS DEVELOPMENT? I WAS LIKE, I HAVE NO IDEA.
I DON'T HAVE A MAP OF YOUR PIPING AND I'LL GET SOME CHANGE THE ENTIRE FINANCIAL OUTLOOK FOR THE TOWN.
CAN WE MAKE IT WORK? AND THAT'S A TOUGH SPOT TO BE IN.
BUT YOU GUYS HAVE GOT A LOT MORE PLANNING TOOLS THAN, THAN THAN MOST.
CAN YOU SAY IT AGAIN FOR THE CAMERA? NO, I'M JUST KIDDING.
UM, SO THE OTHER THING THAT THAT LEADS ME TO THAT I JUST WAS THINKING ABOUT NOT ONLY THE RECYCLERS BUT THE PEOPLE IN THE CORRIDOR.
WHEN WE HAD A DROUGHT LAST YEAR AND WE WERE REQUIRED TO BE IN WATER CONSERVATION, FIRST IT WAS VOLUNTARY, THEN IT WAS, YOU KNOW, MANDATORY THE PEOPLE IN THE CORRIDOR AREN'T REQUIRED TO FOLLOW THAT BECAUSE THEY'RE NOT WITHIN THE TOWN LIMITS.
SO THEY DON'T FALL UNDER THE TOWN CODE.
SO WHEN WE WERE UNDER MANDATORY WATER RESTRICTION LAST YEAR, THE COMMERCIAL PEOPLE OUT IN THE CORRIDOR, WHICH INCLUDES A RESIDENTIAL DEVELOPMENT, UM, BLUE RIDGE SHADOWS GOLF COURSE, THEY CAN WATER THEIR GARDEN, THEY CAN WASH THEIR CARS.
WHEREAS WE WEREN'T ALLOWED TO DO THAT.
SO WE ALSO HAVE NO CONTROL OUTSIDE OF CHARGING THEM TWO TIMES THE RATE.
AND SO MY OTHER THOUGHT PROCESS TO COUNSEL WITH ASKING TO PUT THIS ON A FUTURE WORK SESSION IS AS A DEVELOPER, IF I'M GONNA BRING A DEVELOPMENT FORWARD AND GIVE YOU THESE NUMBERS AND ASK YOU TO PROVIDE SERVICES, IF I HAD TO PAY A FEE, THERE'S A LITTLE BIT MORE OF A COMMITMENT INVOLVED THAN MORE SKIN IN THE GAME.
SO WE DON'T HAVE THE SAME MEDIAN HOUSEHOLD INCOME AS WHAT YOU MENTIONED IN NORTHERN VIRGINIA.
HOWEVER, THE FLIP SIDE OF THAT IS FRONT ROYAL AND WARREN COUNTY ARE IN THE TOP FIVE 7% OF THE LOWEST REAL ESTATE TAXES IN THE STATE OF VIRGINIA.
MM-HMM
WE'RE SEEING APPLICATIONS FOR PEOPLE WHERE WE'RE STILL CLOSE ENOUGH TO, YOU KNOW, THE DC METROPOLITAN AREA, BUT A LOT CHEAPER TO DO BUSINESS HERE.
SO I WOULD, I AM HIGHLY IN FAVOR BECAUSE THIS IS, WE'RE SEEING IT PROGRESS AS WELL.
THE APPLICATIONS FROM THE CORRIDOR, SINCE MY TIME ON COUNCIL EVERY YEAR, I WOULD BE WILLING TO SAY THAT THEY'VE GONE UP AND UP AND UP AND IT'S BECAUSE THE COMMERCIAL AND INDUSTRIAL ASPECT OF DEVELOPMENT IS GOING TO BE IN THE CORRIDOR IN THE COUNTY.
I THINK IF THE APPLICATION DOESN'T COME TO US THOUGH, RIGHT.
BUT IT STARTS AT THE COUNTY RIGHT OUT UTILITY APPLICATION FOR INDUSTRIAL WILL START AT THE COUNTY AND THEN IT WILL COME TO US AFTER THE COUNTY APPROVED.
THERE HAS TO BE A REQUEST TO SERVE.
I'M JUST SAYING FOR COMMERCIAL IN THE CORRIDOR, IT'S ALREADY SET ON THE CORRIDOR AGREEMENT AND ANNEXATION, I JUST MEANT THE PIECE OF THIS.
IF WE WERE TO DO WHAT OTHER LOCALITIES ARE DOING, WHICH IS TO REQUIRE, YOU KNOW, OBVIOUSLY SOME MORE INFO, YOU KNOW, AN ENGINEER TO LOOK AT IT TO FIGURE OUT WHAT THE, I WAS JUST ASKING LIKE WOULD THAT BE ON WHEN IT GETS TO US THAT WE COULD ASK FOR THAT.
IT WOULDN'T BE SOMETHING THE COUNTY WOULD'VE TO ASK FOR UPFRONT.
IT COULD BE WE COULD CONTROL THE ASK IS WHAT I'M SAYING.
IF WE HAD TO, IF, IF I CAN CHIME IN.
[00:45:01]
UM, AS FAR AS YOUR OTHER EXAMPLES, I'M ASSUMING ALL OF THOSE INVOLVE, UH, SERVICES WITHIN THE LOCALITIES BOUNDARIES I WOULD SAY WITHIN THEIR SERVICE AREA.SO I DON'T KNOW HOW YOU CAN'T GET TO CUSTOMERS WITH A, WITH A DROUGHT, WITH A, A DROUGHT REQUIREMENT EVEN THOUGH THEY'RE NOT IN TOWN THEIR CUSTOMERS.
SO IT'S UNUSUAL TO SERVE OUTSIDE OF YOUR BATTERIES.
I THINK THERE'S A LOT OF SITUATIONS THAT ARE SIMILAR TO WHAT YOU GUYS ARE DOING.
YOU SAY SERVICE AREA, TACKLE IT THIS WAY.
SO INDUSTRIAL USERS IN THE COUNTY, IT'S A CASE BY CASE.
IT'S IT'S ARM'S LENGTH NEGOTIATION ONCE THE COUNTY REQUESTS SERVICE.
SO COULD A APPLICATION BE FEE BE ADDED TO THAT? I THINK SO.
UM, COMMERCIAL IN THE CORRIDOR? NO.
YEAH, THEY'RE, THAT THAT AGREEMENT IS PILOT, THEY'RE TREATED, THEY'RE TREATED JUST LIKE OUR, LIKE OUR TOWN RESIDENTS IN A WAY.
THEY'RE TREATED AS THOUGH THEY'RE IN TOWN.
CAN'T ASSESS TAXES, BUT YOU CAN COLLECT PILOT FEES IN LIEU OF TAXES.
THAT'S, SO IS THERE A WAY, THIS IS WHY I'M SAYING A FUTURE WORK SESSION TO NOT WASTE YOUR TIME.
I'M SORRY, MY LAST QUESTION FOR LEGAL TO LOOK INTO WOULD BE, IS THERE A WAY TO REWRITE OR CHANGE, AMEND THE TOWN CODE TO BE THE SERVICE AREA INSTEAD OF LIKE CORPORATE LIMITS THAT LIMIT
WELL, I MEAN YOU'RE, YOU'RE HOLDING THEM TO THE SAME, THEY'RE HOLDING YOU TO THE SAME STANDARDS THAT VDH REQUIRE FOR THE LEVEL OF SERVICE AND THE WATER QUALITY THAT YOU PROVIDE.
SO I, I DON'T KNOW HOW THEY CAN LIVE BY DIFFERENT RULES AS USERS MM-HMM
SO IF THEM NOT FOLLOWING A REDUCED WATER USE ORDINANCE IMPACTS YOUR ABILITY TO PROVIDE QUALITY SERVICE TO THE REST OF YOUR USERS, THEN THAT IS, THAT'S, THAT'S IN IMPACTING YOUR ABILITY TO TAKE CARE OF YOUR WHOLE SERVICE AREA.
AND I, I I'M, NO, UM, GEORGE IS LIKE WHY HE IS JUST LIKE CAR WASHES IN TOWN, COULDN OPERATE DURING THAT, BUT CAR WASHES IN THE CORRIDOR THAT GET THEIR WATER FROM US COULD OPERATE.
WELL WE PROBABLY OBVIOUSLY CAN'T DO REALLY DO MUCH WITH WHAT'S ALREADY THERE, BUT I THINK IN THE FUTURE WE CAN JUST ADD THAT TO OUR AGREEMENTS FOR INDUSTRIAL BECAUSE THAT'S WHAT THE PROCESS RIGHT.
AND AND AND BUT THEN IT'S A BREACH OF CONTRACT KIND OF ENFORCEMENT.
INSTEAD OF A POTENTIALLY CRIMINAL ENFORCEMENT.
WE CAN'T DO CRIMINAL OUTSIDE OF TOWN.
I'M NOT LOOKING TO MAKE HIM A CRIMINAL, BUT DURING A BREACH OF CONTRACT, IF WE HAVE SOMEBODY COME IN THAT'S COMMITTING TO THIS AND THEN WATER, YOU KNOW, IT'S BEING GREED, WATER.
YEAH, THAT'S WHAT I'D BE IN FAVOR OF.
SO THIS, SO, SO TONIGHT WAS ABOUT EXCESS.
I'M GONNA LET YOU KEEP, KEEP GOING.
UM, I WILL SAY WHAT I THOUGHT, ONE OF THE THINGS THAT WAS VERY VALUABLE YOU SAID IS LIKE IF SOME, IF A DEVELOPER WANTS TO COME IN AND THEY ARE GOING TO NEED MORE AND WE'RE GOING TO NEED UPGRADES FOR THEM TO PARTICIPATE IN THAT PART OF IT, THAT'S REALLY NO DIFFERENT THAN WE SAY THAT THEY HAVE TO PUT IN SIDEWALKS AND THINGS LIKE THAT IN DEVELOPMENTS THAT OTHERWISE WE WOULD, YOU KNOW, ROAD STRUCTURE AND STUFF LIKE THAT.
SO I DON'T SEE HOW THIS WOULD, I THINK IT'S ALONG THAT SAME MONTH.
DO YOU HAVE, WELL IN HINDSIGHT'S 2020, BUT WE MADE ALL THOSE IMPROVEMENTS TO THE REDUNDANT WATER LINE AND I SAT ON A LIAISON THAT DISCUSSED NO LONGER USING OUR WATER SERVICES IN THE MIDDLE OF BUILDING THAT REDUNDANT WATER LINE.
THEY WERE CONSIDERING A REGIONAL WATER AUTHORITY WHILE WE WERE IN THE PROCESS OF PROBABLY 70% COMPLETION OF RUNNING THAT WATER LINE OUT THERE.
SO DIDN'T HAVE WANTED, NOBODY WANTED TO TAKE A MORE, IT'S JUST LIKE IF THERE WERE MORE COMMITMENT TO BE GOOD STEWARDS OF OUR RESOURCES, I FEEL LIKE THE TOWN WOULD HAVE A LOT LESS LIABILITY AND EXPOSURE.
WELL, AND JUST TO KIND OF CLOSE THE ENDS ON THAT LAST COMMENT, THE, I SEE A WHOLE GAMUT OF HOW TOWNS AND MUNICIPALITIES HANDLE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENTS.
SO SOME OF THEM ARE LIKE, LOOK, WE'RE NOT GONNA SPEND A PENNY.
AIR REPAIRS ARE NOT GOING TO BUILD THE INFRASTRUCTURE FOR SOMEBODY WHO MAY OR MAY NOT COME.
IF YOU WANNA COME IN, YOU SUBMIT PLANS FOR ALL OF THE UPGRADES THAT ARE NEEDED, WE GET IT REVIEWED, IT MEETS OUR SPECS AND OUR STANDARD DETAILS.
YOU BUILD IT, WE INSPECT IT TO MAKE SURE IT'S EXACTLY WHAT IT'S SUPPOSED TO BE.
[00:50:01]
YOU TEST IT AND PROVE THAT IT RUNS YOU TURN IT OVER TO US AND WE'LL MAINTAIN IT.BUT YOU'RE GONNA BUILD ALL THAT BECAUSE THE RATE PAYERS ARE NOT GONNA CARRY ANY OF THAT ON THEIR BACK.
THE OTHER END IS WE, WE WANT SOMEBODY IN HERE SO BAD THAT WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO PUT SOME INFRASTRUCTURE IN TO, TO BE ATTRACTIVE ENOUGH TO GET 'EM.
YOU'RE LIKE, WE'RE JUST BEGGING ANYBODY THAT'LL COME, WE'RE NOT GONNA GET BUTTONS BUT
AND SO THAT'S, THAT'S THE, THE WIDE END OF THAT SPECTRUM.
AND I'M NOT TELLING YOU WHAT'S RIGHT FOR THE TOWN, I'M JUST SAYING THE HARD LINE IS THIS IS AN EASY CONVERSATION.
IF YOU WANT MILLION GALLONS A DAY ENGINEER SAYS YOU GOTTA DO 300,000 GALLONS OF UPGRADES TO THE PUMP STATION AND RUN A NEW SIX INCH LINE, HAVE AT IT AND YOU CAN HAVE ALL, WELL THEN THEY START SHARPENING THEIR PENCIL BECAUSE THEY'RE LIKE, WE, THAT CUTS INTO OUR PROFIT MARGIN IMMEDIATELY.
IF THE TOWN JUST SAYS, YEAH, WE'LL WE'LL BUILD STUFF, THEN THEY'RE LIKE, WELL LET'S ASK FOR AS MUCH AS WE CAN GET AND THEN WE'LL SELL IT BECAUSE IT'S MORE VALUABLE TO SELL IT THAN BUILD BUILD ON IT.
SO JUST FOOD FOR THOUGHT AND THE THINGS THAT WE EXPERIENCE ON, ON OUR SIDE OF IT.
I HAVE A LEGAL QUESTION FOR THAT.
IS THAT NOT CONSIDERED A PROFFER BECAUSE I WANNA BE ON THE FIRST END OF WHERE HE, HE SENT, THERE'S THEIR STATE STATUTE WITH RESPECT TO WATER AND SEWER INFRASTRUCTURE THAT'S NOT, THAT CAN BE TRANSFERRED.
IT COSTS CAN BE TRANSFERRED TO BUYRIGHT DEVELOPMENT.
THAT'S THE SIDE I WANT THE TOWN TO DO.
TAXPAYERS NOT IMPACT THE PROPER SENSE PROFIT ON THEIR DEVELOPMENT BECAUSE IN THE END WE HAVE TO PROVIDE, WE ARE OBLIGATED TO PROVIDE WATER TO EVERY PERSON INSIDE THE TOWN.
SO THAT'S, THAT'S, THAT SEEMS TO HAVE BEEN, YOU KNOW, THIS COUNCIL, SOME OF THE QUESTIONS AND WHERE ALL THIS IS COMING FROM IS, IS OVER PROMISING TO SOME PEOPLE OUT MAYBE POSSIBLY OUT IN THE CORRIDOR AND THEN NOT HAVING ENOUGH TO PROVIDE TO OUR OWN, YOU KNOW, THOSE IN WHICH WE'RE OBLIGATED TO NOT.
AND IT DOESN'T SOUND LIKE WE'RE THERE YET, RIGHT.
UM, FROM WHAT YOU SAID, OF COURSE WE'RE GOING TO GIVE YOU THOSE EXTRA, UM, THINGS TO ADD TO.
AND I JUST, I'D INCLUDED THE, THE ASSETS FOR BOTH THE WATER AND SEWER SYSTEM MAPPING.
WE TRY TO KEEP THESE UP TO DATE JUST SO FOLKS THAT WANNA GET IN THE WEEDS CAN SEE WHERE EACH ONE OF THOSE PUMP STATIONS ARE OVERLAY THE, THE SERVICE AREAS YOU CAN SEE ON, ON HOW EACH ONE PROVIDES TO EACH PRESSURE ZONE.
AND THAT'S THE PRESENTATION I THINK.
I THINK YOU GOT ALL THE QUESTIONS ALONG THE WAY.
DOES ANYBODY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR HIM NOW OR DID WE PRETTY MUCH PEPPER ALL THE QUESTIONS THAT I THINK THAT WE HAVE TO TELL JOE WHAT WE WANT TO ADD AND LET
UM, AND THE HAN HAN, WE HAVEN'T EVEN TALKED ABOUT THE DEVELOPMENT OF AVTEC PROPERTY AND THAT'S GONNA BE COMING UP FOR SALE SOON.
BUT THAT, YOU KNOW, THAT'S IN INSIDE THE TOWN COMMERCIAL IT, IT'S BEEN SAID THAT WE'RE GETTING A CHICK-FIL-A AND ANOTHER SHEET NORTH OF RURAL FARM AGAIN COMMERCIAL WE HAVE TO PROVIDE.
AND THEN HOW MUCH INFILL DEVELOPMENT DO THEY HAVE? RIGHT? HOW MANY EMPTY BLOCKS? YEAH, I MEAN WE SEE THEM EVERY DAY.
WE USED TO HAVE A NUMBER FOR THAT.
THERE USED TO BE A NUMBER OR AT LEAST I REMEMBER I THINK HAS OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT I THINK WOULD LIKE 1300 OR 1100.
NO 1300 ON ONES ARE ALREADY APPROVED BY RIGHT.
THE INFILL LOTS ARE THE ONES BASICALLY LITTLE PIECES OF HAND ALL OVER TOWN.
LAUREN HAS THAT INFORMATION BUT THEN WHAT, WHAT YOU CHANGE THE USAGE, YOU KNOW.
WELL SO THAT'S WHAT THE SO THAT'S WHAT I WAS GONNA SAY AT THE BEGINNING OF HIS PRESENTATION HE SAID THAT A LOT OF LOCALITIES CAN LOOK AT A MAP AND SEE WHAT THE ZONING ARE.
THAT MEANS NOTHING HERE BECAUSE PEOPLE BUY AGRICULTURAL LAND AND HAVE ZERO INTENTIONS OF DOING ANYTHING AG RELATED.
SO IT'S JUST NOT A GOOD PREDICTOR FOR US.
ALL LANDS BECOMING MORE VIABLE.
THERE WAS A DAY NO ONE WOULD BUILD A ROCKLAND
[00:55:01]
BECAUSE IT WAS ROCK ROCKLAND.NOW BECAUSE OF PROXIMITY TO WASHINGTON AND MARYLAND, UH, AND LAND LESS AND LESS, THE BUSH AND PRESSURE IS OUT HERE.
AND NOW WE'RE DEALING WITH, I THINK THAT'S WHY WE STALL ON THAT LAST WATER REQUEST.
WE KIND OF SEE EACH OTHER LICENSE.
WELL AND WITH OUR NATURAL RESOURCES.
THAT'S WHY I SAY FOR A FUTURE WORK SESSION, I WANNA BE ON THE END OF HISTORY AS A LOCALITY THAT DOES NOT PUT THE COST ON THE TAXPAYER'S BACK FOR THE INFRASTRUCTURE UPGRADES TO DEVELOP HERE.
BECAUSE I THINK EVERYBODY'S SITTING AT THIS TABLE KNOWS AND CAN AGREE WE KNOW WHAT WE HAVE AND I THINK WE DO NEED TO BE SELECTIVE WITH WHAT COMES HERE.
I DON'T FEEL LIKE WE'RE OPEN FOR BUSINESS FOR EVERYTHING.
AND THAT'S MY PERSONAL OPINION.
I THINK, YOU KNOW, AS A MAIN STREET, AS A TOWN, WE NEED TO BE SELECTIVE IN WHAT WE WANT OUR HISTORY TO BE IN THE LEGACY OF FRONT ROYAL.
SO I'VE SAID FOR A LONG TIME, I WALKED PAST A SHOP ON MAIN STREET A YEAR AND A HALF AGO THAT SAID, YOU KNOW, BUY YOUR CIGARETTES HERE AND WE DO YOUR TAXES IN THE BACK.
IT WAS LIKE A LITTLE CONVENIENCE STORE MAIN STREET AND I WAS LIKE IN OUR BEAUTIFUL HISTORIC DOWNTOWN DISTRICT, WHAT IS THIS? IT'S SCARY.
AND SO I THINK WE NEED TO HAVE SOME SEMBLANCE OF, AND AT ONE TIME ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, WE KNEW ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT BROUGHT IN PEN TAB AND THEN THEY BROUGHT IN TORY AND FAMILY DOLLAR.
NOW SPECULATORS WANT TO PUT UP A BUILDING.
WELL WE THINK IT'S, YOU KNOW, IT'S PROBABLY GONNA BE A WAREHOUSE AND WE'LL PROBABLY BE, AND WE'RE GOING TO END UP ONE DAY WITH A BOTTLING PLANT THAT HAS A HUGE UH, USAGE.
I I, WE DON'T HAVE AN UNLIMITED AMOUNTS JUST LIKE OUR LAND, OUR WATERS, IT'S BEEN AWAY.
IT'S NOT AN INFINITE AMOUNT, IT'S NOT A FLOODGATE YOU CAN CLOSE.
ONCE WE OPEN IT, THAT'S OF RIGHT NOW YOU'RE SAYING OUR EXCESS, WE'RE OKAY FOR RIGHT NOW FOR WHAT WE'VE GOT COMING, WE'RE GOING TO GIVE YOU THESE EXTRA THINGS THAT WE KNOW ARE COMING FOR CERTAIN.
WHICH
I CAN'T THINK OF ANYTHING ELSE.
JOE DID YOU HAVE ANYTHING ELSE YOU CAN THINK OF? YEAH, AGAIN, WE'LL MAKE SURE EVERYTHING IN TOWN IS COVERED THAT WE HAVE.
WE'LL GO TO THE COUNTY AND MAKE SURE EVERYTHING IS COVERED THAT HAS BEEN APPROVED, DISCUSSED AT SITE PLAN.
UM, THERE'S TWO OTHER THEORIES OF, YOU KNOW, KIND OF WHERE WE SIT WITH THE CURRENT ZONING.
EVEN IF WE HAVEN'T RECEIVED ANYTHING AFEC B ONE WE KNOW THE ZONING BUT THERE IS NOTHING ON THE TABLE RIGHT NOW.
BUT WE CAN USE THE CONCEPTUAL THEN WE CAN ALSO LOOK AT COMP PLAN STUDIES OF WHAT MIGHT BE ZONED AGRICULTURAL IN THE CORRIDOR TODAY.
BUT TOP PLAN, FUTURE LAND USE SAYS INDUSTRIAL.
WE COULD KIND OF RUN SOME DIFFERENT SCENARIOS OBVIOUSLY WITHIN A REASON FROM A BUDGETARY STANDPOINT ALSO AT THIS POINT.
BUT WE CAN AT LEAST PUT TOGETHER A JOINT INFORMATION WITH LAUREN AND, AND MATT WINDLEY OVER THERE.
WHAT WE HAVE TODAY ON THE BOOKS, WHAT THE ZONING, THE CURRENT ZONING ALLOWS AND THEN WHAT THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN FUTURE LAND USE THEN WOULD ALLOW IT.
UM, I THINK THOSE ARE LIKE THE THREE THINGS THAT WE'RE KIND OF LOOKING AT AS FAR AS WATER.
AND THEN AGAIN ALSO JUST BEING HYPERVIGILANT OF TOWN BAN, TOWN BOUNDARIES THEMSELVES, UNDERSTANDING WHAT WE NEED TO SERVE.
ONE THING THAT WAS MISSING FROM THAT LIST THAT I THINK YOU MIGHT WANNA GET INFORMATION OR YOU MIGHT KNOW FROM YOUR TIME THERE, THE LAST I WAS ON THE TRANSPORTATION SUBCOMMITTEE, MATT WENDLING HAD TALKED ABOUT BLUE RIDGE SHADOWS WAS SUPPOSED TO AT SOME POINT IN THE PLAN, ADD AN ADDITIONAL POINT OF INGRESS EGRESS FOR A ROAD OUT IN THE SUBDIVISION THAT GOES FURTHER UP NORTH FOR MORE DEVELOPMENT.
SO WOULD WE BE REQUIRED TO CONTINUE TO PROVIDE SERVICE FOR THAT AREA ONLY WHAT'S ALREADY DEVELOPED THAT'S RESIDENTIAL.
I KNOW, BUT WE'VE SERVICE THAT IT'S PART OF OUR SERVICE AREA.
UNLESS IT'S MORATORIUM IS AMENDED.
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS MR. STEELE? THANK YOU SIR.
IT IT VERY, IT VERY HELPFUL INFORMATION ON BEHALF OF CHA FOR 20 YEARS, WE HAVE BEEN PROUD TO SERVE THE TOWN RATE PAYERS AND TAXPAYERS AND HOPE TO KEEP HITTING THE MARK AND IF I'M NOT, CALL ME OUT 'CAUSE WE'RE VERY HAPPY TO KEEP WORKING HERE.
[01:00:01]
THE NEXT THING IS A RESOLUTION IN ENERGY SCHEDULED FOR TALLGRASS POWER PURCHASING AGREEMENT WITH AND, AND CARRIE AND UM, PAUL, IS IT BECKY HOUSTON CUSON.HOW ARE YOU? I DON'T THINK WE CAN HEAR YOU.
DO YOU WANNA MAKE SURE WE CAN HEAR IT? OH, THERE YOU GO.
HE'S, SO WE, UM, WE ARE HERE TO TALK ABOUT A, A POWER PURCHASE AGREEMENT WITH THROUGH AMP, WITH, UH, TALLGRASS, UM, WAS PAUL BECKEN WITH UH, AMP, HE IS SENIOR VICE PRESIDENT OF POWER SUPPLY ENERGY MARKETING.
SO WE GOT THE BIG DOG HERE WITH US.
THIS, ON THAT, THAT HE IS VERY KNOWLEDGEABLE, SO ASK HIM ANY QUESTIONS AND HE WILL TAKE CARE OF Y'ALL.
I DON'T THINK YOU HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT THAT WITH THIS SCRAP WATER.
IT'S A, IT'S AN IMPORTANT JOB WE HAVE.
IT'S LIKE WATER AND ELECTRIC OR MIXING.
SO, SO WITHOUT THAT, I'LL LET, I'LL TAKE IT OVER.
UH, THANK YOU, UH, CASEY, AND GOOD EVENING EVERYBODY.
UH, FALL ENERGY MARKETING FOR AMERICAN POWER.
UM, I'M GONNA GO AHEAD AND SHARE PRESENTATION HERE.
WALK THROUGH, UH, A RECOMMENDATION FOR A POWER PURCHASE, UM, CONTRACT ON A PROJECT CALLED TALL GRASS.
FOR SOME REASON I LOST THE CONFERENCE ROOM.
SO, UH, TIME, JUST, UH, PLEASE ASK ANY QUESTIONS THAT YOU HAVE, UM, AS WE GO THROUGH THIS.
SO, IN THE, UH, THE PROJECT, THIS, UH, POWER PURCHASE AGREEMENT IS, UH, RECOMMENDATION IS CALLED TALL GRASS.
I'M GONNA STEP THROUGH WHAT IT IS WE WANT.
THE RECOMMENDATION IS, SO THIS IS A UNIQUE PROJECT, SO HEAT RECOVERY PROJECT, AND IT'S RELATED TO THE, UH, THE ROCKIES EXPRESS PIPELINE OR THE REX PIPELINE, IS WHAT IT'S KNOWN IN THE INDUSTRY.
IT'S OWNED BY A COMPANY CALLED TALL GRASS, AND THE REX PIPELINE TRANSPORTS ABOUT 6% OF ALL THE US DOMESTIC, UH, NATURAL GAS IN THE UNITED STATES.
I'LL SHOW YOU A MAP HERE, BUT IT COMES OUTTA THE ROCKY MOUNTAIN AREA AND THEN GOES
UH, SO TALL GRASS AND CANYON ENERGY HAVE PARTNERED JOINTLY DEVELOP A WASTE OF HEAT POWER PROJECTS ALONG THIS, UH, PIPELINE.
AND WHICH, UH, THERE'S, THEY'VE GOT FOUR PROJECTS CURRENTLY GOING, ONE
AND WHAT IT DOES IS THE PROJECT CATCHES THE WASTE HEAT OFF THE COMPRESSOR STATION, THE WALL IN ITS, UH, PIPELINE.
WE'VE GOT A DIAGRAM HERE TO SHOW YOU IN A MINUTE.
UM, AND THE SITES WERE SELECTED BASED ON THE, UH, ENERGY THAT THE FACILITIES COULD GENERATE.
SO HERE'S JUST A GRAPHIC REPRESENTATION HERE, SHOWS THE PIPELINE, WYOMING, PENNSYLVANIA.
UM, SO ORIGINALLY IT WAS BUILT TO MOVE NATURAL GAS FROM WEST TO EAST.
AND WITH THE, THE SHALE GAS, IT'S NOW IN PENNSYLVANIA AND SOUTHERN OHIO AREA.
THE PIPELINE INITIALLY OPERATES THE OPPOSITE DIRECTION AND MOVES GAS FROM EAST TO WEST.
UM, HERE'S A LITTLE MORE REPRESENTATION OF WHERE THE PROJECTS ARE LOCATED.
THE TWO THAT I'M HERE TO TALK TO, UH, TO YOU TONIGHT ARE THE OHIO P JAM PROJECTS, AND THERE'S TWO LOCATIONS, ONE'S REFERRED TO AS THE COLUMBUS, UH, PROJECT, AND THE
SO GEOGRAPHICALLY, THEY'RE BOTH LOCATED, UH, JUST SOUTH OF THE COLUMBUS AREA AND IN OHIO.
I'M GONNA GO INTO A LOT OF DETAILS, JUST DO A MORE TECHNICAL LOOK AT WHAT THIS DOES.
BUT REAL SIMPLY, IF YOU LOOK HERE TO THE RIGHT HAND, EXCUSE ME, LEFT HAND SIDE, THIS REPRESENTS THE COMPRESSOR STATIONS THAT OPERATE THE, UH, NATURAL GAS PIPELINE.
AND WHAT THIS PROJECT DOES IS IT TAKES THE LEASE HEAT, IT'S GENERATED OFF THESE COMPRESSORS, AND IT, AND IT CAPTURES IT.
AND THEN THROUGH A, UM, UH, UH, A HEAT CYCLE, IT, ITS A TURBINE AND GENERATES ELECTRICITY.
[01:05:01]
TO, UH, WASTE HEAT.THAT'S ON OTHER TYPES OF THERMAL PROJECTS LIKE, UH, THE, OUR, OUR NATURAL GAS PLANT THAT DAM PHONES AND OPERATES.
SO HERE IS JUST A LITTLE HIGH OVERVIEW OF THE ARE WHAT, UH, I'M REFERRING TO THE LOCATIONS IN OHIO.
AGAIN, THESE COUNTIES PROBABLY DON'T MEAN MUCH, UH, TO YOU, BUT THEY'RE, THEY'RE JUST SOUTH AND SOUTHEAST OF COLUMBUS.
THEY'RE IN PJ, THEY'RE INTERCONNECTED WITH A COUPLE OF COOPERATIVES IN THE AREA.
THE, UH, GENERATOR INTERCONNECTION AGREEMENT, WHICH IS REQUIRED FOR THESE TO BE ABLE TO, UH, UH, GET POWER TO THE GRID.
THOSE ARE IN THE FINAL NEGOTIATIONS.
AGAIN, THESE ARE ON RIGHT OFF SITE, THIS COMPRESSOR STATIONS.
SO LAND'S NOT AN ISSUE, AND THERE'S NO PERMIT, THERE'S NO EMISSIONS OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT, UH, WITH THIS TYPE OF A GENERATION SOURCE.
SO HERE'S THE, UH, THE NAME PLATE CAPACITY.
SO JUST UNDER 13, I GO OFF FOR THE COLUMBUS PROJECT, JUST UNDER 10 MEGAWATTS FOR THE CHAIN MILLER BILL PROJECT.
SO NET WE'RE, WE'RE ABOUT 23, ROUGHLY 23 MEGAWATTS BETWEEN THE TWO PROJECTS.
THE ESTIMATED CAPACITY FACTOR IS 92%.
CAPACITY FACTOR IS THE BEST DOMESTIC ESTIMATED AMOUNT OF HOURS PER YEAR THAT THE PROJECT WOULD RUN.
SO 90% OF THE HOURS THAT OPERATES LIKE A BASE LOAD RESOURCE, UH, ANNUAL PRODUCTION, YOU CAN SEE HERE.
SO THE COLUMBUS PROJECT, SLIGHTLY LARGER THAN THE CHAND ROAD PROJECT, THE ELCC.
THIS, THIS EQUATES TO HOW MUCH, UH, THE EXPECTED, EXPECTED CAPACITY VALUE IS OF THE RESOURCES.
SO AGAIN, WITH IT BEING A BASE LOAD RESOURCE THAT RUN, THAT WILL RUN QUITE A BIT.
BUT THE ELCC, WHICH STANDS FOR, UH, ATE OR EFFECTIVE LOAD CARRYING CAPABILITY, IS GREATER THAN 90%.
SO WHAT THAT MEANS IS THAT IF WE LOOK AT THE COLUMBUS PROJECTS, IT'S ROUGHLY, UM, 13, UH, MEGAWATTS.
WE'LL GET SOMEWHERE AROUND, UM, 10 MEGAWATTS, UM, JUST SLIGHTLY MORE THAN 10 MEGAWATTS IN CAPACITY VALUE OUT OF THAT TYPE OF RESOURCE.
UH, THE ESTIMATED COMMERCIAL OPERATION IS THE FIRST QUARTER OF 2027.
UH, THE PRICING FOR THE, UH, OUR PURCHASE AGREEMENT IS 59 50.
UM, FOR BOTH OF 'EM, UH, THAT'S YEAR ONE.
THERE'S A 2% ESCALATOR EACH YEAR.
UM, IT'S A 15 YEAR TERM, AND I'LL SHOW YOU WHAT THAT AVERAGE PRICE COMES OUT TO BE BASED ON THAT ESCALATION.
AND THE PRODUCTS THAT ARE PART OF THIS CONTRACT IS ENERGY, CAPACITY, AND THEN ENVIRONMENTAL ATTRIBUTES.
SO IN THIS CASE, UH, IN OHIO, IN THE STATE OF OHIO, THESE QUALIFY FOR RE RENEWABLE ENERGY CREDITS.
AND I'LL, I'LL SHOW WHAT THAT VOLUME LOOKS LIKE HERE ON THE, ON THE NEXT SLIDE.
SO WHEN WE LOOK AT THAT 59 50 PRICE, AND WE AVERAGE THAT OUT OVER THE 15 YEAR TERM, UH, WITH THAT 2% ESCALATOR, THAT COMES OUT TO AN AVERAGE PRICE OF JUST UNDER $69 A MEGAWATT HOUR FOR THE ENTIRE 15 YEAR TERM.
UH, WE'RE FORECASTING THE REC VALUE AT $2 A MEGAWATT, UH, REC VALUES IN OHIO HAVE COME DOWN, AND NOT JUST IN OHIO, BUT ACROSS THE COUNTRY HERE LATELY.
UM, SO I THINK THIS IS A CONSERVATIVE NUMBER.
UH, HISTORICALLY THIS HAS BEEN IN THE THREE AND $4 RANGE, BUT WE'RE BEING A LITTLE MORE CONSERVATIVE AND CONSERVATIVE WITH THIS ESTIMATE RIGHT NOW.
AND THE CAPACITY, VALUE OF THESE, UH, PROJECTS WOULD, WOULD BE, UH, $12 I MEGAWATT HOUR.
SO A LOT OF VALUE HERE IN THE CAPACITY 'CAUSE OF THE TYPE OF RESOURCE THAT IT IS AND, AND THE PROJECTED AMOUNT OF, OF CAPACITY THAT IT WILL GENERATE.
SO WHEN YOU LOOK AT THAT NET PRICE OVER THE TERM FORECASTED PRICE, WE'RE JUST UNDER $55
SO WHEN YOU GET TO 68, 60 MINUS $2, MINUS $12 IS THE 54 60.
AND WHEN WE LOOK AT THE FORWARD, UH, ENERGY PRICE FOR SEVEN BY 24, WHICH IS, UH, A BLOCK PRICE AND, AND, AND QUITE LIQUID PRODUCT IN THE ENERGY MARKET IS, IT'S CURRENTLY AT 58 75.
AND I'VE GOT A GRAPH HERE THAT SHOWS THIS A LITTLE MORE CLEARLY, BUT YOU CAN SEE WHAT THIS REALLY, WHAT WE'RE SHOWING HERE IS THIS PROJECT IS, IS BASED ON THE, THE, OUR ASSUMPTIONS FOR ENERGY, OR EXCUSE ME, FOR REX AND CAPACITY IS, IS CHEAPER THAN WHAT
[01:10:01]
AND JUST THE ENERGY MARKET IS.UM, SO HERE'S THE GRAPHICAL REPRESENTATION OF, OF WHAT I JUST TALKED TO, THE PRICING.
SO THE, THE RED LINE HERE IS THE FORWARD ENERGY MARKET PRICING FOR THE 15 YEAR TERM, UM, FOR, UM, THE, UM, SEVEN BY 24 PRODUCT.
UM, AND THIS AGAIN, STARTS IN 27 THROUGHOUT THAT, THAT 15 YEAR TERM.
SO WHAT THIS IS, IF WE WERE TO GO OUT TODAY AND BUY A 15 YEAR, UM, UH, STRIP IS WHAT WE REFER TO OF A A A A BLOCK PURCHASE OVER THAT PERIOD OF TIME, WE WOULD BE HAVING THAT FOR THAT, UM, THIS 58 75.
UM, AND THEN THE BLUE LINE IS THE, UH, OUR PURCHASE PRICING, UH, WITH THE, THE 59, THE, THE, EXCUSE ME, MOVING AROUND HERE TOO MUCH.
SO THIS, UH, 59 50, BUT WE'RE SHOWING THIS WITH THE $14 OFF OF IT.
SO YOU TAKE THE 59 50 MINUS 14, WHERE ABOUT $45 ON THAT YEAR ONE, AND WITH THE 2% ESCALATOR, UH, YOU CAN SEE WHAT THAT LOOKS LIKE COMPARED TO THE, TO THE MARKET.
SO WHAT WE'RE RECOMMENDING, 40 POUNDS IS TWO MEGAWATTS OF THE, OF THE PROJECT.
SO RECOMMENDATION TWO MEGAWATTS.
UH, SO THAT'S ROUGHLY 2% OF THE TOWN'S, UH, OR EXCUSE ME, 10% OF THE TOWN'S TOTAL ENERGY, UH, NEEDS.
AND ALONG WITH THE OTHER RESOURCES, I'LL SHOW YOU A GRAPH HERE IN A SECOND.
THIS WOULD WOULD LOCK IN APPROXIMATELY 65% OF THE NEEDS ON A LONG TERM BASIS FOR THE TOWN.
SO IT HEDGES THE ENERGY NEEDS QUITE WELL.
UH, THIS IS IN ADDITION TO THE BLOCKS OF ENERGY THAT WERE APPROVED BACK IN, UH, UH, SEPTEMBER OF 23, UH, TO BE PURCHASED LATER THIS YEAR.
AND AGAIN, I'LL SHOW THIS GRAPHICALLY, BUT THERE'S, THE BLOCKS THAT WERE APPROVED WERE, UH, ONE MEGAWATT SEVEN BY 24 FOR ALL MONTHS OF 2026.
UH, 2.5 MEGAWATTS OF SEVEN BY 24 FOR THE WINTER MONTHS, JANUARY, FEBRUARY, AND DECEMBER IN 26.
AND THEN A BLOCK FOR THE WINTERS IN 27 AND 28 OF 3.5 MEGAWATTS.
SO THIS GRAPHICALLY SHOWS WHAT I, WHAT I JUST TALKED ABOUT.
SO IF WE LOOK OUT, SO WE START HERE IN 25, WE LOOK OUT HERE IN 2027, THAT'S WHERE YOU CAN SEE THE BLUE HATCH LINE.
THAT'S THE RECOMMENDED TWO MEGAWATTS OF THE, UH, TALL GRASS PROJECT.
SO IT STARTS IN 27, GOES OUT TO 36, AND THEN THE BLOCKS THAT WERE APPROVED BACK IN 23 OF THE WHITE BLOCKS HERE.
SO YOU CAN SEE HOW THOSE LAYER IN.
SO IF YOU LOOK AT 2027, UM, THERE'S, UH, YOU KNOW, A SUBSTANTIAL AMOUNT OF THE ENERGY IS, IS, IS LOCKED, UH, UP BY THE PROJECTS THAT, UH, TOWN PARTICIPATES IN, ALONG WITH THE PURCHASES THAT ARE IN PLACE CURRENTLY.
UM, SO THIS IS JUST A SUMMARY OF WHAT THE PROJECTS, SO AGAIN, THE, THE BULK PROJECTS ARE, ARE, WE, WE'RE MARKING IT AS ONE, SO IT'LL BE TWO, TWO PROJECTS, UH, BUT JUST ONE, ONE PPA, UH, FROM AMPS PERSPECTIVE, UH, WE'VE GONE THROUGH THE PLANNING PROCESS.
WE'VE IDENTIFIED A TOTAL OF 40 AMP MEMBERS.
UH, SO WE'RE IN THE MIDST OF, OF THE SUBSCRIPTION PROCESS RIGHT NOW WITH THE AMP MEMBERS.
UM, AND THAT SUBSCRIPTION DEADLINE IS, UM, SEPTEMBER 20TH OF, OF THIS YEAR.
UH, THAT'S WHEN WE HAVE TO HAVE THE PROJECT SUBSCRIBED AND, UH, COMMITTED TO, TO SIGNING THE CONTRACT WITH THE, UH, DEVELOPER.
SO WITH THAT, I WILL STOP, I THINK THAT'S THE LAST SLIDE, AND ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS THAT, UM, ANYBODY HAS.
UH, RECENTLY I'VE BEEN HEARING, UH, ABOUT, UH, THE POTENTIAL THAT, UH, RENEWAL ENERGY CREDITS, UH, MAY BE SLASHED.
AND IF THAT'S THE CASE, HOW WILL THAT AFFECT, HOW, HOW THAT, HOW WILL THAT AFFECT YOUR MODEL AND, AND WHERE THE TOWN FALLS IN?
[01:15:02]
YEAH, SO BACK TO THIS, UH, THIS, UH, FINANCIAL HERE, IT WOULD BE, YOU KNOW, $2 A MEGAWATT HOURS, WHAT WE'RE, WE ARE, UM, UM, PROJECTING FOR RE SO IF THAT WENT AWAY, THEN THIS, THIS FORECASTED PRICE WOULD GO TO 56 60.UM, SO THERE'S STILL UNDER THAT, UH, BASED ON THE CURRENT ENERGY MARKET, WE WOULD STILL BE UNDER THAT, UH, MARKET PRICE.
I HAVE A QUESTION, I THINK MORE FOR US INTERNALLY, WHICH IS, UM, I SAW THE CONTRACT MENTION STUFF ABOUT PLANNED MAINTENANCE OUTAGES.
AND MY QUESTION IS JUST KIND OF, JUST OF THE KNOWLEDGE.
SO YOU SWITCH OVER TO ONE OF THE OTHER KINDS, RIGHT? NOT ONE.
SO IT'S NOT LIKE A FULL BLACKOUT THAT WE HAVE TO HAVE DURING THAT TIME.
IT WOULD JUST BE THAT UNIT GOING DOWN.
UM, AND IT'S JUST FOR MAINTENANCE.
THEY TYPICALLY DO THAT IN, IN THE SHOULDER MONTHS WHERE THERE'S NOT A LOT OF LOAD.
SO THAT'S WHERE THAT 90% VALUE OF THEM RUNNING ALL CAN PROBABLY GO BACK TO THAT SLIDE.
IT SHOWS THEM THAT 90% OF BASELINE POWER, SO THAT 92, SO THIS IS THE 90% THAT FALLS INTO MAINTENANCE, WOULD BE THE 10% BABY DOWN.
AND THEN WE JUST, LIKE YOU SAY, WHICHEVER TO ONE OF OUR OTHER, OTHER CARRIERS IN THE, IN THE GROUP.
ANYBODY ELSE HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR PAUL OR CARRIE?
IT'S STILL GONNA HAVE A TRANSMISSION FEE CORRECT.
TO GET IT HERE FROM POINT OF ORIGIN.
HAWAII'S A LITTLE CLOSER TO MICHIGAN, A LITTLE CLOSER TO ILLINOIS, SO MAYBE THAT WILL HELP.
YEAH, YOU GO BACK TO THAT $12, UM, FOR CAPACITY CHARGE.
UM, IF I MAY, ONE THING I, I SKIPPED OVER ON THIS SLIDE.
UM, SO THE ASSUMPTION, UH, $9 A KW O UM, YOU'RE AWARE OF WHAT THE CAPACITY MARKET HAS DONE.
UM, AND, AND I THINK THAT'S AT LEAST ON THE, UM, FIRST PART OF THIS CONTRACT, THAT'S PROBABLY THE CONSERVATIVE NUMBER.
I THINK CAPACITY PRICING MOST LIKELY ARE GONNA GO HIGHER.
BUT ON THE CONGESTION SIDE OF THINGS, THE TRANSMISSION SIDE, WHERE THESE ARE LOCATED, UM, THEY'RE, UM, THEY'RE IN PRETTY GOOD SPOTS.
WHERE THE PRICING IS, IS IT'S HISTORICALLY BEEN HIGHER THAN, UH, THE, THE, UH, A EP DAYTON HUB, WHICH HAS KIND OF THE, THAT'S THE REAL LIQUID POINT IN THE MARKET THAT, UH, WE TEND TO TRANSACT AT.
SO WHAT THAT MEANS IS THAT THERE'S, THERE'S VALUE THERE WHEN IT COMES TO CONGESTION, BECAUSE THESE ARE A HIGHER COST SELLING.
SO YOU'RE SELLING HIGH TO EVERY POINT AND BUYING, BUYING LOWER.
UM, SO WHERE WE'RE GOING WITH THIS IS IF COUNSEL IS IN AGREEMENT WITH THIS, WE NEED TO PUT THE RESOLUTION ON THE JULY 28TH MEETING.
SO IS EVERYBODY OKAY WITH THAT? CAN IT BE ON THE CONSENT
I MEAN, IT DIDN'T COME TO ME FOR REVIEW.
I GUESS PENDING, WE PUT HIM ON CONSENT BEFORE, BUT TOTALLY.
IS IT, 'CAUSE I THINK THE, I THINK, DID I SEE SOMEWHERE THE DEADLINE IS SEPTEMBER 20TH? MM-HMM
SO WE WOULD, I MEAN, IF WE WAITED TILL THE AUGUST, IS THAT GONNA BE A PROBLEM? WOULD YOU RATHER US GET IT DONE IN JULY? IS THAT THE KEY? THERE'S OTHER PEOPLE AFTER THIS, CORRECT? WELL, CORRECT.
SO THERE'S A, THERE'S 40 OTHER MEMBERS, SO WE YEAH, THAT'S WHAT I WAS, THAT'S WHAT I'M TRYING TO SAY.
SO LET'S, IF WE'RE GONNA SHOOT FOR THE JULY 28TH BENCH LANGUAGE, I'M GOOD WITH CONSENT.
I FEEL LIKE, I FEEL LIKE THE MAJORITY OF THE PEOPLE AREN'T GONNA BE, THEY'RE, MOST PEOPLE AREN'T GONNA, WE HAVE TO GO BACK TO THE OPEN MARKET.
YOU AND I DID WITH EXACTLY, EXACTLY.
SO OUR NEW BUSINESS TONIGHT, NEXT UP IS NEW CAR AND BODY WORN POLICE DEPARTMENT.
[01:20:01]
IS GONNA BE HERE AND OF COURSE SHE'S HERE.IF ANYBODY HAS ANY QUESTIONS, THAT'S KIND OF WEIRD TO SEE US ALL, ISN'T IT? YOU CAN'T SEE ME TALK
UM, ITEM FOUR A TONIGHT IS FOR THE PURCHASE OF INCAR AND BODY, BODY-WORN CAMERA SYSTEMS FOR THE POLICE DEPARTMENT.
SO PREVIOUSLY, UH, COUNCIL, COUNCIL APPROVED AN AWARD FOR THE NCAR CAMERA SYSTEMS, UM, IN THE AMOUNT OF
AND THEN LAST MONTH, UM, PB REQUESTED, UH, ANOTHER QUOTE FOR, UM, THE BODY-WORN CAMERA SYSTEM.
AND THEN WE GOT TO LOOKING AT THE PREVIOUS CONTRACT BACK IN 2020 AND SAW THAT THEY WERE COMBINED INTO ONE BUNDLE.
THIS TIME THEY WERE QUOTING IT SEPARATELY.
UH, SO WE WENT BACK TO 'EM, SAW SOME REDUNDANCY IN THE TWO SEPARATE QUOTES, AND WE WENT BACK TO 'EM, ASKED 'EM IF THEY COULD RE-QUOTE IT, BUNDLE IT ALL TOGETHER, SEE WHAT THEY COULD DO.
WE HAVE, WE'VE ACTUALLY WENT BACK TO 'EM A FEW TIMES THIS SESSION.
THE FIRST TIME THEY SAID NO, AND THEY CAN'T DO IT BECAUSE IT WOULD BE LIKE OVER $250,000, IN WHICH CASE WHERE MOTOROLA SOLUTIONS WOULD CHARGE AN ADDITIONAL, UM, SYSTEM INTEGRATION FEE.
I DON'T KNOW HOW MUCH THAT WOULD'VE BEEN, BUT, BUT THEN WE FINALLY WENT BACK TO 'EM, LIKE, LOOK, JUST PRE PLEASE HUMOROUS AND GO BACK TO MOTOR ROLAND.
SO, UM, SO THIS REQUEST IS TO RETRACT THE PREVIOUS APPROVAL FOR THE 160, UM, 2000 AND REAPPROVE, THE NEW QUOTE FOR, UM, 249,000 JUST UNDER THE 250,000 JUST UNDER.
AND IT SAYS IT'S A COST SAVINGS OF 33, ALMOST, ALMOST 34,000 YEP.
SEPARATING OUT PER FOR PURPOSES.
AND DID I READ IN HERE LIKE, THIS IS GONNA BE OBSOLETE IN FIVE YEARS? UH, I DON'T KNOW IF IT'S GONNA BE OBSOLETE IN FIVE YEARS.
THERE'S ALWAYS THAT POTENTIAL WITH TECHNOLOGY.
WHAT, HOW, HOW LONG HAVE WE HAD THESE? SO WE'RE RIGHT AT THE FIVE YEAR MARK THAT, THAT WAS THE PROBLEM WITH THE I THAT'S WHERE I'M HEARING IT.
YOU CAR CAMERA SYSTEM, WE WERE NOT BEING AVAILABLE.
RIGHT? THEY'RE NO LONGER SUPPORTIVE.
I HAVE A QUESTION IN THE WEEDS.
UM, WHICH IS IN THE, IN THE CONTRACT THEY TALKED ABOUT THEY, WELL, AND THEN THEY SAY WE HAVE IT, WE CAN DO OUR OWN SYSTEM LATER.
BUT THEY TALKED ABOUT THE LEADING RECORDS, RIGHT? UM, AND, AND MY QUESTION IS, IS DO WE LIKE FOLLOW, WE FOLLOW OUR OWN SCHEDULE.
I MEAN, I COULD SEE WHERE YOU WOULD LIKE, WHAT, WHAT CAME TO MIND WAS YOU COULD HAVE SOMEBODY WEARING A BODY-WORN CAMERA AND, AND SEE AN INCIDENT.
YOU DON'T THINK YOU NEED TO HANG ON IT, BUT LATER IT BECOMES AN ISSUE.
SO LIKE YOU FOLLOW A STATUTE OF LIMITATIONS.
YOU KNOW, SO WE DO, WE DO PURGE OUR SYSTEM THAT WAY.
WE KEEP THE CLOUD STORAGE AT A MINIMUM.
AND THEN WE ALSO, ANYTHING THAT WILL APPLY WITH UNDER FOUR YEAR REQUESTS, WE, WE WOULD REDACT CERTAIN THINGS.
SO, BUT DO YOU KEEP, BUT YOU DON'T, SO YOU DON'T DELETE, YOU DO, YOU'RE SAYING YOU DO PURGE THE VIDEOS, BUT IT DEPENDS ON THE CERTAIN THINGS WE GOTTA HOLD FOR A CERTAIN TIMELY.
SO YES, WE DO DELETE THOSE BECAUSE WE DON'T WANT TO KEEP THAT SERVICE BASE BECAUSE WE KEEP ADDING TO THAT.
WE'LL HAVE TO, WE'LL INCREASE COSTS EVENTUALLY.
SO OUR THINGS ARE SET TO PURCHASE CERTAIN TIMELINES THROUGHOUT THE, YOU'VE NOT RUN INTO A SITUATION YET WHERE PURCHASE SOMETHING AND YOU WISH YOU HAD IT? NO, NOT YET.
ANY OTHER QUESTIONS? IF, IF NO ONE'S HAS A PROBLEM WITH THIS, I SAY WE'LL PUT IT ON PINK END.
EVERYBODY OKAY WITH THAT? OKAY.
THANKS MICHELLE FOR YOUR PERSISTENCE TOO.
ALL RIGHT, NEXT UP IS THE JOHN MARLOW PLASMA SIGN, AND LIZZIE IS HERE TO, UM, UPDATE US ON THAT.
THANK YOU LIZZIE, FOR, UH, FOR MY REQUEST UPDATES.
SO IN YOUR PACKET IS A FULL MOCKUP OF WHERE THE SIGN WILL GO.
BUT THIS IS A DRAFT OF WHAT THE SIGN COULD LOOK LIKE.
[01:25:02]
WE ARE A LITTLE BIT UP AGAINST IT BECAUSE WE'VE GOTTA GO BEFORE THE BOARD OF ARCHITECTURAL REVIEW.AND I LOVE A GOOD CRUNCHY DEADLINE, WHICH, UH, THE APPLICATION FOR Z BAR IS TOMORROW.
SO, UM, WE STILL HAVE TIME TO TWEAK OUR DRAFT, BUT THEY WANNA MAKE SURE, YOU KNOW, GOING FOR A CERTIFICATE OF APPROPRIATENESS, THEY WANNA MAKE SURE THAT THE FRAME IS CONSISTENT WITH THE THINGS THAT ARE IN THE, UM, IN THAT ZONE ALREADY.
CHARLES, WOULD YOU MIND PULLING UP THE OTHER ONE FOR ME? YEP.
THAT ONE, I THINK THE TABS ARE OPEN.
SO THIS IS A CIVIL WAR TRAIL SIGN THAT'S ALREADY DOWN THERE.
THEY EVEN GAVE US THE SAME COLOR FOR THE FRAME, SO IT ALL MATCHES.
UM, SO OUR SIGN WILL LOOK EXACTLY LIKE THIS.
JUST OUR BOARD WILL BE DIFFERENT, OF COURSE.
UM, WOULD YOU MIND GOING TO THE OTHER TAB FOR ME? CHARLES? CHARLES, YOU GONNA THROW A STEP AT ME? THANK YOU.
SO I HAD A LITTLE FUN IN CANVA AND THIS, IT WOULD BE TURNED JUST A LITTLE BIT.
UM, BUT THIS IS WHERE THE SIGN, THIS IS WHERE WE'RE PROPOSING IT GOES NOW.
THIS IS WHAT WE TALKED ABOUT IN THE FALL.
I JUST BROUGHT A MORE FUN GRAPHIC THIS TIME.
UM, SO WE'RE GONNA BRICK THE GRASSY AREA.
WE'VE ALREADY TALKED TO PUBLIC WORKS.
THEY HAVE THE MATERIALS ON HAND THAT WE NEED.
WE'RE UTILIZING THE SAME FONT SIZE AND ALL OF THE SUGGESTIONS.
WE TALKED TO OUR FRIENDS AT CIVIL WAR TRAILS WHO'VE ALREADY BEEN THROUGH ALL THE ADA A COMPLIANCE, SO WE'RE NOT REINVENTING THE WHEEL.
UM, AND THEN TINA WAS SO KIND JUST TO PULL TOGETHER ALL THESE PHOTOS FOR ME, WHICH WERE AWESOME.
UM, I THINK A LOT OF PEOPLE HAVE NO IDEA THAT THE ROOF OF THE GABO IS ACTUALLY COPPER BECAUSE IT'S PATINA.
SO IT'S GREEN, BUT IT'S ACTUALLY COPPER.
UM, SO I WANTED TO GET YOUR THOUGHTS ON, ON WHAT WE HAVE AND THE LANGUAGE NEEDS TO BE TRIMMED DOWN A LITTLE BIT.
UM, BUT I, I LIKED THE PHOTOS.
I THOUGHT THE, THE PHOTOS REALLY TOLD THE STORY.
SO WHAT ARE YOUR THOUGHTS? COULD WE MAKE THE PHOTOS SMALLER SO THAT WE CAN KEEP ALL THE WORDS OR NO? WE CAN, YES.
SO THE, THE ACTUAL SIGN WILL BE 24 BY 36, SO IT'S ALMOST DOUBLE WHAT'S IN YOUR HAND, BECAUSE THIS IS AN 11 BY 17 PIECE OF PAPER.
SO IT'S THE SAME SIZE AS THE CIVIL WORK, CORRECT, YES.
TRYING TO KEEP IT AS CONSISTENT AS POSSIBLE SO THAT THE BOARD OF ARCHITECTURE REVIEW DOESN'T THROW STUFF AT ME.
SO THIS IS THE PROPOSED LOCATION YES.
HERE, WHICH I'M MORE IN IT CORRECTLY.
THE CIVIL WAR THING IS BEHIND YOU.
AND SO IF I WERE STANDING AT THIS SIGN, IT WOULD BE BEHIND ME AND TO MY LEFT.
CLOSER TO THE VISITORS, CORRECT.
SO THIS SIGN, SO GAZEBO, THIS SIGN, THE CIVIL WAR TRAILS VISITOR CENTER AS YOU TRAVEL EAST ON, SO YOU BELIEVE THAT WOULD BE MORE VISIBLE THAN TRAINING AND OUT THE CIVIL WAR CENTER? I DO.
UH, AND SO WE HAD TALKED ABOUT TRYING TO FIGURE OUT THE BEST PLACE TO PUT IT, RIGHT.
AND I KIND OF LIKED THE VISUAL OF YOU'RE LOOKING ONTO THE GAZEBO AND THE CONCRETE AREA THAT WAS ALL DESIGNED DURING THAT TIME.
SO A COUPLE OF THESE PICTURES ARE ACTUALLY FROM THAT SPOT.
UM, AND THE ONE WHERE THEY'RE PUTTING THE DOME ON TOP, THAT IS ALMOST THE EXACT SAME SPOT WHERE THAT SIGN WOULD BE.
KINDA SQUINT YOUR EYE AND TIL YOUR HEAD TO THE LEFT, BUT IT'S FAIR.
WAS HE, WAS HE BORN IN FRONT ROYAL? NO, I DON'T BELIEVE SO.
HE WAS A, HE WAS A, UH, SPORTS STAR.
HE GRADUATED, HE WAS WARREN COUNTY.
THE NUMBER, HE HELD THE NUMBER OF ATHLETIC RECORDS THERE.
HE MOVED HERE A HE WAS BEFORE.
MARLOW MOTORS IS OPENED IN 48, I BELIEVE.
I'M ASSUMING THE FAMILY MOVED HERE THEN.
YEAH, THEY, SO MARLOW'S BEEN AROUND 75 YEARS NOW.
70, 70 MORE THAN 75, 77, MAYBE 70, BUT IT ENDED UP, I THINK IT MIGHT BE 77 NOW.
SO I JUST WONDER IF THERE'S ANY PIECE, I MEAN, I MEAN, I KNOW YOU'RE OUTTA LANGUAGE, BUT I MEAN, I LIKE, WHAT I ALSO LIKE ABOUT HIM IS THAT, WELL, I KNEW HE GRADUATED HERE OBVIOUSLY BECAUSE OF THE WORK, BUT HE, YOU KNOW, HE, HE SPENT HIS LIFE HERE.
I MEAN, HE, HE WAS A BUSINESSMAN, SO IT WASN'T JUST, I MEAN, HE SERVED HIS ENTIRE LIFE.
[01:30:01]
SURE.FIT, FIT A PIECE OF THAT IN, IN SOME WAY.
WELL, THE LAST PARAGRAPH SAYS, EVEN AFTER HIS TENURE AS MAYOR, DR.
MARLEY REMAIN DEEPLY INVOLVED IN COMMUNIC WELLBEING AS CRITERIA LEADER OF, ACTUALLY WE LEAVE OUT A PART WHERE HE SAID NO MORE SICK.
BUT I THINK WHAT LIZZIE'S SAYING, WHICH I THINK IS, IS A FAIR THING TO SAY.
LIKE, WE, YOU CAN'T GET IT ALL.
NO, I WAS GONNA SAY, HAVING ATTENDED MR. MARLOW'S FUNERAL, I MEAN, WHICH WAS JUST TAKE LOOK SPEAKER AFTER SPEAKER AFTER SPEAKER LOOKING AT THE ARY ALONE WILL TELL YOU THAT WE CAN'T YEAH, YEAH.
THERE'S NO WAY TO GET IT ALL IN.
BUT I, I THINK IT'S CERTAINLY POSSIBLE TO HAVE A LITTLE MORE COLOR.
WELL, I MEAN, YEAH, I MEAN, I'M NOT GONNA, LIKE I SAID, I'M, I'M NOT, THIS, THIS IS WELL WRITTEN.
AND I ONLY HAVE TO EDIT IN AT ALL
UM, BUT, UM, I WAS ONLY THINKING, I'M ALWAYS THINKING LIKE WHEN, IN TERMS OF PEOPLE, UM, YOUNG PEOPLE, IF THERE WAS ANYBODY SO MOVED, YOU KNOW, THAT WAS READING THIS AND THOUGHT, OH WELL HE HAD TO HAVE COME FROM SOMEWHERE ELSE AND DID THIS.
NO, HE WAS, HE WAS HERE FOR MOST OF HIS LIFE AND THEN ALSO CONTRIBUTED, YOU KNOW, I THINK THAT'S A PER A GOOD THING.
HIS FATHER CAME HERE TO BUILD, UM, HOUSES AROUND AFTER THE, THE, UH, WHEN AEX, WELL ACTUALLY HOUSE BUILDER TO START.
HE WAS A YOUNG WHEN SHE WALKED OUT.
DOES THE LANGUAGE HAVE TO BE THE WAY THAT IT'S GOING TO BE PRESENTED BY TOMORROW'S APPROVAL? THAT'S WHAT I THOUGHT.
I THOUGHT, OH YEAH, THAT'S WHAT, YEAH.
SO YOU JUST THE DESIGN LAYOUT, THE LOCATION.
ALTHOUGH I THINK IT'S WRITTEN VERY WELL.
I DO LOVE ALL THE PICTURES THOUGH.
I THINK THAT'S SO, IT MAKES ME SAD.
I WAS GONNA SAY, AND I MUST SAY THAT SEEING MY KIDS' PICTURE THERE IS, IS VERY ENDEARING TO ME.
HE'S MY FIRST PRINCIPAL AND IS VERY INVOLVED IN, UM, ACTUALLY THAT I STARTED WORKING ON.
THANKS ENOUGH FOR FINDING THE PICTURES.
I GUESS I'M FINE WITH THE LOCATION.
UH, I JUST, UH, I WAS JUST WONDERING, THERE'S REALLY NOTHING, WE, WE DON'T HAVE ANYTHING LIKE AROUND THE, IN THE, IN THE BRICK GAZEBO AREA, ANY PLAQUES OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT EXCEPT BRICKS.
SO I, I THINK THAT THERE ARE A COUPLE OF THE BENCHES THAT HAVE BEEN DEDICATED OVER THE YEARS.
UM, THERE'S THE, THE STONE ITSELF THAT'S ON TOP OF THE TIME CAPSULE IN THE GAZEBO.
UM, BUT BEYOND THAT, I'M NOT AWARE OF ANY OTHER WELL, AND OF COURSE YOU'VE GOT, UM, THE SUNDIAL AND THE STATUE AND, UM, THE, AND THE BACK CORNER THAT HAS BEEN DEDICATED.
UM, SO THERE ARE A COUPLE OF OTHER DEDICATIONS, BUT NOTHING OF QUITE THE SAME SIZE DOWN THERE,
UH, SO I DID HAVE SOMEONE ASK IF WE WERE GONNA DO ANYTHING SPECIAL WITH THE BRICKS, IF FOLKS COULD SPONSOR A BRICK OR SOMETHING AND TO BEGINNING, I DUNNO HOW ANY OF THAT WORKS WERE SPONSORED, CORRECT? YES.
UH, THAT WAS A NUMBER OF YEARS AGO WHEN THEY, UH, REVITALIZED THAT SECTION, I BELIEVE.
SO A LOT OF BUSINESSES DONATED MM-HMM
SO GENERALLY SPEAKING, DO WE FEEL GOOD ABOUT, GOOD ENOUGH ABOUT THIS TO PUT IT FORWARD TO THE BAR? OKAY.
AND JUST FOR COUNSEL'S AWARENESS, THE HOPE IS THAT WE CAN, THAT OUR HOPE IS THAT, UM, THE FRIDAY NIGHT OF, UH, UH, THE FESTIVAL LEAVES, THAT'S WHAT WE TALKED ABOUT.
BEING ABLE TO DEDICATE THAT NIGHT WHILE FOLKS ARE DOWNTOWN, BEING ABLE TO INVITE THE FAMILY.
AND THEN THAT'S, I DON'T, I DON'T KNOW IF YOU, I MEAN, 'CAUSE IT WOULD TAKE THAT LONG TO GET THIS, TO GET THIS ALL CORRECT, THIS DONE, THAT DONE.
UM, UH, I, I DON'T KNOW THAT WE COULD DO IT ANY SOONER IS REALLY, AND THAT, BECAUSE THAT KIND OF IS YET AGAIN ANOTHER LIKE EVENT THAT'S DOWNTOWN AND THE GAZEBO AND THE FOCUS AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
I THINK THAT PEOPLE WOULD BE ABLE TO ENJOY IT.
WE, WE DIDN'T WANNA PICK A DAY WHERE WE COULDN'T, YOU KNOW, THAT WE WANNA BE ABLE TO HAVE THE MOST AMOUNT OF PEOPLE THAT COULD BE THERE AND APPRECIATE IT.
[01:35:01]
RIGHT.SO WE'LL WORK AS DILIGENTLY AS POSSIBLE.
UM, BUT, UH, YOU KNOW, IT'S, THE BAR MEETING ISN'T FOR ANOTHER MONTH, SO WE HAVE TIME TO TWEAK THE DRAFT, BUT WE STILL NEED TO GET APPROVAL FROM THOSE FOLKS.
SO, UM, THIS IS ABSOLUTELY A DRAFT.
I HAVE NOT PUT THIS IN FRONT OF THE MARLOW'S YET.
UM, I, I WOULD LIKE FOR, FOR JOYCE AND EMILY TO HAVE A, HAVE A PEEK AT IT AS WELL.
UM, BUT I WANTED TO BRING IT TO YOU GUYS FIRST.
SO THIS IS, THIS IS WHERE WE'RE WORKING FROM MOVING FORWARD.
ANY QUESTIONS? I LIKE HOW YOU'RE USING THE SAME SIGN RIGHT THERE.
WE'RE GONNA KEEP IT CONSISTENT.
WE HAVE ONE IN FRONT OF THE COURTHOUSE.
PEOPLE WILL RECOGNIZE WHAT THOSE ARE.
THERE'S A REASON THAT THE TRAILS USED THE SAME ONE.
OKAY, SO NEXT UP IS THE RETAINMENT OF THE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT ACCESS GRANT.
SO THE TOWN RECEIVED THE REQUEST FROM, UH, VIRGINIA DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION TO REPAY THE ECONOMIC ACCESS GRANT THAT WAS RELATED TO THE WEST CONNECTOR.
UM, AMOUNT OF REPAYMENT REQUESTED TOTALS OF FIVE $60,582 AND 15 6 CENTS.
UH, THE ORIGINAL AMOUNT OF GRANT WAS $650,000.
UM, BUT, UH, THE TOWN WAS UNABLE TO EXPEND ALL THE FUNDS BECAUSE THE PROJECT WAS UNABLE TO BE COMPLETED.
UH, THE, UH, WE'VE BEEN BUDGETING FOR THIS FOR A FEW YEARS NOW.
UH, WE DO HAVE $650,000 SET ASIDE, UH, FOR THE REPAYMENT.
UM, AND LIKE I SAID, NOW, UH, DEPART THE MOTOR VEHICLES OR DEPARTMENT OF TRANSPORTATION IS REQUESTING A REPAYMENT, UH, REPAYMENT OF, UH, $452,000, UH, BY APRIL 8TH, 2025.
BUT THE REQUEST DIDN'T COME IN UNTIL JUNE 9TH
SO A LITTLE, LITTLE LATE ON THE REQUEST COMING IN.
UM, AND THEN THE, UH, REMAINING 113,000 BY, UH, DECEMBER 7TH, 2025, UM, UH, WOULD, UH, UH, RECOMMEND TO GO AHEAD AND REPAY, UH, THE FULL, UH, $565,000 SO THE TOWN CAN STOP THE BUILDING, UH, THE, UH, LETTER OF CREDIT, UH, TO THE TEAM, UH, ROUGHLY $5,000 A YEAR, UH, THAT WE'RE HOLDING ON THE PROJECT.
WELL, I THINK WE ALL KNOW THAT COUNCIL'S WORKING ON NEGOTIATING THAT AMOUNT.
I'M, I'M ASSUMING EVERYONE READ THAT, IF I CAN JUST READ FROM THE LETTER FROM THE COMMISSIONER BRIDGE PLEASE.
UPON RECEIPT OF THIS LETTER, THE TOWN HAS REQUESTED TO, TO PROVIDE THE DEPARTMENT WITH THE FOLLOWING INFORMATION WITHIN 45 DAYS.
THE DATE OF THE LETTER IS, IS JUNE NINE.
UH, FIRST BULLET POINT, DOCUMENTATION OF PENDING ELIGIBLE CAPITAL OUTLAY, WHICH WOULD SATISFY ANY PART OF THE OUTSTANDING CAPITAL OUTLAY REQUIREMENT.
IF DOCUMENTATION EXISTS, PLEASE PROVIDE THE POTENTIAL, UH, BUSINESS NAME, AMOUNT OF POTENTIAL CAPITAL OUTLAY AND DATE WHEN THE CAPITAL OUTLAY DOCUMENTATION WILL BE AVAILABLE.
OF COURSE, EVERYONE AT THE TABLE IS WELL AWARE THAT, UH, WITH THE SITUATION AT THE EDA DOCUMENTATION IS NOT AVAILABLE, UM, THROUGH THE ACTIONS OF THE FORMER DIRECTOR.
UM, UH, THAT SAID, UH, UH, THERE IS AN ARGUMENT TO BE MADE.
I MEAN, THE ROAD IS BUILT AND THERE'S A BUILDING SITTING THERE ON THE IT FEDERAL SITE.
UM, AND SO, YES, UM, I'M TRYING, I'M ATTEMPTING TO EXHAUST ANY AVENUE FOR, UH, IF NOT AVOIDING TOTAL REPAYMENT, AVOIDING SOME OF THE REPAYMENT.
UM, THE LETTER, UM, REFERS TO, UM, TO, TO CONTACT TERRY SHORT, UH, WITH VDO.
AND, UM, AND I'M WORKING WITH HIM.
YOU'VE HAD ALL THE CORRESPONDENCE, AT LEAST IN THE ONE THAT I'VE READ.
UM, AND THEN OF COURSE, SECOND BULLET POINT IS IF NO PENDING ELIGIBLE CAPITAL A OUTLAY EXISTS, PROVIDE THE DATE ON WHICH THE DEPARTMENT CAN EXPECT TO RECEIVE THE INITIAL REPAYMENT.
WELL, WILL THE $5,000 THING COME AROUND AGAIN? UM, SO THE, UH,
UM, AND, UM, UH, RIGHT NOW, UH, IF WE
[01:40:01]
WERE TO REPAY IT THIS MONTH, UH, IT WOULD BE ROUGHLY $1,200 AND, UH, THEY'LL TAKE ANOTHER $200 EACH MONTH THEREAFTER.SO THEY'LL, THEY'LL, THEY WILL PRORATE IT FOR US.
UM, BUT YEAH, IT HAS THE, UH, COME BACK UP FOR RENEWAL.
I THINK IT'S WELL WORTH LETTING GEORGE CONTINUE DOWN THIS PATH AND SEE IF HE CAN'T, IF NOT ELIMINATE IT, AT LEAST REDUCE IT.
I MEAN, WE HAVE THE MONEY SAVED UP TO PAY IT, BUT, UM, WE'D CERTAINLY, CERTAINLY A BUILDING OUT THERE, WE CAN BUILD A ROAD OUT THERE AND MR. SAUNA, HOW NO ONE CAN REALLY PREDICT.
LIKE WHEN YOU'D BE ABLE TO, BECAUSE, BECAUSE THE BALL IS NOW IN YOUR COURT.
SEND ACTUALLY IN MR. SHORT'S COURT.
SO HE ALREADY HAS EVERYTHING THAT'S RIGHT.
AND HE NEEDS, WE'RE JUST WAITING TO HEAR BACK FROM HIM.
AND IS HE GONNA BE AT THAT MEETING? I'M GONNA BE UP TOMORROW.
UM, YOU NEED A BUYER FOR, IN WINCHESTER TO HAVE A CAP, A PROJECTED CAPITAL OUTLAY.
DON'T, DON'T YOU NEED A BUYER TO HAVE A PROJECTED CAPITAL OUTLET.
WELL, THERE'S, FOR ONE THING, THERE'S A TAX ASSESSMENT.
WELL, THE COUNTY HAS ASSESSED, THERE'S A BUILDING SITTING THERE AND THERE'S AN ASSESSED VALUE OF THE BUILDING, UH, 2.25 MILLION.
I WAS JUST GONNA SAY, YOU, YOU, EVEN THOUGH IT'S ASSESSED AT THAT, YOU DON'T KNOW WHAT THE REAL MARKET VALUE IS.
PRESUMABLY HIGHER MARKET VALUES ARE ALWAYS HIGHER THAN ASSESSED VALUES ARE.
THIS IS A DIFFERENT SITUATION, BUT REALLY ALL WE ALL, WHAT NEEDS TO HAPPEN IS FOR THEM TO BELIEVE THAT WE INVESTED IN, YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN, I, I GET THE ASSESS VALUE IN THIS AND ALL THAT STUFF, BUT I'M JUST SAYING THE FACTS ARE, THERE IS A BUILDING THERE.
SO, UM, WE, SO SO THE LETTER, DID HE GET, HOW LONG DO THEY HAVE ANY, IS THERE ANY KINDA LIKE, YOU KNOW HOW LIKE WE HAVE THINGS WHEN STUFF COMES TO US, WE HAVE TO HAVE IT DONE IN 60 DAYS OR WHATEVER.
DO THEY, IS THERE A D WHEN THEY HAVE TO RESPOND? THEY'RE, THEY'RE ASKING FOR ACTION WITHIN 45 DAYS OF RECEIPT RECEIPT WITH SOMEWHERE AROUND MID-JUNE.
SO BY THE END OF THIS MEETING, WHICH WOULD, WHICH WOULD ALLOW THIS EFFORT TO PLAY OUT BETWEEN NOW AND THE NEXT AND THE REGULAR MEETING.
AND THERE WAS SOMETHING I, I REMEMBER READING ABOUT OCCUPANCY AND THERE WAS STORM WATER MANAGE.
THERE, THERE WERE, THERE WERE QUESTIONS ABOUT THE STATUS OF THE CO OKAY.
BUT THAT IS NOT A TERM IN THE GRANT THAT ANYWHERE THAT ICE OKAY.
SO THE BALL'S LY BACK, BUT WE'RE TRYING, WE'RE TRYING TO ADDRESS THAT HIS BALL, THE BALL BALLS BACK INTO TERRY'S HANDS TO NOW COME BACK AND SAY THIS, THIS, THIS, OR, OKAY.
SO WORST CASE SCENARIO, WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO PAY THE $1,200 TO RENEW IT IF WE DON'T, AND THEN IT'S ABOUT A COUPLE HUNDRED DOLLARS A MONTH.
SO EVEN IF WE, EVEN IF WE HEAR SOMETHING IN THE MONTH OF JULY, YAY.
HEY, WE CAN TAKE ACTION ON IT IN AUGUST.
LIKE IF THEY SAY YOU'RE NOT GONNA GET ANYTHING OFF OF THE OFF OF THIS, I THINK THE ACTION WOULD BE AT THE END OF THIS MONTH.
SO WE WILL KNOW SOMETHING BY THEN.
BECAUSE, BECAUSE IT'S UH, WHAT'S 14TH BE THE 28TH? THAT'S PRETTY LATE IN JULY.
WE WERE, WE WERE SAYING THAT MOVE FORWARD WITH JULY 28TH AS BEING THE ACTION ITEM.
UNLESS WE'RE ABLE TO GET OTHER NEWS BEFORE THEN WE'LL LET COUNCIL KNOW, BUT WE SHOULD PLAN TO TAKE SOME ACTION.
YEAH, SENATOR, THEY WANTED US TO MAKE PAYMENT BY APRIL AND WE DIDN'T GET THE LETTER UNTIL JUNE.
I WOULD NOT HOLD MY BREATH, BUT I GUESS WE HAVE SOME OPTIMISTS, BUT WE STILL HAVE TO HAVE THIS LINE OF CREDIT NO MATTER WHAT AND, UM, UNTIL, UNTIL THE AMOUNTS REPAID OR THE, UH, OR THE ALLEGATIONS ARE SATISFIED.
UM, BUT WE HAVE TO HOLD THIS LINE A LETTER OF CREDIT.
GOOD NEWS IS WE HAVE THE MONEY.
THE BETTER NEWS MAY BE THAT WE CAN REDUCE THE AMOUNT WE HAVE TO PAY.
MAYBE IT'LL BE REDUCED BY $1,200, THEN IT'LL PAY FOR THIS LETTER OF CREDIT.
I MEAN, IF I'M READING THIS CORRECT AND WHAT BJ SAID, YEAH, IT'S UH, 565 5 82 56.
HOWEVER, WE'RE HOPING TO GET IT FURTHER CORRECT.
ANY DOLLARS BETTER THAN HAVE TO PAY THE AMOUNT.
SO WE'LL KNOW BY THE END OF JULY WHAT'S GONNA HAPPEN.
WHAT WE THE OTHER BJ AND GET THIS OFF YOUR PLATE BECAUSE I KNOW FOR FIVE YEARS WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT IT.
[01:45:01]
UM, ALL RIGHT, NEXT UP IS THE ALLEY VACATION REQUEST AND MR. PETTY IS GOING TO BE PRESENTING THAT, CORRECT? YEAH.UM, AND JUST FOR CLARIFICATION, WE WOULD HAVE THAT ON FOR BUS, A BUSINESS ITEM FOR THE 28TH AS THEY LIKELY MAYBE DISCUSSION ONE WAY OR ANOTHER, RIGHT? YEP.
UM, SORRY, JUST SO I DIDN'T, THIS HAS COME BEFORE COUNSEL TWICE NOW.
SO I BELIEVE EVERYBODY AT THE TABLE IS AWARE OF THIS PARTICULAR LOCATION, UM, APPLICANT AND RIGHT AWAY.
SO THIS WAS A APPROVED IN 2024 AND THERE WAS A CONDITION THAT UM, IF THE CONDITIONS OF THE ORDINANCE WERE NOT SATISFIED, WHICH ONE WAS THAT IT WOULD BE CLOSED IN 120 DAYS, IT WOULD BE CANCELED.
AND THAT HAPPENED JULY 23RD, 2024.
THE APPLICANT HAS RESUBMITTED THE SAME, IT'S THE SAME ALLEY VACATION THERE AT NORTH ROW EXTENDED, UM, KIND OF IN LINE WITH 16TH STREET.
AND SO ALL THE DOCUMENTATION IS THERE.
I WILL SAY SINCE LAST YEAR, YOU KNOW, IN MY TIME HERE, UH, WE'VE BEEN REVIEWING ALLEYS AS A WHOLE.
UM, YOU DID ALSO GET AN INSPECTION REPORT FROM PUBLIC WORKS LAST YEAR ABOUT ALL OF OUR UNIMPROVED ALLEYS, UH, AND DISCUSSION WITH PUBLIC WORKS.
AND, YOU KNOW, STAFF IS, THESE ARE KIND OF VALUABLE.
WE ARE IN THE UTILITY BUSINESS AND OF HALF OF THESE UNAPPROVED DAS, THEY ACTUALLY DO CONTAIN PUBLIC UTILITIES.
AND ONE ISSUE THAT WE HAVE SEEN UP HERE ON THE OTHER SIDE ON 16TH STREET, WHICH WE'RE STILL LOOKING AT ADDRESSING, IS SOME DRAINAGE ISSUES.
WE'RE GETTING A LOT OF THOSE COMPLAINTS.
AND WHILE IT'S NOT BEEN DETERMINED, UM, BECAUSE THIS IS AN ALLEY AND IT IS STILL TOWN PROPERTY, UM, IT MIGHT BE A MITIGATION FACTOR FOR THAT PARTICULAR DRAINAGE ISSUE BECAUSE THESE ALLEYS DO ALIGN WITH MAPPED STREETS.
YOU KNOW, THEY'VE BECOME LOGICAL CONNECTIONS BETWEEN ONE STREET AND ANOTHER.
SO AS WE LOOK AT UTILITIES OR DRAINAGE, WHETHER IT'S SEWER OR WATER, ELECTRIC, I CAN'T PREDICT THE FUTURE 10, 15 YEARS DOWN THE ROAD, BUT THESE MAKE LOGICAL CONNECTIONS BETWEEN, UH, STREETS, NEIGHBORHOODS, DEVELOPMENTS AS THEY OCCUR.
AND SO AS LONG AS WE'RE IN THE UTILITY BUSINESS, WHETHER IT'S THIS ALLEY OR ANY OTHER ALLEY IN MY CURRENT POSITION AND WE'RE REVIEWING OUR INSPECTIONS, I THINK WE STILL HAVE SOME WORK TO DO AND SOME DUE DILIGENCE ON ALL OF OUR UNIMPROVED ALLEYS AT THIS TIME.
I JUST FEEL LIKE ALL OF THESE ALLEYS ARE KIND OF IMPORTANT AS WE LOOK AT PUBLIC UTILITY STANDPOINT.
SO I JUST WANTED TO EXPRESS THAT FROM MY PERSPECTIVE AS I'M REVIEWING THESE THINGS.
UM, OTHERWISE, YOU KNOW, WHAT WOULD BE RECOMMENDED TONIGHT IS THAT COUNSEL EITHER DECIDE TO MOVE THIS APPLICATION FORWARD FOR A PUBLIC HEARING, WHICH WOULD BE IN AUGUST, UM, BECAUSE WE HAVE TO HAVE 30 DAYS NOTICE, UM, FOR THOSE PUBLIC HEARINGS IT SAYS STATE'S 30 DAYS.
SO WE WOULD SEND THAT TO THE JOINT OR COUNSEL IT WAS LISTED AS AN ACTION ITEM CAN TAKE ACTION TO NOT PROCEED FORWARD.
UM, BUT THAT IS WHAT'S BEFORE YOU HERE TONIGHT.
YOU HAVE ANY QUESTIONS I CAN ANSWER THROUGH GEORGE, THE HISTORY OF THIS ONE.
YOU CAN ANSWER QUESTIONS HEARING AS TO WHETHER YOU THINK SO.
LIKE FOR THE, THE ONES THAT HAVE UTILITIES, IS IT BETTER TO MAYBE NOT CLEAN THEM UP THIS MUCH SO THAT YOU DON'T HAVE TRAFFIC THROUGH THE UTILITY AREA OR THE HAZARD TO, TO WORKERS WHO ARE GOING IN
I'VE JUST SEEN THE POWERPOINT.
I THINK THAT ONES THAT HAVE UTILITIES, IT LOOKED LIKE SOME OF THE IMAGES I SAW.
'CAUSE THEY'RE, I THINK THERE WERE 47 UNIMPROVED ALLEY, IF I REMEMBER THE PRESENTATION.
23 OF THEM HAD UTILITY CONNECTIONS.
SO, AND THEN SOME WERE JUST THOROUGHFARES, PEOPLE WERE ACTUALLY STILL USING THEM.
MAYBE IT WAS PARTLY OR IN FULL.
UM, I THINK IT WOULD JUST DEPEND ON THE UTILITY.
SOME I SAW WERE ELECTRIC LINES.
SOME LOOKED LIKE THEY HAD MANHOLE COVERS SITTING UP THREE OR FOUR FEET OUT OF 'EM.
SO IT WOULD JUST DEPEND ON WHAT THE UTILITY WAS.
OBVIOUSLY AS THE UTILITY PROVIDER, SOMETIMES IT'S ELECTRICAL, WE WANT TO KEEP IT CLEAR SO WE DON'T HAVE VEGETATION.
UM, BUT OBVIOUSLY THAT ALSO ALLOWS US ACCESS TO THESE.
SO I THINK IT'S JUST A CASE BY CASE.
BUT I THINK ALSO IT IS IMPORTANT THAT MYSELF AND THE STAFF, WE GO BACK TO LOOK AT THAT REPORT AND UNDERSTAND WHAT WE'RE DOING WITH THESE UNAPPROVED ALLEYS.
BECAUSE AS OF LAST WEEK WE HAD ANOTHER ONE THAT WE WERE DEALING WITH WITH VEGETATION.
AND AT THE SAME ALLEY, THE OTHER SIDE WAS USED AS A THOROUGHFARE.
[01:50:01]
GONNA KEEP 'EM, WE NEED TO FIGURE OUT WHAT WE'RE DOING WITH 'EM, BUT ALSO AS THE LOCAL UTILITY PROVIDER ALSO UNDERSTAND HOW VALUABLE THAT THESE CAN BE FOR US IN THE FUTURE.I'M SORRY, JUDGE, IS THERE STORM WATER DRAINS IN HERE AND IN THIS ALLEY? THERE'S CURRENTLY NOTHING IN THIS ALLEY THAT I'M AWARE OF.
I DON'T FAIR DAYLIGHTS RIGHT TO TURN THE DAYLIGHTS.
YEAH, SO AS THE, I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE CORNER IS, BUT IT'S AT 16TH VIRGINIA.
UM, IT, IT DAYLIGHTS THERE AND IT COMES, THERE'S A PIPE THAT GOES UNDER THE ROAD AND ALL DAYLIGHTS RIGHT THERE.
AND THEN SHE FLOWS DOWN TOWARDS THE RIVERSIDE NORTH.
BUT IT'S, BUT IT'S ALSO WHERE THERE HAVE BEEN SOME DRAINAGE ISSUES WITH THE PROPERTY OWNER THAT, THAT, UM, ON THAT STREET THAT I KNOW I MET WITH AND, AND, UM, FORMER TOWN MANAGER MET WITH.
UM, ROBBIE, I THINK YOU'RE PART OF THAT MEETING TOO.
AND I MET WITH LORD FAIRFAX SOIL THE WATER LAST WEEK.
'CAUSE THEY HAVE SOME PROGRAMS THAT THIS MIGHT BE A CANDIDATE FOR THAT COULD SLOW THAT, THAT DALE DISCHARGE AREA OUT, UM, OF POSSIBLE EXAMPLES THAT WE CAN USE.
AND BECAUSE THERE IS, YOU KNOW, LAND THERE, UM, WE COULD POTENTIALLY DO THAT.
UH, BUT THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE WOULD'VE TO LOOK AT AND PLAN FOR AND UNDERSTAND A LITTLE BETTER.
BUT UNLIKE SOME OF THE OTHER DRAINAGE ISSUES THAT WE HAVE THAT ARE ON PRIVATE PROPERTY, THIS IS ONE THAT ACTUALLY DOES IT STARTED TO ON, YOU KNOW, UH, AREA THAT WE MIGHT BE ABLE TO MITIGATE SOME OF THAT.
SO THAT'S WHY THIS WAS KIND OF IMPORTANT.
AND WE HAVE PUBLIC WORKS SCOPE AND TAKE A LOOK.
SO COUNSEL ONE, UM, IN TALKING TO MR. PETTY, UM, IN, IN PREPARING FOR TONIGHT'S AGENDA, UM, HE, HE HAS, YOU KNOW, OVER THE LAST, SINCE 2020 JANUARY, 2020 WHEN I'VE JOINED COUNSEL ALLEY, VACATIONS HAVE COME UP, YOU KNOW, OVER TIME.
UM, AND MR. PETTY'S, UM, MR. PETTY'S ASSESSMENT AND, AND TALKING ABOUT APPROACHING OUR UNIMPROVED ALLEYS THAT ARE LAND THAT BELONGS TO THE TOWN.
YOU KNOW, IT, HE HAD A DIFFERENT, A LITTLE BIT OF A DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVE THAN SOME PRIOR THINGS.
SO I SAID MAKE SURE THAT HE SHARED THAT WITH COUNSEL.
UM, SO, UM, AND, AND IBEL ANYWAY, COUNSEL'S PREROGATIVE ON EITHER MOVING THIS TO A PUBLIC HEARING OR, UM, I MAKING THE DECISION NOW THAT THEY DON'T WANT TO VACATE, UM, OR NOT THAT MAKING THAT DECISION NOW THAT YOU DON'T WANT TO VACATE, BUT JUST, YOU KNOW, DO YOU WANNA MOVE THIS FORWARD OR NOT? THAT'S REALLY WHAT I'M TRYING AT
WELL, I WILL SAY THIS, UH, YOU KNOW, WITH ALL THE TORRENTIAL RANGES WE'VE, WE'VE BEEN HAVING, AND AS SOON AS I GET OUTTA THIS MEETING TONIGHT, I'M GONNA BE, UH, I GOT WORK TO DO.
AND, UH, SO, UH, THE TOPOGRAPHY OF THAT PARTICULAR AREA, UH, I, I CAN SEE WHERE THAT ALLEY HAS VALUE IN TERMS OF, OF, UH, UH, A STORM, STORM WATER SYSTEM, UH, BEING, BEING USED IF NOTHING ELSE, UH, TO ULTIMATELY AT SOME POINT IMPROVING NORTH ROYAL AVENUE ON THE DRAINAGE DOWN NORTH ROYAL AVENUE.
UM, UH, SO THAT THERE'S NOT FLOODING ON THE OTHER PROPERTY, PROPERTY LINES.
I MEAN, TO DO NOTHING TO ME IS WE GIVE AWAY THAT ALLEY OR WE'RE BASICALLY GIVING AWAY CONTROL.
SO, UH, THAT'S, HEY, ANYBODY ELSE INPUT ON WHAT TO DO? COUNCILMAN RAPPAPORT'S, GIVEN HIS ASSESSMENT OF THE SITUATION? I'D LIKE TO HEAR FROM EVERY, AT LEAST EVERYBODY WHAT THEY WANNA DO SO WE CAN I FEEL COUNT.
I, I FEEL LIKE COUNCIL RAPPAPORT, UM, YOU KNOW, I MEAN IS THIS HAS BEEN DONE HOW MANY TIMES NOW, THIS WOULD BEING THE THIRD TIME OR SECOND TIME THAT THEY, THEY'VE COME TO US, UH, BUT I THINK WE'RE WILLING TO LOOK, I THINK WE NEED TO DENY IT AND I THINK WE NEED TO LOOK AT THE ALLEY ABOUT THE ABATEMENT OF, YOU KNOW, STORM WATER DOWN THE ROAD OR EVEN IMPROVEMENTS OR
[01:55:01]
WHATEVER IT TAKES.I DON'T KNOW THAT I THINK I, I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THIS ISN'T LIKE WHERE WE'RE TAKING A VOTE TONIGHT, SO IT'S NOT LIKE I DENY IT NOT FORWARD.
YEAH, IT'S WHETHER OR NOT YOU WANNA MOVE FOR YOU.
AND IS A DENY, I JUST THINK OF DENY AS LIKE A VOTE.
I'M LIKE, I JUST WANNA ADDRESS THE ELEPHANT IN THE ROOM.
UM, I WASN'T SURE IF I WAS GONNA SPEAK ON THIS OR NOT, BUT, UM, I CAN, I HAVE NO INVESTMENT IN THIS AND IT DOESN'T AFFECT ME, BUT I THINK PIGGYBACKING OFF OF EXACTLY WHAT COUNCILMAN
IT'S THE FOURTH TIME IT'S BEEN PRESENTED TO THE TOWN.
THE FIRST TIME THE TOWN MANAGER DID NOT BRING IT TO COUNSEL.
AND I THINK GIVEN THE CIRCUMSTANCES THAT WE VOTED TO APPROVE THE VACATION AND, YOU KNOW, THERE ARE LEGAL OPINIONS AND OTHER OPINIONS OF THE CONDITIONS OF THE SECOND REQUEST AND WHY THEY WERE UNABLE TO BE MET WITHIN THE 120 DAY TIME LIMIT.
UM, AND THE TOWN WAS NOT INNOCENT IN THAT TIME LIMIT, WHICH I THINK WE WERE ALL VERY AWARE OF.
UM, I THINK IT'S CRUEL NOT TO MOVE IT FORWARD AFTER THIS.
EVERYBODY SITTING HERE TONIGHT IS WHO APPROVED IT.
SO TO NOT EVEN MOVE IT FORWARD AND HAVE PUBLIC INPUT, I THINK SEEMS A LITTLE CRUEL.
I CAN, JOE, CAN YOU REPEAT WHAT YOU SAID ABOUT, YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT THE, UM, THERE'S NO UTILITIES THERE AND YOU DID, YOU, DID I HEAR YOU CORRECTLY IN THAT, UM, THEY, THERE WERE SOME ISSUES THERE THAT MAYBE ALLEVIATED IF WE GOT RID OF THE ALLEY? I HEAR THAT.
HAVE YOU ON THE PLAT THAT'S ATTACHED IN YOUR PACKET THERE ON THE LEFT SIDE OF THE DRAWING WHERE IT'S VIRGINIA AVENUE AND SIXTH STREET MM-HMM
YOU'LL SEE, UH, IT'S TWO CIRCLES AND A DASH LINE THAT IS THE UNDERGROUND DRAINAGE.
AND THAT'S WHERE IT COMES OUT AT, RIGHT AT THAT CORNER AND WATER SPILLS OUT INTO THE ALLEY AND THEN YOU'LL SEE THAT THERE IS A PROPERTY OWNER, MR. GREEN.
IT, IT KIND OF SLOPES DOWN TOWARDS HIM AND THEN THE, AS THE WATER COMES OUT, IT, IT, IT KIND OF SHEET FLOWS DOWN THAT, THAT CURRENTLY THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT.
AND SO IF WE HAD THIS, WE WOULD'VE THE AVAILABILITY TO POSSIBLY DO SOMETHING THERE, UM, TO MITIGATE THAT.
UM, YOU KNOW, THAT'S SOMETHING TOO AGAIN THAT WE WOULD'VE TO LOOK AT.
OTHERWISE THERE'S NO OTHER UTILITIES, UH, CURRENTLY IN THERE.
UM, BUT IT'S NOT TO SAY THERE COULDN'T BE A NEED IN THE FUTURE.
SO MAYOR CORPORAL, YOU SAID THAT, UM, THE CURRENT TOWN MANAGER HAS A DIFFERENT OPINION THAN FORMER TOWN MANAGERS.
WHERE I WAS GOING, WHEN I LOST TRAIN OF MY THOUGHT TO PIGGYBACK OFF COUNCILMAN PEELER'S COMMENTS, WE SHOULD, OH, AND COUNCILMAN RAPORT FOR THAT MATTER, WE SHOULD USE THIS FOR ROYAL AVENUE AND FOR ABATEMENT.
HAS THAT THOUGHT NEVER OCCURRED PRIOR TO NOW NO OTHER TOWN MANAGER OR STAFF HAS EVER CONSIDERED? WHAT I MEANT BY THAT WAS THAT, AND YOU KNOW, YOU'VE BEEN SITTING HERE WITH PEOPLE, GOOD PART OF IT.
SOME TOWN MANAGERS I FEEL LIKE IN THE PAST HAVE, HAVE LOOKED AT THE ALLEYS AS THEY'RE JUST PIECES OF, IF NO ONE'S USING 'EM, IF IT'S ON THERE, WE, YOU KNOW, WE WE VACATE THEM AND WE GET A COUPLE THOUSAND FOR 'EM OR WHATEVER IT IS AND MOVE ON.
I JUST MEANT THAT IT WAS A DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVE FROM MR. PETTY.
THAT WAS A DIFFERENT PERSPECTIVE THAT HE SHARED WITH ME.
MY QUESTION, ISN'T THAT MY QUESTION? I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE OTHERS THOUGHT.
MY QUESTION WAS NOT THE OTHER COUNCIL MEMBERS STAFF.
WE HAVE GOTTEN FEEDBACK, ME SITTING RIGHT HERE BESIDE YOU FROM MULTIPLE STAFF MEMBERS AND MR. GREEN'S PROPERTY.
THAT'S BEEN YEARS THAT THAT'S BEEN AN ISSUE.
SO MY QUESTION, I GUESS IS THERE WAS NEVER ANY STAFF RECOMMENDATION IN ANY OF THESE PACKETS.
WHEN YOU GO BACK AND LOOK TO THAT, THAT WAS PART OF THE ISSUE.
SO I GUESS THAT'S WHY I'M CONFUSED.
AND I KNOW LIKE IN OUR COUNCIL RETREAT WE TALKED ABOUT BEING TRANSPARENT AND I FEEL LIKE WE'RE NOT BEING TRANSPARENT IN THIS MOMENT WHEN WE TALK ABOUT THIS EXACT SETTING COUNCIL WHO APPROVED SOMETHING AND THEN NOW I WON'T EVEN MOVE IT FORWARD TO GET PUBLIC INPUT AGAIN FOR THE THIRD TIME.
WELL, MAYBE I'M AN IDIOT HERE.
I DON'T KNOW, BUT I JUST GOTTA, I DON'T RECALL SEEING THIS LAST YEAR.
I THOUGHT, ARE YOU GOT, ARE WE GETTING CONFUSED WITH THE OTHER HIKE ONE ON THE OTHER SIDE? NO, THIS ONE, SAME ONE.
[02:00:01]
THE HOSPITAL.UM, THE TITLE COMPANY HAS EMAILS WITH STAMPED RECEIPTS THAT WERE FORWARDED TO US BY A LEGAL TEAM.
'CAUSE I WAS LIKE, IS THIS THE SAME ONE? A COUPLE CAME IN BECAUSE THIS LOOKS, I DON'T RECALL SEEING IT LIKE THIS.
YEAH, THIS CLAP, THIS LOOKS DIFFERENT TO ME.
SO IT'S BEEN THE LAST COUPLE YEARS.
TWO, I WAS GONNA SAY THAT THE, THE, THE, UM, THE DRAINAGE ISSUE WITH THAT ONE PIECE OF PROPERTY.
THAT'S WHY WHEN YOU SAID IT HAD BEEN MANY YEARS, ACTUALLY IT WASN'T, IT'S JUST BEEN, I THINK IN TWO YEARS AGO THAT THE TOWN PUT THAT IN.
AND I JUST KNOW IT WAS JUST LAST YEAR THAT I, IT'S ACTUALLY LAST, I WANNA SAY BEING THE SUMMER THAT I MET WITH HIM.
I'M SAYING THE CHANGE IN THE DRAINAGE THERE THAT WAS PUT IN BY THE TOWN HAS BEEN IN THE LAST FEW YEARS AND IT WAS DURING, AND THAT'S WHEN HE, I WAS JUST SAYING IT WASN'T LIKE A, IT WAS JUST THE BEGINNING OF LAST SUMMER WE MET WITH HIM.
AND IT'S, UH, IT'S NOT ENTIRELY RESOLVED YET, RIGHT? NO, I I ANTICIPATED THAT.
WELL, YOU KNOW, THERE'S ADDITIONAL, YOU KNOW, AS, AS, UM, TOWN MANAGER PETTY, UH, ALLUDED TO, I MEAN, WE MAY WANT TO RUN POWER LINES ACROSS, UM, ADDITIONAL POWER LINES ACROSS, UH, TO NORTH ROYAL AVENUE.
I MEAN, UH, SHEOR AVENUE, I'M SORRY, SHEOR AVENUE.
THERE MAY BE A REASON TO DO THAT IN THE FUTURE.
UM, YOU KNOW, YOU CAN'T PREDICT THE FUTURE.
YOU CAN'T PREDICT THAT WHOLE AREA WHAT IT'S GOING TO BE DOWN THE ROAD.
SO GIVING UP ALLEYS, UM, I, I'M NOT, I'M, I'M NOT A, A, A REAL FAN GIVING UP ALLEYS.
THERE, THERE WERE REASONS WHY I VOTED FOR IT LAST TIME, BUT I'M, WE'RE NOT GONNA GET INTO THAT TONIGHT.
BUT, UM, I, I, I, I'M JUST SAYING THAT THAT ALLEY HAS SOME VALUE.
UM, I BELIEVE IT HAS SOME VALUE TO THE TOWN.
THE LAST THING I'LL NOTE IS WE'VE NEVER SOLD AN ALLEY FOR THE COUPLE THOUSAND DOLLARS, LIKE WAS MENTIONED EARLIER.
WE'VE DISCUSSED ALLEYS FOR LIABILITY ISSUES, WHICH THIS ONE PRESENTS AS WELL.
UM, THEY'RE NOT TAKEN CARE OF.
THEY'RE NOT MAINTAINED BY THE TOWN AS THEY'RE SUPPOSED TO BE.
PEOPLE DRIVE FOUR WHEELERS THROUGH THEM, TREES FALL OVER ON PEOPLE'S FENCES AND HOUSES FROM THE TOWN NOT TAKING CARE OF THEM.
SO LIABILITY HAS BEEN THE DRIVING FACTOR, NOT MONEY.
WHEN ACTUALLY WE GOT THE OFFER AFTER COUNSEL APPROVED THIS, WE WERE ALL IN SHOCK AT WHAT THE ASSESSED VALUE.
THIS ONE WAS, I DON'T THINK WE'VE EVER LOOKED AT A VACATION AND THOUGHT IT WAS $20,000.
IT WAS 40,000 ORIGINALLY THE FIRST TIME.
THIS IS THE FOURTH TIME, NOT THREE, THREE.
I'M TRYING TO THINK HOW MANY, ALL THE ONLY ONE WE CONSIDERED FOR MONEY WAS BECAUSE IT WAS GONNA GO TO THE YOUTH.
THE PERSON OFFERED TO MAKE A CONTRIBUTION THROUGH THEIR ALLEY VACATION TO GO TOWARDS REACHING OUT.
NOW WAS ONE THE DISCUSSIONS FOR FINANCIAL AND WE DIDN'T END UP SELLING DIFFERENT, WE DIDN'T END UP SELLING THAT ONE.
I JUST, MELISSA, YOU ASKED, I'M TAKING NOTE IF YOU ASKED JOE TO REPEAT WHAT HE SAID, WAYNE, GLEN, JOSH, MELISSA ALREADY HEARD FROM YOU.
WAYNE, I'M SORRY I'M POINTING TO YOU.
I WAS JUST, I JUST NEED TO KNOW FIVE MINUTES AFTER NINE.
I KNOW Y'ALL USUALLY HOLD ME TO THE, HOLD ME TO THE FIRE HERE.
SO DO YOU, DOES WHAT YOU ALL WANT TO DO, UM, OR REGARDING THIS? WELL, I MEAN WE, WE ALREADY APPROVED THIS LAST YEAR OR TWICE.
SO MY, MY THOUGHTS WON'T, HAVEN'T CHANGED.
I'M, THERE'S NOTHING, NOTHING I CAN SEE NOW THAT I REALIZE, YOU KNOW, THANKS WE FOR WAYNE FOR POINTING THAT OUT.
THAT IS THE CORRECT DWELLING THAT I WAS THINKING OR DOING BE, BUT YEAH, BUT MY THOUGHTS ON THIS HASN'T CHANGED SINCE LAST YEAR.
SO I VOTED FOR IT LAST YEAR AND UNLESS THE PUBLIC HEARING, I MEAN, I THINK I, I, AGAIN, YOU KNOW, WE WEREN'T A HUNDRED PERCENT INNOCENT IN THAT, THAT PROCEDURAL EFFORT LAST YEAR.
SO, UM, I THINK WE SHOULD WE OWE IT TO PUT IT TO THE BULK HEARING? YES.
JUST MAKE A POINT IN ORDER, AND GEORGE CAN'T CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, UM, IF THE COUNSEL DID NOT WANT TO PURSUE THAT, SHE WOULD TAKE A MOTION TO NOT MOVE IT.
IF YOU WANT TO MOVE FORWARD, NO ACTION WOULD BE
[02:05:01]
YOU JUST DIRECT STAFF AND WE WILL, WE'LL, JUST WITH THE CONSENT TO MOVE FORWARD, WE'LL GO AHEAD AND SET EVERYTHING IN MOTION FOR THE PUBLIC HEARING TO BE LETTERS OUT.PUBLIC HEARING WOULD BE IN AUGUST.
GLENN, DO YOU HAVE A, UH, LET, LEMME LET ME CHIME IN.
THE, THE RATIONALE FOR, FOR BEING LABELED AS AN ACTION ITEM IS SIMPLY THAT COUNSEL'S WELL AWARE OF THE FACTS.
COUNSEL'S BEEN THROUGH IT TWICE.
SO BEFORE ADVANCING IT DOWN THE ROAD, IT SEEMED APPROPRIATE IN THIS PARTICULAR CASE TO MAKE SURE THAT COUNSEL'S ON BOARD, IF NOT A MOTION TO DENY.
NOW, THE FIRST TIME THERE WASN'T ANY PROBLEMS. THEY JUST NEVER FINISHED THE DEAL.
I WAS GONNA SAY THE FIRST TIME THEY COUNSEL DID IT, IT JUST NEVER HAPPENED.
THE SECOND TIME WAS THE ONE THAT WAS CONFUSED.
THERE WAS A DIFFERENT SITUATION.
I JUST NEED TO, WELL, I MEAN, I VOTED ALONG WITH EVERYONE ELSE TO APPROVE THIS LAST YEAR THAT WAS UNDER JOE WALTZ AND NOW WE HAVE MR. PETTY HERE.
AND I THINK HE HAS A DIFFERENT IDEA ABOUT THE USEFULNESS OF THESE ALLEYS PLUS OUR RESPONSIBILITIES FOR MAINTAINING THEM.
I LOOKED AT AN ALLEY WITH THEM THE OTHER DAY FOR 12, 12, 13, 1200 BLOCK OVER ANY, ANYWAY, IT'S A TYPICAL OVERGROWN ALLEY.
UH, A TREE HAD FALLEN OVER ON A FENCE AND UH, I THINK GEORGE WADE IN AND GAVE US AN OPINION OF ABOUT IF WE DON'T MAINTAIN OUR PROPERTY.
SO I KNOW JOE WALTZ DID A STUDY OF THE ALLEYS WITH SOME RECOMMENDATIONS.
IT TOOK A LOT LONGER THAN WE INITIALLY THOUGHT.
UM, BUT ALSO THINKING WE HAVE A NEW TOWN MANAGER NOW AND HE MAY HAVE DIFFERENT IDEAS TALKING, TALKING WITH THE UTILITY PROVIDERS.
I RESPECT HIS OPINION, SO I WAS CHANGING MY MIND AT THIS POINT AND, UH, NOT VOTE TO APPROVE IT BASED ON HIS RECOMMENDATION.
MOVE IT FORWARD TO A PUBLIC HEARING, IS WHAT WE'RE MAKING THE DECISION ON TONIGHT.
YOU MOVE TO THE PUBLIC HEARING.
THE ACTION ITEM IS DECIDE TO MOVE IT FORWARD OR DENY MOVING MR. MOTION, MR. SON OR MR. PETTY JUST SAID IF WE WANTED TO TAKE ACTION, THERE HAS TO BE A MOTION MADE TONIGHT.
NOT THAT THE ONLY ACTION WOULD BE TO DENY.
I'M SAYING THERE'S NO ACTION TO APPROVE.
THE VACATION REQUEST, IT'S TO LET THE PUBLIC HAVE AN INPUT ACTION WOULD BE TO DENY GIVEN THAT, AGAIN, THE ARGUMENT BEING THE COUNCIL'S ALREADY AWARE OF ALL THE INFORMATION.
I STILL, I VALUE JOE'S OPINION ON, ON VALUE OF ALL'S.
UM, BUT I ALSO, UH, AM A BIG PROPONENT OF PRIVATE PROPERTY VERSUS I I DON'T LIKE GOVERNMENT DOING PROPERTY AS, AS MINIMAL AS POSSIBLE.
SO, AND I THINK THAT WE'VE ALREADY APPROVED THIS.
I THINK WE NEED TO MOVE FORWARD WITH THIS.
I TAKE NO ACTION BECAUSE RIGHT.
SO MY, MY WE'RE MOVING FORWARD.
I DON'T NEED TO MAKE ANY MOTION OR ACTION.
SO, BUT, UH, I DO THINK THAT IT IS, I DON'T, I DON'T THINK WE SHOULD HANG ON TO THINGS UNLESS WE HAVE A REAL, YOU KNOW, IN, IN THE NEXT FIVE YEARS WE'RE GONNA DO SOMETHING WITH IT.
I DON'T THINK WE JUST HANG ON FOR THE PROSPECT OF, YOU KNOW, THAT WE MIGHT PUT UTILITY LINES IN OR WE MIGHT DO THIS OR WE MIGHT DO THAT.
IF WE DON'T HAVE A CLEAR PLAN AND, AND CAN START ON IT IN THE NEXT FIVE YEARS, THEN WE'LL WE'LL JUST LEAVE IT TO PRIVATE PROPERTY, WHICH IS ALSO WHAT EASEMENTS ARE FOR.
HOW MANY TIMES HAS THE TOWN HAD, I JUST RAN INTO IT RECENTLY.
THE TOWN HAS SEWAGE LINES THAT THEY DIDN'T HAVE AN EASEMENT FOR ON PRIVATE PROPERTY.
LIKE WE HEARD FROM, FROM ENERGY SERVICES THAT THERE ARE NO PLANS TO HAVE POWER LINES PUT HERE.
MY OPINION IS THIS, NO MATTER WHAT ALLEY IT IS, IT'S THEIR RIGHT TO HAVE THEIR APPLICATION BROUGHT FORWARD.
AND IT'S WHETHER WE HAVE NEW INFORMATION, IN MY OPINION AND HOW I VOTE CHANGES MATTERS OR NOT.
I THINK PICKING AND CHOOSING WHAT APPLICATIONS WE ALLOW TO PROCEED IS A REALLY SLIPPERY SLOPE WE'RE MOVING INTO.
IT'S, AND IT GOES AGAINST WHAT COUNSEL PUT IN THEIR COUNCIL INITIATIVES MISSION AND VALUES, DESPITE WHO THE MANAGER IS OF TRANSPARENCY, DOING GOOD BUSINESS PRACTICES, ALLOWING AN APPLICATION TO MOVE FORWARD AND HAVE ITS DUE PROCESS IS ALL THAT IS.
[02:10:01]
WITH A PUBLIC HEARING ON THIS, IT WOULD BE AUGUST.I ALREADY, I ALREADY WROTE IT.
YOU WELL, WELL I I'M WE'RE GOING.
I'M BEING FULLY ADVISED OF THE PREMISES.
DENY THE APPLICATION OF ERIN HEIGHT FOR THE VACATION OF TOWN ALLEYWAY, UH, A ABUTTING 1516 NORTH ROYAL AVENUE.
IS THERE ANY DISCUSSION
REPEAT THAT
I WOULD JUST ADD THAT WHEN YOU VACATE AN ALLEY, WE DEALT WITH THIS WITH A VERY CONTENTIOUS DIFFERENT ALLEY VACATION.
WE GET TO PICK AND CHOOSE WHAT PORTION OF THE ALLEY IS NECESSARY, WHAT PORTION WE VACATE, HOW MUCH WE VACATE IT FOR.
THIS JUST BEGINS A NEGOTIATION PROCESS.
SO IF AT THE END OF 16TH STREET AND VIRGINIA AVENUE THERE'S SOME ABATEMENT PROTOCOL, WE COULD LEAVE THAT PORTION OF THE ALLEY.
THIS COUNCIL IS VERY WELL AWARE THAT PORTION OF THE ALLEY IS NOT THE ISSUE.
ALL RIGHT, SO, WELL YOU GOTTA DO A VOTE, MS. PRESLEY SECOND.
SO WE'RE GONNA HOLD A PUBLIC HEARING IN AUGUST TO GET THE PUBLIC'S INPUT.
UM, THE OTHER THING THAT I THINK IS IMPORTANT ABOUT THE PUBLIC INPUT IS THAT EVERY ONE OF THE PROPERTY OWNERS THAT WILL BE AFFECTED BY THIS WILL GET A LETTER.
UM, SO WE'LL PAY FOR ALL THAT AGAIN.
AND UM, SO THEY'LL ALL GET A LETTER ABOUT THIS AND THEY'LL HAVE AN OPPORTUNITY TO COME AND SPEAK.
I DO KNOW THAT, UM, I KNOW ONE OF THE NEIGHBORS AFTER THE LAST TIME THAT WAS, UM, A CONCERN HE SHARED THAT HE DIDN'T THINK THAT, HE DIDN'T REALIZE BY THE TIME HE GOT THE LETTER HE DIDN'T SHOW UP AND HAD A CONCERN.
AND I KNOW IN THE PAST THIS COUNSEL HAS DONE, UM, LIKE HAD A REVIEW REVIEWING COMMITTEE OR WHATEVER.
THE THING IS, WE'VE ALREADY DONE THE REVIEWING COMMITTEE AT LEAST ONCE I THINK.
OR DID WE EVER, DID WE I NEVER SENT 'EM OUT ONCE.
MAKE SURE WE'LL MAKE SURE EVERYTHING'S DONE PROPERTY.
IF WE HAVE TO DO THE VIEWERS IS UP TO COUNCIL, RIGHT? NO, I HAVE, I UNDERSTAND.
BUT I'M JUST SAYING THAT IN THE PAST AT THE PUBLIC HEARING, UM, THAT'S WHEN COUNSEL MADE A DECISION DEPENDING ON WHAT THE PEOPLE WERE SAYING BECAUSE I KNOW THAT ON THESE ALLEY VACATIONS SOMETIMES THE PEOPLE THAT ACTUALLY ARE NEAR IT WE'LL COME AND SHARE THINGS THAT MAYBE WE WEREN'T AWARE OF.
SO WE'LL HAVE TO SEE WHAT THEY WANT TO SEE WHAT THE PUBLIC HEARING SAYS.
WELL, I HAVE A COUPLE OF CONCERNS ABOUT THE APPLICATION.
HE, BUT AARON HEKE IS NOT THE SOLE OWNER.
NUMBER TWO, PREVIOUSLY IT INVOLVED A SECOND PARCEL THAT WAS IN TRUSTS.
FURTHER DOWN, FARTHER DOWN THE ALLEY.
IT'S NOT CLEAR FROM THE APPLICATION IF THAT'S STILL IN PLAY.
IF SO, THE TRUSTEE NEEDS TO JOIN THE APPLICATION FOR THAT PARCEL.
AND THAT'S THE ONE I'M ASSUMING IS N DASH F JUNK AND HEIGHT? CORRECT.
SO, SO CAN, BUT THAT NEEDS TO BE CLEANED UP.
SO WHO, SO WHO HANDLE THE APPLICATION IS PLANNING AND ZONING.
SO WE'LL HAVE PLANNING AND ZONING CONTACT THE APPLICANT AND LET THEM KNOW TO JOIN THE, ALL THE DIFFERENT THINGS ANY ABIDING PROPERTY OWNER CAN APPLY FOR AN ALLEY VACATION.
IT DOESN'T SAY THAT IT HAS TO BE EVERYONE ON THE FEED.
IF THE PROPERTY DOES IT SPEC SPECIFY THAT IN TOWN CODE BECAUSE JUST LIKE THE OWNER IS THE OWNER.
BUT THEY HAVE, SO WHO IS THE OWNER? THEY HAVE, THEY'RE BOTH, EITHER ONE OF THEM COULD DO EITHER THING.
NO, I COULD TAKE OUT A SECOND LIEN ON MY HOME DESPITE IT BEING A MINE AND MY HUSBAND WITHOUT THE OTHER PERSON SIGNING.
THIS IS WHAT I DO FOR A LIVING.
YOU HAVE EQUAL AMOUNT OWNERSHIP, YOU HAVE EQUAL AMOUNT.
SO I DO HOME EQUITY LINES FOR ONE AND OUT THE OTHER.
ALL THE, THE TITLE OWNER HAS TO ENCUMBER THE PROPERTY BY SIGNING THE DEED OF TRUST.
IF ONE OF THEM IS A TITLE OWNER.
I THIS IS CO-OWNED HUSBAND AND WIFE.
SO GET WITH STAFF TO FIGURE OUT THE APPLICATION.
BUT, BUT IT DOES NEED TO BE DONE SO THAT WE CAN HAVE THE PUBLIC HEARING ALL IT SEEMS LIKE WE SHOULDN'T HAVE TAKEN ACTION
[02:15:01]
ON AN ITEM THAT WASN'T DONE UP TO STANDARD, BUT THAT YEAH.DO THEY, I MEAN, DOES THAT HAVE TO RESTART THE PROCESS IF THE APPLICATION IS NOT, IT JUST WAS PRESENTED TO COUNCIL COUNCIL ONE WAY AND IT WASN'T IN ACTION TAKEN.
ALRIGHT, SO THAT'S, SO WE'RE DONE WITH THAT.
THAT'S GONNA TAKE CARE OF THAT PART.
UM, THE ONLY OTHER THING THAT I'M GONNA ADD, IT'S NOT GEN ITEMS FOR COUNCIL'S KNOWLEDGE IS THAT THURSDAY NIGHT WE WERE SUPPOSED TO BE HAVING A LIAISON MEETING AND IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING, I'VE NOT GOTTEN A CALL YET, BUT I DID RECEIVE AN EMAIL THAT THE COUNTY IS GONNA CANCEL THAT.
UM, SO, SO NOBODY NEEDS TO TUNE IN.
UM, I LOOK FORWARD TO HEARING.
I I, IT DIDN'T SAY POSTPONE, IT SAID CANCEL.
SO I DON'T REALLY KNOW IF WE'RE GONNA POSTPONE IT, RESCHEDULE IT.
UM, I, IT WOULD BE MY PREFERENCE THAT WE RESCHEDULE IT BECAUSE WE HAD QUITE A FEW ITEMS ON THERE THAT WERE OF IMPORTANCE TO THIS COUNCIL THAT NEEDS TO BE DISCUSSED WITH THE COUNTY.
SO HOPEFULLY, UM, HOPEFULLY I'LL HEAR FROM UH, THEIR CHAIR TO RESCHEDULE IT AND I'LL MAKE SURE NO, I'LL MAKE SURE THAT YOU'RE AVAILABLE TO RESCHEDULE IT AND NO, NOTHING ELSE WAS ADDED WAS CORRECTLY SENT THE AGENDA OVER TODAY AND UM, AND YEAH, SO THE COUNTY ADDED NOTHING TO THE TOWN COUNTY LIAISON MEETING AGENDA FOR THE PUBLIC AND THE PEOPLE HERE TONIGHT TO BE AWARE.
IT WAS ONLY THE TOWN'S ITEMS, WHICH IS WHAT HAPPENED THE LAST LIAISON MEETING THAT YOU AND I ATTENDED AS WELL? NO, WE LAST MEETING WE HAD OH YEAH, YOU'RE RIGHT.
WE WERE THE LAST SUMMER WE THAT WE CAN, THEY CANCELED THE ONE IN JAN JULY LAST.
WE WERE THE ONLY ONE MOVING FORWARD ITEMS TO DISCUSS JOINTLY WITH THE COUNTY.
HE'S NOT ENGAGING IN THAT, BUT, BUT THE ITEMS THAT WE HAD WERE DEFINITELY TOWN, COUNTY.
IT WASN'T LIKE IT WAS JUST US.
THE, THE THINGS WE WANTED DISCUSS, WE NEEDED TO DISCUSS.
YES, MR. COUNSELOR WITH MY CONCERN IS THE, UM, AND IT IS ONE OF THE ITEMS THAT IN THE CASE SPRINGS PROPERTY AND HOW THEY MAY BE MOVING FORWARD THAT MAY SOMEHOW ENCUMBER OUR PROPERTY.
I'M, I'M NOT A SURVEY PERSON, BUT I MEAN THEY OWN A STRIP.
WE OWN SOME TOGETHER AND WE OWN SOME BY OURSELVES.
SO I'VE JUST HEARD THE DISCUSSIONS PUTTING IN AN ENTRANCE AND YES, I THINK WE NEED TO HAVE SOME SAY IN THAT BECAUSE ACCESS TO OUR PROPERTY, I, I DON'T THINK IT CAN JUST UNILATERALLY THEY CAN MAKE A DECISION ON A PIECE OF PROPERTY THAT WE HAVE TOGETHER.
I'M, I'M HOPEFULLY I'M GOING TO HEAR FROM THE CHAIRMAN 'CAUSE I, WHAT, WHAT HAPPENED, IT WAS EXPRESSED THAT THE KEN COUNTY WANTED TO HAVE THEIR STAFF HAVE MORE TIME TO DO SOME RESEARCH, WHICH USUALLY AT THE LIAISON MEETING IT'S MORE JUST, HERE'S THE TOPIC, LET'S DISCUSS.
NOPE, NO ACTIONS ARE EVER TAKEN AT THE LIAISON MEETING.
BUT REGARDLESS, THEY MAYBE WANTED THEIR STAFF TO RESEARCH SOME THINGS.
I HAVEN'T, I I I'M WAITING FOR THE CHAIRMAN TO CONTACT ME.
UM, AND I HAVEN'T HEARD FROM ANYBODY TONIGHT, BUT WHEN I DO, MY PLAN IS TO SAY IF NOTHING ELSE, THAT ITEM NEEDS TO HAPPEN ASAP, UM, BECAUSE OF, OF SOME OF THE, UM, THINGS THAT YOU JUST SHARED.
AND, YOU KNOW, WORST COMES TO WORST, EVERY COUNCIL MEMBER CAN ALWAYS SHOW UP TO A BOARD OF SUPERVISORS MEETING AND SPEAK DURING THE PUBLIC COMMENTS ABOUT WE NEED, WE NEED, WE NEED TO HAVE A CONVERSATION ABOUT PROPERTY THAT THAT IS.
SO, YOU KNOW, OR PARCELS COUNTY OWNS ONE, WHICH IS WHERE THEY'RE POSSIBLY THINKING ABOUT, UM, YOU ALLOWING A PUBLIC GROUP TO USE TOWN OWNS ONE AND THE TOWN AND COUNTY OWNED TWO PARCELS TOGETHER.
AND THAT'S REALLY WAS AN ITEM THAT WAS, YOU KNOW, WE JUST WANTED, I I I KNEW IT WAS ON ENGINE.
I SAW THE AGENDA, BUT NOW I'M VERY CONCERNED THAT THEY'RE PERHAPS MOVING FORWARD WITH SOMETHING THAT DOESN'T, DOESN'T HAVE IMPLICATIONS TO THE TENANT.
AND THE SUMMARY THAT WENT TODAY, UM, TO THE COUNTY AND ACTUALLY WAS RELEASED TO THE PUBLIC.
SO ANYBODY CAN SEE THAT THE SUMMARY ABOUT THAT PARTICULAR ITEM, UM, PROVIDED A LOT OF INFORMATION.
SO I'M NOT REALLY SURE WHAT NEEDED TO BE RESEARCHED, BUT MAYBE THAT WASN'T THE ITEM.
I I'M, I'M JUST AS, UM, SURPRISED AS YOU ARE THAT, THAT WE'RE NOT GONNA HAVE A THURSDAY NIGHT.
I'LL HAVE A THURSDAY NIGHT FREE, BUT I'M HOPEFUL THAT WE CAN RESCHEDULE IT BECAUSE I DON'T WANNA WAIT TILL OCTOBER.
I DO, I THINK WE'D BE REMISS NOT TO
[02:20:01]
DISCUSS AT A LIAISON MEETING LAST YEAR AS WELL.UM, THEY THREW OUT THE IDEA OF WELL YOU CAN BUY OUR PARCEL.
WHEN WE WERE DISCUSSING, EXPLORING OUR OPTIONS FOR THE CASE SPRINGS AND BY JOKINGLY, NOT ON BEHALF OF COUNSEL, SAID, WELL WE'D BE INTERESTED IN THAT.
AND THE TOWN MANAGER AT THE TIME WAS LIKE, THAT'S A GREAT IDEA.
AND THEY SAID THEY DIDN'T WANT THE LAND.
SO NOW BRI NOT TO BE INCLUDED IN DISCUSSION WITH US IS WILD OTHER THAN THE PARTIAL EXPERIENCE ON, I MEAN, IS THAT THE BEST USE OF THE LAND AND IT, DOES IT ENCUMBER THE USE OF THE JOINT PROPERTY AND DOES IT GIVE US ACCESS TO IT? DOES IT MEET THEIR PLANNING COMMISSIONS ENTRY CORRIDOR OR, AND AGAIN, THESE ARE ALL THINGS THAT I WAS HOPEFUL THAT WE WOULD GET TO DISCUSS ON THURSDAY NIGHT.
AND I PROMISE YOU THAT I WILL TRY MY VERY BEST TO MAKE SURE THAT THE, THAT WE GET A MEETING THAT WE, I MEAN WELL WE, IT'S PART OF OUR, YOU KNOW, THE LIAISON MEETINGS ARE PART OF, UM, THE TOWN AND COUNTY'S EXPECTATIONS.
SO IT'S NOT LIKE WE, UM, IT'S, YOU KNOW, IT'S, THERE'S A PROCEDURE TO IT.
SO HOPEFULLY WE'RE GONNA, HOPEFULLY WE WILL GET ONE IN MAYBE MAYBE THEY WANTED TO HAVE A LITTLE BIT OF TIME TO LOOK OVER ALL THOSE ITEMS. IT'S, I MEAN THERE WERE NOT, AND THEY WERE HEAVY.
THOSE WEREN'T THE ONLY THINGS THOUGH THAT NEEDED TO BE DISCUSSED THAT THE FARM USE OF THE FARM IS REALLY IMPORTANT TOO.
WHETHER OR NOT WE'RE GONNA DO TIPPING FEES OR WHETHER OR NOT WE'RE GONNA CHARGE.
AND AGAIN, I DON'T WANNA WAIT TILL OCTOBER BECAUSE THEN WE'VE GONE ANOTHER THREE MONTHS WITHOUT, THEN WE NEED TO, UM, IF THEY WON'T DISCUSS IT, THEN WE NEED TO MAKE A DECISION FOR YEAH.
THAT, THAT THEY'RE NOT OPTION ONE OF REDUCING THE TIPPING FEES AND WE JUST PUT COSTS IN IT, IMPLEMENT IT AND LET YEAH.
I WOULD JUST LIKE TO END IT FOR MY COMMENTS REGARDING THIS, THAT THIS IS AN ELECTION CYCLE FOR THE COUNTY AND THE TOWN AND COUNTY HAS WORKED TIRELESSLY, ESPECIALLY SINCE THE EDA TRAGEDY AND DEBACLE IN THIS COMMUNITY TO WORK TOGETHER FOR THE BETTERMENT OF THE PEOPLE OF FRONT OIL AND WARREN COUNTY.
AND I HOPE THOSE PEOPLE WHO WILL WATCH THIS MEETING OR READ THE ARTICLE OR HEAR ABOUT TONIGHT'S MEETING, KNOW THAT THIS IS A BLATANT, UM, OPPORTUNITY FOR THE COUNTY TO NOT PARTICIPATE.
NOT ONLY ARE THEY CANCELING, WE, WE DON'T KNOW ABOUT POSTPONING, BUT THIS IS THE SECOND LIAISON MEETING IN A ROW THAT THE TOWN AND THE COUNCIL ARE THE ONLY ONES WHO TOOK THE TIME AND THE ENERGY TO ADD ITEMS TO THAT AGENDA TO DISCUSS FOR THE BETTERMENT OF OUR COMMUNITY.