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I'M GONNA CALL THE REGULAR TOWN COUNCIL WORK SESSION FOR[Town Council Work Session on March 10, 2025.]
MONDAY, MARCH 10TH TO ORDER MS. PRESLEY, CAN WE DO A ROLL CALL? MAYOR RELL HERE.SO OUR FIRST, UM, ITEM TONIGHT IS A PRESENTATION BY BDOT AND IT'S, SORRY, TAKE A SECOND ANALYSIS OF ROYAL LANE AND JOHN MARSHALL HIGHWAY REQUESTED FOR CONTINUED DISCUSSION OF A REQUEST FOR A SPECIAL USE PERMIT FOR MULTIFAMILY APARTMENTS AND AN OFFICE BUILDING OFF ROYAL LANE FROM PAN ASSOCIATES.
I KNOW YOU'RE GONNA PROBABLY HEAD US OFF AND THEN AND INTRODUCE THOSE THAT ARE JOINING US.
THE FIRST I QUICKLY RECAP THE APPLICATION AND THEN I'LL GO OVER THE, UM, SUGGESTIONS FROM
UM, OKAY, SO THIS, THIS IS A SPECIAL USE PERMIT APPLICATION.
THIS IS FOR A 36 UNIT TOTAL, UM, APARTMENT COMPLEX.
SO THERE'LL BE THREE BUILDINGS, UM, AND EACH ONE WILL HAVE, UH, 12 UNITS IN IT.
THE PROPERTY IS ZONED C ONE, SO BY RIGHT, THIS IS FOR COMMERCIAL USES.
SO THE REASON THERE'S AN SEP IS BECAUSE THEY'RE REQUESTING APARTMENTS ON THE GROUND FLOOR AND, UM, THERE'S MORE YOU THREE THEM.
SO THE, UM, PROJECT SITE, IF YOU REMEMBER, IS OFF, UH, IS THAT THE END OF ROYAL LANE, WHICH IS OFF OF JOHN MARSHALL.
UM, AND THEN WE HAVE A, UH, I GUESS THAT'S REED MOUNT ROAD, UM, EXTENSION THAT'S PARTIALLY THERE BUT IS NOT BUILT TO LET SEE, NOT DRIVE.
LAUREN, CAN YOU JUST POINT TO THAT? SO, I MEAN, FOR OUR KNOWLEDGE, JUST TO MAKE SURE, SO THERE IS SOME SEMBLANCE OF A, A ROAD HERE.
UM, IT IS, I I, TO MY KNOWLEDGE, IT'S NOT COMPLETE AND IT'S CERTAINLY NOT BUILT TO ANY STANDARDS, UM, THAT WE WOULD ALLOW THE PUBLIC TO USE.
AND IT WOULD, IT WOULD COME IN BEHIND THE, WHAT IS LIKE THE, THE SHOPPING CENTER THERE, RIGHT? YES.
SO HERE'S THE SHOPPING CENTER, HERE'S THE PROJECT SITE.
UM, AND THIS IS IN THE COMPREHENSIVE PLAN.
SO IT'S LIKE ON THAT, YOU KNOW, FOUR PAGE TABLE WE HAVE OF PROPOSED TRANSPORTATION IMPROVEMENTS, THIS IS ITEM NUMBER 12 AND IT WOULD BE AN EXTENSION COME ALL THE WAY THROUGH HERE AND CONNECT INTO, ACTUALLY INTO THIS SITE, WHICH WOULD THEN CONNECT ROYAL LANE TO, UM, REMOUNT ROAD.
IS THAT SQUARE THERE, THE BOWLING ALLEY? I BELIEVE SO, YES.
THERE'S NOT HAVE BEEN A COST ESTIMATE AT ALL.
IT'S A LITTLE BIT ABOVE THE BOWLING.
YEAH, THAT'S WHAT I WAS THINKING.
I THINK THIS IS THE BOWL'S THAT IS YEAH, THAT'S WHAT I WAS THINKING.
IT'S JUST BEHIND THE BOWLING ALLEY.
SO WHAT'S THIS SPACE THAT, SO OUR COMP PLAN, THIS IS CALLING, I THINK THIS IS THE LOCATION OF THE ROAD.
IT, IT KIND OF TRAVERSES OUR, UH, THE TOWN'S PROPERTY HERE AND THEN IT WOULD CONNECT INTO THIS PIECE.
P WE CAN'T SEE THE WATER TREATMENT PLANT THERE.
IT WOULD BE FURTHER, NO, THE WATER TREATMENT PLANT WOULD BE FURTHER.
YEAH, BUT WE HAD SOMEBODY SPEAK THAT THOUGHT THERE WAS A ROAD THERE, SO YEAH, IT IS THERE, THERE, IT'S NOT AN ACTUAL ROAD.
IT DOESN'T GO ALL THE WAY THROUGH.
CAN YOU GO BACK PLEASE? SO WHERE, SO COMES OUT BETWEEN THE TWO HOUSES WHERE, WHERE THE WALL FINGER WAS AND THEN IT KIND OF COMES THIS WAY AND I'M NOT, I'M NOT SURE WHAT THIS IS.
THE REST OF THAT ISN'T AN ACTUAL ROAD.
CAN I JUST ASK ON SOME, SORRY, MY POINT, SO BECAUSE THESE TWO ARE HOUSES HERE, SO THIS RIGHT HERE.
AND THAT'S THE BACK OF SOMETHING THERE.
SO THIS RIGHT HERE IS, I'M ASSUMING IT'S LIKE DIRT, SOME GRAVEL, RIGHT? IT'S NOT AND IT'S NOT, IS IT PRIVATE? PROBABLY THAT'S NOT, THAT'S IS IT? IT'S JUST STONE.
IT GOES BACK PAST THE SUBSTATION.
AND IT KIND OF CURVES AND GOES AROUND.
BUT IT'S, BUT IT IS NOT PAVED OR TAR AND SHIP OR ANYTHING RIGHT NOW.
I JUST WANTED TO MAKE SURE WE ALL WE'RE UNDERSTANDING.
PEOPLE CAN'T GO DRIVING BACK THERE.
NO, WE CERTAINLY DON'T TO GET TO THEIR HOUSE, BUT NOT DEAD ENDS RIGHT THERE.
SO AS THE CONSTITUENTS ADJUSTED THAT THEY USE THAT FOR AN ENTRY TO THE PROJECT SITE, IT IS NOT A ROAD THAT PEOPLE CAN JUST DRIVE THROUGH RIGHT NOW.
SO THIS IS THE INITIAL KIND OF ROUGH
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CONCEPT THAT WAS SUBMITTED BY THE APPLICANT.SO, UM, SEE IF I, THIS IS IT WITHOUT THE TOPO.
UM, SO ESSENTIALLY THEY'VE RESERVED THIS RIGHT OF WAY ALL THE WAY TO THE EDGE OF THE PARCEL.
SO YOU CAN SEE THEY WOULD HAVE THEIR CUL-DE-SAC THAT HELPS WITH EMERGENCY VEHICLE ACCESS.
IT'S GOT THE PROPER TURNING RADIUS, UM, TO ALLOW EASY ENTRY INTO THE PARKING LOT.
BUT THIS RESERVATION OF RIGHT OF WAY WOULD ALLOW THE EXTENSION TO COME AND CONNECT TO THAT OTHER ROAD.
UM, DO YOU KNOW HOW FAR THAT IS? I MEAN IT'S PROBABLY NOT THE SCALE, BUT I WAS JUST WONDERING IF YOU KNEW IT WOULD BE THE SCALE AND WHAT THEY SUBMITTED.
BUT I'VE GOT NO WAY OF JUDGING IT HERE.
UM, BUT THIS JUST SHOWS YOU THE GENERAL CONCEPT.
SO YOU'VE GOT THE THREE STRUCTURES AND THEN THE PARKING IN THE CENTER.
UM, I WANT YOU TO POINT ROW LANE.
WE ALL THE WAY UP THE JOHN MARSHALL, RIGHT? YEP.
AND WHERE'S THE DAYCARE? THE DAYCARE? UM, I BELIEVE IT'S RIGHT HERE.
SHOULD BE RIGHT? YES, IT SHOULD BE RIGHT THERE.
AND BEYOND WHERE THOSE APARTMENTS ARE GOING THAT WAY TOWARDS JOHN MARSHALL, THOSE ARE HOUSES? YES.
YEAH, THERE'S LIKE AND THERE HOUSES ON THIS SIDE? YEAH, THAT'S SIDE.
SO WHEN WE HAD THE PLANNING COMMISSION, PUBLIC HEARING, THE PLANNING COMMISSION RECOMMENDED APPROVAL, UM, BUT THEY HAD, UH, THE PUBLIC CAME OUT AND KIND OF SPOKE AGAINST THE, UM, TRAFFIC ISSUES AT THE INTERSECTION.
SO THERE IS A PERCEIVED PROBLEM.
I WILL PREFACE THIS PRESENTATION WITH, WE DID NOT STUDY THE LEVEL OF SERVICE AT THIS INTERSECTION.
THE TRAFFIC IMPACT ANALYSIS THAT WAS SUBMITTED WAS NOT A REQUIREMENT OF THIS SUP AND IT WAS 10 PLUS YEARS OLD APPROXIMATELY.
UM, BUT THE DATA THAT WE'VE NOW PULLED FROM 2023, AND THIS IS JUST STRAIGHT OFF THE VDOT WEBSITE AS OF RIGHT NOW ON JOHN MARSHALL HIGHWAY, UM, THE AVERAGE DAILY TRAFFIC IS LISTED AS LIKE 14,000 UH, TRIPS.
AND THEN THE AVERAGE, UM, WEEKDAY TRAFFIC IS LISTED AT 16,000 ENTIRE.
SO THAT'S BASICALLY LIKE THE ENTIRE POPULATION OF FRONT WHEEL BASICALLY DRIVING RAIL IS DRIVING
SO IT INCREASED FROM 12,000 2014 TO 14,000, WHICH IS 13% INCREASE AND 13,000 TO 16,000, WHICH IS A 27% INCREASE.
SO THE RE THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN THE TWO IS THE FACT THAT THE TOP NUMBER TAKES INTO CONSIDERATION THE WEEKENDS.
THAT WOULD MEAN, I'M JUST LAUGHING 'CAUSE LIKE I SPEND MORE TIME GOING PAST DOING ON THE WEEKEND
UM, BUT THESE 36 APARTMENTS, I MEAN FROM THAT TRAFFIC IMPACT ANALYSIS THAT WAS STUDIED, THEY'RE NOT GOING TO TRIGGER ANY MAJOR REQUIREMENTS OTHER THAN EXTENSIONS OF THOSE, UM, TURN LANES IN AND OUT.
UM, BUT WHEN YOU LOOK AT THAT ENTIRE STREET THERE, THE OFFICE USES AT THE END.
SO THE EYE DOCTOR, THE CHIROPRACTOR, UM, WHAT ELSE IS THERE? THE DENTAL OFFICE THAT COMBINED WITH THE OTHER 90 UNIT APARTMENT BUILDING AND THEN A DAYCARE.
DAYCARE GENERATES SIGNIFICANT AMOUNTS OF TRAFFIC IN DURING, YOU KNOW, PEAK HOURS.
UM, THAT'S GONNA GENERATE MORE TRAFFIC THAN THIS LOAD ON ITS OWN.
UM, SO YOU ARE LOOKING AT IS THIS USE APPROPRIATE AT THIS SITE? UM, I CAN'T PROVE THAT THIS INTERSECTION IS FAILING RIGHT NOW JUST BASED OFF THE USES THAT ARE THERE OR THAT IT WOULD FAIL IF THIS USE WAS PERMITTED.
UM, AND WE ALSO CAN'T, YOU KNOW, I KNOW THAT WE'VE SAID THAT UH, COMMERCIAL USE IS PROBABLY NOT AS VIABLE BECAUSE THERE'S NO, YOU KNOW, THERE'S NOT MUCH ROOM FOR SIGNAGE OR MARKETING, YOU KNOW, WHERE, WHERE IT'S PLACED, BUT WE DON'T KNOW WHAT KIND OF COMMERCIAL USE SOMEBODY MIGHT TAKE.
SO THEY COULD PUT ANY BUYRIGHT COMMERCIAL USE BACK THERE.
AND WE DO HAVE PROHIBITIONS ON LIKE OFF PREMISES SIGNS.
SO IDEALLY IT'S PROBABLY NOT THE BEST SPOT FOR A COMMERCIAL COMMERCIAL USE UNLESS YOU'RE LOOKING AT LIKE WAREHOUSE STORAGE OR UM, THINGS LIKE THAT.
BUT RETAIL, NO WORK BACK THERE.
IT'S TOO FAR OFF THE MAIN STREET.
UM, BUT SOME OTHER USE OTHER THAN RETAIL COULD IF IT DIDN'T REQUIRE, BUT THAT COULD BE BY RIGHT.
AND THAT'S THE THING THAT COULD BE BY RIGHT.
AND IT COULD GENERATE MORE TRAFFIC THEN THIS EVER COULD.
UM, BUT THAT'S JUST GONNA BE A, THAT'S UP TO THE PROPERTY OWNER.
HOW DID IT END UP COER? I MEAN, HOW IS IT, UM, IS IT BECAUSE IT BACKS UP TO SOME COMMERCIAL, NEAR COMMERCIAL?
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I MEAN WHAT MAKES IT COMMERCIAL IN THE FIRST PLACE? AT SOME POINT IN TIME, THAT ENTIRE PORTION OF TOWN WAS ZONED, UM, COMMERCIAL.SO EVERYTHING ALONG JOHN MARSHALL HIGHWAY MM-HMM
WAS GIVEN A COMMERCIAL ZONING DESIGNATION EVEN THOUGH HISTORICALLY IT HAD BEEN RESIDENTIAL.
UM, SO I HAVE A FEELING THAT IT PROBABLY SWITCHED OVER IN THE SEVENTIES OR EIGHTIES WHENEVER THOSE SHOPPING CENTERS WERE CONSTRUCTED.
I WOULD IMAGINE THERE WOULD'VE BEEN SOME TYPE OF REZONING BACK THEN.
IT WOULD'VE BEEN IN THE SEVENTIES NEIGHBORHOOD.
THERE'S A SLOT IN OUR YEAH, THAT'S THE CURRENT ZONING.
SO I MEAN THE TOWN, UM, ADOPTED, I THINK THE FIRST ZONING ORDINANCE WAS FROM THE FIFTIES.
UM, AND THEN EVERY SO MANY YEARS YOU, WE HAD SOME UPDATES TO IT.
I DON'T KNOW THAT THERE WAS EVER A MAJOR COMPREHENSIVE RESO OF THE ENTIRE TOWN.
UM, BUT AT SOME POINT THAT WHOLE SECTION ALONG JOHN MARSHALL WAS MADE OR DESIGNATED COMMERCIAL.
SO SOME OF THE HOUSE THEY WERE ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE STREET ARE ACTUALLY IN COMMERCIAL.
THEY'RE LEGALLY NONCONFORMING.
SO BASICALLY IF THEY WANT TO SIGNIFICANTLY CHANGE THAT, THAT'S, IT'S GONNA BE DIFFICULT.
UM, AND THEN YOU HAD ASKED FOR ACCIDENT DATA.
SO THAT WAS PROVIDED IN THE LAST 10 YEARS, THERE HAVE BEEN THREE CAR ACCIDENTS AT THAT INTERSECTION OF JOHN MARSHALL AND ROYAL LANE.
SO TWO OF THE ACCIDENTS WERE IN 20 18, 1 OF WHOM WAS IN 20 24, 2 INVOLVED, UH, PROPERTY DAMAGE AND ONE INVOLVED BODILY INJURY OR PERSONAL INJURY.
UM, SO WHAT, LIKE SINCE THEN WHAT WE'VE DONE IS, UM, I HAD ASKED
SO THEY CAME BACK WITH THREE SUGGESTIONS.
SO THE FIRST ONE IS BASICALLY JUST SIGNAGE AND PAINTING IMPROVEMENTS.
UM, AND THAT COMES INTO A BETTER DEFINING THE WESTBOUND LANES BY ADDING A GORE AREA BETWEEN THE RIGHT TURN ONTO ROYAL LANE.
UM, RIGHT TURN WHICH FORCES? WHAT'S GORE? SORRY? IT'S LIKE GAP I GUESS LIKE, OR YEAH, IT'S THE, I APOLOGIZE FOR THE, FOR THE, THE RUDIMENTARY SKETCHES, BUT IT IS THE STRIPING THAT IN BETWEEN THE THROUGH LANE AND THE RIGHT TURN LANE.
SO IT'S JUST PAINTING ON THE STREET.
THIS IS, THIS FIRST SUGGESTION OR SCENARIO IS JUST PAINTING MAYBE A LITTLE BIT OF MILLING.
WE'VE ALREADY GOT A RIGHT TURN LANE INTO ROLLING LANE THOUGH.
YOU SAID MAKE IT BRIGHTER, LIKE PAINT IT LIKE THERE WOULD BE A, A GAP HERE.
SO YOU WOULD HAVE THIS DESIGNATED RIGHT TURN, WHICH WOULD THEN SEPARATE THE PEOPLE TURNING AND THEN YOU'D HAVE A, A SEPARATED AREA AND THEN YOU'D HAVE THE THROUGH TRAFFIC COMING THROUGH, WHICH MEANS WHEN YOU'RE MAKING A TURN OUT OF HERE, THESE PEOPLE ARE DEDICATED TO TURNING, YOU KNOW THAT THEY'RE TURNING AND IT GIVES YOU A LITTLE BIT OF LEEWAY.
SO MOSTLY YOU'RE JUST WATCHING THIS CAR HERE AND THEN THESE CARS OVER HERE, UM, KINDA LIKE PULLING OUT SEVEN 11 GOING LEFT.
SO IT GIVES, LIKE IN THEIR EMAIL THEY SAID THAT THIS GIVES, UM, THE PEOPLE EXITING FROM ROYAL LANE, THE CONFIDENCE THAT THE PEOPLE IN THE RIGHT LANE ARE ACTUALLY TURNING RIGHT AND NOT JUST DRIVING THROUGH.
UM, AND THEN IT WOULD ALLOW THE EASTBOUND LANES TO SPLIT.
SO THIS ESTIMATED COST WAS AT $34,852 AND THAT WOULD BE THE TOWN'S EXPENSE.
MAY, MAY I ASK HOW, HOW THAT WILL HELP FOLKS COMING OUT OF ROYAL LANE TO MAKE A LEFT.
DO WE KNOW IT WON'T REDUCES THE THREE LANE? YEAH, SO YOU'VE GOT A LOT GOING ON AT THAT INTERSECTION.
UM, YOU'VE GOT CARS MERGING EASTBOUND INTO ONE LANE.
JOE, CAN YOU, DO YOU MIND COMING UP HERE JUST 'CAUSE THEN THAT WAY THE VIDEO ANYBODY WATCHING CAN, SORRY, I'M SORRY.
BUT YEAH, SO WE'RE, WE'RE TRANSITIONING FROM, FROM FOUR LANES TO TWO.
SO THE EASTBOUND CARS ARE IN TWO LANES HERE AND THEY HAVE TO TRANSITION TO THE SINGLE LANE AND THEN YOU'VE GOT THE RIGHT TURN LANE.
SO IF YOU'RE SITTING HERE AND THERE'S TWO CARS APPROACHING ONE IN BOTH LANES, YOU DON'T KNOW WHETHER THIS CAR IS GONNA TURN RIGHT OR NOT.
SO IF WE FORCE THIS MERGE TO HAPPEN FURTHER BACK, UM, ANYBODY IN THE RIGHT LANE, THE CAR SITTING HERE WILL KNOW THAT THEY'RE GONNA TURN RIGHT.
SO IF THERE'S ONLY ONE VEHICLE APPROACHING AND IT'S IN THE RIGHT LANE, THEN THEY CAN PRETTY MUCH JUST LOOK THAT WAY AND THEN GO OUT.
WOULD DELINEATORS BE PLACED IN THE NO, IT'S JUST STRIPING.
THIS IS JUST STRIPING ON THE ROAD.
JUST SO, I MEAN I THINK, AND IT'S KIND OF THE SAME THING HERE.
I DON'T THINK THIS SIDE IS AS BIG AN ISSUE.
SO YOU'RE GONNA KNOCK THAT WITH THAT, WITH THAT YOU, YOU'RE GONNA BRING, UH, WESTBOUND 55 IN TO ONE LANE COMING DOWN.
NO ONE, IT'S STILL GONNA, IT'S ALREADY ONE LANE.
IT'S GONNA SPLIT INTO TWO HERE.
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WESTBOUND.YOU GONNA NARROW THE LANE THEN, RIGHT? WHAT'S THAT? THAT MARK IS GOING NARROW THAT LANE.
RIGHT NOW I SAT OUT THERE FOR A WHILE AND JUST WATCH TRAFFIC.
AND RIGHT NOW AS THEY'RE COMING DOWN THE HILL, THEY, THEY JUST KIND OF SEPARATE DEPENDING ON WHICH LANE THEY WANT TO BE IN.
EVEN THOUGH THERE'S NOT REALLY MULTIPLE LANES UNTIL YOU GET PAST THE INTERSECTION.
UM, AND LIKE I SAID, I DON'T THINK THIS STRIPING IS AS CRITICAL AS THIS ONE.
IF YOU'RE JUST GONNA DO STRIPING.
MY ONLY CONCERN WOULD BE IF CARS, YOU KNOW, STARTED PASSING EACH OTHER BACK THERE AND WHICH THEY ALMOST DO.
I I COULD IMAGINE SOMEBODY BEING IRRITATED.
EVEN THOUGH YOU'RE PAST THE INTERSECTION BEFORE THE DOTT LINE OR THE BROKEN LINES, BUT YEAH, WELL ONCE YOU PASS THE, UM, IT USED TO BE MCGREEVY'S BUT IT'S WHERE BRETT HERBECK IS NOW.
THAT'S SINGLE LANE RIGHT IN FRONT OF THAT BUILDING OVER THERE.
YEAH, IT'S SINGLE LANE AND THEN RIGHT AT THE VERY BOTTOM ACTUALLY RIGHT AROUND THERE IS WHEN IT KIND OF GOES WHERE YOU CAN GET INTO TWO.
I NEVER SEEN PEOPLE TRYING TO PASS THERE.
I I DON'T THEY START TO SEPARATE BEFORE IF YOU LOOK AT THE PICTURE, BUT YOU WANNA SEPARATE OUT.
YEAH, BUT I'M SAYING THOUGH, THEY'RE NOT PASSING IN FRONT OF THAT, THAT GREEN SPACE UP THERE.
I MEAN 'CAUSE YOU CAN'T BECAUSE IT'S ONLY ONE LANE.
BUT THIS DOES AT LEAST IT KEEPS THAT LANE MOVING AND THEN IT LETS YOU KNOW HERE 'CAUSE NOT EVERYBODY'S SUPER RELIABLE TURN SIGNALS, UM, THAT THESE PEOPLE ARE IN.
AND OFTENTIMES BECAUSE I, YOU KNOW, LIVE OFF JAMESTOWN WHEN I'M GOING UP, IT'S PEOPLE WITHOUT A STATE TAGS IN THE RIGHT LANE NOT KNOWING THAT THAT LANE'S GOING TO END AND GETTING OVER IN THE LAST SECOND RIGHT AT ROYAL LANE TO THE LEFT.
WE PROBABLY NEED SOMETHING ANYWAY, BUT YEAH.
AND THEY'LL DO ANOTHER SUGGESTION.
IF I SEE A TAG FROM OUT STATE, I'M LIKE, I KNOW THEY'RE COMING OVER, I JUST DON'T KNOW IT YET.
YEAH, YOU HAVE, YOU HAVE ONE SIGN BACK HERE I THINK.
I DON'T REMEMBER IF IT'S UM, LANE ENDS MERGE LEFT OR RIGHT.
I'M NOT SURE, BUT IT HAS ONE OF THOSE.
IT'S A SMALL LITTLE WHITE SIGN.
YEAH, YOU PROBABLY WANT TO IMPROVE THE SIGNS THERE AS WELL JUST TO MAKE IT CLEAR THAT PEOPLE NEED TO GET OVER IT.
BUT I STILL DON'T UNDERSTAND HOW THAT'S GONNA HELP GET THE TRAFFIC OFF OF ROYAL LANE.
JUST GONNA ALLOW, I'VE BEEN UP THERE AND PICKED UP GRANDCHILDREN AT, AT 3, 3 34 O'CLOCK AND IT'S BEEN SITTING ALL THE WAY BACK TO WHERE THE HOUSES ARE ON THE LEFT HAND SIDE GOING UP.
YEAH, I IN THE AFTERNOON SITTING THERE LIKE JOHN MARSHALL'S BACKED UP BACK THE AFTERNOON.
JOHN MARSHALL WASN'T BACK UP AND PEOPLE COMING OUT AND THEY'RE AFRAID TO TRY TO PULL OUT.
I DON'T THINK THIS IS GONNA REALLY GREATLY IMPROVE THE OPERATION OF THE INTERSECTION.
I THINK SAFETY A WAY UP TO
THAT'S THE SAME KIND OF BATTLE IF YOU COME OFF RICHMOND ROAD.
I GOT LEFT OUT THERE EVERY MORNING.
I WAS GONNA SAY, YEAH, I WAS THE SAME.
THIS IS THE LEAST EXPENSIVE SCENARIO IN TOWN.
OH, THE NEXT ONE IS THIS CONTINUOUS GREEN TEA INTERSECTION.
UM, SIT DOWN, JUST LEAVE IT OUTTA THE WAY.
UM, SO THIS ONE WOULD ALLOW OR REQUIRE US TO ACTUALLY PUT CONCRETE MEDIANS IN THE, THE ROAD AND THEN YOU WOULD ACTUALLY LIKE BE PHYSICALLY SEPARATING OUT TRAFFIC FOR, SO THIS ONE, UM, WOULD ALLOW THOSE TURNING LEFT ON JOHN MARSHALL.
YOU WOULDN'T HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT THROUGH GRAPHIC AS MUCH BECAUSE YOU'VE GOT DEDICATED LANES THERE.
UM, AND THIS CAN BE SIGNALED OR UNSIGN DEPENDING ON VOLUME CAN BE WHAT? I'M SORRY, SIGNALED OR UNSIGNED.
I ASSUME THAT PRICE IS UNSIGNED.
YES, THIS IS THE UNSIGNED PRICE.
SO THIS ONE IS APPROXIMATELY $228,688.
SO THAT'S JUST YOUR, I CAN SEE PEOPLE PULLING OUT, TURNING LEFT AND GOING RIGHT INTO THAT MIDDLE LANE INTO THE WRONG LANE.
WHAT'S THAT? BEYOND COMING LANE? YEAH.
REACH AROUND, GRAB SOMETHING OR SOMEBODY OH, RIGHT IN FRONT OF YOU, WEST OF THE EASTBOUND LANE.
YEAH, WE'LL GO RIGHT INTO THE, IIII KNOW THAT WOULD HAPPEN.
LIKE I WOULD HAVE TO BE, I, THE ONLY THING I CAN THINK OF IS THEY HAVE 'EM A LOT LIKE AT THE BEACH WHEN YOU GO LIKE YOU WANNA GO TO A RESTAURANT AND YOU GOT THAT LITTLE INLET, YOU KNOW, HAY MARKET HAS THIS SIGNALED TO GET ORDERED OFF.
66, UM, IS IT 40? UH, IT LOOKS LIKE YOU'RE COMING AT THE TRAFFIC WHEN YOU TURN LEFT TO GO TOWARDS 66 AT HAY MART.
IT'S SIGNALED CONCRETE THAT'S MORE FIRST OF IT'S KIND IN THE COUNTRY OR SOMETHING.
SO I ASKED HIM WHICH PART OF THAT IS CONCRETE, LIKE RAISED CONCRETE.
WELL, BEFORE WE GO TO THE, I MEAN I HAD SORT OF ENVISIONED THESE THREE PIECES BEING CONCRETE MEDIAN.
IF YOU WERE CONCERNED ABOUT VEHICLES TURNING DOWN THIS WAY, YOU COULD CERTAINLY OMIT THE CONCRETE THERE.
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GOING IN SIMILAR TO THAT IN, UM, FREDERICK COUNTY ON THE WEST SIDE OF WINCHESTER.UM, THEY'RE PUTTING ONE IN KIND OF SIMILAR TO THAT.
DO YOU HAVE THE OTHER I'VE GOT, OH NO I DON'T WHICH ONE BECAUSE THERE WAS ONLY TWO.
IS IT YOU HAVE IT IN YOUR NO, NO, IT'S NOT.
LET'S DO SOME HOT WHEEL STUFF RIGHT HERE.
WAS THERE SOMETHING DIFFERENT? YOU THINK IT WAS JUST A VDOT GOT, UM, SOME LITERATURE ON THE GREEN C AND THEY'VE GOT A PICTURE OF ONE THAT'S SHOWS KIND OF HOW IT'S BETTER THAN MY SKETCH AND I GOT THAT.
IT LOOKS LIKE A T BUT WHAT IS THE CONTINUOUS, WHAT IS, TELL ME WHAT THAT MEANS.
WELL THE, SO THIS THE THROUGH THE WESTBOUND THROUGH TRAFFIC DOESN'T HAVE TO STOP.
SO IF YOU'RE PULLING OUT HERE AND YOU'RE LOOKING TO THE EAST, YOU ONLY HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT PEOPLE MAKING A LEFT.
SO IF THERE'S NO ONE MAKING A LEFT, THEN YOU ONLY HAVE TO WORRY ABOUT PEOPLE COMING FROM THIS DIRECTION.
AND THEN YOU CAN PULL INTO HERE AND NORMALLY THIS, UM, THIS LANE HAS TO MERGE OVER, BUT SINCE YOU ALREADY HAVE TWO LANES HERE, IT'S BASICALLY JUST GONNA TURN INTO THE OTHER LANE.
UM, WE'RE DOING CHANGE WITH UPS WERE TO COME BACK THERE.
THEY CAN ONLY GO RIGHT OUT THERE.
WELL, WELL, AND THEY, THEY COULD DO A RIDE OUT ONLY.
I JUST, I, I'LL BE HONEST WITH YOU, I JUST DON'T KNOW HOW MANY, HOW MANY PEOPLE ARE REALLY TURNING LEFT THERE.
I'M NOT SAYING THERE AREN'T PEOPLE THAT ARE COMING FROM THAT DIRECTION.
I JUST TURN RIGHT BECAUSE IT'S DIFFICULT TO TURN LEFT.
NO, I'M SAYING, I'M SAYING WE GOTTA GO PEOPLE COMING THIS WAY TO BASICALLY HAVE AN ENTIRE LANE FOR ANYBODY THAT'S COMING THIS WAY.
I, I JUST DON'T SEE, I DON'T, I DON'T KNOW THAT THERE'S THAT MANY PEOPLE COMING MAKING A LEFT INTO ROYAL LANE.
I MEAN, I MEAN I KNOW THERE ARE HOUSED THERE, I KNOW THERE ARE APARTMENTS THERE AND DAYCARE, THIS OFFICE BUILDING IS GENERATING A LOT OF TRAFFIC BECAUSE YOU'VE GOT AN EYE DOCTOR, YOU'VE GOT A CHIROPRACTOR THERE AND YOU'VE GOT THE DENTAL OFFICE.
SO THOSE ARE GENERATING, YOU KNOW, EVERY 10, 15 MINUTES PEOPLE ARE IN AND OUT, IN AND OUT AND ESPECIALLY LIKE THE CHIROPRACTOR EVERY 15, 20 MINUTES.
BUT I GUARANTEE IF SOMEBODY STOOD UP THERE AND COUNTED, MOST OF 'EM ARE BECOMING PULLING IN.
I'M SAYING THE ONLY PEOPLE THAT ARE COMING IN THAT WAY RIGHT.
IS SOMEBODY THAT WORKS IN THE CITY.
SOMEBODY THAT'S COMING OFF OF EACH RUN.
ONE OF THE ANYONE THAT LIVES OUT.
YEAH, BUT I'M SAYING MOST THERE'S NOT, I'M JUST SAYING THAT'S THAT EXTRA MEDIAN THERE THAT'S ON THAT LEFT TO MAKE IT GO THAT WAY.
IT'S GONNA, DON'T YOU IMAGINE THAT'LL, DON'T YOU IMAGINE THIS'LL SLOW TRAFFIC TOO? NOT THAT THAT'S A BAD THING, BUT THAT'S A PRETTY BIG
I MEAN A LOT OF PEOPLE COMING IN AND OUT OF THERE.
THERE'S DEFINITELY ONE MORE THAN 25.
YEAH, WELL I'M JUST SAYING LIKE, I'M JUST SAYING THAT 55, THERE'S 25, 55, THERE'S SO MANY PEOPLE THAT COME FROM THE CITY THAT WORK THAT WAY.
I'M JUST SAYING I DON'T THINK THAT MANY OF 'EM ARE MAKING A LEFT.
I THINK A LOT OF 'EM ARE GOING INTO TOWN.
BUT ANYWAY, THEN, THEN AFTER YOU GET OUT OF THE, OUT OF THE, THE CONCRETE PORTION OF IT, EVEN WITH THE THREE TRAFFIC, THEY'RE GONNA START JOCKEYING IN POSITION TO TURN LEFT, TO TURN LEFT ONTO REMOUNT, RE TURN INTO COMMERCE OFF 66.
SO IF THERE'S VEHICLES COMING OFF ROYAL LANE, THEN YOU KNOW THAT, YOU KNOW THEY'RE GONNA, AND THERE ARE A LOT OF PROBLEMS ON JOHN MARSHALL LIKE THIS.
THIS ISN'T JUST, THEY NEED TO GET RIGHT AND OTHERS PEOPLE NEED TO GET TO THE LEFT.
I JUST REALIZED ALSO IF YOU'RE GOING WEST AND YOU NEED TO TURN LEFT ONTO JAMESTOWN, THERE'S ENOUGH SPACE THERE NOW WHERE YOU CAN GET OVER IN THE MIDDLE AND THE TRAFFIC CAN CONTINUE TO PASS ON THE RIGHT, BUT YOU'RE NOT GONNA BE ABLE TO PASS WHILE YOU WAIT TO TURN LEFT ONTO JAMESTOWN.
SO IT'S GONNA BACK UP TO ROYAL LANE.
WHERE IS JAMESTOWN THE NEXT ROAD OVER HERE? YES.
THERE'S THERE'S ROOM FOR THIS LEFT TURN LANE AND THAT ONE.
SO THERE'D BE A LEFT TURN LANE DESIGNATED.
YEAH, BECAUSE THAT'S, ISN'T THERE A, THERE'S A MEDIAN THERE NOW, RIGHT? CENTER LINE? YEAH.
THERE'S NOT A, THERE'S NOT A, THERE'S NOT A MEDIA CONCRETE TWO-WAY LEFT LANE.
YEAH, THERE'S LIKE A, NOT A TWO-WAY.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT YOU MEAN BY A TWO-WAY.
JUST, YOU CAN EITHER MAKE A LEFT.
NO, IT'S WHERE YOU CAN MAKE A LEFT OR YOU CAN MAKE A RIGHT COMING DOWN.
IT'S GOT AREAS GOING BOTH WAYS.
YOU CAN SEE IT ON YOUR DRAWING THERE.
YOU CAN TURN RIGHT GOING UP OR LEFT GOING DOWN.
I DON'T SEE CENTER LINE ON ROW LANE AND THE LEFT AND RIGHT HAND DEDICATED CHART.
BUT THAT'S, THAT WOULD BE UP TO WE, THAT WAY YOU CAN EITHER BE YEAH, I UNDERSTAND WHAT THE TOWN WOULD BE ABLE TO PAINT THOSE IN.
WE WERE JUST FOR THIS, JUST LOOKING AT
[00:25:01]
OKAY, JUST THIS, MY QUESTION WAS WHY IS IT RURAL LANE RIGHT TO THE LEFT OR RIGHT DEDICATED LANE? BECAUSE RIGHT NOW WAS THE CARS PARKED ON THE EAST SIDE.IT NARROWS TO A POINT THAT IF THE FIRST CAR IS TURNING LEFT, DOESN'T MATTER WHAT YOU'RE DOING BACK THERE.
YOU'RE WAITING ON THAT FIRST CAR.
WHEREAS WE PUT A DIVIDED LINE TOOK PROBABLY FIVE OR SIX PARKING SPOTS WHEN WE LOOKED AT IT SOME REASON AND PUT A DEDICATOR LEFT AND RIGHT.
AT LEAST YOU COULD UM, HAVE TRAFFIC ON BOTH OF STACKING.
WELL YOU HAVE STACKING, IF YOU'RE MAKING A RIGHT, PERHAPS YOU CAN GET DOWN THERE AND GO AHEAD AND MAKE IT RIGHT WHILE THE OTHER PERSON'S WAITING TO MAKE A LEFT.
ANY OF THOSE PEOPLE THAT ARE PARKING, THERE ARE STAFF IN THAT, IN THAT BUILDING.
YOU KNOW WHAT I'M SAYING? THEY DO HAVE STAFF SUSPICION IS THERE ARE COMMUTERS.
I AFFORD TO THE THE DOCTOR'S OFFICE IS YEAH.
SOME OF THE STAFF I SEEN PARKING THERE.
EMPLOYEES NOT ONE OF THOSE OFFICES.
WELL I KNOW AND THAT'S, I'M THINKING THEY'RE PROBABLY PARKING THERE SO THEY DON'T, THEY'RE NOT IN WELL, AND TOO, WHEN YOU'RE IN A PARKING LOT, YOU RUN THE RISK OF SOMEBODY BUMPING YOUR CAR.
YOU KNOW, SO THEY'RE PARKING THERE AND, AND THEY'RE, BUT THEY'RE ONLY TALKING ABOUT TAKING FOUR, MAYBE FIVE SPOTS.
AS WE LOOK AT THE PICTURE PARKING, THE IN LANE IS ALREADY YELLOWED BACK A DISTANCE AND WE'RE TALKING ABOUT DOING THE SAME THING ON THE RIGHT SIDE OF THE ROAD.
WHICH WOULD, ROBBIE AND I LOOKED AT THIS AND IT WAS FOUR OR FIVE CARS.
AND I FEEL LIKE THAT PARKING, WHAT I WAS TRYING TO SAY IS THAT PARKING LOT COULD CONSUME THOSE FOUR OR FIVE SPOTS.
I I DON'T THINK IT WAS A PROBLEM TAKEN AWAY AND I REALLY, YEAH, ROBBIE EVEN RECOGNIZED THE VEHICLE THERE AND BELIEVES HE'S A COMMUTER.
SO YEAH, YOU SEND AN OFFICER OUT THERE FOR A COUPLE HOURS A DAY, LOOK AT IT AND YOU KNOW, THERE'S, THERE'S COMMUTER PARKING ON OUT TO THE LINE, THERE'S PLENTY OF PARKING.
SO IF THAT'S THE CASE, WE'RE NOT REALLY GONNA AFFECT THE BUSINESS ON ROADERS PARK, ON ROAD ON EDGE TOO.
AM I WRONG TO ASK? SO IF YOU, I KNOW THAT THIS CHANGES, IT ALL FEED OUT FOR A SECOND, BUT BUSINESS, COULD WE, SO CAN WE BUILD THE OTHER ROAD FOR LESS THAN 2 28, 6 88? DO YOU KNOW? I DUNNO.
SO WOULD DID YOU HEAR HER QUESTION? SHE SAID COULD WE BUILD, COULD WE CONNECT THAT REMOUNT DRIVE OR WHATEVER FOR 228,000? NO, I THINK YOU'D BE LOOKING IN INTO MILLIONS.
I'M JUST THINKING IF ALL THAT WAS MEDIAS, I CAN'T IMAGINE WHAT THAT WOULD BE.
SO WHEN YOU GET OVER THERE BEHIND THE SUBSTATION, IT STAYS WET WHERE IT'S KIND OF DOWN BELOW THE WATER PLANT AND I MEAN THERE'S BAMBOO, THE BAMBOO IN, THERE'S SO WIDE YOU BARELY GET THE TRUCK.
I MEAN THE MIRROR'S BARELY CLEAR.
SO YOU'D HAVE, WE, WE DROVE UP IN THERE IN ROBBIE'S TRUCK AND LOOKED AT IT.
I MEAN IT'S VERY NARROW IT, YOU GO DOWN TO WHERE OBVIOUSLY WATER FLOWS THROUGH THERE WHEN IT'S WET.
SO YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT A MASSIVE CULVERT AND GRADING AND IT'S NOT AS SIMPLE AS TAR CHIPPING IT.
I THOUGHT YOU GOTTA BRING IT UP TO STATE SANDERS.
WELL I THOUGHT ILLUSION WAS MAKE IT A ONE WAY OUT OF THERE.
AT LEAST YOU'D HAVE ANOTHER EXIT POINT.
BUT IT'S GONNA BE COSTLY AND I DON'T KNOW THAT IT WOULD MAKE SENSE FOR THE TOWN TO INCUR THAT COST FOR 36 12 UNITS.
UM, AND THEN YOUR NEXT OPTION, AND YOU CAN GO BACK TO QUESTIONS IF YOU NEED TO, WOULD BE A SIGNAL THERE, WHICH APPARENTLY THOSE RUN 300 TO $800,000 FOR A TRAFFIC SIGNAL THAT WOULD REQUIRE A SIGNAL TIMING STUDY.
AND I, I WOULD THINK THAT THAT WOULD BACK UP THE TRAFFIC ON JOHN MARSHALL EVEN MORE.
I THINK AS WE DO LIKE TRANSPORTATION STUDY DOWNWARD, I THINK JOHN MARSHALL'S GONNA BE THE BIG FOCUS OF THE PROBLEMS IN THIS TOWN.
I WAS GONNA SAY, IF YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT TRAFFIC SIGNAL, THE FOLKS SPIN OFF OF WALKER AVENUE.
AND THERE'S TWO SCHOOLS BACK IN THERE.
SO WHAT QUESTIONS DO YOU HAVE FOR JOE MIKE AT THIS POINT? SOMETHING, THERE WAS SOME LANGUAGE IN THERE ABOUT SHOOT YOU RIGHT.
IT HAS MORE TO DO WITH, UM, THE EXTENSION OF ROYAL WAYNE.
UH, AND THEN THERE'S WAS A STATEMENT ABOUT, UH, COULD BE EXTENDED IF NEED BE.
WHAT DOES THAT MEAN? YOU MEAN IT COULD WHERE WHERE YEAH, IT'S SOMEWHERE IN THERE.
'CAUSE I REMEMBER THINKING WHERE, AND I'M GOING LIKE WHAT ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT? EXTENDED? I THINK IT'S, I THINK IT'S HERE WHERE THEY'RE RESERVING THAT RIGHT OF WAY WHERE THEY COULD EXTEND IT BEYOND THIS IS ROYAL LANE EXTENSION.
SO ALL OF THIS IS THE POTENTIAL EXTENSION OF IT.
NO, THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT THE EXTENSION FROM THE CUL-DE-SAC AND THEN WHERE IT SAYS RESERVATION RIGHT AWAY THEN IT COULD BE EXTENDED IF NEEDED.
IS THAT PROPERTY LINE? THIS IS THE PROPERTY LINE HERE.
[00:30:01]
OF RIGHT OF WAY AND IT EXTENDS THROUGH THE CUL-DE-SAC ALL THE WAY TO THE PROPERTY LINE HERE.RESERVATION OF RIGHT OF 60 FOOT RIGHT OF WAY.
IS THAT, SO THAT JUST IN CASE WE WOULD DECIDE AT SOME POINT IF THE TOWN AT SOME POINT WANTS DRIVE THIS COULD BE CONNECTED ALL THE WAY FOR, IS THAT A RIGHT THAT SOMEBODY MAYBE WOULD WANT IT IN AN OUTLET? SO WHAT WOULD A $300,000 LIKE CAN YOU OH, I DON'T KNOW.
THAT'S JUST THE PRICES WE GET FROM, FROM DISTRICTS.
I CANNOT, IT DEPENDS ON 2 34 THAT'S THE CASE I'M START DRIVING THROUGH OR THE RAISED CONCRETE.
YEAH, IT JUST DEPENDS ON THE NUMBER OF SIGNAL HEADS AND YOU KNOW, THE SIZE OF ARMS AND ALL THAT.
DOES ANYBODY ON COUNCIL HAVE ANY MORE QUESTIONS FOR, UM, JOE, OUR VDO REPRESENTATIVE THAT THAT CAME TONIGHT? YEAH, THE ONLY OTHER QUESTION THAT I HAVE IS IN THE END, HOW DOES THAT IMPROVE THE SAFETY OF THE PEOPLE TRYING TO MAKE A LEFT TERMINAL FOR OIL LANE? ANY ANY OF THESE OPTIONS? YEAH, THE, I MEAN THE CONTINUOUS GREEN T IS GOING TO REDUCE CONFLICT POINTS.
UM, SO THAT STRAIGHTAWAY IS GONNA IMPROVE THE SAFETY OF THAT INTERSECTION.
UM, THAT'S ONE OF THE REASONS WE, YOU KNOW, ANYTIME THERE'S A T INTERSECTION, UH, THIS IS ONE THAT WE LOOK AT AND YOU KNOW, WHEN WE ANALYZE THE DIFFERENT OPTIONS, THIS ONE TYPICALLY WILL ALWAYS SCORE WELL AT ITS T INTERSECTION.
UM, AND LIKE I SAID, IT IT, YOU COULD COME IN LATER AND PUT IN A SIGNAL IF YOU NEEDED TO.
UM, WE'RE DOING ONE OF THESE UP ON 5 22 NORTH OF WINCHESTER AT GAINESBORO WHERE GAINSBOROUGH SCHOOL IS IN ROAD.
WE'RE DOING A CONTINUOUS GREEN TEE ON 5 22.
SO, UM, THE, THE WESTBOUND NORTHBOUND 5 22 WILL CONTINUE THROUGH AND ONLY THE EASTBOUND WILL HAVE TO STOP.
SO, UM, IT, THE, THE SHORT ANSWER IS IT REDUCES THE NUMBER OF CONCRETE POINTS.
BUT IT'LL, IT WILL NOT, IT WILL NOT IMPROVE THE FLOW OF TURNING LEFT OFF ROYAL LANE IF, IF WE DID NOTHING IT WILL IMPROVE THE OPERATION.
IT WILL, IT WILL IMPROVE THE OPERATION.
BECAUSE YOU WON'T HAVE TO THE LEFT TURNS WON'T HAVE TO WAIT FOR CARS GOING THROUGH.
SO IT TAKES THEM COMPLETELY OUTTA IT.
IT'S JUST THE LESS AND IF IF THERE'S NOT THAT MANY LESS, THEN YOU'RE REALLY JUST LOOKING AT THESE, YOU GET OUT AND, AND THEN IF OKAY, IF YOU LOOKED AT IT VERSUS A TRADITIONAL SIGNAL, UH, OBVIOUSLY YOU'RE GONNA BE STOPPING THE WHOLE INTERSECTION EVERY SO OFTEN.
SO, YOU KNOW, THE WESTBOUND LANES ARE GONNA HAVE TO STOP AND IT'S GONNA BACK UP.
OR WHEN WE, SO THANK YOU FOR THAT.
UH, DOES ANYBODY HAVE MORE QUESTIONS FOR JOE? RIGHT THERE? UM, WHEN WE LOOKED AT THE CRO ROAD APARTMENT THING, THEY DID DO A TRAFFIC, THEY DIDN'T, THEY DID A TRAFFIC ANALYSIS AND I, I MIGHT BE WRONG, BUT WITH 90 APARTMENTS 'CAUSE WE WERE WORRIED ABOUT ZA ROAD WITH THE SCHOOL AND STUFF, WASN'T IT LIKE LESS THAN 2000 EXTRA THAT THEY THOUGHT THAT IT WOULD, THAT IT WOULD ADD TO THAT ROAD? YEAH.
SOMETHING MEANING THAT THE FOLKS LIVING IN THOSE 90 APARTMENTS RIGHT.
WOULD ONLY AND THEY DID A TRAFFIC, I MEAN THEY PAID TO HAVE A TRAFFIC ANALYSIS AND YEAH, THAT'S THAT'S WHAT I WAS JUST THINKING.
AND THAT TRAFFIC ANALYSIS SHOWED THAT THEY REALLY ONLY NEEDED TO LENGTHEN THE TURN LANE IN AND OUT.
UM, SO THAT THE, THE ISSUES THERE IS BASICALLY IT SCHOOL PICKUP AND DROP OFF ARE THE, THE PARENTS ARE TAKING UP THE SHOULDER AND THEN, THEN SOME OF THE DRIVING.
BUT I'M SAYING THOUGH, AS FAR AS ADDING INTO THE TRAFFIC COUNT, WHEN THEY DID THE ANALYSIS FOR 90 APARTMENTS WAS 90, NOT 92, 90 APARTMENTS.
IT WAS 16 EXTRA TRAFFIC, 1600 EXTRA TRIPS.
BUT THAT IN THE GRAND SCHEME OF THE, THE VOLUME ON THAT ROAD, IT, IT DIDN'T NEGATIVELY IMPACT IT, IT DIDN'T.
I'M JUST TRYING TO, I'M NOT SERVICE, I WASN'T EVEN TALKING ABOUT THE ROADS.
I'M TALKING ABOUT 90 APARTMENTS BROUGHT ABOUT 1600 EXTRA TRIPS, 36 APARTMENTS.
WE WOULDN'T THINK IT WOULD BE 1600 TRIPS.
SO THAT'S WHAT I'M TRYING TO THINK ABOUT.
WHEN THEY COME UP WITH THOSE NUMBERS, THERE'S A COEFFICIENT FOOT TO IT.
SO, AND I'M PRETTY SURE 40% INCREASE, RIGHT.
I WAS JUST LOOKING AT THE 14,000 AVERAGE DAILY AND THE 16,000 AVERAGE WEEKDAY AT 16,000.
I'M SAYING THAT IF, EVEN IF IT, EVEN THOUGH 90 IS, YOU KNOW, ALMOST, ALMOST THREE TIMES, IT'S DEFINITELY TWO
[00:35:01]
AND A HALF TIMES 36 THAT EVEN IF IT ADDED 1600 MORE TRIPS.THAT'S WHAT I'M TRYING TO THINK ABOUT WHAT THE IMPACT OF 1600 MORE TRIPS.
I MEAN IT SOUNDS LIKE A LOT, BUT YOU KNOW, AT 800 YOU, YOU WOULD THINK 800 WOULD BE EARLIER IN THE DAY, 800 WOULD BE, I MEAN THERE IS A SCHOOL BUS THAT GOES UP THERE TOO TO, BUT, BUT, UM, TWICE A DAY.
'CAUSE YOU GOT, YOU KNOW, HIGH SCHOOL, I'M NOT CONCERNED WITH THE, NOT JUST THE OPTICS, BUT THE THOUGHT OF MAKING IMPROVEMENTS TO A ROAD THAT'S, YEAH, IT HAS ISSUES, BUT WE HAVE A LOT OF ROADS THAT NEED IMPROVEMENTS OFF OF JOHN MARSHALL, UM, AND THE ENTIRE TOWN LIMIT OF JOHN MARSHALL HIGHWAY.
SO I GUESS FOR ME IT'S AN ISSUE OF IS IT RESPONSIBLE TO MAKE ALMOST A $300,000 INVESTMENT FOR THE UPGRADES OF THIS ROAD FOR 36 APARTMENTS WHEN WE'RE NOT EXPECTED TO OR GOING TO FOR THE ALREADY LONGSTANDING COMMUNITIES THAT WE HAVE THAT ARE HAVING ISSUES IT.
THE OTHER THING IS, IS AS AS DEVELOPMENT CONTINUES, THAT PROVES GONNA GET BUSIER.
AND WE'RE SETTING THE PRECEDENCE THAT WE'LL MAKE THE IMPROVEMENTS AND PUT THE ENTIRE COST OF IMPROVEMENTS FOR DEVELOPMENT.
AND IT'S NOT LIKE WE'RE GOING TO GET THE SAME TYPE OF RESIDENTIAL INCOME OFF OF 36 APARTMENT UNITS AS WE WOULD IN 36 HOMES.
AND I WILL SAY SINCE, SINCE BEING ON COUNCIL AND SERVING IN THIS ROLE, A LOT OF PEOPLE ASKED ME ABOUT JOHN MARSHALL HIGHWAY BECAUSE WHEN I FIRST GOT ON COUNCIL, I STILL DIDN'T UNDERSTAND HOW MUCH THOSE KINDS OF THINGS COST.
AND I SAID, WELL I THINK WE NEED TO PUT IT AS A GOAL TO WIDEN OUR MARSHALL HIGHWAY TO MAKE IT FOUR LANES ALL THE WAY LEE RUN BECAUSE LEACH, AND THIS WAS BEFORE LEERA THERE AND I FORGET, BUT SOMEBODY SAID, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT $50 MILLION.
I WAS LIKE, WHAT? AND THEY'RE LIKE, BECAUSE YOU HAVE TO BUY ALL THE RIGHTS TO THEIR PROPERTY.
AND I WAS LIKE, OKAY, NEVERMIND.
UM, THERE WERE PINCH POINTS ON JOHN MARSHALL.
AND IF YOU'RE GONNA PRIORITIZE IT, I DON'T KNOW THAT THIS WOULD BE THE PRIORITY TO PUT THE MONEY INTO IT.
WHICH IS WHY I THINK I GO BACK TO, WE WERE, WE PUT THE SEED MONEY IN THE BUDGET A COUPLE YEARS AGO AND IT GOT TAKEN OUT BY THE NEXT COUNCIL.
BUT WE NEED A TRANSPORTATION STUDY.
BECAUSE THIS THEN WE CAN PRIORITIZE JUST LIKE WE HAVE A FIVE AND A 10 YEAR PAVING PLAN IF WE'RE GONNA INVEST MONEY INTO THE INFRASTRUCTURE LIKE THAT, I'M SORRY, BUT IT SHOULDN'T BE FOR 36 APARTMENTS.
SO WE DO HAVE THE MONEY AND THE, UH, BUDGETED FOR TRANSPORTATION.
WE'RE WORKING ON GETTING THE RFP WRITTEN UP.
HOPEFULLY WE'LL HAVE IT ON THE STREET HERE SHORTLY BECAUSE THE LAST I RECALL WHEN WE HAD BUDGETED 50,000 FOR IT, WE DIDN'T KEEP 50,000 IN FOR IT.
WE ACTUALLY HAD TO INCREASE IT AND WE DID INCREASE IT.
WE DID, WE MOVED SOME MONEY OVER DURING THIS LAST, WHEN WE DID THE PURCHASE ORDERS BACK IN OCTOBER, WE PUT A LITTLE BIT MORE MONEY TOWARDS IT.
AND IT COSTS A HUNDRED THOUSAND PLUS FOR THE STUDY.
I THINK WE HAVE ABOUT A HUNDRED, WHAT IS IT, 150 MORE? YEAH, IT'S ABOUT 150.
AND I WOULD IMAGINE IT'S GONNA TAKE EVERY BIT OF THAT.
THAT WOULD BE AN INDEPENDENT STUDY OF THE ENTIRE, THAT MEANS HIGHER.
BUT THAT ALSO, TRANSPORTATION ISN'T JUST VEHICLES, IT'S THE WALKABILITY.
IT'S, IT'S ALL FORMS OF, AND IN THE R IN THERE.
SO WE REFERENCED BACK TO THE CONFERENCE OF PLAN.
SO, UM, ALL OF THOSE GOALS WE HAVE AS FAR AS THE TRANSPORTATION CHAPTER GOES, WE HAVE LIKE 40 SOME PROPOSED ROAD IMPROVEMENTS, INTERSECTION STUDIES, AND THEN WE ALSO THROW IN THERE, UH, POTENTIAL GRANT SUPPORT FOR THEM TO HELP US, UM, ACQUIRE GRANT MONEY FOR, TO OFFSET SOME OF THE COSTS.
I ALSO JUST WONDER WHAT KIND OF PRECEDENCE THIS WOULD SET FOR NEW DEVELOPMENT THAT WE'RE WILLING TO MAKE HUNDREDS OF THOUSANDS OF DOLLARS OF IMPROVEMENT OR BOX IF WE DO IT WELL, THE OTHER THING TOO, LIKE I AND I FEEL BAD AS I'M SITTING HERE THINKING THAT I WOULDN'T WANT ANYBODY THAT'S WATCHING THIS TO SAY IT'S ALL ABOUT THE MONEY.
EVEN THOUGH WHEN YOU'RE SITTING IN THESE SEATS, YOU, MONEY'S HUGE PART OF YOUR DECISION MAKING.
BUT I THINK IT, IT, IT SHOULD BE ABOUT SAFETY, RIGHT? UM, BUT IT, IT DOESN'T FEEL LIKE THOSE, IT DOESN'T FEEL LIKE THE STATS THAT YOU GAVE US WITH TWO ACCIDENTS IN 2018 AND ONE ACCIDENT IN 2024.
AND I CAN TELL YOU RIGHT NOW, LIKE I SAID, AT THE END OF WALKER GOING OUT ONTO JOHN MARSHALL, THERE'S BEEN WAY, WAY MORE THAN TWO OR THREE, YOU KNOW, I'M SAYING LIKE, SO THAT'S, I MEAN, OR AT LEAST YOU KNOW WHAT I'M TALKING ABOUT, RIGHT? WHERE PEOPLE STOP AND THEY GO AROUND PEOPLE AND ALL THAT.
DID THEY GET THE INFORMATION FROM YOU? I'M SORRY? FOR WHAT? FOR THE ACCIDENTS? YES.
[00:40:01]
EARLIER TODAY.WELL THE OTHER PIECE IS, IS THAT WE HAVE TO ADJUST A WHOLE NEW TRAFFIC PATTERN AND, AND YOU KNOW HOW LONG THAT TAKE OUT? THAT'S WHAT BRUCE WAS SAYING.
WELL, AND ALSO BY THE TIME THE REST OF THE DEVELOPMENT THAT'S GONNA HAPPEN OUT THERE HAPPENS, THIS WON'T BE SUFFICIENT.
YOU'RE NOT REQUIRED TO DO THIS AS PART OF THE SUP.
LIKE THIS IS NOT A REQUIREMENT.
YOU CAN APPROVE IT OR NOT APPROVE IT, BUT IT, THIS IS NOT A REQUIREMENT.
THIS IS JUST BECAUSE THERE'S PUBLIC PERCEPTION THAT THIS INTERSECTION IS NOT WORKING.
THIS IS NOT PROOF THAT THE INTERSECTION IS FAILING.
LITTLE PAINT ON THE GROUND IS NOT GONNA MAKE IT WORK EITHER.
IT WOULD BE BETTER THAN WHAT'S THERE.
IT WAS, THAT'S WHY THAT WAS THE ONE SUGGESTION.
I'M NOT ING I HAVEN'T DISAGREE.
I, I WOULD WITH JUST PAINTING SOMETHING DOWN.
YOU KNOW, I I I'VE WORKED A LOT OF ACCIDENTS IN MY LIFE AND THE WAY THE PAINT'S NOT GONNA STOP, BUT I WILL SAY ONE THING, IT'S BETTER, IT'S BETTER TO TRY SOMETHING TO INDICATE THROUGH THERE THAT THIS IS WHERE YOU GO AND THIS LOOK AT PROVING THE SIGNAGE TO MAKE SURE THERE'S CLARITY SO THAT PEOPLE UNDERSTAND THIS LANE ENDS.
AND YOU WILL NEED TO MERGE INSTEAD OF THEM JUST TRYING TO CUT BACK OVER.
BUT I THINK WITH ANYTHING AFTER A WHILE WHEN YOU WERE SAYING TRAFFIC PATTERNS, LIKE AFTER A WHILE PEOPLE, THEY, THEIR PATTERN STARTS, IT'S TOURISTS AND PEOPLE THAT DON'T DRIVE IT EVERY DAY WON'T.
THE PEOPLE THAT DRIVE IT ONE TIME AND THEY'RE SITTING THERE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT WHICH LANE AM I SUPPOSED TO GET IN.
BUT, AND I WOULD IMAGINE THE PEOPLE THAT ARE PULLING OUTTA RURAL LANE, THEY'RE GONNA QUICKLY FIGURE OUT, FIGURE, GO LEFT, GO.
YOU KNOW, SO I JUST FIGURE OUT IT'S GONNA BE JUST THE SAME AS IT'S NOW LET'S DO A ROUNDABOUT AND MAKE EVERYBODY ANGRY.
SO THIS TOPIC WAS ON FOR TONIGHT BECAUSE, UM, WE NEEDED TO GATHER MORE INFORMATION ABOUT THE SPECIAL USE PERMIT FOR THE MULTIFAMILY APARTMENTS.
AND, AND BECAUSE SAFETY WAS, WAS A CONCERN FROM SOME PEOPLE THAT SPOKE OR SENT US EMAILS.
SO ASKING DDOT TO WEIGH IN AND ASKING STAFF AND, AND YOU KNOW, TO TRY TO GET NUMBERS AND STUFF.
THAT'S WHAT ALL OF THIS EXTRA INFORMATION WAS TONIGHT.
I'M SAYING PEOPLE COUNCIL ASKED FOR MORE INFORMATION, THEY PROVIDED MORE INFORMATION.
ARE WE READY TO MOVE FORWARD? DO YOU NEED MORE INFORMATION OR CAN WE PUT THIS ON THE NEXT MEETING? THAT, THAT'S KIND OF WHERE, THAT'S WHERE THE NEXT DECISION IS.
ARE PEOPLE, DO THEY HAVE ENOUGH INFORMATION TO TAKE ACTION OR DO YOU WANT MORE INFORMATION? I REALLY DON'T KNOW WHAT ELSE CAN BE EXPLAINED.
YOU TALKING ABOUT JUST THE INTERSECTION, JOE, ARE YOU TALKING ABOUT THE WHOLE THING? THE, THE WHOLE PROJECT, THE SPECIAL USE PERMIT IS WHAT WE HAVE TO TAKE ACTION ON.
SO JOE, DID YOU HAVE A QUESTION? YEAH, SOMEBODY SAID CAN YOU GO BACK TO THE SITE PLAN? YEAH.
SO HOW IMPORTANT IS THE EXTENSION OF ROYAL LANE IN THE GRAND SCHEME OF THINGS? WHAT DOES THAT DO? YOU MIGHT BE ABLE TO TRADE WITH THE DEVELOPER IF YOU PULL THE CUL-DE-SAC BACK TO UM, WHERE THE ENTRANCE TO THE DAYCARE IS AND JUST RESERVE THE RIGHT OF WAY THROUGH THERE, THEY'RE GONNA SAVE QUITE A BIT OF MONEY AND THEY MIGHT BE WILLING TO GO OUT AND DO THE IMPROVEMENTS.
UM, IN EXCHANGE FOR THAT YOU WOULD STILL HAVE THE RIGHT OF WAY RESERVATION.
I MEAN, I DON'T KNOW WHAT'S GOING ON WITH THAT OTHER PARCEL DOWN THERE OR IF THAT'S THEIR ONLY ACCESS.
YOU MEAN IF THEY ACCESSED LOWER IN THE PARKING LOT, DIDN'T HAVE TO CONSTRUCT THIS THAT THEY COULD POTENTIALLY DO WELL WE CAN'T ASK THEM TO DO FUND.
THEY WOULD HAVE TO OFFER THAT.
AND AND ARE YOU SAYING LIKE IF THEY DID THAT, YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT THE CONTINUOUS TEA PLAN, WOULD THAT BE THE ONE YOU'D RECOMMEND? I'M JUST NOT SURE THAT THAT'S NOT GONNA CAUSE MORE GRIDLOCK.
I MEAN I I I LOVE IT'LL BE OBSOLETE EVERY COUPLE OF YEARS.
BUT THANK YOU FOR THE BEING CREATIVE THINKING TOO.
GLEN HAD HIS HAND RAISED FOR A WHILE.
COULD WE LOOK AT AND GOING AHEAD, I MEAN WITHIN OUR CONTROL RESTRICTING THE PARKING AND PUTTING A DEDICATED LEFT AND RIGHT, THERE'D BE A MIDDLE LINE SO PEOPLE KNOW WHAT SIDE TO BE ON AND THEY HAVE A DEDICATED LEFT, DEDICATED RIGHT.
AND LET'S SEE WHAT THE IMPACT OF THAT IMPROVEMENT WOULD BE.
I THINK WE'D HAVE TO PUT THAT AS A SEPARATE ITEM AT A WORK SESSION AND HAVE THE DISCUSSION WITH STAFF TO DO THAT BECAUSE WE'RE, WE ARE REQUIRED TONIGHT TO DECIDE ABOUT A SPECIAL USE PERMIT.
WELL, WHETHER OR NOT TO MOVE IT FORWARD.
I I AGREE, BUT I'M OFF, I'M OFFERING SOMETHING THAT NO, I HEAR YOU.
I JUST DON'T THINK WE'RE ALLOWED.
THAT'S NOT WHAT WE'RE DISCUSSING ON THE FUTURE, HOWEVER.
AND THAT'S NOT, IT'S NOT LIKE THEY'RE GONNA BUILD THOSE THREE SIX APARTMENTS TOMORROW.
SO WE GOT A LITTLE BIT OF TIME, BUT WE COULD HAVE A RELATIVELY LOW COST IMPACT.
[00:45:01]
AND I'M KIND OF LOOKING AT YOU GUYS, IF WE TRY THAT, WHAT DO WE GAIN? I MEAN, WOULD IT MAKE IT EASIER FOR THE PEOPLE TRANSVERSING OUT WITH JUST A LITTLE PAINT ON THE GROUND AND RESTRICTING SOME PARTS? COULD WE MAKE SOMETHING BETTER AT A VERY MINIMAL COST THOUGH? AND THEN ARE YOU GONNA RUN INTO THE, THE BUSINESSES THAT ARE THERE THAT, I KNOW THAT YOU SAID YOU THOUGHT ONE OF THEM WAS A COMMUTER, BUT IF THEIR CUSTOMERS OF THE, OF THE DENTIST WITH YOU, YOU KNOW, THEN YOU'RE, YOU'RE IMPACTING THEIR ABILITY TO MAKE, TO HAVE, YOU KNOW,BUT THOSE, BUT THOSE, THOSE FOUR OR FIVE SPOTS, I MEAN IT'S THE TOWNS ROAD.
I MEAN WE, IT'S A TOWNS ROAD AND WE NEED TO MITIGATE TRAFFIC TO THE POINT THAT WE CAN, IF WE CHECK OUT FOUR PARKING SPOTS, THEY MIGHT HAVE TO PARK UP THE HILL AND WALK A LITTLE BIT MORE.
BUT ARE WE TRYING TO SOLVE A TRAFFIC ISSUE? ARE WE WORRIED ABOUT FOUR PARKING SPOTS? I MEAN THAT'S BASICALLY WHAT I'M SAYING.
AND IT COULD ALSO, AGAIN, WE'LL PUT THIS ON OTHER WORK SESSION TALK.
ALTHOUGH HONESTLY I'M GONNA BE QUITE FRANK WITH YOU, I DON'T KNOW THAT THAT'S A, I DON'T KNOW THAT THAT'S A, THAT COUNCIL NEEDS TO TAKE SOME KIND OF ACTION ON WHETHER OR NOT WE WIPE OUT THOSE FOUR PARKING SPACES.
THAT CAN BE A TOTAL STAFF DECISION TO SAY, YOU KNOW, PORT PUBLIC WORKS TO BE ABLE TO SAY WE'RE GONNA NOT ALLOW PARKING THERE.
PUT UP SIGNS THAT SAYS NO PARKING.
AND IF IT DOESN'T MAKE AN IMPACT, THEN AGAIN STAFF COULD MAKE, I MEAN, DO YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT I'M UNDERSTAND? DO YOU FEEL LIKE UNDERSTAND THAT'S SOMETHING THAT WE'VE GOTTA TAKE AN ACTION ON? IT'S SOMETHING THAT, LET'S TRY YEAH, WE CAN, WE DON'T TAKE ACTION ON THAT.
MY QUESTION IS, WE'RE HERE DISCUSSING THE SPECIAL USE PERMIT FOR 36 APARTMENTS.
SO IS THE APPETITE TO DO THIS AND PUSH THIS BACK ANOTHER MONTH, TWO MONTHS, THREE MONTHS TO LET STAFF DO THAT AND THEN SEE THE IMPACT? HOW DOES IT PERTAIN TO WHAT WE'RE SUPPOSED TO BE DISCUSSING RIGHT NOW? I I DON'T THINK IT DOES.
I THINK IT WOULD JUST BE A, UM, A PROACTIVE INSTEAD OF REACTIVE.
THAT'S WHAT WE WERE TALKING ABOUT.
BUT I THINK THIS SUPI MEAN, I THINK THAT IF EVERYBODY'S READY TO TAKE ACTION ON THAT, THAT WOULD BE AT THE, THAT COULD BE AT THE MARCH.
NOPE, IT'S GOTTA BE THE APRIL.
'CAUSE WE NEED PUBLIC HEARING.
SO IT COULD GO AHEAD AND MOVE IT TO THE APRIL MEETING.
LET STAFF DETERMINE IF THEY WANNA DO SOMETHING ABOUT THE FOUR PARKING SPACES.
AND THAT WOULD AT LEAST GIVE US SOME INFORMATION IF AFTER, YOU KNOW, AFTER SIX, SEVEN WEEKS WE'RE LIKE, THAT DIDN'T REALLY CHANGE ANYTHING.
AND THE CUS NO, I'M NOT SAYING IT NEEDS TO IMPACT THE SUP DECISION, BUT THAT'S WHAT I'M ASKING IS THAT WHAT THE COUNCIL MEMBERS WHO HAVE BROUGHT IT FORWARD WANT, DO THEY WANNA WAIT TO TAKE ACTION ON THE SUP UNTIL STAFF CHANGES THE PARKING AND PUTS LINES? DO YOU WANT TO WAIT? I, I'M GONNA START WITH YOU.
I I, I, WELL I NEED, I WANTED TO ASK TO BE REPRESENTATIVE GO AHEAD.
UH, TO EXPLAIN HE STAYED
I MEAN, HOW ACCURATE, HOW ACCURATE OR IS THE FORMULA IN DETERMINING THAT NUMBER? I MEAN, IT, IT'S FAIRLY ACCURATE FOR RESIDENTIAL, BUT COMMERCIAL REALLY DEPENDS ON THE USE.
I MEAN, WE DON'T REALLY KNOW A CHICK-FIL-A BACK THERE IS GONNA GENERATE WAY MORE TRAFFIC THAN EVEN A BURGER KING, EVEN THOUGH THE SAME USE.
SO, BUT, BUT WE'VE BASICALLY NO ONE, WELL, THEY COULD, BUT IT'S NOT LIKELY THAT ANYONE WOULD PUT A, A FAST FOOD JOINT THAT FAR OFF THE ROAD.
UH, SO IT, IT COULD BE A, A LOWER END USE, WHICH WOULD MEAN THAT, THAT THERE WOULD BE LESS TRAFFIC IMPACT.
I MEAN, IT'S POSSIBLE, BUT I MEAN, TO HAVE A SUCCESSFUL BUSINESS BACK THERE, YOU'RE GONNA NEED TO GENERATE SOME TRAFFIC.
DID THAT ANSWER YOUR QUESTION? WAS THAT PRETTY MUCH? OKAY, SO THE, THE WHAT'S BEFORE US, THIS WAS, WE HAD A REALLY GOOD 50 MINUTE DISCUSSION HERE.
SO WHAT'S BEFORE US IS, ARE WE READY TO TAKE ACTION ON THIS SPECIAL USE PERMIT IN APRIL? 'CAUSE WE'LL HAVE TO, I I'M NOT ASKING FOR A VOTE.
[00:50:01]
ANY OTHER INFORMATION YOU NEED TO BE READY TO TAKE ACTION ON THIS AT THIS POINT? I'VE GOT ONE MORE QUESTION.START OUT AT WORKS FOR AS WORKFORCE HOUSING, CORRECT? YOU'RE ASKING ME LAUREN.
AND NOW IT'S GONE TO APARTMENTS AND I UNDERSTAND THAT THERE'S BEEN TALK OF CONDOS.
I THINK WE DON'T KNOW WHAT'S GONNA BE WHERE.
WELL, HOLD ON, THERE'S A CAVEAT WITH THAT.
SO OUR ORDINANCE IS FOR APARTMENTS.
WE DON'T DISTINGUISH BETWEEN LIKE THE PRICE OF THE APARTMENTS WHEN THEY'RE SUBMITTING THAT APPLICATION.
SO THE APPLICATION IS FOR APARTMENTS IN THE C ONE DISTRICT.
THAT'S THE, THE I UNDERSTAND THAT THE GENTLEMAN WAS TOLD, BUT SO THEN THE APPLICANT BEFORE THE MEETING EMAILED SAYING THEY'RE POTENTIALLY CONSIDERING CONDOMINIUM AND HAS TO BE A MOVING APPLICATION.
IT, WE DON'T HAVE ANYTHING IN OUR ORDINANCE FOR PROHIBITING THE CONDOMINIUM.
AND MY UNDERSTANDING IS THAT IN STATE CODE WE CAN'T PROHIBIT, BUT THAT'S SOMETHING THAT'S GONNA COME AFTER.
SO THEY GET THE APPROVAL FOR THE APARTMENT THAT IF THEY CHOOSE TO TURN THAT INTO A CONDO ASSOCIATION, THAT'S THEIR PREROGATIVE.
WE DON'T HAVE SEPARATE REQUIREMENTS OR CONDOMINIUMS THAT ARE SEPARATE FROM APARTMENT.
BUT WITHOUT THE SPECIAL USE PERMIT FOR APARTMENTS, THEY COULDN'T DO CONDOMINIUMS. THEY CAN'T DO ANY OF IT.
SO THIS IS JUST THE FIRST LEVEL OF APPROVAL.
THERE IS NOTHING DECEPTIVE OR ANYTHING ABOUT THAT WITH THE APPLICATION.
IT IS WHERE APARTMENTS, IF THEY CHOOSE TO TURN A CONDOS AFTERWARDS, THAT IS ON THE APPLICANT.
THAT IS NOT A, SOMETHING STAFF HAS CONTROL OVER.
SO, BUT I, 'CAUSE JOSH, I THINK I HEARD YOU SAY SOMETHING ABOUT ANOTHER MEETING.
JUST WANNA CLARIFY WHAT YOU JUST SAID.
THIS SPECIAL USE PERMIT IS FOR APARTMENTS.
IF IT IS APPROVED AND THEY DECIDE TO CHANGE THE CONDOMINIUMS, IT'S NOT COMING BACK TO COUNCIL, IT'S NOT COMING BACK TO STAFF.
IT'S NOT A LAND USE ISSUE, RIGHT? IT'S AN OWNERSHIP ISSUE, RIGHT? MM-HMM
IT'S, IT'S NOT A LAND USE ISSUE.
SO WE'RE LOOKING AT THAT USE, IT'S A MULTI-FAMILY, YOU KNOW, RESIDENTIAL USE, HOW THEY DICTATE OWNERSHIP IS NOT A ZONING CONCERN.
SO WHEN THEY SUBMIT THAT APPLICATION, THEY'RE APPLYING FOR APARTMENTS, THE STRUCTURE, THE BUILDING, ALL OF THAT IS THE SAME.
WHETHER THEY CALL THEM APARTMENTS AND THEY RENT THEM OUT, OR IF THEY DO SOME TYPE OF THE CORPORATION, WHATEVER THEY HAVE TO DO TO TURN IT INTO CONDOS.
BUT IT'S NOT A LAND USE SUSPICION.
WHAT DO YOU SEE AS THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN APARTMENTS AND CONDOS? CONDOS OWNER.
CONDOMINIUMS WOULD BE OWNED INDIVIDUALLY.
SO THEY WOULD SELL THEM WHEREAS IT COULD BE LIKE A TOWNHOUSE, RIGHT? RIGHT.
SO AS IF THEY'RE APARTMENTS, THEN THEY'RE RENTED AND YOU'RE GONNA HAVE LIKE BASICALLY A, A PROPERTY MANAGER THERE MANAGER THERE COLLECTING THE RENT EACH MONTH.
CONDOS, THEY WOULD TAKE OUT A MORTGAGE AND THEY WOULD OWN THAT CONDO.
INTERIOR WALLS OF THAT BUILDING ARE THEIRS.
JUST OUTTA CURIOSITY FROM THIS COUNCIL'S PERCEPTION, DO YOU ALL THINK THAT, DO PEOPLE THINK THAT, THAT THERE'S SOME NEGATIVITY TO BE IN A CONDO INSTEAD OF AN APARTMENT? THERE'S A HUGE NEED FOR CONDOS IN OUR AREA.
I WAS GONNA, I I HAVE CLIENTS.
NO, I JUST ASKED THE QUESTION.
NO, I KNOW, BUT PEOPLE HAVE BROUGHT UP ABOUT THE CON BROUGHT IT UP AS LIKE IT'S CONDOS.
AND I'M THINKING MYSELF BY THAT DESCRIPTION.
I THINK THAT'S LIKE, BE BETTER THAN CONDOS.
CONDOS MITIGATE A LOT OF THE ISSUES THAT WE'RE HAVING WITH PROPERTY MAINTENANCE, ET CETERA, BECAUSE THEY'RE OWNER OCCUPIED.
SO I HAVE PEOPLE ALL THE TIME WHO ARE SELLING THEIR HOMES ON HIGH KNOB OR THE MOUNTAIN ON LINDEN BECAUSE THEY NO LONGER CAN CARE FOR THEIR YARD AND THEY NEED A PLACE TO LIVE AND OWN THAT THEY DON'T HAVE TO DO MAINTENANCE ON AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
SO OWNER OCCUPIED CONDOS ARE, UM, NOT A BAD THING FOR THE COMMUNITY WHATSOEVER.
HOWEVER, FOR THE DEVELOPER, IT'S GONNA BE TRICKIER.
THEY CAN'T BE SOLD UNTIL THEY'RE A HUNDRED PERCENT COMPLETE.
SO YOU CAN'T START SELLING 'EM BEFORE THEY'RE COMPLETED AND THINGS LIKE THAT.
SO IT'S HARDER FOR THE PROFITABILITY FOR THE DEVELOPER, BUT BECAUSE THERE'S NEED FOR IT, I COULD SEE WHY THEY'D BE INTERESTED.
AND THIS WOULD NOT, I MEAN IF WE WENT THE CONDOS, IT'S NOT GONNA BE AFFORDABLE HEALTH.
IT'S NOT, I DON'T, I MEAN IT'S NOT GONNA FALL UNDER THAT CATEGORY OF THE ONES WE JUST DID OUR RENT.
SO THE CONDOS COULD BE AFFORDABLE.
VHDA DOES LOANS FOR MORTGAGES FOR AFFORDABLE HOUSING.
LOOK AT THE COST GOING UP IN BREAKFAST.
BUT I'M, I'M STILL A LITTLE CONFUSED ON, I MEAN, I, I GET EVERYTHING YOU'RE SAYING ABOUT THE LAND USE BUILDING USED AND ALL THAT, BUT I'M NOT UNDERSTANDING HOW YOU CAN EQUATE AN APARTMENT BEING THE SAME THING
[00:55:01]
AS A CONDO.IF ONE IS OWNERSHIP AND ONE NOT.
WE'RE LOOKING AT THE LAND USE OF IT.
SO WE'RE LOOKING AT THE RESIDENTIAL USE OF IT.
SO IT IS A SEPARATE DWELLING PIECE OF GROUND.
I'M NOT CONCERNED WITH WHO'S LIVING IN IT.
HOW THEY'RE, YOU KNOW, WHETHER THEY'RE PAYING RENT OR THEY'RE PAYING A MORTGAGE.
THAT'S A, COULD HE BUILD TWO HOUSES AND THAT'S IT? UH, NOT IN THE C ONE DISTRICT.
WELL THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING IS WHEN YOU'RE, TO ME IT'S BASICALLY YOU'RE SAYING LIKE HE COULD BUILD A HOUSE THERE BECAUSE A CONDO IS, IS A HOUSE LOOKS LIKE TOWNHOUSES.
THE CONDO MULTIFAMILY, THE CONDOS THAT JUST WENT UP IN WIN WINCHESTER AND OLD TOWN WINCHESTER ARE ESSENTIALLY TOWNHOUSES.
THEY'RE, IT'S A ROW OF TOWNHOUSES, BUT THEY'RE CONDOS.
BUT I'M SAYING THAT THIS SUP IS TO CHANGE IT FROM, OR TO ALLOW THEM TO BUILD MULTI-FAMILY MULTIFAMILY ON A COMMERCIAL ZONE PLACE.
THAT'S WHAT YOU'RE LOOKING AT.
THAT'S WHY THIS, I WAS LOOKING AT THE WORD APARTMENT.
THAT'S WHAT WAS, SO IF COUNCIL DOESN'T APPROVE THIS, THEN THE ONLY USE FOR THAT IS COMMERCIAL.
THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT CALL IT A SEPARATE APPLICATION.
SO I'M GONNA ASK ONE MORE TIME, UNLESS I HEAR ANYBODY SAY DIFFERENTLY, I'M ASSUMING, OR A MAJORITY SAYS DIFFERENTLY THAT THEY'RE NOT READY FOR THIS VOTE IN APRIL.
UM, I'M GONNA ASK MS. PRESLEY TO THAT.
WE'RE GONNA PUT IT ON APRIL AND ADVERTISE IT AS A PUBLIC HEARING AND PEOPLE CAN COME AND SPEAK AGAIN.
THAT IS, UH, A VIRTUAL, UM, PRESENTATION, BYEC, AND I'M GONNA LET MR. WILSON DO THE TALKING.
SO THE, UH, PAM DID, UH, CONTRACT WITH STATE TECH CONSULTING THERE AT THE END OF LAST YEAR.
UH, IT'S NORMAL WORK AND COST OF SERVICE STUDY.
LAST FULL COST OF SERVICE STUDY WE HAD IN THOUSAND 19.
WE DID UPDATE THE, UH, NUMBERS IN 2021 WHEN WE RECEIVED THE, UH, ARPA FUNDING, UH, WHICH WE WENT TO THE, UH, I AND I ABATEMENT PROJECTS AND THE REDUNDANT WATER LINE.
UM, WE TRY TO DO WATER OR, UH, COST OF SERVICE STUDIES EVERY FIVE YEARS, UH, TO MAKE SURE THAT OUR, UH, RATES ARE IN CONFORMANCE WITH, UH, THE, OUR DEBT SERVICE OBLIGATIONS THAT WE HAVE.
UM, AND THAT'S KIND OF WHERE WE'RE AT AT THIS POINT.
UM, WITH US, WE HAVE DAVID HEDER HEER, AND KEVIN COOK WITH STANTEC.
AND, UM, I THANK YOU GUYS FOR COMING HERE AND I KIND OF WANNA TURN IT OVER TO THEM.
CAN YOU HEAR US THERE? CAN YOU HEAR US DJ? YES, SIR.
OH, BRING UP THE PRESENTATION HERE.
UM, SO WE CAN'T SEE THE PRESENTATION, SO WE'LL JUST HAVE TO, UM, KIND OF STEP THROUGH, I GUESS, WHEN YOU CAN DO THE, SHARE THE PRESENTATION AND TALK HERE.
WE DON'T NEED TO SEE YOUR FACE WHILE YOU'RE DOING THAT.
MAYBE IF WE START TO ASK QUESTIONS WE COULD, BUT YEAH.
AND WHEN YOU PUT IT ON SHARE, IF YOU CAN JUST SHARE TO THE WHOLE, LIKE, FULL SCREEN, BECAUSE IT WAS PRETTY SMALL THERE.
WE CERTAINLY DON'T NEED TO SEE US.
WELL, WELL, KEVIN'S BLOWN THAT UP.
I, I DO APPRECIATE THE OPPORTUNITY, UH, TO SPEAK THIS EVENING AND ALLOW, ALLOWING US TO DO IT, UH, VIRTUALLY DO APPRECIATE THAT.
UM, ARE YOU ABLE TO SHARE KEVIN? YES.
THAT, THAT, THAT'S GOOD RIGHT THERE.
Y'ALL THINK THAT'S BIG ENOUGH? BUT YOU'RE ALL OKAY WITH THAT? YEAH.
UM, WE DO HAVE A BRIEF PRESENTATION.
HOPEFULLY GET, GET THROUGH IT IN ABOUT 20, 25 MINUTES.
AND, UM, JUST IN TERMS OF OUR AGENDA, UM, I'M GONNA PROVIDE, IF YOU WANNA GO TO THE NEXT SLIDE, I'M GONNA PROVIDE A LITTLE BIT OF BACKGROUND ON STANTEC, JUST TALK ABOUT BACKGROUND TO THE STUDY, KIND OF LAY THE FRAMEWORK FOR, UM, A RATE STUDY.
AND THEN I'LL TURN IT OVER TO KEVIN COOK, WHO IS THE PROJECT MANAGER, AND HE'LL TAKE YOU THROUGH THE, UM, THE DETAILS, THE ANALYSIS AND, AND OUR RECOMMENDATIONS.
AND THEN WE'D BE HAPPY TO, UM, ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS YOU MAY HAVE.
SO JUST A LITTLE BIT ABOUT STANTEC.
UH, WE HAVE HAD THE OPPORTUNITY TO WORK WITH THE TOWN IN THE PAST.
UM, KEVIN AND I ARE PART OF THE FINANCIAL SERVICES GROUP, SO THERE'S OVER 30 OF US THAT DO, UM, REALLY UTILITY RATE STUDIES ALL ACROSS THE COUNTRY, UH, BOTH IN THE MID-ATLANTIC.
UM, I'VE BEEN DOING RATE STUDIES IN THE MID-ATLANTIC FOR ABOUT 25 YEARS NOW.
SO A LOT OF EXPERIENCE IN, UH, VIRGINIA, MARYLAND.
UM, BUT THIS IS REALLY OUR BREAD AND BUTTER WORK.
WHAT WE DO IS, UM, THESE EXCITING UTILITY RATE STUDIES.
[01:00:01]
US.UM, IN TERMS OF THIS STUDY, WE GO TO THE NEXT SLIDE.
UH, WE WERE CONTRACTED BY THE TOWN TO PERFORM SOME SPECIFIC TASKS.
UH, THE BIGGEST, MOST SIGNIFICANT TASK IS REALLY THE REVENUE SUFFICIENCY ANALYSIS, AND THAT'S WHERE WE'RE LOOKING AT WHAT DOES IT COST TO PROVIDE WATER AND SEWER SERVICE TODAY AND THEN INTO THE FUTURE.
SO WE DO LOOK AT OVER A 10 YEAR PERIOD, AND THEN WE EXAMINE WHETHER YOUR CURRENT WATER AND SEWER RATES ARE SUFFICIENT TO MEET THOSE REVENUES OR THOSE REVENUE REQUIREMENTS.
AND THEN IF THEY'RE NOT, WE WOULD PROPOSE, WE'LL BE TALKING ABOUT THIS EVENING, SOME POTENTIAL ADJUSTMENTS TO RAISE.
WE'VE ALSO LOOKED AT YOUR WATER AND SEWER DEVELOPMENT CHARGES.
SO THESE ARE THE ONE-TIME CHARGES FOR NEW CONNECTIONS TO THE SYSTEM.
WE'VE EVALUATED WHAT YOU CHARGE INSIDE VERSUS OUTSIDE THE TOWN TO MAKE SURE THOSE SURCHARGES ARE APPROPRIATE.
AND THEN ONE OF THE MISCELLANEOUS CHARGES WE'VE LOOKED AT, UM, SPECIFICALLY THIS YEAR IS THE SEPAGE HALL FEES AND COME UP WITH SOME RECOMMENDATIONS RELATED TO THOSE.
SO JUST A LITTLE BIT MORE BACKGROUND IN TERMS OF, I KNOW WE TALK A LOT OF JARGON WHEN WE'RE TALKING ABOUT A RATE STUDY.
I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE IT'S CLEAR THAT THERE'S REALLY, THERE'S THREE KEY COMPONENTS THAT WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THIS EVENING, BUT TWO PRIMARY DRIVERS.
AND SO RATES, YOUR MONTHLY RATES, WHAT SHOWS UP ON SOMEBODY'S WATER BILL, UM, ARE THE PRIMARY SOURCE OF REVENUES FOR THE UTILITY.
AND THESE RECOVER THE COST OF OPERATING AND MAINTAIN THE SYSTEM.
ANY DEBT SERVICE THEY PAY FOR RENEWAL AND REPLACEMENT COSTS IN THE SYSTEM.
SO THAT'S BY FAR THE LARGEST REVENUE SOURCE.
UM, WE ALSO HAVE SYSTEM DEVELOPMENT CHARGES.
DID I LOSE AUDIO? NO, NO, YOU JUST, OH, SORRY.
IT SOUNDED STRANGE FOR A SECOND.
UM, WE HAVE SEPTIC TAKE, UH, WASTE FEES, WHICH ARE MISCELLANEOUS CHARGES THAT WHEN SOMEBODY BRINGS, UM, SEPTIC COLLEGE BRING WASTE TO THE WASTEWATER TREATMENT PLANT, UM, THEY PAY FOR THAT, UM, THAT SERVICE FOR YOU TO TAKE THE SEPAGE.
AND THEN THE FINAL KEY COMPONENT IS A SYSTEM DEVELOPMENT CHARGE.
SO THIS IS A WAY THAT YOU CAN HAVE, UM, GROWTH, PAY FOR GROWTH.
SO AS NEW CUSTOMERS JOIN THE SYSTEM, YOU'RE ESSENTIALLY RECOVERING A PORTION OF THE COST OF PROVIDING THAT INFRASTRUCTURE TO MAKE CAPACITY AVAILABLE FOR NEW CUSTOMERS.
SO THAT'S GONNA, THE FRAMING, KEVIN'S GONNA TAKE US THROUGH EACH OF THESE IN TERMS OF THE ANALYSIS AND THE RECOMMENDATIONS, BUT, SO I'LL TURN IT OVER TO KEVIN.
SO DO YOU ALSO HAVE THIS IN YOUR EMAIL TOO, IF ANYBODY, IF THIS ACTUALLY GO AHEAD.
AND IF ANYONE HAS ANY QUESTIONS WHILE I'M GOING THROUGH THIS, FEEL FREE TO, YOU KNOW, JUMP IN.
SO I'M GONNA BE TALKING ABOUT THE REVENUE SUFFICIENCY ANALYSIS ANALYSIS FIRST.
UH, SO IN ORDER TO COMPLETE THIS ANALYSIS, UM, THE FIRST THING WE HAD TO DO IS INCORPORATE THE TOWN'S WATER AND SEWER SYSTEM OPERATING IN FINANCIAL DATA INTO OUR PROPRIETARY FINANCIAL ANALYSIS MANAGEMENT TOOL.
AND THIS DATA INCLUDED THINGS LIKE THE OPERATING EXPENSE, REVENUE BUDGETS, UH, THE CURRENT FIVE YEAR PLAN OF CAPITAL SPENDING, UH, ANY OUTSTANDING DEBTS, UM, AND THEN THINGS ASSUMPTIONS LIKE, UM, ANY ANTICIPATED GROWTH IN ACCOUNTS OR FUTURE VOLUME USAGE, UH, INTEREST EARNINGS ON FUND BALANCE, OR, UM, YOU KNOW, ANY OTHER MISCELLANEOUS ASSUMPTIONS.
NOW, WHAT THIS SLIDE HERE IS SHOWING ARE SOME OF THE, THE KEY ASSUMPTIONS IN DATA THAT WE USED.
SO STARTING AT THE TOP, YOU CAN SEE THAT WE INCLUDED A TARGET OF NINE MONTHS OF OPERATING EXPENSES IN EACH YEAR.
UM, AND ESSENTIALLY THAT WAS DONE TO ENSURE THAT WE HAVE SUFFICIENT BALANCE IN THE WATER AND SEWER FUNDS TO COVER ANY SORT OF EMERGENCIES OR UNFORESEEN SPEND.
UH, WE ALSO INCLUDED DEBT SERVICE COVERAGE TARGET OF 1.5, WHICH IS RIGHT LINE WITH, YOU KNOW, INDUSTRY STANDARD.
AND IT'S ALSO WHAT, UM, A LOT OF RATING AGENCIES ARE LOOKING FOR.
THE REST OF THESE DATA POINTS, UH, HAVE TO DO WITH THE CAPITAL SPEND.
SO IF YOU LOOK AT THE BOTTOM RIGHT, UH, LEFT HAND NUMBER, YOU CAN SEE THAT THE TOTAL 10 YEAR WATER CIP WAS ABOUT $41.7 MILLION.
UH, AND A LITTLE BIT LESS THAN HALF OF THAT WAS ANTICIPATED TO BE FUNDED THROUGH, UM, LOW INTEREST LOANS SECURED THROUGH STATE REVOLVING FUNDS.
UM, AND OF THAT ROUGHLY $20 MILLION, 15 MILLION OF THAT WAS FOR THE INTAKE UPGRADE PROJECT, WHICH WAS IN FISCAL YEAR 2031.
NOW, ON THE SEWER SIDE, A LITTLE BIT LESS SPENDING, SO IT'S ABOUT 14.6 $15 MILLION OVER THE 10 YEARS.
AND AGAIN, SIMILARLY ABOUT HALF OF THAT WAS ASSUMED TO BE, UH, PAID THROUGH SRF FUNDING.
BJ, SO IF WE JUMP, IT'S GONNA HAPPEN IN 2031, RIGHT? I'M SORRY.
HE MEANS THAT'S GONNA BE A 2031.
UM, THAT'S WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT CURRENTLY UNDER THE CURRENT LEGISLATION.
WE HAVE MONEY, UH, I'M GONNA HAVE THAT MONEY INCLUDED INTO THE FISCAL YEAR 26 BUDGET TO KIND OF EXPLORE
[01:05:01]
OUR OPTIONS AND SEE WHAT WE CAN DO.UM, SO WE'RE LOOKING AT, UH, THEY DID LOOK AT A 10 YEAR PERIOD, BUT UM, THE IMPLEMENTATION PERIOD THAT WE'RE LOOKING AT IS FIVE YEARS.
UH, 2031, WE WOULD PROBABLY BE DOING ANOTHER RATE STUDY AT THAT POINT AND HAVE BETTER INFORMATION.
AND WE DO LOOK AT A, A, A 10 YEAR PROJECTION PERIOD.
SO YEAH, YOU'RE RIGHT THAT IN 31, THAT IS TECHNICALLY OUT OF THE FIVE YEAR RECOMMENDED RATE PERIOD.
UH, BUT WE DO LIKE TO LOOK AT IT FROM A 10 YEAR PERSPECTIVE.
SO WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT HERE IS THE, UM, RESULTS SCREEN OF OUR PANEL OR DASHBOARD OF OUR FINANCIAL MODEL, UH, SPECIFICALLY FOR THE WATER FUND.
UH, SO THERE'S QUITE A BIT GOING ON HERE.
SO I'LL JUST DRAW ATTENTION TO A COUPLE KEY POINTS.
UH, FIRST BEING THAT BLUE LINE AT THE VERY TOP, WHICH REPRESENTS THE RECOMMEND RATE PLAN.
SO YOU CAN SEE THAT WE HAVE 3% FROM FISCAL YEAR 26 THROUGH FISCAL YEAR 30, AT WHICH POINT WE'RE BUMPING IT UP SLIGHTLY TO 4% FROM 31.
AND ON NEXT KEY POINT WOULD BE THE OPERATING FUND GRAPH.
SO IT'S THAT TOP LEFT HAND GRAPH.
AND THOSE BLUE BARS REPRESENT THE ENDING FUND BALANCE IN EACH GIVEN YEAR.
AND YOU CAN SEE THAT WITH THIS PLAN BREAKS, THOSE BLUE BARS ARE ABOVE OR AT THE TARGET, WHICH IS THAT BLACK LINE, WHICH AGAIN IS THAT NINE MONTHS OF OPERATING EXPENSES.
UM, ONE THING THAT'S PRETTY OBVIOUS IS THAT THIS PLAN IS VERY HEAVILY DEPENDENT UPON THE CAPITAL SPEND PLAN.
SO YOU CAN SEE THAT, YOU KNOW, IN 26, UH, 31, OBVIOUSLY SOME HIGH SPIKES OF CAPITAL.
AND YOU CAN SEE THAT BECAUSE OF THOSE CAPITAL SPENDING SPIKES, WE ARE SPENDING THAT FUND BALANCE DOWN TO THAT LEVEL IN 35 WHERE WE'RE REACHING THE TARGET.
IF WE MOVE ON TO THE SEWER FUND, IT'S KIND OF THE SAME IDEA.
SO UP AT THE TOP YOU CAN SEE OUR RECOMMENDED RATE PLAN, WHICH IS 200 QUARTER PERCENT, AND THAT'S FROM 26.
AND ON, UH, THE SEWER FUND IS A LITTLE BIT SIMPLER THAN THE WATER FUND.
UH, THE CAPITAL SPENDING IS MORE LEVEL, UH, WITH THE EXCEPTION OF IN FISCAL 26, THE CENTER FUTURE PROJECT.
UM, BUT THE REASON THAT THAT'S NOT REALLY AFFECTING THE OPERATING FUND BALANCES UP IN THAT TOP LEFT HAND CHART AS MUCH IS BECAUSE THAT IS TO BE FUNDED THROUGH, UH, SRF FUNDING.
SO IF WE MOVE ON WHAT THAT MEANS FOR THE AVERAGE CUSTOMER, UH, SO WHAT WE HAVE HERE IS A TYPICAL RESIDENTIAL MONTHLY BILL, UH, WITH A THREE-FOUR METER 5,000, UH, 500 GALLON USAGE.
AND YOU CAN SEE THAT FOR WATER, CUSTOMERS CAN EXPECT TO SEE ABOUT, ABOUT A DOLLAR CHANGE MONTHLY.
UH, FROM 26 TO 30, IT'S ABOUT 3% ON THE SEWER SIDE, UH, YOU CAN EXPECT ABOUT A DOLLAR 30 TO A DOLLAR 45, WHICH THE TWO AND A QUARTER.
AND THEN IN AGGREGATE THEIR TOTAL BILL EACH MONTH, UH, MONTHLY YOU CAN SEE ABOUT $2 27 CENTS TO $2 50 CENTS, WHICH IS, UH, IN AGGREGATE ABOUT 2.5%.
SO PRETTY MODEST INCREASES, WHICH IS ACCENTUATED BY THIS, UH, GRAPH WE HAVE HERE, WHICH IS A BENCHMARKING SURVEY THAT WE PERFORMED WHERE WE LOOKED AT THE TOWNS RATES COMPARED TO SOME OTHER LOCAL UTILITIES.
AND YOU CAN SEE THAT THE TOWN IS, UH, DEFINITELY ON THE LOWER END AS FAR AS MONTHLY BILLS.
UM, AND EVEN WITH THE PROPOSED INCREASES, WITH THE PROPOSED INCREASES, WE KEEP A RELATIVE POSITION IN THAT YOU ARE WELL BELOW THE AVERAGE.
SO WE, I WAS JUST SHARING WITH THEM AT THE END OF WHEN I WAS DOING ALL THAT STUFF FOR, UH, THE LEGISLATIVE SESSION.
VIENNA IS ABOUT LIKE, I THINK IT'S LESS THAN A THOUSAND PE LIKE WE'RE VERY CLOSE YES.
THEY'RE WITHIN LIKE A THOUSAND, MAYBE 1500 POPULATION OF US, MAYBE NINE EVEN.
WELL, I MEAN, CHARLESBURG JUST 10 MILES DOWN THE ROAD.
RIGHT?
WE DO SEE AROUND THE COUNTRY THAT TYPICALLY A NATIONAL AVERAGE IS ABOUT $115 PER MONTH FOR A WATER AND SEWER BILL.
SO YOU GUYS ARE DOING QUITE WELL IN TERMS OF YOUR WATER AND SEWER BILLS.
NO, NATIONAL, YEAH, IT'S NOT MUCH DIFFERENCE OR PERSON
[01:10:08]
FORWARD, READY TO MOVE ON.SO THE NEXT COMPONENT OF OUR SCOPE WAS, UH, THE SEPTIC TANK WASTE FEED ANALYSIS.
SO, UH, CURRENTLY THE WAY THAT THIS WORKS IS, UH, THE TOWN BILLS WARREN COUNTY $50 PER THOUSAND GALLONS FOR SEPTIC WASTE THAT IS RECEIVED FROM HAULERS AT THE WASTEWATER TREATMENT PLANT.
UH, THE COUNTY THEN BILLS THE HAULERS AND ULTIMATELY AND REIMBURSES THE TOWN, UH, TWICE A YEAR.
THE REASON WE WERE ASKED TO, UH, UPDATE THE SPEED, I'M SORRY, I JUST, JUST WANTED TO CORRECT.
UH, WE'RE, UH, WE BILL MONTHLY FOR THE, UH, SEPTIC CALLS AND, AND WARREN COUNTY BILL, UH, PAYS US, UH, PAYS THE TOWN MONTHLY.
SO THIS CURRENT, UH, THE REASON WE'RE ASKED TO UPDATE THIS FEE IS BECAUSE THIS FEE HAS NOT, NOT KEPT PACE WITH INCREASES, UH, TO THE SORT TREATMENT COSTS.
UM, ESSENTIALLY WHEN THE FLEET FEE WAS IMPLEMENTED HASN'T REALLY INCREASED SINCE THEN.
UH, SO OBVIOUSLY, YOU KNOW, THE COST OF TREATING WASTE HAS INCREASED OVER TIME.
UH, SO IN ORDER TO ACCOMPLISH THIS WOULD BE DETERMINED THAT, UH, THE HISTORICAL INCREASES THAT HAVE BEEN APPLIED TO THE SEWER VOLUMETRIC RATES COULD BE A REASONABLE BASIS TO GROSS UP THAT FEE TO CURRENT DAY LEVELS.
UH, I
UH, SO IF WE TOOK THAT CUMULATIVE AMOUNT, SLIDE IT TO THAT FEE, THAT SHOULD BRING US UP TO CURRENT DAY LEVELS.
SO YOU CAN SEE THE CALCULATIONS AT THE, AT THE BOTTOM OF THIS SLIDE, UH, THAT IF WE TAKE THAT APPROACH BY FISCAL YEAR OF 26, THIS FEE SHOULD BE INCREASED APPROXIMATELY 17%, UH, WHICH WOULD RESULT IN A PROPOSED FEE OF ABOUT, OF, UH, $58 AND 55 CENTS OR A THOUSAND GALLONS OF SEVEN.
THE COUNTY RECOVERS THAT FROM THE HAULER THOUGH, RIGHT? CORRECT.
WARREN COUNTY BILLS THE HAULER.
THEY, THEY ADD ON A PORTION, UH, TO PAY FOR THE DEBT SERVICE OF THE, UH, WASTEWATER TREATMENT PLANT CALL STATION.
AND THEN THEY PASS THAT ALONG TO THE HAULER.
BUT LIKE UNLIKE THE SOLID WASTE STUDY, UM, WE, THEY HAVE A WAY TO RECOVER THAT MONEY.
'CAUSE THE HAULER PAYS IT, RIGHT? CORRECT.
VERSUS WHAT WE WERE DOING WITH THE SUB, WITH THE SOLID WASTE.
WE, OUR WHOLE SYSTEM HAD TO CORRECT CUSTOMER SUITE.
SO ALONG WITH INCREASING THAT FEE TO CURRENT DAY COSTS, WE'RE ALSO RECOMMENDING THAT YOU ALSO INCREASE THAT FEE ANNUALLY.
UH, ESSENTIALLY TIE IT TO THE SEWER RATE PLAN, UH, JUST TO MAKE SURE THAT WE, YOU KNOW, KEEP THAT PARITY AND THAT THIS FEE IS RECOVERING THE COSTS APPROPRIATE TO, UH, YOU KNOW, THE SEWAGE TREATMENT COSTS.
WE HAVE NOT INCREASED OUR COST SINCE THE ORIGINAL $50.
SO ALL THOSE NUMBERS IS WHAT WE SHOULD HAVE INCREASED IT TO RECOVER IT.
AND SO WE'VE BEEN GOING IN THE HALL.
AND, UH, MY PLAN IS, IS THAT WE WOULD, UH, BRING THIS TO LIAISON MEETINGS, BUT COUNSEL IS OKAY WITH IT.
BRING THIS BOARD TO LIAISON MEETING FOR DISCUSSION.
THAT'S NICE OF US TO BRING IT TO LA LIAISON MEETING INSTEAD OF JUST IMPLEMENTING IT.
THE NEXT COMPONENT OF OUR ANALYSIS WAS, UH, UPDATING THE SYSTEM DEVELOPMENT CHARGES.
UH, SO AS DAVE MENTIONED, SYSTEM DEVELOPMENT CHARGES LEVIED AGAINST NEW GROWTH IN ORDER TO, UH, YOU KNOW, PAY FOR THE COST OF EXPANSION.
ESSENTIALLY, THE IDEA BEING THAT GROWTH SHOULD PAY FOR GROWTH.
SO THE TOWN CURRENTLY ASSESSES THIS FEE, UH, BASED UPON THE LARGEST OF EITHER THE METER SIZE OR THE SERVICE LINE SIZE, UH, FOR A CONNECTION.
UH, SO WE WERE TASKED WITH BASICALLY UPDATING THE FEE BASED UPON THE MOST RECENT, UH, AND CURRENT COSTS FOR THE SYSTEM.
THESE COSTS ARE ESSENTIALLY TWO DIFFERENT COMPONENTS.
SO THE FIRST WOULD BE ANY GROWTH RELATED CAPITAL IN THE CIP, UH, THE 10 YEAR CIP.
SO THAT'S ANYTHING THAT'S THROUGH FISCAL 2035.
AND THEN ALSO THE REPLACEMENT COSTS, NEW LESS DEPRECIATION OF, UH, THESE EXISTING SYSTEM ASSETS.
SO FOR WATER AND SEWER, WE LOOKED AT THIS, UM, THROUGH DIFFERENT FUNCTIONS.
SO FOR THE WATER SIDE, WE LOOKED AT THIS DATA THROUGH SUPPLY
[01:15:01]
AND TREATMENT AND TRANSMISSION AND DISTRIBUTION.AND ON THE SEWER SIDE, UH, WE LOOKED AT IT THROUGH TREATMENT AND COLLECTION.
UH, ONE THING TO NOTE THAT WITH THESE COSTS, WE THEN DID A FEW ADJUSTMENTS TO BACK OUT A COUPLE THINGS.
SO THE FIRST WOULD BE A CREDIT FOR ANY OUTSTANDING PRINCIPLE ON ANY, UH, EXPANSION RELATED DEBT.
UH, THE REASON WE DO THIS IS BECAUSE IN THE CAP CALCULATION OF OUR RATES, WE DO INCLUDE DEBT SERVICE.
SO WE WANNA MAKE SURE THAT WE'RE, WE'RE NOT DOUBLE COUNTING ANYTHING.
AND THEN ALSO WE ALL BACKED OUT ANY CONTRIBUTED OR DONATED ASSETS OR ANYTHING THAT WAS FUNDED THROUGH GRANTS.
ESSENTIALLY, WE JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT ALL THE COSTS THAT ARE BEING ATTRIBUTED TO THIS FEE IS AN ACTUAL COST.
SO WITH THIS UPDATE, YOU CAN SEE THE FOLLOWING FEES.
SO OUR WATER FEE INCREASED FROM 2,663 TO 4,466.
THE SEWER FEE INCREASED SLIGHTLY FROM SEVEN THOUSAND THREE HUNDRED THIRTY SEVEN THOUSAND THREE HUNDRED EIGHTY SIX, WHICH GIVES US A TOTAL COMBINED FEE OF 9,993 INCREASING TO 11,852.
AND THEN THIS IS FOR, UH, ONE ERU OR ONE EQUIVALENT RESIDENTIAL UNIT, WHICH IS A THREE FOURTH METER CUSTOMER.
I FLIP TO THE NEXT TAB, YOU CAN SEE WHAT THAT FEE WOULD BE FOR ALL THE DIFFERENT METER SIZES.
AND I'LL JUST KEEP THIS ON HERE FOR A MINUTE SO WE CAN TAKE A LOOK.
THE NEXT COMPONENT WOULD BE TO LOOK LIKE WE DID FOR THE RATES, UH, PERFORM A BENCHMARKING ANALYSIS.
SO AS YOU CAN SEE, MUCH LIKE THE WATER AND SEWER RATES, UH, THE TOWN CURRENTLY SITS ON THE LOWER HALF OF THE BENCHMARKING ANALYSIS.
UH, AND EVEN WITH THE UPDATED FEE, MAINTAIN YOUR RELATIVE POSITION, YOU ONLY MOVE UP UP ONE.
UM, AND THAT YOU'RE DEFINITELY ON THE LOWER END.
ANY QUESTIONS ON THE STCS? WE'RE GOOD.
SO THE LAST PART OF OUR SCOPE WAS THE INSIDE OUTSIDE TOWN COST DIFFERENTIAL ANALYSIS.
UH, ESSENTIALLY WE JUST WANTED TO, UH, TAKE A LOOK AT WHAT THE, UH, TOWN CURRENTLY HAS FOR, UH, SURCHARGE FOR OUTSIDE CUSTOMERS, WHICH IS 100%.
UH, AND ESSENTIALLY WE WANTED TO TAKE ALL THE COSTS AND ALLOCATE THEM BETWEEN COSTS THAT ARE FOR IN TREATING INSIDE AND OUTSIDE CUSTOMERS.
SO, UH, THIS WAS DONE BY TAKING ALL THE COSTS FROM THE BUDGET AND THEN ALLOCATING THEM TO EITHER INSIDE OR OUTSIDE CUSTOMERS, USING A NUMBER OF ALLOCATION FACTORS, UM, INCLUDING ACCOUNTS, FLOWS, DEBT, CIP, THINGS LIKE THAT.
ONCE WE HAD THOSE COSTS ALLOCATED TO EITHER INSIDE OR OUTSIDE, WE THEN TOOK LOOK AT THE CURRENT REVENUE GENERATION AND THEN COMPARE TO SEE IF THE COST RECOVERY IS APPROPRIATE.
SO BASED UPON THIS ANALYSIS, WE DETERMINED THAT WATER WAS SLIGHTLY UNDER RECOVERING AT ABOUT 90%, AND SEWER WAS OVER RECOVERING SLIGHTLY BY AT ABOUT 117%.
UH, BUT IF YOU TAKE THE COMBINED WEIGHTED AVERAGE, SO ALL THE COSTS RELATED TO OUTSIDE VERSUS ALL REVENUES RELATED TO OUTSIDE, YOU CAN SEE THAT THE, UH, COST RECOVERY PERCENTAGE OF 102.4% IS RIGHT ON TARGET WITH THE CURRENT SURCHARGE AMOUNT OF A HUNDRED PERCENT.
SO BASED UPON THIS, WE DON'T RECOMMEND ANY CHANGES TO THE CURRENT SURCHARGE.
UM, BUT WE WILL SAY THAT A, AGAIN, THIS IS JUST A SNAPSHOT IN TIME AND IT, AS THINGS CHANGE, IT IS GOOD TO OCCASIONALLY REEVALUATE.
UM, BUT CURRENTLY AS IT SITS, NO CHANGES ARE RECOMMENDED.
AND IN FIVE YEARS WE DO THIS AGAIN.
AND IF THAT NUMBER IS LARGER THAN 102, WE WOULD, UM, WE'VE REVIEWED THIS WITH EACH ONE OF OUR COST OF SERVICE STUDIES AND THERE'S NEVER BEEN A RECOMMENDATION, BUT WE, WE DO REVIEW IT TO MAKE SURE THAT OUR RATES ARE INDEED IN LINE FOR THE PE FOLKS THAT ARE OUTSIDE OF TOWN.
FOR THE FOLKS THAT ARE OUT OF TOWN.
SO IN SUMMARY RATE INCREASES, WE ARE RECOMMENDING A 3% INCREASE FROM FISCAL YEAR 26 TO 30.
AND THEN IN THOSE OUTER YEARS, UH, 4% INCREASE ON THE SEWER SIDE TWO AND A QUARTER WILL WORK
[01:20:01]
FOR THE 10 YEARS.UH, AND WHAT THAT MEANS TO A RE A TYPICAL CUSTOMER FISCAL 26, IT'S A MONTHLY BILL INCREASE OF ABOUT $2 AND 27 CENTS OR TWO AND A HALF PERCENT FOR THE SUB TO TAKE WASTE FEES.
WE RECOMMEND INCREASING THE FEE FROM $50 TO 58, 55 PER K GO.
UH, AND THEN FROM THERE WE COULD, WE RECOMMEND TO CONTINUE TO INCREASE THAT FEE, ESSENTIALLY TIE IT TO THE SEWER RATE INCREASES.
FOR THE SYSTEM DEVELOPMENT CHARGES, WE RECOMMEND TO INCREASE THE FEE TO THE CALCULATED AMOUNT, WHICH WOULD GO FROM 9,000 HUNDRED 93 TO A THOU 11,852, WHICH IS AN INCREASE OF 1,859.
AND THEN FOR THE INSIDE OUTSIDE COST DIFFERENTIAL, WE RECOMMEND NO CHANGES TO THE EXISTING SURCHARGE.
AND WITH THAT, WE'LL OPEN THE FLOOR AND ANY QUESTIONS, UH, NORMALLY WHAT WE DO IS WE BRING THIS FORWARD TO COUNCIL ALONG WITH BUDGET APPROVAL.
WE DO 'EM ON THE SAME NIGHT, UH, AS A REGARD ORDINANCE CHANGE.
UH, SO THESE ARE THE RATES WE WOULD INCORPORATE INTO THE FISCAL WILL BE YOUR 26TH BUDGET.
AND THEN THE NIGHT THAT WE APPROVED THE BUDGET, WE WOULD ALSO APPROVE THE NEW GRANTS.
UM, ANYBODY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS? SO WITH THIS, WHEN WE LOOK AT OUR IMPROVEMENTS, WE'RE LOOKING AT BARRING MONEY, LIKE FOR THE PUMP STATION AND THE CENTER, IT'S HUGE.
AND THEN OUR DEBT SERVICES ADDED IN, THAT'S PART OF WHAT WE'RE DOING WITH OUR RATES.
SO WE CAN MAKE THE REPAIRS, UPGRADES, AND IT'S ALL DONE ON A LEVEL BASIS.
SET ALL, WE GOTTA HAVE A MILLION DOLLARS THIS YEAR OR WHATEVER, CORRECT.
THIS HAS TAKEN OUR DEBT SERVICES INTO ACCOUNT AS WELL AS THE, UH, UM, UH, THE DEBT, UH, DEBT COVERAGE RATIO, UH, TO MAKE SURE WE'RE MEETING THOSE GUIDELINES FOR THOSE PARTICULAR PROGRAMS WHERE WE CAN GET THOSE LOW INTEREST RATES.
UM, AND UH, MAKE APPLICATION FOR THOSE PROCESS, UM, UH, FOR THOSE, UM, PROJECTS.
UH, BUT YES, IT'S TAKEN INTO THE MAJOR, UH, THE PROJECTS, THE, THE CENTRIFUGE, THE UH, PUMP STATIONS, THINGS LIKE THAT, THOSE BIG PROJECTS.
AND, UM, WHAT THE PLAN WOULD BE WOULD, ONCE WE GET MORE INFORMATION, WHEN UH, THE INTAKES, UH, WE WOULD COME BACK AND, AND REEVALUATE WHERE WE'RE AT.
LIKE I SAY, HOPEFULLY NEXT YEAR WE'LL HAVE THE MONEY, THE BUDGET TO DO A STUDY AND SEE WHAT WE NEED TO DO FOR THOSE INTAKES, UH, COMING DOWN THE ROAD.
SO BASICALLY WE'RE TALKING ABOUT $2 AND 27 CENTS.
I MEAN, THAT'S GIVE OR TAKE WHAT YOU USE IN WATER FOR THE AVERAGE.
BUT THAT'S THE AVERAGE, AVERAGE ACCOUNT.
I CAN ASSURE YOU WITH MY WATER, IT'LL BE MORE THAN THAT.
UM, SO DOES COUNCIL HAVE ANY QUESTIONS? YEAH.
SOME GOOD EDUCATIONAL MATERIAL.
I THINK PERHAPS, UM, WHEN WE MAKE THIS CHANGE, WE PRESENT AT THAT MEETING THE SLIDES THAT SHOW FRONT ROYAL IN COMPARISON TO THE REST OF US AROUND THE AREAS.
IT, UH, DEFINITELY SHOWS THAT WE'RE DOING THE THINGS DO AND YOU KNOW.
YEAH, I DON'T, I GUESS STRS HAS REALLY NICE WATER INFRASTRUCTURE FOR THEIR WATER AND SEWER 'CAUSE PRETTY HIGH THERE.
AND ALSO, UM, SO WE OBVIOUS HAVE TO ADVERTISE FOR THIS.
UM, AND WHEN ARE WE TALKING ABOUT DOING THAT? WHAT I WOULD DO IS I, I HAVE TO COME BACK TO COUNSEL WITH THE ACTUAL OR, UH, DRAFT ORDINANCE BECAUSE WE HAVE TO CHANGE THE ORDINANCE.
UM, AND I WOULD DO THAT ALONG WITH THE BUDGET.
UH, WHEN WE DO THE BUDGET APPROPRIATION ORDINANCE, WE WOULD DO IT THE SAME, MOST LIKELY WOULD BE MAY.
AND THIS WOULD START TO TAKE EFFECT IN JULY, RIGHT? JULY 1ST JULY WITH THE JULY BILL.
UM, THAT GIVES US PLENTY OF TIME TO GET THE WORD OUT FOR PEOPLE TO BE AWARE OF IT TOO, AT THAT SAME TIME.
I'M ASSUMING THE, UM, THE SEPTIC HOLLER THAT IT WOULD CHANGE THEN TOO IN JULY? THAT THAT WOULD YES.
I I, I'M JUST BEING QUITE FRANK WITH YOU, WHEN I LOOK AT THAT, WE'RE ALREADY IN THE HOLE AND WE'VE BEEN IN THE HOLE SINCE 2020 WITH THAT.
IT WOULD, IT, UH, IT WOULD REQUIRE A ORDINANCE CHANGE BECAUSE THE SET TO CALL IS PART OF THE ORDINANCE.
I RECOMMEND DOING IT ALL AT ONCE.
SO WE'RE JUST TWO MORE, TWO MORE MONTHS OF LOSING MONEY, BUT NOT MAJOR MONEY, I GUESS, IS WHAT WE'RE THINKING.
SO, SO I, I HAVE TO ASK A QUESTION.
SO HAVE WE, HAS COUNCIL SEEN THESE BEFORE? UM, AND I'M LOOKING AT THE SEWAGE HAULING RIGHT HERE.
I MEAN THE SEPTIC HALL, UH, NO, WE'VE NOT
[01:25:01]
REVIEWED THAT IN THE PAST.THE OTHER, THE OTHER INFORMATION WHEN I, IT WAS 2019 IS WHEN WE DID IT, BUT IT WAS GIVEN, THE INFORMATION WAS GIVEN IN 2020, THE BEGINNING.
I JUST REMEMBER IT WAS IMPLEMENTED IN 2020.
THE SOONER CHANGE, 'CAUSE WE WERE DOING IT ON A SCREEN.
I CAN REMEMBER SITTING IN THE HOUSE DOING ALL THAT ON A SCREEN BECAUSE WE WERE, WE WERE, WE WERE ON VIRTUAL MEETINGS AND VIRTUAL ACTION AND MS. PRE WAS CALLING ON US OVER THE, OVER THE SCREEN.
BUT THE SEPTIC CALLING, I THINK HAS BEEN A CONCERN OF MR. WILSON'S FOR, FOR A LITTLE WHILE.
UM, BUT WAITING UNTIL WE ACTUALLY HAD THE DATA TO SAY THIS WAS, I THINK SO I WILL, WE WILL PUT THIS ON THE APRIL LIAISON MEETING THAT YES.
AND I MEAN, IT WON'T BE PASSED BY THEN, BUT AT LEAST IT LETS THEM KNOW THAT STARTING IN JULY SEND, THEY CAN BUDGET APPROPRIATELY FOR IT.
UM, BUT EVEN IF WE, IF WE WERE TO PASS THIS IN MAY, COULD WE START THE FEE SOONER FOR THEM? YES.
THE UM, WE COULD MAKE IT, WE COULD MAKE THAT PORTION, UM, UM, EFFECTIVE OF ONE PASSAGE.
I THINK, I THINK THAT MIGHT BE A GOOD IDEA.
I KNOW LAST YEAR, LIKE THE, THE SOLID WASTING, THEY APPROVED IT LAST WEEK OF JUNE AND IT STARTED ON JULY ONCE.
I THINK WE'D BE OKAY TO SAY ONCE THAT'S PASSED, THE RATES WILL START EVEN, IT MIGHT ONLY BE ONE MONTH, BUT ONE MONTH'S BETTER THAN, YEAH.
SO OUR NEXT ITEM IS FOR A, AND THAT'S THE BID FOR WATERLINE UPGRADES IN NORTHWARD AVENUE, WEST 12TH STREET AND CHERRY STREET.
AND I BELIEVE MS. CAMPBELL'S HERE TO PRESENT ON THAT.
THIS IS GONNA TAKE LIKE TWO MINUTES, MAYBE DON'T SAY THAT.
THAT JUST J SOUNDS GOOD TO ME.
UH, SO PURCHASING ISSUE, THAT SOLICITATION FOR WATERLINE UPGRADES TO WEST 12TH STREET, CHERRY STREET, AND NORTH ROYAL AVENUE, HOLDING A PUBLIC BID OPENING ON FEBRUARY 12TH, RECEIVING SEVEN BIDS.
THE METHOD OF PROCUREMENT WAS COMPETITIVE, SEALED BIDDING PER THE VPP AND GUIDELINES.
UM, AND USING EVA TO, UM, ADVERTISE THE COMMONWEALTH OF VIRGINIA'S ONLINE PROCUREMENT WEBSITE.
THE WATER MAINTENANCE DEPARTMENT CURRENTLY HAS FUNDS PREVIOUSLY BUDGETED FOR THESE UPGRADES.
COUNSEL HAS REQUESTED TO APPROVE A BID FROM THE LOWEST RESPONSIVE AND RESPONSIBLE BIDDER GREENRIDGE CONTRACTORS OF HAGERSTOWN, MARYLAND FOR A FIRM FIXED PRICE IN THE AMOUNT OF 902,000 A HUNDRED.
WHAT, WHY DO I GET THIS WRONG? EVERY TIME.
WHAT? 902,000 $132 AND 25 CENTS.
COUNSEL, HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR MS. CAMPBELL? I'M ASSUMING THEN THAT WE CAN OH, GO AHEAD.
DOES IT GIVE YOU ANY, HAVE WE DONE BUSINESS WITH THEM BEFORE? WE'VE NOT DONE BUSINESS WITH THIS COMPANY BEFORE.
THE REASON WHY I ASK, I MEAN, THEY'RE OBVIOUSLY QUITE A BIT UNDER MM-HMM
WE DID REACH OUT TO THOUSAND OR MORE UNDER MM-HMM
WE DID REACH OUT TO 'EM TO CONFIRM THEIR PRICING, TO MAKE SURE THAT IT WAS ACCURATE.
UM, AND THAT THEY WERE, THEY WERE GOOD FOR IT.
AND THEN, UM, PUBLIC WORKS, ROBBIE REACHED OUT TO FIVE, UM, REFERENCES AND GOT GOOD REFERENCES FROM EACH OF 'EM.
I, I THINK IT'S GREAT TO SAVE MONEY.
IT JUST, IT'S SUCH A TERRIBLE DIFFERENCE.
THANKS FOR GOING THE EXTRA MILE TO MAKE SURE DEAL.
WE WANNA MAKE SURE IT WAS OKAY.
MAYBE THE OTHERS DIDN'T WANT THE JOB.
WHO KNOWS? MIGHT HAVE BEEN TOO BUSY.
I SAY WE PUT THIS ON THE CONSENT AGENDA WAS TOO MILLION DOLLARS UP.
DOES ANYBODY AGAINST PUTTING THIS ON THE CONSENT AGENDA? NO.
IT'LL GO ON THE CONSENT AGENDA.
SO THE NEXT ITEM IS A TRANSFER AND RETIRED BUCKET TRUCK TO WARREN COUNTY PUBLIC SCHOOLS.
AND I'M GONNA GIVE YOU GUYS A LITTLE BIT OF THE BACKGROUND ON THAT.
SO, UM, WE HAVE, WE HAD A BUCKET TRUCK IN ENERGY SERVICES THAT WE WERE NO LONGER GONNA NEED.
AND WE, THERE WAS THOUGHT THAT IT MIGHT GO TO AUCTION AND THE SCHOOL SYSTEM MIGHT HAVE BEEN INTERESTED IN IT.
AND THEN WE ENDED UP USING IT IN OUR FLEET.
SO WE KEPT IT IN PUBLIC WORKS.
BUT THE BUCKET TRUCK THAT PUBLIC
[01:30:01]
WORKS WAS USING, WHICH IS THIS 1989 GMC BUCKET TRUCK, WAS NOW GOING TO BE RETIRED.UM, AND SO I, I'VE BEEN COMMUNICATING BACK AND FORTH WITH THEIR DIRECTOR OF FACILITIES BECAUSE THE SCHOOLS, UM, HAVE TO OBVIOUSLY CHANGE LIGHTS IN PARKING LOTS, ATHLETIC FIELDS, SCHOOLS, THINGS LIKE THAT.
SO AGAIN, SOME BACKGROUND INFORMATION THAT I WASN'T AWARE OF.
UM, THEY HAVE TO RENT EQUIPMENT TO BE ABLE TO DO THAT.
I THINK THEY'VE SPENT ALMOST $10,000 ALREADY THIS YEAR ON RENTING EQUIPMENT.
'CAUSE IT, IT ISN'T JUST RENTING THE EQUIPMENT THAT'S GONNA LIFT THEM UP.
THEY HAVE TO RENT THE EQUIPMENT THAT MOVES THE EQUIPMENT FROM SCHOOL TO SCHOOL.
AND THEY GENERALLY TRY TO GET IT ALL ON LIKE THE SAME DAY.
SO IT REALLY IS AN EXPENSE TO THEM.
I'VE BEEN ASSURED BY DON
UM, I PERSONALLY SEE THIS AS A WIN-WIN FOR THE PUBLIC BECAUSE, UM, ALL OF US ARE PAY TAXES TO THE COUNTY WHO PAYS FOR THE SCHOOL SYSTEM.
AND SO BY SAVING THEM SOME MONEY, WE'RE ACTUALLY SAVING OUR CITIZENS SOME MONEY.
AND IT IS A BUCKET TRUCK THAT WE NO LONGER HAVE A NEED FOR.
SO, UM, IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING THAT LIKE IT'S HARD TO GET PARTS FOR IT.
SO, UH, SO WE'RE REALLY NOT, YEAH, WE'RE, IF WE WERE TO PUT IT UP FOR AUCTION, I DON'T KNOW THAT WE WOULD GET A LOT FOR IT.
SO WE'RE ON PERCENTAGE AGENDA THEN, RIGHT? YEAH, I, I WAS GONNA SAY THAT EXCEPT THAT I'D LIKE FOR IT TO NOT BE ON THE CONSENT AGENDA.
I'D LIKE FOR US TO HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY TO MAKE SURE THAT THE PUBLIC HEARS THAT WE ARE COLLABORATING AND PARTNERING WITH, UM, THE SCHOOL SYSTEM COUNTY OR WHOEVER IT IS THAT WOULD BE, THAT IS PAYING THOSE MAINTENANCE BILLS.
I I KIND OF, I'M SURPRISED THE COUNTY DOESN'T WANNA GET A BUCKET TRUCK THEMSELVES.
IS THIS THE FIRST TIME? IT SEEMS TO ME THAT NO.
WE, WE HAVE DONATED, WE HAVE DONATED TWO DIFFERENT BUCKET TRUCKS.
I'M SURE IT'S NOT SETTING PRESENT.
IN 2008, WE DONATED A BUCKET TRUCK TO THE COUNTY.
AND IN 2022, WE DONATED A BUCKET TRUCK TO THE COUNTY.
UM, THE, AND THE ONE, THE MOST RECENT ONE IN 2022, I THINK IT STARTED TO HAVE SOME ISSUES.
AND IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING THAT IT COST MORE TO FIX.
SO BECAUSE THE SCHOOL SYSTEM WAS ABLE TO USE THAT ONE, BUT NOW THAT THEY'RE NOT, UM, SO I WILL TELL YOU THAT I REALLY FEEL LIKE THEY WOULD BE VERY GRATEFUL FOR THIS.
IT'S A STATE, IT GOES BACK TO A SAFETY ISSUE WHEN PARKING LOT LIGHTS CAN'T GET CHANGED FOR MONTHS BECAUSE YOU GOTTA GET THE EQUIPMENT.
SO AGAIN, I JUST, I I I SEE THIS AND LET ME BE CLEAR, NOT BECAUSE I WORKED FOR THE SCHOOL SYSTEM, EVEN IF I WASN'T A TEACHER, I SEE THIS AS AN OPPORTUNITY FOR OUR CITIZENS TO BENEFIT FROM SOMETHING THAT, YOU KNOW, IT, IT'S GONNA BE A WIN-WIN AND IT'S GONNA BE A WIN-WIN FOR ANY CITIZEN IN THE TOWN WHO, YOU KNOW.
SO, AND IT'S REALLY NOT PROBABLY WORTH A LOT.
BUT IT'S WORTH SOMETHING TO THEM.
IT IS FULLY DE SO WE'RE NOT PUTTING IT ON CONSENT.
IS IT GONNA BE A BUSINESS ITEM? OH, I GUESS.
I MEAN, GUESS IT DOESN'T MATTER BECAUSE IT SAYS CONSENT, RIGHT? IT SAYS CONSENT ON.
WELL, I JUST WANT TO MAKE SURE THAT THE PUBLIC RECOGNIZES THAT WE ARE PARTNERS IN OUR COMMUNITY.
AND THAT'S THE REASON WHY I THOUGHT THAT IT, TO HAVE THE OPPORTUNITY FOR US TO SAY IT AGAIN FOR THE PEOPLE THAT AREN'T HERE, YOU KNOW, AREN'T LISTENING TO IT TONIGHT.
I WON'T HAVE, I DON'T HAVE TO CONVINCE THEM.
I JUST, WE JUST HAVE TO SAY WHAT WE'RE DOING.
I FELT LIKE I NEEDED TO CONVINCE EVERYBODY HERE FIRST BUSINESS, BUSINESS.
UM, AND, AND TINA, CAN THAT HAPPEN ON THE 24TH? YES.
POLL ATTACHMENT AGREEMENT TO EXTEND FOR A PERIOD OF 15 YEARS IN MUTUAL AGREEMENT FOR THE ATTACHMENT FACILITIES TO TOWN AND TO GREAT SPEED AND UTILITY POLLS.
UM, SO THE TOWN HAS SEVERAL POLL ATTACHMENT AGREEMENTS WITH VARIOUS FRANCHISEES.
UM, THE TOWN'S IN THE ENVIOUS POSITION OF OWNING UTILITY POLLS.
SO, UM, THIS IS NOT A FRANCHISE, THIS IS A FULL ATTACHMENT AGREEMENT.
A FRANCHISE CONVEYS RIGHTS, UH, TO THE FRANCHISEE TO USE TOWN RIGHTS OF WAY TO PROVIDE FACILITIES FOR SERVICES
[01:35:01]
PROVIDED TO THE PUBLIC.UM, SO, UM, COUNCIL WAS MADE AWARE OF A COUPLE OTHERS THAT WERE EXTENDED RECENTLY, AND THEY, THOSE WERE DONE ADMINISTRATIVELY BECAUSE THE AGREEMENT PROVIDED FOR ADMINISTRATIVE EXTENSIONS, UM, AND THOSE TWO GENERATED, UH, WILL GENERATE APPROXIMATELY A HUNDRED THOUSAND ADDITIONAL FUNDS FOR THE ENTER ELECTRIC ENTERPRISE FUND OVER THE NEXT FIVE YEARS.
THIS ONE COMES TO COUNCIL BECAUSE, UH, THE ORIGINAL ONE IS RUNNING ITS COURSE.
IT WAS, UM, IT WAS 20 YEARS, UH, AND IT, AND IT EXPIRES, UH, IN JUNE OF THIS YEAR.
AND SO THIS IS, THIS IS TO GO FORWARD ANOTHER 15 YEARS WITH BRIGHT SPEEDED FOR CENTRAL TELEPHONE.
UM, THIS ONE'S A LITTLE DIFFERENT IN THAT WORK.
THE TOWN'S ALSO ON BRIGHT SPEED POLES.
SO THIS ONE HAS MUTUAL LANGUAGE.
UM, UH, THE TOWN COULD BE ON THEIRS.
UH, THEY ARE ON A THOU, THEY HAVE A THOUSAND MORE ATTACHMENTS THAN WE DO.
THEY HAVE MORE ON OURS THAN WE HAVE ON THEIRS.
UH, THE INCREASE IS SEVEN, UH, $6 AND 50 CENTS PER ATTACHMENT.
UM, WHICH IS APPROXIMATELY, WELL, GIVEN THE DIFFERENTIAL IN NUMBERS OF ATTACHMENTS, ABOUT 5,000 A YEAR IN ADDITIONAL REVENUE FOR THE ENTERPRISE FUND.
NOT A WHOLE LOT THEN 10,000, NOT AS MUCH AS A HUNDRED THOUSAND, BUT THAT'S, WELL, THE A HUNDRED THOUSAND WAS TWO OVER THE COURSE OF FIVE YEARS.
UH, WHERE THE FRANCHISEE WAS EXCLUSIVELY, EXCLUSIVELY ON OUR POLLS, WE WEREN'T ON ANY OF THEIR FACILITIES.
SO, SO ACROSS 15 YEARS IT'LL BE $75,000.
SO BECAUSE IT'S IN EFFECT A NEW AGREEMENT, I WANT TO BRING IT TO COUNCIL.
ANYBODY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR MR? IT DOES NOT REQUIRE A PUBLIC HEARING.
IS THERE ANYBODY THAT, UM, HAS ANY QUESTIONS OR ANY CONCERNS ABOUT THAT? OKAY.
MR. PRESLEY WILL PUT THAT ON CONSENT.
AND THEN THE LAST ONE IS AUSTIN, MR. SONNET.
UM, AND THIS IS THAT, YOU KNOW, THIS IS THE LEASE AGREEMENT THAT KIND OF GOES BACK TO, UM, BEING ABLE TO ALLOW A COUPLE TIER OR CLASS THREE BUSINESSES ON MAIN STREET TO HAVE THEIR OWN, UH, TO OPT OUT TRASH.
SO LEGAL WAS TASKED WITH COMING UP WITH A LEASE AGREEMENT, UH, TO FACILITATE THESE TWO CLASS THREE, UH, USERS TO OPT OUT OF THE MAIN STREET PROGRAM.
UH, IT'S, THE PROBLEM IS SPACE, WHICH IS THE ENTIRE REASON FOR THE MAIN STREET SPECIAL DISTRICT LACK OF SPACE.
SO, OPTING OUT, YOU STILL HAVE A SPACE PROBLEM, WHERE ARE THE DUMPSTERS GONNA GO? SO, SO COUNSEL TASKS, LEGAL WITH COMING UP WITH A LEASE.
UM, AND SO WHAT WE'RE DOING IS TAKING THE SAME SPACE CURRENTLY USED FOR TOWN DUMPSTERS AND LEASING IT TO THE TWO USERS AS, AS, UH, LESSEES.
AND, UM, THERE'S BEEN SOME FEEDBACK.
UM, UH, THE MOST SIGNIFICANT PROBABLY IS THAT THE CURRENT ENCLOSURE HAS SOME DAMAGE.
AND LESSEE ARE ASKING THAT, THAT BE REMEDIED.
THE LEASE IS WRITTEN AS IS THE CONDITION IS AS IS.
SO MY POSITION WOULD BE, WELL LET, IF WE'RE GONNA FIX IT, LET'S FIX IT NOW BEFORE THE LEASE GOES INTO EFFECT AND LEAVE THE AS IS LANGUAGE ALONE.
AND HOW MUCH IS IT GONNA COST TO REPAIR? WAS IT LIKE 30,000? NO, 325.
3 25 FOR THE MATERIALS STAFF'S TIME TO MAKE THE REPAIR.
AND THIS IS A FIVE YEAR LEASE WITH EXTENSIONS, BUT PROVIDED THERE'S MUTUAL AGREEMENT, RIGHT.
UM, SO WE'LL COME BACK BEFORE COUNCIL, BEFORE AN EXTENSION.
THE EXTENSIONS WOULD NOT, THEY'D AUTOMATICALLY ADMINISTRATIVE.
LIKE NOW YOU, I JUST LOOKED, BUT, OKAY.
UH, I HAVE A QUESTION FOR STAFF WHILE YOU LOOK, GEORGE, TAKE A QUICK LOOK AT IT.
WHAT ARE WE GONNA DO WITH THE DUMPSTERS THAT WE OWN, THAT WE HAVE IN THE ENCLOSURES THERE? RIGHT NOW? THEY GO AWAY.
WHERE ARE WE GONNA, UM, DO WE HAVE HAVE SOME OLDER ONES? WE CAN CHANGE OUT THOUGH.
WE'VE GOT SOME REALLY BAD ONES THAT WE NEED TO HAVE CHANGED OUT.
SO IT'S SOMETHING LIKE, WE'VE PATCHED THE FLOORS, WE'LL JUST TAKE FOR SCRAP.
SO WE'LL BE ABLE TO PUT 'EM TO USE.
THAT'S WHAT I WAS WONDERING WHERE THEY WOULD BE
[01:40:01]
UTILIZED.THERE WAS SOMETHING SAID DURING THE STUDY ABOUT WE HAD TO REPLACE SO MANY DUMPSTERS.
ANYTHING THAT CAN BE REUSED, IT'S STILL GOOD, BUT THE LID BEING PLASTIC WHEREVER THE WAY IT'S DRAFTED IS IT WOULD BE AN ADMINISTRATIVE EXTENSION.
I JUST, THE COUNCIL WOULD LIKE IT TO COME BACK EVERY FIVE YEARS.
WE JUST ALWAYS TALK ABOUT HOW WHEN WE MAKE DECISIONS THAT WE DON'T WANT TO COMMIT FUTURE COUNSELS TO THE SAME, YOU KNOW, SO I WAS JUST THINKING LIKE AT THE END OF THE FIVE YEARS, IF WE LOOK AT IT AND SAY THAT WAS A GOOD IDEA, DIDN'T WORK WELL, OR IF THERE WERE ANY CONCERNS, PROBLEMS, THEN THAT COUNCIL AND, AND WOULD, WOULD LOOK AT IT AGAIN.
BUT, UH, BUT AGAIN, THAT'S JUST MY THOUGHT.
I DON'T KNOW WHAT OTHER PEOPLE FEEL.
UM, I GUESS MY QUESTION WOULD BE, YOU KNOW, THAT'S TODAY WITH THESE TWO BUSINESSES, WHAT IF THE BUSINESSES ARE SOLD OR THEY GO OUT OF THIS, THERE'S AUTOMATIC TERMINATION LANGUAGE IN THE AGREEMENT.
THAT'S WHAT I, AND IT DOES, IT DOESN'T BIND US TO ANY OTHER BUSINESSES EITHER.
I MEAN, WE'RE SETTING A PRECEDENT, BUT I'M JUST SAYING BECAUSE JUST THESE TWO, IT WOULD, IT WOULD JUST DEPEND ON WHERE THOSE BUSINESSES ARE AND HOW CLOSE THEY ARE TO A DUMPSTER.
AND THEY, AND THE LESSEES WILL, ARE REQUIRED TO CONTINUE TO SHOW PROOF OF BEING CONTRACTED WITH A PRIVATE CIRCLE AND THEY'RE GONNA SHARE ONE YES.
AND SO ONE BEHIND WHAT GOES IN THE ENCLOSURES UP TO THEM, BUT THEY'RE GONNA SHARE THE SPACE.
BUT I'M SAYING IT'S ONE SPACE SHARE SPACE THAT ONE OF THE BUSINESSES IS GONNA HAVE TO, UM, TRANSPORT HOWEVER MANY STEPS GOING TO THERE.
AND THAT'S, AND THAT WAS ALL PART OF WHAT THEY'RE AGREEING TO.
RIGHT? I JUST WANNA, I, I JUST, I KNOW THEY WON'T, BUT I'M JUST SAYING THAT WE JUST WANNA MAKE SURE THAT, THAT SOMEBODY'S NOT GOING TO DEN LIKE IF THERE WAS AN OVERFLOW OF TRASH, THAT THEY'RE NOT USING THE TOWN ONES.
BECAUSE THAT'S THE WHOLE IDEA.
THEY CAN ONLY, THEY CAN ONLY USE THE TRASH, THE DUMPSTER THAT'S IN THAT ENCLOSURE FOR BOTH OF THOSE BUSINESSES THAT THEY HAVE TO SECURE IT AND MAINTAIN IT.
MAYBE IF SOMEBODY DROPS A MATTRESS IN FRONT.
IT'S THEIR, THEIR RESPONSIBILITY.
IT'S NO LONGER IN FRONT OF IT THOUGH.
YOU KNOW, JUST LIKE THEY DID ON SOUTH FRONT, THEY ON SOUTH STREET WHEN OKAY.
I MEAN THE APPLICANT ALSO REQUESTS OR STATED THAT THEY'D LIKE TO PAINT THE DUMPSTER IMMEDIATELY UPON THE EN THE ENCLOSURE.
TO DISTINGUISH IT, UH, FROM THE TOWN ENCLOSURES AND PUT UP THEIR AND SIGNAGE AND AS LONG AS THEY'VE IN COMPLIANCE, I THINK THAT WAS ALL IN THE EMAIL.
COUNSEL WOULD PREFER IT COMES BACK EVERY FIVE YEARS.
SAY MAYBE I JUST DON'T LIKE TO COMMIT OTHERS.
I YOU, I JUST GOING LIKE EITHER LIKE THE OTHER ONE ADMINISTRATIVELY.
THAT WOULD BE THE TOWN MANAGER.
I, I, I HAVE CONCERNS WITH IT AND THAT'S WHY I BROUGHT IT UP BECAUSE WE LEARNED WHEN THERE WERE OTHER TOWN PROPERTIES THAT WERE LEASED, UM, AND A RIGHT OF WAY THAT SOME POTENTIAL ADMINISTRATION WAS SHOWING FAVORITISM TOWARDS CERTAIN INDIVIDUALS AND COUNSEL HAD ABSOLUTELY NO IDEA OF IT.
SO WE INHERITED AN ISSUE THAT HAD NEVER COME BEFORE US, UM, ON A LEASE THAT WAS BEING, YOU KNOW, AUTOMATICALLY RENEWED ADMINISTRATIVELY.
AND IT WAS NO FAULT OF ANY OF THE ADMINISTRATION THAT'S HERE TODAY.
UM, BUT IT WAS QUITE THE FIASCO TO LEARN THAT WE WERE LEASING TOWN PROPERTY AND WE HAD NO IDEA OF IT OR HOW LONG IT HAD BEEN GOING ON.
SO I JUST THINK IT WOULD BE NICE TO BRING IT BACK BEFORE COUNCILS AND THEN IF THERE IS AN ISSUE, IT CAN BE ADDRESSED IN THE NAME OF TRANSPARENCY OF THE TOWN'S PROPERTY.
WELL, WHAT CAN CHANGE IN FIVE YEARS.
'CAUSE FIVE YEARS AGO WE DIDN'T HAVE THE BUSINESSES RIGHT.
SO, AND WE WEREN'T, AND FIVE YEARS AGO WE WEREN'T DISTINGUISHING BETWEEN THE FEED THOSE EITHER.
SO WHO KNOWS WHAT FIVE YEARS FROM NOW MIGHT BE.
SO THIS CAN BE RENEWED THREE TIMES, IS THAT CORRECT? THAT'S CURRENTLY WRITTEN, UH, UP TO THREE ADDITIONAL FIVE YEAR TERMS UPON THE WRITTEN REQUEST OF THE LESSEES AND THE WRITTEN CONSENT OF THE LESSOR, WHICH WOULD BE ADMINISTRATIVE, THE TOWN MANAGER, THE WAY IT'S CURRENTLY DRAFTED.
SO THEN THAT'S AN EASY CHANGE.
IF SO, YEAR 16, IF THEY WANT TO DO IT AGAIN, THEN WE START ALL OVER AGAIN.
WELL, WE'D HAVE THE FOUNDATION AND THE FRAMEWORK.
IT WOULD BE THE INITIAL FIVE AND THEN POTENTIALLY THREE MORE FIVES.
I THINK LET LET THE COUNCIL HAVE A SAY IN FIVE YEARS.
[01:45:01]
IT, IT COULD BE AS SIMPLE AS JUST YES.IF THERE ISN'T ANY PROBLEMS AND EVERYBODY'S HAPPY WITH IT, THEN IT'S EASY.
IT MIGHT BE LIKE ME AND WE WANT MORE PEOPLE TO DO THEIR OWN DUMPSTERS.
LET'S DONATE SOME PARKING SPACES.
IF WE HAVE A PARKING GARAGE BY THEN WE MIGHT DECIDE TO DO THAT FOR EVERYBODY.
SO, AND BECAUSE ALSO, LIKE THAT'S WHAT, THAT'S WHY I WANTED TO EMPHASIZE THAT IT'S NO ADMINISTRATIVE STAFF THAT IS STILL WITH THE TOWN OR HERE TODAY.
BECAUSE GOD FORBID SOME OF OUR LONGSTANDING STAFF ARE NOT HERE WHEN THIS CONTRACT COMES UP FOR ADMINISTRATIVE RENEWAL IN FIVE YEARS.
AND THEN WE HAVE SOMEBODY WHO DOESN'T UNDERSTAND THE HISTORY AND HOW THIS GOT HERE AND MM-HMM
THE MEANING BEHIND IT AND THE TOWN WILL GO AHEAD AND MAKE THE REPAIRS.
OH, I'M FINE WITH THAT OVER THE NEXT COUPLE WEEKS.
PLUS THEY WANTED TO LOOK NICE.
I MEAN, IT'S STILL PART OF OUR DOWNTOWN NEXT COUPLE WEEKS.
MY UNDERSTANDING IS TOWN IS NOT RESPONSIBLE FOR THE DAMAGE.
AND THAT'S STATED IN THE EMAIL.
WELL WHO WAS RESPONSE? WE DON'T KNOW.
WELL, ONCE THIS SIGN THOUGH, THAT'S GOING FORWARD, IT'S AS IS.
IT HAS TO BE RETURNED IN THE SAME CONDITION AS RECEIVED.
NOW WE CALL OUT, YOU'RE GONNA TAKE PICTURES AND PUT 'EM IN THAT PILE.
NOW YOU'RE MAKE ME GONNA ASK A DIFFERENT QUESTION THOUGH.
IF IT GETS DAMAGED DURING THESE NEXT FIVE YEARS, IT'S THEIR RESPONSIBILITY.
THAT'S THEIR RESPONSIBILITY TO FIX IT.
BUT IT'S NO SECURITY THE WAY CURRENTLY WRITTEN.
THERE'S NO SECURITY TO BACK THAT UP.
BUT IT'S TO BE RETURNED IN THE SAME CONDITION.
I KNOW, BUT I'M, WHAT I'M TRYING TO SAY IS, IS OUR HOPE, THAT IS OUR HOPE THAT THEY'RE GONNA FIX IT RIGHT AWAY IF IT GETS DAMAGED.
BECAUSE AGAIN, IT'S ALL OUR, THE, THE IMAGE OF OUR DOWNTOWN AND WE DON'T HAVE ANY RIGHT.
TO, AND, AND I KNOW WE'RE ALL GOING LIKE, COME ON, BUT LOOK HOW MANY PEOPLE HAVE GOTTEN BUILDINGS IN THIS COMMUNITY, SECURED IT, STARTED TEARING IT APART AND THEN NEVER FIXED IT.
AND IT'S SITTING THERE LOOKING LIKE AN EYESORE AND EVERYBODY THINKS IT'S OUR FAULT.
SO I MEAN, IS THERE ANY LANGUAGE THAT COULD SAY LIKE, IF THERE'S DAM, YOU KNOW, I GUESS NOT.
'CAUSE IT'S, WELL, IT, IT ALREADY REQUIRES MAINTENANCE.
UM, LESSEE SHALL MAINTAIN THE PREMISES.
UH, SAME CONDITION AND REPAIR AS IN, AS EXISTED AT THE COMMENCEMENT OF THE LEASE.
I MEAN, HOWEVER IT LOOKS THE BE WOULD IT BE REASONABLE TO SAY LIKE, SIGNIFICANT DAMAGE SHOULD BE REMEDIED WITHIN LIKE 30 DAYS OR SO, YOU KNOW, ANYTHING LIKE THAT OR? WELL, WE HAVEN'T.
I MEAN, LET'S, LET'S BE HONEST, IT'S BEEN LIKE IT IS.
UH, WE HAVEN'T DONE IT IN 30 DAYS OR SIX MONTHS, SO YEAH.
UM, WHY? BUT WE COULD I, AM I RIGHT IN THIS? IF THEY DON'T DO IT, WE COULD IN THE PIECE.
WELL MY OTHER THOUGHT WAS IF THEY DON'T DO IT AND IT'S THE TOWN'S PROPERTY, WE MAKE THE REPAIRS JUST LIKE WE WOULD GO MOW SOMEBODY'S LAWN AND BILL THEM FOR IT.
I MEAN, I'M SURE THEY'LL MAKE THE REPAIRS TOO, BECAUSE THEY WANT IT TO BE IT'S REFLECTION OF THEIR BUSINESS SO THAT NOBODY ELSE IS USING IT.
I MEAN, THE WHOLE POINT OF THIS IS SO NOBODY ELSE GETS IN THE ENCLOSURE AND DUMPS THEIR TRASH OR THEIR MATTRESS OR WHATEVER.
WELL, THEY'RE GONNA HAVE SIGNS ON IT, RIGHT, RIGHT.
SO THEY'RE GONNA SAY, THIS IS FOR THIS.
SO OBVIOUSLY THEY CAN READ, WILL SEE A SIGN.
IT DIDN'T DETERMINE, AGAIN, I AGREE.
IT'S NOT WHAT PEOPLE ARE GOING TO BACK INTO A DUMPSTER, IT'S GONNA BE THEIR PROBLEM OR NOT.
YOU KNOW, WE DON'T, WE WON'T BE ENFORCING, WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE PIECE OF PROP, THE LITTLE PIECE OF STRETCH OF LAND.
SO MORE THAN ANYTHING, THE LEASE.
SO WE'RE TALKING ABOUT THE ENCLOSURE, ENCLOSURE, THE ENCLOSURES DOWN, PROPERTY ENCLOSURE STUFF.
BUT YEAH, WE CAN TALK ABOUT A MILLION DIFFERENT SCENARIOS.
WELL, THE ONLY CHANGE FOR ME IS THAT YES.
I THINK GLEN WAS IN AGREEMENT WITH THAT.
DO WE HAVE A CONSENSUS? THAT'S FINE.
SO JUST CHANGE THAT PART AND I'M SURE THERE'LL BE OKAY WITH THAT.
WE HAVE NOW COME TO THE PORTION OF OUR CODE HEARING.
DO I, OH, WHAT IS THIS? A PUBLIC HEARING? OH, THIS, THIS IS A PUBLIC HEARING, SO IT WON'T COME UNTIL APRIL.
IT'S A PUBLIC HEARING UNDER 15.2.
EVEN A LEASE OF TOWN ON PROPERTY REQUIRES A PUBLIC, SO THAT'LL BE ON APRIL.
AND IT'LL BE EFFECTIVE IN MAY.
UP UNTIL NOW, THEY'RE, I WASN'T AWARE, A PUPPY.
WE WILL CONTINUE TO GO DOWN LAST TWO RATES TO WHICH TIME THIS IS IMPLEMENT.
NOW THAT'S GONNA BE A QUESTION GOING.
[01:50:01]
SO IF SOMEBODY CAN READ, READ US INTO CLOSE.AND IF SOMEBODY NEEDS TO USE THE RESTROOM, THAT'S FINE TOO.
BUT LET, WE'LL GO AHEAD AND GET ENCLOSED.
FIRST, MADAM MAYOR, I MOVE THAT TOWN COUNCIL, CONVENE A CLOSED MEETING PURSUANT TO SECTION 2.2 DASH 3 7 1 AND 2.2 DASH 3 7 1 2 OF THE CODE OF VIRGINIA FOR THE FOLLOWING PURPOSES.
ONE PURSUANT TO 2.2 DASH 3 7 1 A, ONE OF THE CODE OF VIRGINIA FOR THE DISCUSSION, CONSIDERATION, OR INTERVIEWS OF PROSPECTIVE CANDIDATES FOR EMPLOYMENT ASSIGNMENT, APPOINTMENT, PROMOTION, PERFORMANCE, DEMOTION, SALARIES, DISCIPLINING, OR RESIGNATION OF SPECIFIC PUBLIC OFFICERS, APPOINTEES OR EMPLOYEES OF ANY PUBLIC BODY OR SPECIFICALLY THE TOWN MANAGER POSITION.
AND NUMBER TWO, PURSUANT TO 2.2 DASH 3 7 1 1 A EIGHT OF THE CODE OF VIRGINIA FOR CONSULTATION WITH LEGAL COUNSEL EMPLOYED OR RETAINED BY A PUBLIC BODY REGARDING SPECIFIC LEGAL MATTERS REQUIRING THE PROVISION OF LEGAL ADVICE BY SUCH COUNSEL, OR SPECIFICALLY THE INSOLVENCY AND DISPOSITION OF ASSETS OF THE INDUSTRIAL DEVELOPMENT AUTHORITY OF THE TOWN OF HART ROYAL AND THE COUNTY OF WARREN VIRGINIA.
COUNCILWOMAN DE DEMON PAY? YES.
TAKE A REAL QUICK BREAK AND LET.