* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.
           
          [00:00:02]
WELCOME TO THE, UH, 
          [Town Council Work Session on January 8, 2023.]
I'M GONNA CALL TO ORDER THE TOWN COUNCIL REGULAR WORK SESSION FOR MONDAY, JANUARY 8TH. 
          MS. PRESLEY, CAN WE DO A ROLL CALL? MAYOR  HERE. 
          VICE MAYOR LOC. 
          HERE. 
          COUNCILMAN INGRAM? HERE. 
          COUNCILMAN MORRIS? HERE. 
          COUNCILMAN RAPPAPORT? HERE. 
          COUNCILMAN DE DAMON PAYNE. 
          HERE. 
          I'M COUNCILMAN WOOD HERE. 
          OKAY. 
          FIRST UP, ITEM NUMBER TWO IS THE SOLID WASTE COST OF SERVICES STUDY FROM THE MSW CONSULTANTS. 
          AND MR. WILSON, I UNDERSTAND YOU'RE GONNA YEP. 
          KEEP US OFF US AND INTRODUCE. 
          SO, UH, A FEW MONTHS AGO, UH, THE TOWN ENTERED INTO A COST OF SERVICE, UH, STUDY AGREEMENT WITH, UH, MSW CONSULTANTS. 
          UM, BEEN WORKING WITH THEM HERE OVER THE LAST FEW MONTHS, COMPILING COMPREHENSIVE INFORMATION. 
          UH, WHAT WE'RE LOOKING FORWARD TONIGHT IS, UH, TO SHOW THE PRELIMINARY FINDINGS HERE, WHERE WE'RE AT, UH, AS, AS WELL AS, UH, GET A CONSENSUS FROM COUNSEL ON IMPLEMENTATION OF THE RATE SCHEDULE, UM, RATE SCHEDULE, YOU KNOW, ONE YEAR, THREE YEARS, AND ALSO SOME, UH, DIRECTION ON HOW TO TACKLE, UH, MAIN STREET, UH, WITH US TONIGHT. 
          UH, WE HAVE, UH, JOHN CULBERTSON HERE FROM MSW CONSULTANTS. 
          UH, HE'S GONNA, UH, REVIEW A PRESENTATION WITH YOU. 
          ALSO HAVE ERIC JORGENSON AND ROBBIE, UH, BOYER THERE. 
          ERIC, UH, IS THE HEAD OF OUR SOLID WASTE DIVISION. 
          AND, UM, ROBBIE, OF COURSE, DIRECTOR OF PUBLIC WORKS WITH THAT. 
          I'M GONNA TURN IT OVER HERE. 
          MR. JOHN. 
          THANK YOU. 
          AND, UH, A LITTLE BIT OF A BELATED HAPPY NEW YEAR TO EVERYBODY. 
          SO, UH, THANK YOU FOR FITTING US IN, UH, ON THIS, UH, THIS FIRST MEETING. 
          UM, IT'S A LITTLE BIT OF A SLOW TIME, BUT IT'S SHAPING UP TO BE ANOTHER BUSY YEAR, SO I DON'T KNOW IF YOU'RE FEELING THAT, BUT THAT SURE SEEMS TO BE THE CASE. 
          UM, WELL, GREAT. 
          UH, I, UM, UH, MY NAME IS JOHN CULBERTSON. 
          I'M A PRINCIPAL OF MSW CONSULTANTS. 
          I'M GOING TO TAKE A MOMENT AND MAKE SURE I CAN ADVANCE THE SLIDES, WHICH I CAN. 
          UM, AND I'VE GOT ABOUT, UH, ABOUT A DOZEN SLIDES TO, UH, GO OVER A LITTLE BIT OF THE BACKGROUND OF OUR PROJECT, UH, AND TO, UM, BRIEF YOU ON, UH, WHERE WE THINK WE ARE AND TO HOPEFULLY GET, UH, A LITTLE BIT OF GUIDANCE AND HOPEFULLY SEE IF WE CAN FIND SOME CONSENSUS ON OUTCOMES. 
          SO I VERY MUCH APPRECIATE THE OPPORTUNITY. 
          UM, SO VERY BRIEFLY, I'LL GIVE A QUICK OVERVIEW. 
          UM, I THINK WE PROBABLY POACHED THIS SLIDE FROM SOMEWHERE. 
          I'M NOT GONNA READ IT TO YOU, BUT MSW CONSULTANTS, UH, WE ARE, WE FANCY OURSELVES A MANAGEMENT CONSULTING COMPANY. 
          WE SPECIALIZE IN THE MUNICIPAL WASTE MANAGEMENT SPACE. 
          SO WE WORK WITH CITIES, COUNTIES, AUTHORITIES, EVEN STATE AGENCIES, UM, OPTIMIZING WASTE MANAGEMENT, UH, COLLECTION SYSTEMS TO INCLUDE DISPOSAL OF MATERIAL, LANDFILL PROCESSING RECYCLABLES, COMPOSTING OF ORGANICS, UH, AND THEN ALL MATTER OF THINGS TO MANAGE AND ADMINISTER THOSE SYSTEMS. SO PUBLIC OUTREACH AND EDUCATION. 
          AND, UH, FOR THIS STUDY, OF COURSE, UM, WE PUT TOGETHER A FULL FLEDGED UTILITY RATE MODELS. 
          IT'S INTERESTING, UM, I'VE BEEN DOING THIS A LONG TIME COMING UP, I CAN'T EVEN BELIEVE THIS ON 30 YEARS. 
          UM, AND TO THIS DAY, UH, SOLID WASTE, UH, IS BECAUSE IT IS, IT, IT'S KIND OF THE FORGOTTEN UTILITY, BUT AT THE END OF THE DAY, IT, IT CONFORMS WITH MANY OF THE CHARACTERISTICS OF A TYPICALLY UTILITY BUSINESS. 
          UH, AND SO WE TRY TO BRING SOME OF THE BEST PRACTICES FROM OTHER UTILITY SERVICES LOOKING AT FULL COST OF SERVICE AND RATE ANALYSIS. 
          AND SO, UH, BY THE END OF THIS, HOPEFULLY YOU'LL, YOU'LL SEE THAT WE'VE REACHED THAT POINT. 
          UM, JUST A QUICK HISTORY BEFORE I GO ON DATING BACK TO THE 2016 TIMEFRAME THAT MSS W CONSULTANTS FIRST HAD KIND OF AN INITIAL, UH, ENGAGEMENT WITH THE TOWN TO LOOK AT KIND OF OPERATIONALLY AND RATE WISE, REALLY ALMOST LIKE A FIRST BLUSH. 
          HOW'S IT GOING? AND, AND WE ISSUED A, A REPORT WITH RECOMMENDATIONS THAT ACTUALLY INCLUDED, UM, GOING TO A, A SINGLE STREAM RECYCLING PROGRAM, WHICH WAS DONE INTEGRATING THE COMMERCIAL AND, UM, DOWNTOWN AREA WITH RESIDENTIAL ROUTES, WHICH WAS DONE. 
          UH, AND IT WAS REALLY NICE TO SEE THAT BECAUSE OPERATIONALLY, UM, WE WEREN'T HIRED THIS TIME TO DO AN OPERATIONAL ANALYSIS, BUT ALL OF THE CHECKS ARE THERE THAT OPERATIONALLY THINGS ARE, ARE LOOKING VERY GOOD WITH THE TOWN SERVICE DELIVERY IN TERMS OF HOW YOU SERVE YOUR CUSTOMERS. 
          SO KIND OF CHECKING THOSE BOXES. 
          WELL, THE FINAL RECOMMENDATION BACK IN 2016 WAS TO ACTUALLY INVEST THE TIME TO DO A FULL COST OF SERVICE AND UTILITY RATE STUDY TO REALLY GET GOOD INFORMATION AND TO REALLY HAVE A BASIS FOR THE CHARGES THAT YOU, UH, THAT YOU ASSESS TO YOUR CUSTOMERS TO PROVIDE SERVICES THAT ARE CRITICAL FOR, YOU KNOW, TOWN UNIFICATION AND HEALTH, RIGHT? REMOVAL OF SANITATION, REMOVAL OF RECYCLING. 
          YOU KNOW, YOU WANT, YOU WANT A NICE TOWN, AND THAT'S EXACTLY WHAT THIS SERVICE DOES. 
          SO, UM, I'M GONNA GO THROUGH, HOPEFULLY NOT SPEND A WHOLE LOT OF TIME READING ANYTHING TO YOU. 
          MAYBE TRY TO HIT SOME OF THE HIGH POINTS. 
          UH, SO THIS PARTICULAR ENGAGEMENT, UM, I NEED TO REALLY, FRANKLY JUST, UH, YOU KNOW, UH, SEND OUT A THANK YOU, UH, TO, UH, FOLKS IN, IN FINANCE AND SANITATION. 
          UH, WE GOT GREAT SUPPORT IN TERMS OF COMPILING A RANGE OF DATA THAT WE NEED TO DO THIS ANALYSIS, UH, WHICH INCLUDES BOTH FINANCIAL AND OPERATIONAL METRICS. 
          SO CUSTOMER BASE SIZE, NUMBER OF HOUSEHOLD TYPES OF CUSTOMERS, THE TONNAGES THAT YOU'RE COLLECTING, UM, THE, THE DIFFERENT ARRANGEMENTS YOU HAVE FOR PAYING FOR DISPOSAL AND PROCESSING. 
          UH, IT REALLY, WE GOT GREAT SUPPORT, 
          [00:05:01]
AND THAT MAKES OUR JOB SO MUCH EASIER TO BE ABLE TO, YOU KNOW, WE HAD REALLY GOOD COLLABORATION AND CLEAR THINGS UP. 
          UH, AND SO THE TASK, AGAIN, THIS, THIS SLIDE IS JUST A LITTLE BIT OF A BULLETING OF THE STEPS THAT WE GO THROUGH. 
          UH, WE ALSO, UH, WE DID SOME BENCHMARKING, SO WE DID COMPARE AND CONTRAST HOW SERVICES PROVIDED. 
          I, I DON'T HAVE, WE HAVE A LOT MORE SLIDES AND THROUGHOUT THIS PROJECT, THERE'S PROBABLY A LOT MORE INFORMATION THAT I'M GOING TO TOUCH ON TONIGHT. 
          BUT I DO WANT YOU TO BE AWARE, UH, OF SOME OF THE THINGS WE DID TO REALLY FEEL COMFORTABLE, UH, THAT WE WERE GOING DOWN A PATH THAT IS REASONABLE WITHIN THE REGIONAL MARKET HERE FOR WASTE MANAGEMENT, UH, AND FOR, FOR PROVIDING THESE SERVICES. 
          BUT, UH, AS, UH, AS BJ SAID, UM, WE WANT TO SHARE SOME OPTIONS FOR, UH, KIND OF STANDARD RATE, UH, CHANGES TO RATES GOING FORWARD SO THAT YOU CAN MAINTAIN A SUSTAINABLE, YOU KNOW, FULL SERVICE SYSTEM TO YOUR CUSTOMERS. 
          AND WE DO NEED SOME GUIDANCE, UH, IN THE MAIN STREET AREA, UM, WHICH WE'LL GET TO. 
          AGAIN, I THINK THOSE ARE REALLY KIND OF THE KEY FINAL POINTS. 
          UM, I HAVE A COUPLE OF SLIDES TO TELL YOU KIND OF WHAT YOU ALREADY KNOW, WHICH I PREFER TO DO WITH PICTURES. 
          UH, BUT THE SERVICES YOU'RE PROVIDING PREDOMINANTLY YOUR, AS MOST TOWNS AND CITIES, YOU'RE PREDOMINANTLY SERVING YOUR RESIDENTIAL SECTOR. 
          UH, YOU'RE PROVIDING A, UH, AN AUTOMATED OR SEMI, OR RATHER A SEMI-AUTOMATED REFUSE AND RECYCLING COLLECTION, UM, YOU'RE, YOU'RE ABLE TO HANDLE OVERSIZED SET OUTS. 
          UM, IT'S, IT'S A, IT'S A RATIONAL SYSTEM. 
          IT'S A RATIONAL RATE STRUCTURE. 
          UH, IT'S A WELL RUN SYSTEM. 
          UM, YOU DO SOME, UH, A VERY SMALL AMOUNT OF COLLECTION TO COMMERCIAL CUSTOMERS, AND ESPECIALLY IN THIS MAIN STREET AREA. 
          UM, BUT THE NICE THING ABOUT THAT IS YOU'RE ABLE TO DO THAT TUCKED INTO YOUR RESIDENTIAL ROUTES. 
          MM-HMM, , WE RUN INTO A LOT OF COMMUNITIES THAT HAVE A VERY SMALL COMMERCIAL SECTOR, UH, AND THEY'VE BOUGHT A WHOLE NEW TRUCK AND HAVE ALMOST A WHOLE EXTRA DRIVER WHO'S VERY INEFFICIENT AND UNDERUTILIZED SERVING THAT DOWNTOWN AREA. 
          WHEREAS OPERATIONALLY, UH, THE TOWN HERE HAS BEEN ABLE TO INTEGRATE THOSE CUSTOMERS IN AN EFFICIENT MANNER WITHIN THE REGULAR ROUTES. 
          AND I THINK THAT, THAT, THAT WOULD COME OUT IN THE RATES, UH, UM, IF THAT WERE NOT THE CASE. 
          SO AGAIN, JUST LIKE TO HAVE A FEW PICTURES. 
          UH, SO, UM, OPERATIONALLY, UH, IN SOME REGARDS, YOU KNOW, IT'S NOT ROCKET SCIENCE TO DO WASTE AND RECYCLING COLLECTION, BUT THE CHALLENGE CAN COME IN, IN SHARED USAGE AREAS. 
          SO THE MAIN STREET AREA HAS SOME, UH, COMMERCIAL CONTAINERS WHICH ARE SHARED WITH DIFFERENT, UH, UH, DIFFERENT COMMERCIAL AND EVEN SOME MIXED USE, EVEN SOME RESIDENTIAL DWELLINGS. 
          AND THESE ARE JUST SOME PICTURES THAT SHOW, UM, YOU KNOW, NOT YOUR SORT OF CONVENTIONAL PICKUP. 
          YOU CAN SEE SOME OUT OF CONTAINER SET OUTS ON THE LEFT, AND YOU CAN SEE THAT THERE'S SOME, YOU KNOW, TRUCK NAVIGATION, AND YOU CAN SEE THAT, THAT, YOU KNOW, SOME OF THE PLACEMENT OF CONTAINERS REQUIRE SHARED USAGE. 
          SO IT, IT MAKES SENSE TO PROVIDE SERVICE THAT WAY, BUT IT CREATES CHALLENGES ADMINISTERING AND MANAGING AND THEN RECOVERING REVENUES FAIRLY FROM THE DIFFERENT CUSTOMERS IN THAT MAIN STREET AREA THAT RELY ON YOUR SERVICE. 
          SO WE'LL TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT THAT AS WE GO FORWARD. 
          UM, AND THEN THE LAST THING, UM, THE TOWN DOES OPERATE ITS DROP OFF SITE, UM, WHICH, UH, DOES SOME, DO SOME OF YOUR YARD WASTE PROCESSING AND ALLOW SOME ADDITIONAL, UH, RECYCLING MATERIALS THERE. 
          AND, AND THAT IS, THAT'S REALLY QUITE COMMON, UM, TO HAVE THAT SERVICE AS WELL. 
          SO AGAIN, THE TAKEAWAY SERVICE-WISE, YOU'RE PROVIDING REALLY THE FULL RANGE OF SERVICES THAT YOUR RESIDENTS NEED, AND YOU'RE SUPPORTING YOUR MAIN STREET AREA, YOU KNOW, KIND OF, KIND OF CHECKING THE BOX, UH, SERVICE-WISE. 
          AND SO HENCE THIS NOTION OF A, OF A UTILITY COST OF SERVICE AND RATE STUDY. 
          SO I'M GONNA NOW JUMP AHEAD THERE. 
          THERE COULD BE A WHOLE NUMBER, AND IF THOSE OF YOU ARE INTERESTED, I'D BE HAPPY TO, UM, YOU KNOW, WORK WITH, UH, UM, UH, THE, THE FOLKS HERE, UH, WITH THE TOWN TO PROVIDE BACKUP. 
          BUT WHEN WE DO COST OF SERVICE AND RATE WORK, UM, IN ADDITION TO JUST LOOKING AT THE OVERALL SYSTEM COST, WE ARE ALLOCATING THOSE FULL COSTS BACK TO, UM, THE SPECIFIC FUNCTIONS THAT YOU'RE PROVIDING AND THE SPECIFIC CUSTOMERS THAT YOU'RE SERVING. 
          AND SO, UH, THIS TABLE, UM, BREAKS DOWN YOUR SERVICES KIND OF ON AN ACTIVITY LEVEL, IF YOU WILL, AND YOU CAN SEE THERE'S COLLECTION AND THEN THERE'S YOUR DROP OFF SITE FACILITY. 
          SO WE, WE DID ALLOCATE YOUR FULL COST. 
          UM, AND I SHOULD SAY JUST I'M A LITTLE BIT FOR DEFINITIONS. 
          WHEN WE SAY FULL COST, UM, WE TRY TO CAPTURE, AND WE BELIEVE WE HAVE CAPTURED WITH ALL THE INPUT THAT, UH, WE'VE GOTTEN FROM STAFF, UH, DIRECT OPERATING EXPENSE, SO THAT'S LABOR BENEFITS, UH, VEHICLE OPERATION, YOU KNOW, OIL, GAS, ET CETERA. 
          BUT WE ALSO CAPTURE, UH, VEHICLE REPLACEMENT COSTS. 
          THEY ARE NOT REFUSE COLLECTION TRUCKS ARE NOT INEXPENSIVE. 
          THEY HAVE A USEFUL LIFE. 
          OUR MODEL FACTORS IN, UM, WHAT WE WOULD CALL INDUSTRY STANDARD REPLACEMENT, THAT WE ALSO COORDINATE WITH THE CONDITIONS HERE IN THE TOWN. 
          UH, AND, UH, IF THERE WERE GOING TO BE ANY SIGNIFICANT, UM, CAPITAL IMPROVEMENTS, FOR EXAMPLE, TO YOUR FLEET YARD, WE WOULD HAVE CAPTURED THOSE, BUT WE DID NOT IDENTIFY ANY MAJOR CAPITAL IMPROVEMENTS. 
          SO, UH, IT TRULY IS A FULL COST OF SERVICE. 
          WE, WE THINK IT'S VERY IMPORTANT TO CAPTURE ALL OF THOSE ELEMENTS, NOT JUST YOUR DIRECT OPERATING EXPENSE. 
          AND THEN WE ALSO CAPTURE ALLOCATED TOWN OVERHEAD. 
          OBVIOUSLY YOU PROBABLY HAVE, 
          [00:10:01]
UH, YOU KNOW, SOME LEGAL AND RISK MANAGEMENT, HUMAN RESOURCES, OTHER FUNCTIONS THAT THE TOWN ALLOCATES INTO, UH, THE SANITATION. 
          SO WE FEEL VERY GOOD THAT WHY THIS IS IMPORTANT IS THIS REALLY HIGHLIGHTS THE REVENUE THAT'S NEEDED TO SUSTAINABLY PROVIDE ALL OF THESE SANITATION SERVICES, AND ALSO TO PAY A FAIR SHARE OF THE TOWN MANAGEMENT AND ADMINISTRATIVE OVERHEAD. 
          AND WHAT THAT DOES IS WE THINK THAT CREATES HEALTHY LOCAL GOVERNMENTS BECAUSE YOU'RE ABLE TO FUND THOSE SERVICES. 
          SO THAT, THAT'S REALLY OUR PHILOSOPHY. 
          BEFORE YOU FLIP SLIDES, I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE I UNDERSTAND. 
          SO THAT FROM WHAT, FROM WHAT YOU'RE SHOWING US RIGHT NOW, WE, IT COSTS 1,000,004, WE HAVE 1,000,030 THOUSAND. 
          YES. 
          SO WE'RE A DEFICIT OF 375,767. 
          THAT IS CORRECT. 
          THAT IS CORRECT. 
          AND SO, SO REALLY THE, THE BIG THERE, THERE REALLY ARE TWO TAKEAWAYS KIND OF HIGHLIGHTED AT THE BOTTOM. 
          YOU ARE PREDOMINANTLY A RESIDENTIAL SYSTEM, UM, YOU KNOW, IN TERMS OF WHO YOUR, WHO YOUR ESSENTIALLY RATE BASE IS ESSENTIALLY A RESIDENTIAL RATE BASE. 
          AND, UM, WE UNDERSTAND THAT RATES HAVEN'T BEEN ADJUSTED SINCE 2016. 
          AND SO YOU'RE AT A DEFICIT. 
          YES. 
          BUT I THINK IT IS CRITICAL TO BE AWARE IN OUR INDUSTRY, IN THE WASTE INDUSTRY, AND FRANKLY EVEN AT THE ECONOMY, WITHIN THE ECONOMY AT LARGE, WE HAVE BEEN THROUGH MANY, UH, PRICE ESCALATION SITUATIONS OF LATE, STARTING SOON AFTER THE PANDEMIC, OUR INDUSTRY WASTE COLLECTION STARTED TO EXPERIENCE SIGNIFICANT OPERATIONAL CHALLENGES DUE TO LABOR SHORTAGES AND INCREASED LABOR COSTS DUE TO SIGNIFICANT SLOWDOWNS IN PROCURING CAPITAL EQUIPMENT, LIKE $350,000 GARBAGE TRUCKS. 
          UM, WE HAVE SEEN TREMENDOUS, UH, PRICE ESCALATION ACROSS THE PRIVATE SECTOR AND FRANKLY ACROSS MOST OF OUR MUNICIPAL CLIENTS. 
          UM, WHERE THE MORE WE, AND, AND WE TEND TO ENCOURAGE THIS, WE CAN, I'M HERE TO ANSWER QUESTIONS, BUT WE DO TEND TO LOOK AT THIS SERVICE AS A UTILITY AND RECOGNIZING THAT YOUR, YOUR DIRECT OPERATING EXPENSE AND YOUR CAPITAL COSTS AND EVEN YOUR CAPITAL IMPROVEMENTS ARE ESCALATING. 
          AND WE'VE HAD SOME PRETTY BIG INFLATION YEARS LATELY. 
          UM, SO THE FACT THAT THE TOWN HAS NOT INCREASED OR CHANGED RATES SINCE 2016, IT DOES NOT SURPRISE US AT ALL THAT THERE, WHAT, TO ME, YOU KNOW, THIS COULD BE PORTRAYED AS A HUGE DEFICIT, UM, BUT GOSH, UM, IT'S NOT UNREASONABLE. 
          AND IN FACT, WE HAVE HAD CLIENTS SEE 40, 50, EVEN 70% INCREASES THAT THEY'VE NEEDED TO GET THEIR RATES UP JUST FROM JUST NOT REALLY PAYING ATTENTION AND NOT HAVING THE RIGHT, UM, MANAGEMENT AND FINANCIAL STRUCTURE IN PLACE. 
          SO IS THIS OPTIMAL? NO. 
          IS IT MANAGEABLE? WE THINK IT IS. 
          AND THAT'S WHAT WE WANNA TALK ABOUT AS WE GO FORWARD IN TERMS OF RATE PATH. 
          AND THE BIGGEST, THE BIGGEST DIFFERENCES ARE MAIN STREET REFUGE AND DROP OFF SITE. 
          I MEAN, THOSE ARE THE ONES THAT I SEE THE LARGEST DISCREPANCY BETWEEN THE REVENUE NEEDED. 
          AND I SHOULD, I SHOULD TOUCH THIS. 
          AM I, AM I WRONG? IS THAT ? NO, THOSE NUMBERS ARE RIGHT. 
          OKAY. 
          SO AS YOU LOOK AT BOTH FROM, YOU CAN LOOK AT IT AS AN ABSOLUTE DOLLAR CHANGE OR A PERCENTAGE DIFFERENCE. 
          YEAH. 
          SO COMMERCIAL, THOSE ARE THE TWO BIGGEST, THE COMMERCIAL MAIN STREET AREA ON A PERCENTAGE BASIS IS FAR AND AWAY, UM, YOU KNOW, KIND OF, KIND OF UNDER, UM, THE MAIN STREET REFUGE RATHER IS FAR AND AWAY THE MOST UNDERFUNDED FROM A RATE STANDPOINT, WHICH IS WHY WE'RE REALLY LOOKING FOR YOUR GUIDANCE ON THAT ISSUE AS I GET FURTHER ALONG. 
          BUT I SHOULD POINT OUT, SO THE DROP OFF SITE IS USED BY YOUR RESIDENTIAL SECTOR. 
          UH, IT'S REALLY PART OF THE BROAD BASKET OF SERVICES. 
          SO WE ARE LOOKING, YOU'RE NEVER GONNA CHARGE FEES FOR USERS TO COME INTO THAT SITE. 
          MM-HMM. 
          . 
          SO WE HAVE BUILT THE EXPENSE OF THAT SITE INTO THE RATES, UH, BECAUSE WE THINK THAT THAT'S APPROPRIATE GIVEN WHO USES THE SITE, WE'RE ESSENTIALLY PROPOSING TO RECOVER THE COST OF THAT THROUGH THE COLLECTION RATES BECAUSE IT'S ESSENTIALLY PART OF THE BASKET OF SERVICES THAT THE TOWN PROVIDES. 
          SORRY, I I, I HAVE A QUESTION FOR MR. WALTZ, OR, OR FOR ROBBIE OR FOR ERIC, FOR THE DROP OFF SITE, JUST OUTTA CURIOSITY FOR SOMEBODY TO, AND I SHOULD KNOW THIS 'CAUSE I'VE ACTUALLY GO ON IN THERE WITH MY HUSBAND BEFORE, BUT TO DROP OFF, DO THEY HAVE TO HAVE A TOWN? UH, DO THEY HAVE TO HAVE A TOWN, UM, ADDRESS COUNTER COUNTY? SO WE, WE TAKE COUNTY TRASH, COUNTER, COUNTY, BRUSH, BRUSH, BRUSH. 
          BUT STILL, JUST CURIOUS, DO WE, DO WE ADDRESS COMMERCIAL VERSUS RESIDENTIAL AT THAT SITE? YOU MEAN FOR SITE BRUSH FOR THE DROP OFF SITE? YEAH. 
          YES. 
          YES. 
          THE BUSINESSES HAVE TO PAY. 
          COMMERCIAL HAS TO PAY. 
          THE COMMERCIAL HAS TO PAY. 
          RESIDENTS DON'T HAVE TO PAY, BUT WE DO ACCEPT COUNTY RESIDENTS WHO DON'T, I MEAN, OBVIOUSLY EVERY TOWN RESIDENTS A COUNTY, BUT SO WE ACCEPT THE COUNTY RESIDENTS BRUSH AND THOSE TYPES OF THINGS. 
          YEP. 
          HMM. 
          OKAY. 
          METAL GOODS. 
          OH, METAL. 
          GOOD. 
          THAT'S WHAT I WAS GONNA SAY. 
          BUT THEY CALL 'EM WHITE GOODS, BUT YEAH, WHATEVER. 
          IT'S SAME THING, RIGHT? LIKE, YEAH. 
          SO, SO, UM, SO AGAIN, COMING BACK THOUGH, 
          [00:15:01]
THESE, I MEAN, YOU KNOW, THESE, THIS IS WHERE, THIS IS WHAT WE FOUND AND, AND THIS IN SOME DEGREE IS THE CHALLENGE BEFORE THE TOWN IS TO, UM, LOOK AT, AT THE CURRENT RATE. 
          I'M GONNA GO AHEAD AND HIT THE NEXT SLIDE BECAUSE WE ACTUALLY START THEN I'LL GO, LET ME GO BACK. 
          SO THERE'S THE ABSOLUTE, THE PICTURE SHOWING THE ABSOLUTE OVERALL CIRCUMSTANCE, BUT REALLY HOW DOES THAT TRANSLATE INTO RATES TO DIFFERENT CUSTOMER CLASSES? SO THE NEXT COUPLE OF SLIDES THAT I HAVE ARE GOING TO FOCUS ON RESIDENTIAL RATES OR RATES TO RESIDENTIAL HOUSEHOLDS. 
          AND IF WHENEVER YOU HAVE A DEFICIT, AND YOU MAY HAVE BEEN THROUGH OR BEEN FAMILIAR WITH OTHER RATE STUDIES FOR OTHER UTILITIES, UM, THERE ARE SOME, THE DECISIONS PRIMARILY HAVE TO DO WITH, YOU CAN EITHER DECIDE TO SUPPLEMENT THAT UTILITY WITH GENERAL FUND TAX REVENUES. 
          WE DON'T EVER TYPICALLY SUGGEST THAT. 
          SO WHAT WE TRY TO DO IS COME UP WITH, UH, SOME TIMING, UH, A PERIOD OF TIME TO RAMP UP TO RATES THAT WILL GET YOU TO, UH, FULL RECOVERY OF THE REVENUE YOU NEED. 
          SO IN DISCUSSIONS WITH STAFF, AND BASED ON WHAT WE SEE IN OTHER, UH, SANITATION UTILITIES, THE NEXT COUPLE OF SLIDES I HAVE, UH, COMPARE AND CONTRAST FOR THE RESIDENTIAL SECTOR, JUST A, A ONE-TIME BUMP. 
          SO YOU CAN KIND OF GUESS WHERE THAT'S GONNA LOOK AT WITH A 27% DEFICIT. 
          A ONE-TIME BUMP WOULD BE A PRETTY SIGNIFICANT RATE INCREASE. 
          SO WE'VE ALSO, UM, SHOWN A THREE YEAR RAMP UP A THREE YEAR INCREASE OF SMALLER INCREASES EVERY YEAR OVER THREE YEARS. 
          THERE'S REALLY, UM, YOU KNOW, I THINK THE IDEA IS TO MAYBE NOT SHOCK ANYBODY, AND I USE THE WORD SHOCK BECAUSE ANYTIME YOU SEE A 27% INCREASE, THAT'S KIND OF OFFICIALLY A SHOCK. 
          BUT I DO THINK IT'S IMPORTANT TO POINT OUT THAT IN THE REALM OF UTILITY SERVICES, SANITATION IS GENERALLY AT THE LOW END. 
          IF YOU LOOK AT ELECTRICITY, IF YOU LOOK AT ENERGY, IF YOU EVEN LOOK AT WATER SEWER, UH, SO IN SOME REGARDS, YOU KNOW, WE'RE TALKING, YOU'LL, I'M JUST GONNA JUMP TO MY, MY ONE YEAR INCREASE. 
          SO IF, IF WE WERE TO WAVE OUR MAGIC WAND AND IMPLEMENT RATES THAT WOULD RECOVER THE FULL REVENUE, UM, SO THE TOP TABLE SHOWS THE DOLLAR VALUES PER MONTH. 
          SO RIGHT NOW YOU'RE IN THE 12 TO $14 PER MONTH PER HOUSEHOLD. 
          SO, YOU KNOW, THAT'S, THANKFULLY THAT'S NOT A, YOU KNOW, THAT'S NOT NECESSARILY BREAKING THE BANK. 
          I MEAN, CERTAINLY WE HAVE DIFFERENT, UH, DIFFERENT NEIGHBORHOODS WHERE THAT COULD BE MORE OR LESS OF A, OF A FINANCIAL BURDEN. 
          UH, BUT WE WOULD BE ASKING, OR YOU WOULD BE LOOKING AT JUMPING UP ABOUT $4 PER HOUSEHOLD, $3 A HOUSEHOLD. 
          IF YOU LOOK AT THE ABSOLUTE, UM, RATE INCREASE ON A DOLLAR PER HOUSEHOLD PER MONTH LEVEL. 
          AND THEN THE BOTTOM TABLE SHOWS WHAT THOSE PERCENTAGE INCREASES ARE. 
          THE ONE THING I WANT TO CALL OUT HERE, UH, IS THAT THERE IS A RATE, UM, THAT THE TOWN WILL PROVIDE AN INCREASED SERVICE TO ENTER PRIVATE PROPERTY AND GO TO A, YOU KNOW, A SIDE DOOR OR A CARPORT OR A GARAGE SERVICE. 
          AND IN THE OLDEN DAYS, THERE ARE COMMUNITIES ALL OVER THE COUNTRY THAT IN THE OLDEN DAYS, THAT WAS THE STANDARD THAT GARBAGE MEN WOULD, YOU KNOW, THEY'D TAKE THEIR LAP SACK AND THEY'D WALK UP AND THEY'D PICK YOUR GARBAGE UP RIGHT OUTSIDE YOUR KITCHEN DOOR. 
          SUPER CONVENIENT, UM, IN THIS DAY AND AGE, SO THE SALT WASTE INDUSTRY, UH, HAS UNFORTUNATELY BEEN IN OSHA'S TOP 10 LIST OF MOST DANGEROUS IN, UH, INDUSTRIES, UH, THROUGHOUT THE US. 
          AND THERE HAS BEEN A MAJOR, MAJOR PUSH TO REALLY LOOK AT HEALTH AND SAFETY ISSUES IN OUR INDUSTRY. 
          UM, AND WHAT IT HAS DONE, IT HAS, IT HAS VERY MUCH PUSHED THIS NOTION OF GOING UP TO THE SIDE DOOR, BACK DOOR. 
          UH, IT HAS TURNED THAT INTO A VERY PREMIUM SERVICE BECAUSE OF THE HIGHER RISK FOR INJURY, THE HIGHER INSURANCE THAT COSTS. 
          AND QUITE CANDIDLY, THE TIME IT TAKES FOR, UM, YOUR CREWS TO MAKE THAT WALK, WALK UP AND BACK. 
          WE ACTUALLY USE SOME TIME ESTIMATES TO ESTIMATE WHAT THE INCREMENTAL COST IS, WHICH IS WHY INSTEAD OF $5 YOUR KIND OF YOUR CURRENT PREMIUM FEE. 
          UM, WE BELIEVE IT'S, IT'S UP TO ALMOST FIVE TIMES THAT. 
          AND WE THINK THAT THE OPERATIONAL METRICS ALONE SUPPORT WHY THAT REALLY NEEDS TO BE A HIGHER CHARGE. 
          NOW, THAT'S A VALUE JUDGMENT. 
          I'M NOT SAYING THAT IT'S WRONG TO OFFER THAT SERVICE, BUT I THINK WHAT I DO WANT TO GET ACROSS IS THAT THAT IS NOT AN INEXPENSIVE SERVICE BECAUSE OF THE TIME REQUIREMENT AND SOME OF THE INCREASED HEALTH AND SAFETY RISKS. 
          SO I JUST THINK YOU SHOULD, DO WE OFFER THAT NOW? YES. 
          YES, WE DO. 
          I ASK, AND I WAS GONNA SAY, I, I DON'T, I HATE, I ALWAYS HATE TO PUT STAFF ON SPOT, BUT I'M JUST CURIOUS, DO YOU KNOW HOW MANY PEOPLE, UM, UM, DO WE HAVE ANY IDEA OF HOW MANY OFF THE TOP OF MY HEAD? BUT IT'S QUITE A FEW, SEVERAL. 
          IT'S, IT IS A, IT IS A LOT. 
          IT'S A, UM, A LOT. 
          IT'S A LOT. 
          AND, UH, WE'RE GONNA BE COMING BACK TO COUNCIL WITH A REQUEST TO CHANGE THE ORDINANCE, UH, TO, UM, UH, GIVE IT, UH, I DON'T WANNA SAY STRICTER GUIDELINES, BUT MORE VALUE GUIDELINES THAN WHAT WE CURRENTLY HAVE. 
          'CAUSE IT IS KIND OF VAGUE. 
          YEP. 
          UM, BUT I WANT TO TIGHTEN UP ON THAT AND ALSO SEND OUT NOTICE TO THOSE, UH, THAT ARE CURRENTLY, THAT ARE CURRENTLY USING IT THAT HEY, THESE CHANGES ARE EXPECTED TO COME, BUT WE'RE GONNA BRING THAT TO COUNCIL IN THE FUTURE. 
          AND I THINK ANOTHER ISSUE, BECAUSE I'M GLAD YOU SAID THAT, 'CAUSE ANOTHER ISSUE THAT COMES UP, UM, WE ACTUALLY DO. 
          SO 
          [00:20:01]
THERE ARE CERTAINLY FOLKS THAT ARE PHYSICALLY DISABLED OR HAVE MEDICAL EXCEPTIONS. 
          WE ARE NOT SUGGESTING THAT THAT RATE BE CHARGED. 
          WE, WE BELIEVE IT IS APPROPRIATE AND THE INDUSTRY STANDARD, WE BELIEVE IS TO HAVE EXCEPTIONS FOR FOLKS THAT ARE PHYSICALLY DISABLED, HAVE SOME KIND OF A MEDICAL, UH, ISSUE AND NEED THAT SERVICE. 
          WE WOULD ESSENTIALLY SUGGEST YOU CHARGE THOSE FOLKS THE SAME RATE. 
          BUT BJ GOES TO YOUR POINT, HAVING THE RIGHT ORDINANCE LANGUAGE TO ESTABLISH, YEAH, WE WILL PROVIDE THE SERVICE WITHIN OUR REGULAR RATE STRUCTURE IF YOU NEED THE SERVICE BECAUSE YOU'RE PHYSICALLY UNABLE TO, TO GET YOUR WASTE WHERE WE NEED TO GET IT. 
          BUT OTHER THAN THAT, AS FAR AS PREMIUM SERVICE GOES, UM, THAT IS REALLY BECOMING A THING OF THE PAST IN OUR INDUSTRY IN ALL BUT THE MOST UNIQUE CIRCUMSTANCE. 
          AND I, AGAIN, YOU KNOW YOUR CUSTOMERS, YOU KNOW WHAT THEY WANT. 
          WE HAVE SOME CUSTOMERS IN, UH, QUITE CANDIDLY, UM, PRETTY WEALTHY AREAS THAT HAVE DECIDED THEY'LL PAY ALMOST ANY AMOUNT OF MONEY FOR THAT SERVICE. 
          WE HAVE A, A, A CUSTOMER DOWN IN, UH, UM, UM, ACTUALLY UP FROM OUR OFFICE IN FLORIDA, WE HAVE A CUSTOMER THAT THE, THE, THEIR FOLKS PAY 60 SOME DOLLARS A MONTH JUST FOR BACKDOOR SIDE DOOR SERVICE FOR THE WHOLE COMMUNITY. 
          'CAUSE IT'S JUST A VERY EXPENSIVE, RISKY SYSTEM. 
          SO I DID, I DID WANT TO CALL THAT PARTICULAR PREMIUM SERVICE OUT AS WE TALK ABOUT THIS. 
          AND THE TOP ONE IS, I'M JUST SAYING THE TOP, LIKE THE VERY TOP ONE, THE 1410, THAT'S ABOUT, I THINK IF I'M ASKING RIGHT, IT'S ABOUT $40 MORE A YEAR IS WHAT THE DIFFERENCE WOULD BE. 
          YEAH. 
          FOUR FOUR TI YEAH. 
          40, $50, FOUR AND 35 CENTS TIMES 12 IS ABOUT RIGHT. 
          YEAH. 
          NOT, NO, NO, IT'S NOT. 
          YEAH. 
          SO, SO THE, THE INCREMENTAL COST MAY BE $50 MORE A YEAR 50, ROUGHLY SPEAKING. 
          I CAN'T, I CAN'T SEE THE MATH IN MY HEAD. 
          NO, IT IS, IT IS ABOUT THAT. 
          RIGHT? SOMETHING SOMETHING LIKE THAT. 
          AND I GUESS THE OTHER THING, I DIDN'T TALK ABOUT IT, BUT ONE OF THE THINGS THAT YOU ALREADY DO THAT WE LIKE IS YOU OFFER YOUR RESIDENTS DIFFERENT SIZES OF TRASH CARTS. 
          AND, AND SO A BIGGER TRASH CART, YOU CHARGE MORE SMALLER TRASH CART, YOU CHARGE LESS THAT, THAT'S ANOTHER RATIONAL COMPONENT, UH, OF A SALT WASTE UTILITY THAT YOU'VE ALREADY BUILT IN. 
          AND SO, UM, SO THAT, THAT MAKES A LOT OF SENSE. 
          UM, AND WE'VE OBVIOUSLY, WE THINK THAT THAT'S A GOOD THING TO KEEP. 
          SO 52, 50 $2. 
          THERE WE GO. 
          BUT SOMEBODY'S GOT THE CALCULATOR HERE. 
          SO I, I AM CURIOUS THOUGH, HOW, HOW MANY, WE DO HAVE A HIGH PERCENTAGE OF DISABLED PEOPLE HERE. 
          DO YOU HAVE ANY CLUE OF HOW I DIDN'T BRING IT UP WITH ME? I DO HAVE THOSE FIGURES. 
          DO YOU HAPPEN TO HAVE THEM? YOU KNOW WHAT? I DON'T HAVE THEM FROM MEMORY AS I STAND HERE BEFORE YOU, I'M SURE WE HAVE THOSE IN OUR MODEL. 
          'CAUSE I THINK WE TALKED THROUGH THAT. 
          AND THAT NUMBER ISN'T NECESSARILY THAT THEY'RE DISABLED. 
          IT'S THAT THEY'RE, THEY, THEY'RE ON OUR PROGRAM NOW. 
          OUR PROGRAM IS KIND OF VAGUE. 
          UM, AND WE'LL, SO IF THE INCOME HEALTH PROGRAM IS WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, LIKE AN INCOME PROGRAM INCOME? NO, IT'S, NO, IT'S REALLY ABOUT ABILITY TO GET THE TRASH RIGHT. 
          OUR CURRENT, CURRENT PROGRAM IS, UH, UM, IT'S FOR, UH, BY AGE. 
          AND THEN I THINK THERE'S ALSO SOMETHING FOR THE MEDICAL. 
          UM, BUT I'M, WE'RE GONNA BE BRINGING BACK THAT IN IN DEPTH AT A LATER WORK SESSION. 
          OKAY. 
          SO JUST OUTTA CURIOSITY. 
          MM-HMM. 
           DO, DO THEY PAY, DO THEY PAY THE 1410 AND IN ADDITION TO THAT, THE $5. 
          OKAY. 
          THAT'S WHAT I THOUGHT. 
          SO THEY'D BE LIKE $19 AND 10 CENTS TO BE ABLE TO HAVE DOOR TO DOOR TO, YOU KNOW, DOOR TO CURB SERVICE. 
          CORRECT. 
          AND THEY, AND THEN THEY ALSO BRING THE, THE, UH, TRASH SUSCEPTIBLE BACK TO THE DOOR. 
          MM-HMM. 
          , WHEREVER THEY, WHEREVER THEY TAKE IT FROM, THEY CAN PUT IT EXACTLY BACK, RIGHT? YEAH. 
          SO, UM, SO I THINK WITH THAT CONCLUSION, YEAH, THANK YOU FOR THE QUESTIONS. 
          I THINK THOSE ARE GOTTEN GLAD WE GOT TO TOUCH ON A COUPLE OF THOSE ISSUES. 
          JUST KIND OF SEEING THAT, YOU KNOW, ONE YEAR, FOUR TO FIVE, THREE TO $4 AND THEN 30%. 
          SO LET ME NOW CUT OVER TO A RESIDENTIAL THREE YEAR RATE PATH. 
          AND, AND WE WILL KIND OF, WE'LL TAKE A LOOK AT THAT. 
          SO SAME ROWS, RIGHT? SAME ROWS. 
          WE'VE GOT THE MONTHLY RATES AND ABSOLUTE HOUSE COST PER HOUSEHOLD PER MONTH ON THE TOP TABLE PERCENTAGE CHANGE. 
          BUT ESSENTIALLY WHAT YOU'RE SEEING, UM, AND, AND THIS IS, UH, I WOULD SAY OUR BASELINE THREE YEAR PHASE IN RECOMMENDATION, MUCH LOWER, LESS THAN 10% A YEAR ACROSS THREE YEARS. 
          YOU CAN SEE EVENTUALLY YOU'RE GETTING UP IN 2026 TO ABOUT THE SAME LEVEL. 
          IT ACTUALLY IS GONNA COME IN A LITTLE BIT HIGHER. 
          'CAUSE AS YOU'RE, AS YOU'RE BEHIND, YOU'LL BE CATCHING UP OVER THREE YEARS. 
          AND, AND I THINK WE JUST WANTED TO CONTRAST DOING IT ALL AT ONCE AND HITTING A BIG 30% INCREASE, WHICH EVEN THOUGH IT'S ONLY $50 A YEAR, 27, 30%, THAT'S A PRETTY BIG PERCENTAGE NUMBER. 
          YOU COULD, YOU COULD POTENTIALLY, UM, YOU KNOW, GET SOME SOME NEGATIVE FEEDBACK ON THAT. 
          SO WE WANTED TO ALSO GIVE YOU WHAT IT MIGHT LOOK LIKE IF YOU WANTED TO PHASE IN THESE INCREASES IN A WAY THAT ISN'T GONNA HIT EVERYBODY ALL UP FRONT. 
          UM, I WILL POINT OUT THAT, UM, WE DO RECOMMEND WE DID NOT PHASE IN THE, UH, THE PREMIUM SERVICE, THE PRIVATE PROPERTY ENTRY, WE ARE ESSENTIALLY RECOMMENDING, AND AGAIN, THESE ARE CONSULTANT RECOMMENDATIONS, WE'RE HERE TO SUPPORT YOU TO MAKE DECISIONS THAT ARE GONNA WORK FOR YOUR CONSTITUENCY. 
          UM, BUT WE DID LEAVE, UH, ESSENTIALLY JUST AN IMMEDIATE INCREASE TO THE PRIVATE ENTRY, UH, PREMIUM SERVICE BECAUSE, UM, THAT IS REALLY THE WAY THE 
          [00:25:01]
INDUSTRY IS GOING. 
          AND FRANKLY IT DOES, IT CREATES HIGHER RISK OF, OF INJURY AND, YOU KNOW, AB YOU KNOW, KIND OF SHORT TERM ABSENTEEISM OR LIGHT DUTY SERVICE AND THINGS THAT IMPAIR YOU OPERATIONALLY. 
          SO, UM, WE DIDN'T, THAT'S $222 THE DIFFERENCE IN CASE Y'ALL WERE  NO, I'M JUST LETTING THEM. 
          SO THE DIFFERENCE FOR THAT, FOR SOMEBODY ON THE ENTRY ON THE PROPERTY WOULD BE $222 DIFFERENCE FOR THE YEAR. 
          THAT DOESN'T NECESSARILY TAKE AN ANNUAL INFLATION. 
          WELL, SO, UM, SO OUR RATE MODEL, WE ARE PROJECTING, WE ARE ESCALATING YOUR DIRECT OPERATING EXPENSE. 
          UM, WE'RE ESCALATING, WE'RE ESSENTIALLY ESCALATING IN OUR MODEL. 
          SO WE HAVE TAKEN THAT INTO ACCOUNT IN SETTING THESE RATES. 
          WE WE'RE ASSUMING THAT THE, YOUR COST OF DELIVERING SERVICE IS GOING TO INCREASE AND WE FACTORED THAT IN. 
          BUT YOURS QUESTION IS PERFECT TIMING BECAUSE I DIDN'T MENTION ON THE LAST SLIDE, BUT YOU CAN SEE THERE'S A, A LITTLE, UH, ITALICIZED, BULLETED, UH, SENTENCE ON THE BOTTOM OF THIS SLIDE. 
          UM, WE GENERALLY RECOMMEND TO ALL OF OUR, UH, LOCAL GOVERNMENT SOLID WASTE PROVIDERS TO CONTEMPLATE SOME FORM OF ROUTINE, UH, RATE ESCALATION RATHER THAN DOING A RATE STUDY EVERY YEAR. 
          UM, WE GENERALLY SAY, GOSH, IF YOU CAN DO AN ANNUAL ESCALATION AT MAYBE CPI OR MAYBE, YOU KNOW, THREE QUARTERS OF CPI OR SOME PLACES WILL DO, SOME COMMITTEES WILL DO A, EVERY TWO YEARS, THEY'LL JUMP UP 5%. 
          BUT SOME ROUTINE ESCALATION, WE, UH, I MEAN MY CRYSTAL BALLS NO BETTER THAN ANY OF THE GURUS ON WALL STREET, BUT WE DON'T SEE THE, THE PRICE OF DELIVERING SANITATION SERVICES COMING DOWN ANYTIME SOON, . 
          SO, UM, SO WE DO RECOMMEND THAT IN ADDITION TO CONTEMPLATING WHAT WE THINK ARE IMPORTANT INITIAL RATE INCREASES TO GET YOU TO THAT SUSTAINABILITY, YOU KNOW, NICE FINANCIALLY SUSTAINABLE SYSTEM, WE THINK THAT WOULD BE APPROPRIATE TO SET EXPECTATIONS WITH YOUR COMMUNITY THAT HEY, YOU KNOW, WE ARE GONNA NEED TO, YOU KNOW, REASONABLY INCREASE RATES EVERY YEAR MUCH AS YOU WOULD A WATER UTILITY OR ELECTRIC UTILITY OR ANY OTHER UTILITY THAT'S GOTTA, YOU KNOW, CONTINUE PROVIDING SERVICES, UH, YOU KNOW, GOING FORWARD. 
          SO I, I APPRECIATE THE QUESTION 'CAUSE IT WAS A PERFECT TIMING TO, UH, POINT OUT THAT NOTION THAT, THAT THAT'S SOMETHING WE WOULD RECOMMEND THAT YOU CONSIDER JUST TO MAINTAIN GOOD FINANCIAL HEALTH, UM, FOR THE SERVICES THAT YOU'RE DELIVERING TO YOUR CUSTOMERS. 
          THAT IS GOING VERY WELL. 
          SO WHAT DOES CPI MEAN, CPI IS THE CONSUMER PRICE INDEX AND IT'S A WIDELY PUBLISHED, UH, UH, FEDERAL, UH, GOVERNMENT METRIC AND THERE ARE ALL SORTS OF BREAKDOWNS, BUT CPI IS JUST THE, THE QUICK ADJUSTMENT. 
          WE CAN THANK YOU. 
          UH, IF WE, IF IF THERE'S ANY INTEREST WE CAN TALK THROUGH THAT THERE ARE DIFFERENT CPIS THAT GET APPLIED FOR SANITATION. 
          WE'RE HAPPY TO TALK WITH YOU OFFLINE ON THAT. 
          SO I JUST SAID ALL IGNORANT BY THAT. 
          SO. 
          ALRIGHT, SO I HAVE BEEN TALKING ABOUT RESIDENTIAL SERVICE. 
          I'M GONNA SHIFT OVER TO COMMERCIAL DUMPSTER SERVICE. 
          SO DUMPSTERS ARE THE LARGER CONTAINERS, YOU KNOW, 2, 4, 6 YARD CONTAINERS THAT YOU CAN THROW BAGS IN. 
          THEY TYPICALLY HAVE LIDS. 
          UM, YOU DON'T HAVE VERY MANY COMMERCIAL CUSTOMERS. 
          UM, WE, UM, WE LOOKED AT YOUR CURRENT RATE, WHICH IS BROKEN BETWEEN A COLLECTION CHARGE AND A DISPOSAL CHARGE. 
          AND WE'RE ACTUALLY ACTUALLY JUST SAYING THAT IT TURNS OUT IT'S INDUSTRY STANDARD TO, UH, HAVE A SINGLE CHARGE THAT COMBINES BOTH THE COLLECTION COMPONENT AND THE DISPOSAL COMPONENT BASED ON THE SIZE OF THE CONTAINER. 
          THERE, THERE ARE TWO THINGS THAT IMPACT THE COST OF COMMERCIAL DUMPSTER COLLECTION. 
          HOW BIG IS A CONTAINER? BIGGER CONTAINER'S, MORE TRASH. 
          SO IT'S MORE EXPENSIVE TO DISPOSE OF IT, BUT ALSO HOW MANY TIMES A WEEK DO YOU HAVE TO TRAVEL TO THAT PROPERTY AND LIFT IT? SO BASICALLY IF YOU TRAVEL TWICE A WEEK TO A COMMERCIAL BUSINESS THAT'S TWICE AS EXPENSIVE TO SERVE AS THE BUSINESS, THAT'S YOU ONLY TRAVEL ONCE A WEEK TO GO SERVE. 
          SO WE FACTOR IN THE FREQUENCY AND THE CONTAINER SIZE WHEN WE'RE DEVELOPING OUR COST PROJECTIONS. 
          AND, AND THERE'S AN KIND OF AN INDUSTRY STANDARD RATE MAKING, UM, MATRIX THAT WE USE FOR COMMERCIAL DUMPSTER SERVICE. 
          AND I THINK, UH, IT IS AN IMPORTANT TAKEAWAY THAT, UM, THE CURRENT RATES, UM, ARE LOW, BUT THEY ACTUALLY START TO GET REALLY LOW AS THE FREQUENCY GOES UP. 
          NOW YOU DON'T HAVE A LOT OF CUSTOMERS, UM, BUT YOU CAN SEE, UM, UH, THE CURRENT RATES, THERE'S A LITTLE BIT OF A STAIR STEP GOING FROM ONCE A WEEK TO TWICE A WEEK. 
          UH, WE BELIEVE THE MATH IS, IS VERY CLEAR TO DEMONSTRATE THAT IF YOU HAVE TWICE A WEEK, IT'S BASICALLY TWICE AS EXPENSIVE AS ONCE A WEEK SERVICE. 
          'CAUSE THAT TRUCK'S GOTTA MAKE THAT TRIP BOTH TIMES AND PICK UP THAT TRASH BOTH TIMES AND DUMP THAT TRASH BOTH TIMES. 
          SO, UM, WE HAVE ONLY PUT FORTH HERE ON THIS SLIDE THE NOTION OF JUST MAKING A ONETIME RATE INCREASE FOR THE, YOUR SMALL NUMBER OF COMMERCIAL CUSTOMERS TO GET THEM UP TO THE FULL COST. 
          UM, THANKFULLY IT'S NOT A HUGE, A HUGE COMPONENT OF YOUR SYSTEM AND WE THINK YOU'RE PROBABLY ALSO SERVING CUSTOMERS THAT IF THEY DID TURN AROUND AND GO OUT TO A PRIVATE HAULER, THEY'D FRANKLY PROBABLY PAY MORE. 
          'CAUSE WE THINK THERE'S PROBABLY A REASON THAT YOU'RE SERVING A FEW COMMERCIAL CUSTOMERS BECAUSE, UH, UM, IT SORT OF WORKS OUT THAT WAY THAT THE PRIVATE HAULERS ARE HAPPY TO LET THE CITY DO CUSTOMERS THAT MAY BE A LITTLE BIT MORE CHALLENGING TO DO SOMETIMES. 
          SO, UM, WE, WE THINK THIS IS NOT A HUGE RISK. 
          UM, CERTAINLY YOU MAY, YOU MAY KNOW MORE THAN WE DO ON THAT, BUT THAT WAS OUR SENSE IN BRINGING 17 COMMERCIAL CUSTOMERS THIS BRINGING BRINGING THIS FORWARD TO YOU THAT WE THINK THAT'S A, A PRETTY FAIR AND REASONABLE 
          [00:30:01]
AND, UM, FRANKLY NOT THAT, UM, CONTROVERSIAL OF A, OF A, OF A CHANGE TO MAKE DJ. 
          ARE THEY ALL OVER TOWN OR ARE THEY IN CERTAIN WE ALL WRITE DOWN. 
          I DON'T THINK I CAN SAY. 
          OH, OKAY. 
          YEAH, SORRY. 
          THE MURDER WAS ON. 
          I KNOW KNOW WE'VE GOT ONE OUT JOHN MARSHALL, SO IT COULD BE ODD. 
          YEAH. 
          AND SO, SO COMMERCIAL BUSINESSES IN, IN THE TOWN HAVE THE OP THE OPTION TO PICK UP THE PHONE AND CALL A, A PRIVATE VENDOR TO COME IN AND SERVE THEM. 
          AND, UH, IN SOME REGARDS, UM, I WOULD HYPOTHESIZE AND I MAYBE NEED TO BE A LITTLE CAREFUL IN A PUBLIC SETTING, BUT, UH, OFTENTIMES, UM, THE COMMERCIAL ENTITIES THAT ARE NOT, UH, YOU KNOW, THAT ARE NOT USING THE, THE PRIVATE HAULERS HAVE CALLED AROUND AND ARE GETTING A LOT HIGHER PRICES FROM PRIVATE HAULERS. 
          SO THEY'RE HAPPY TO, UH, KEEP THEIR BUSINESS WITH YOU AT A SIGNIFICANTLY DISCOUNTED RATE. 
          AND I THINK WE'RE JUST SUGGESTING YOU SHOULD CHARGE A FAIR RATE FOR THE SERVICE YOU'RE PROVIDING. 
          AND CANDIDLY, I'LL, IF YOU DO RAISE YOUR RATE AND EVERYBODY SAYS, OH, THAT YOUR 17 CUSTOMERS GET UPSET WITH YOU, IT'S NOT A FINANCIALLY FATAL BLOW TO LOSE A FEW COMMERCIAL CUSTOMERS IN SOME REGARDS. 
          SO, UH, AGAIN, I MAYBE NEED TO BE A LITTLE CAREFUL OF THAT. 
          YOU'RE FINE. 
          , I APOLOGIZE. 
          BUT, UH, IN SOME REGARDS THAT THAT'S A VERY MANAGEABLE CUSTOMER BASE FOR YOU. 
          SO, WHICH IS POSITIVE. 
          WE HAVE, WE HAVE SOME CLIENTS, SOME LOCAL GOVERNMENTS ACTUALLY PROVIDE A HUNDRED PERCENT OF THE COMMERCIAL SERVICE AS WELL AS A HUNDRED PERCENT OF THE RESIDENTIAL SERVICE, IN WHICH CASE IT'S A VERY DIFFERENT, UH, DIFFERENT BALLGAME. 
          AND REALLY THIS, THIS BRINGS ME TO WHAT I THINK IS PROBABLY A COMBINATION OF A LITTLE BIT OF, UM, HOPEFULLY GIVING AN OVERVIEW OF HOW THINGS WORK NOW IN MAIN STREET AND TO TALK A LITTLE BIT ABOUT HOW WE THINK THEY MAYBE SHOULD WORK AND TO GET YOUR GUIDANCE ON THIS TOPIC. 
          SO, UM, THE MAIN STREET CORRIDOR, WHICH IS, UM, I KNOW I'M IN IT RIGHT NOW, BUT I I DON'T QUITE HAVE THE FEEL FOR NORTH ROYAL AVENUE TO HIGH STREET, BUT ABOUT 145 ACCOUNTS, UM, WHICH IS, IT'S MIXED USE. 
          SO THERE'S SOME RESIDENTIAL, UH, PROPERTY RESIDENTIAL, UH, HOUSEHOLDS, UH, AND THEN THERE ARE SOME, UH, SOME COMMERCIAL BUSINESSES, SOME GOVERNMENTAL BUILDINGS. 
          I THINK. 
          I THINK IT'S A, A MIX OF, UH, COMMERCIAL MAYBE INSTITUTIONAL GOVERNMENTAL. 
          UM, AND SO, AND THERE ARE A VARIETY OF BUSINESS TYPES AS WELL. 
          AND, AND THIS IS IMPORTANT TO REMEMBER, UM, AND AS FORESHADOWING, I WOULD ASK YOU IF, YOU KNOW, IF YOU GO INTO A, AN ANTIQUE SHOP, YOU'RE PROBABLY NOT THINKING THERE'S A HUGE AMOUNT OF TRASH BEING GENERATED AND YOU GO INTO A RESTAURANT, YOU PROBABLY HAVE A FAIR AMOUNT OF TRASH AND IT'S PRETTY HEAVY. 
          AND, AND SO THOSE ARE THINGS THAT FACTOR INTO THE COST OF PROVIDING SERVICE, RIGHT? HOW MUCH IS GENERATED AND HOW EXPENSIVE IS IT TO COLLECT IT AND DISPOSE OF IT. 
          SO EVEN THOUGH YOU HAVE SHARED COLLECTION, UM, YOU HAVE GENERATORS OF THAT THAT GENERATE DIFFERENT AMOUNTS, UM, THAT YOU ALL ARE, ARE SERVING THROUGH THESE SHARED CONTAINERS. 
          AND I THINK ANOTHER THING WE REALIZED IS THE MAIN STREET AREA, UM, THERE ARE, WE THINK SOME CUSTOMERS A PRETTY SIGNIFICANT NUMBER THAT ARE NOT ACTUALLY CURRENTLY BEING CHARGED FOR GARBAGE COLLECTION BECAUSE THERE'S NO ASSOCIATED UTIL, AND HELP ME IF I'M MISSTATING THIS, IF THERE'S NO ASSOCIATED UTILITY, UH, THAT SAYS, HEY, THERE'S A CUSTOMER AT THIS BUILDING GENERATING TRASH, BUT WE DON'T HAVE A WATER METER. 
          THEY MIGHT BE SKATING, UH, GETTING SERVICE THAT THEY, YOU KNOW, AT THE MOMENT ARE PAYING FOR. 
          SO THERE'S A LITTLE BIT OF AN INFRASTRUCTURE ISSUE ON MAIN STREET TO BE ABLE TO PROPERLY ASSESS SOLID WASTE FEES TO THE FOLKS THAT ARE LEGITIMATELY GENERATING WASTE THAT NEED YOUR SERVICES. 
          SO WHERE IS THEIR GARBAGE GOING? OH, IT'S GOING TO YOU. 
          THE, THE PROBLEM, THE PROBLEM IS OUR, OUR CURRENT ORDINANCE REQUIRES, UM, ACCOUNTS TO BE CONNECTED TO SANITARY SEWER. 
          UM, THERE'S A NUMBER OF ACCOUNTS ON MAIN STREET THAT DO NOT HAVE SANITARY SERVER, THEIR ACCOUNT BECAUSE THE LANDLORD PAYS IT OR WHAT HAVE YOU. 
          THERE'S ALL KINDS OF, OH, DIFFERENT NUANCES. 
          MM-HMM. 
          . 
          SO THE LANDLORD MAY BE PAYING FOR IT, BUT THE OTHER ACCOUNTS ARE NOT. 
          SO THAT'S, THAT'S WHERE WE'RE, WE'VE GOT A LITTLE BIT OF A, OF A PROBLEM THERE AND WE'RE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT HOW TO WORK THROUGH THIS. 
          AND SO A LANDLORD COULD HAVE THREE, FOUR OR FIVE TENANTS, BUT THEY'RE ONLY PAYING ONE GARBAGE RATE, ONE GARBAGE, THE WHOLE BUILDING. 
          AND IT COULD BE THAT THEY'RE PAYING THE $26 FOR COMMERCIAL IF THEY HAVE A, YOU KNOW, A BUSINESS ACCOUNT AND THEN, UM, OR MAYBE THEY'RE ALL CONNECTED TO, UM, YOU KNOW, ONE METER. 
          UM, BUT THEY ONLY GET, YOU ONLY GET ONE TRASH CAN. 
          RIGHT? WELL NORMALLY FOR THAT, FOR THAT MAIN STREET, DOESN'T, MAIN STREET DOESN'T HAVE TRASH CANS. 
          MAIN STREET HAS MUCH MORE, IT'S MUCH MORE OF A SHARED SERVICE MODEL BECAUSE OF THE HIGH DENSITY GOTCHA. 
          OKAY. 
          WHERE MULTIPLE GENERATORS ARE USING A, A SUBSET OF CONTAINERS WHERE YOU CAN'T NECESSARILY, THERE'S, SO WHERE'S, LIKE IN RESIDENTIAL, WE ARE ONLY ALLOWED ONE TRASH CAN AND IF YOU HAVE MORE THAN THAT, YOU COULD CHARGE US MORE. 
          LIKE OUR LEAST THAT'S WHAT THEY SAY. 
          CORRECT. 
          YOU KNOW, SO I MEAN, MAIN STREET, THEY'RE USING THESE SHARED CONTAINERS, THE, THE DUMPSTERS THAT ARE OUT BACK. 
          UM, SO WE DON'T KNOW HOW, YOU KNOW, IF THEY'RE, IF IF IT'S ONE CONTAINER, IF IT'S THREE CONTAINERS. 
          SO THAT THAT'S OUR, THAT'S WHAT WE'RE GOING GETTING INTO, SORRY, . 
          YEP. 
          AND, AND I THINK WHAT THIS SLIDE ALSO HIGHLIGHTS IS THERE IS A VERY, WHAT I WOULD CALL ADMINISTRATIVELY, THERE'S AN ADMINISTRATIVELY SIMPLISTIC RATE, 
          [00:35:01]
I THINK AS A CONSEQUENCE, RIGHT. 
          OF NOT HAVING, UM, REALLY THE RIGHT, UH, YOU KNOW, METER, UH, CORRELATION BETWEEN METERS AND WASTE GENERATION. 
          THERE'S A, YOU KNOW, KIND OF A SIMPLISTIC RATE WHERE IF YOU'RE A RESIDENT, YOU GET CHARGED THE RESIDENTIAL RATE AND IF YOU'RE A COMMERCIAL, WE'RE JUST GONNA CHARGE YOU $26. 
          RIGHT? SO IT'S VERY SIMPLISTIC. 
          LET ME NOW JUMP THOUGH THAT, AND THIS GOES BACK, I THINK MAYOR, YOU POINTED OUT THE SIGNIFICANT, UH, SHORTFALL IN, UH, CURRENT REVENUES IN MAIN STREET. 
          THERE'S A SERIOUS DEFICIT IN TERMS OF THE COST OF SERVICE. 
          AND SO WE WORKED WITH STAFF TO, UH, ISOLATE THE ROUTES AND THE EMPLOYEES AND THE TRUCKS THAT ARE NEEDED TO GO DOWN TO YOUR MAIN STREET AREA, THE, THE TIME, THE TIME REQUIREMENT FOR THEM TO PROVIDE THESE SERVICES. 
          'CAUSE THEY'VE GOTTA GO MULTIPLE DAYS A WEEK BECAUSE EVERYBODY'S FILLING THESE CONTAINERS AT, YOU KNOW, EVERY DAY YOU CAN'T LET THAT OVERFLOW. 
          'CAUSE THEN YOU HAVE REAL ISSUES WITH LITTER, UH, IN YOUR MAIN STREET AREA. 
          SO THERE'S A SIGNIFICANT DEFICIT. 
          UH, AND SO, UM, WE DID KIND OF SOME SIMPLISTIC, IF YOU JUST, UM, IF, IF YOU, IF YOU JUST WENT TO A SORT OF AN EQUALLY SIMPLISTIC FLAT RATE GIVEN THE CUSTOMERS THAT YOU HAVE, YOU WOULD NEED TO BUMP. 
          WE, UH, WE WOULD ESSENTIALLY HONOR THE RESIDENTIAL RATE OF 1845, WHICH WE'LL RECALL WAS THE RECOMMENDED 30% INCREASE. 
          BUT YOU, WE, WE WOULD ESSENTIALLY, YOU WOULD BE REALLY BUMPING UP THOSE COMMERCIAL RATES INTO THE HUNDREDS FROM THE $26 RANGE IF YOU KEPT A SIM A SIMPLISTICALLY FLAT RATE. 
          CONVERSELY, YOU COULD JUST TAKE ALL OF THE PAYING ACCOUNTS, WHICH IS A COMBINATION OF RESIDENTIAL AND COMMERCIAL. 
          YOU COULD CHARGE THEM A SINGLE RATE. 
          BUT THEN YOU'RE REALLY MASSIVELY OVERCHARGING YOUR RESIDENTIAL DWELLINGS. 
          UH, AND YOU'RE STILL MISSING THE 68 ACCOUNTS THAT AREN'T PAYING. 
          AND SO REALLY I THINK I'M HERE TO ENLIGHTEN THE FACT THAT THERE ARE SOME, AT THE MOMENT, UM, THERE, THERE'S SOME ORDINANCE ISSUES THAT DON'T ALLOW YOU TO CHARGE AND RECOVER RATES FROM FOLKS THAT AREN'T ON METERS. 
          SO THERE'S A LITTLE BIT OF A KIND OF AN ORDINANCE, UH, MANAGEMENT ISSUE ASSOCIATED. 
          BUT THEN THERE ALSO ARE QUESTIONS ABOUT, UM, SETTING RATES IN A DOWNTOWN SHARED SERVICE AREA. 
          UM, I'LL SHARE WHAT WE THINK IS SORT OF THE PROFESSIONAL BEST PRACTICE. 
          UM, THERE ARE MANY COMMUNITIES THAT HAVE A DOWNTOWN AREA WITH MANY GENERATORS THAT SHARE A SMALL NUMBER OF CONTAINERS. 
          SO, UM, THERE ARE A VARIETY OF, UM, BASES THAT CAN BE USED TO DEVELOP A TIERED RATE STRUCTURE FOR SHARED SERVICE. 
          AND IT, UH, THE, THE RATE DEVELOPMENT TYPICALLY DIFFERENTIATES BUSINESSES BY TYPE OF BUSINESS. 
          I'M NOT HERE TO CALL ANY NAMES TO ANY PARTICULAR BUSINESS IN THE TOWN, BUT RESTAURANTS GENERATE MORE AND HEAVIER WASTE PER SQUARE FOOT THAN SMALL RETAIL SHOPS, FOR EXAMPLE. 
          SO, SO THERE'S A BUSINESS DIFFERENTIATION IN TERMS OF HOW GENERATION WORKS IN THESE AREAS. 
          AND THEN THERE'S ALSO A SIZE GENERATION, LIKE A SMALL DINER RESTAURANT IS NOT GONNA GENERATE AS MUCH AS A LARGER SIT-DOWN RESTAURANT. 
          SO, SO THERE ARE, UM, RATE MODELS, UH, THAT CAN BE APPLIED TO A DOWNTOWN AREA, MAIN STREET AREA THAT TYPICALLY CATEGORIZE THE BUSINESSES BY TYPE. 
          AND THEN WE HAVE SOME DIFFERENT GENERATION FACTORS FOR DIFFERENT BUSINESS TYPES AND IDEALLY CAPTURES SOME SORT OF SQUARE FOOTAGE, POSSIBLY FROM TAX ROLLS, POSSIBLY FROM SOME OTHER SOURCE, UM, WHERE THERE'S ESSENTIALLY A TIERED RATE STRUCTURE. 
          AND SO IT SOUNDS LIKE A LOT OF WORK FOR WHAT'S A SMALL AREA, BUT IT'S OTHERWISE THERE'S A RISK OF HAVING RATES THAT REALLY ARE GOING TO BE UNFAIR AND DEMONSTRABLY WRONG FOR CERTAIN CUSTOMERS. 
          IN OTHER WORDS, THE MOMENT YOU CHARGE EVERY CUSTOMER DOWN THERE, INCLUDING RESIDENTS, $93 A MONTH, EVERY ONE OF THOSE RESIDENTIAL FOLKS IS GONNA HAVE A LEGITIMATE CLAIM THAT YOU'RE OVERCHARGING THEM. 
          SO THERE'S A LITTLE BIT OF A, HOW CAN WE WORK INTO, UM, A, A, UH, KIND OF A STANDARD RATE MATRIX THAT IS TIERED TO BUSINESS TYPE AND BUSINESS SIZE. 
          UH, AND SO I THINK, I THINK WE WERE HOPING TO SPUR A LITTLE DISCUSSION FROM YOU. 
          I THINK OUR RECOMMENDATION, WHICH I DON'T THINK WE PUT IN THE SLIDE, I THINK OUR RECOMMENDATION IS TO TAKE THE STEPS ADMINISTRATIVELY AND, AND IN THE ORDINANCE REVISION TO ENABLE REVENUE RECOVERY FROM EVERY ONE OF THE CUSTOMERS THAT GENERATE WASTE, WHICH SOUNDS LIKE WE DON'T HAVE THAT NOW. 
          SO THAT'S PART OF THE RECOMMENDATION. 
          BUT THEN ONCE THAT, ASSUMING THAT GOES FORWARD, THE SECOND RECOMMENDATION WOULD BE TO DEVELOP A, UM, UM, I WOULD SAY A BASIC TIERED RATE STRUCTURE FOR YOUR NON-RESIDENTIAL ACCOUNTS ON MAIN STREET THAT HAS SOME DIFFERENTIATION DEPENDING ON THE TYPE OF BUSINESS AND THE SIZE OF THE BUSINESS. 
          AND THAT'S A LITTLE BIT OF A TWO B DETERMINED BECAUSE THERE'S A, THERE'S SOME ADDITIONAL STEPS THAT WOULD NEED TO COME IN FOR THAT. 
          UM, THAT SAID, I THINK WE WOULD LOVE TO GET YOUR FEEDBACK ON, YOU KNOW, IS IT MORE IMPORTANT TO KEEP KIND OF ADMINISTRATIVE SIMPLICITY AND KIND OF, NOBODY'S COMPLAINED ABOUT THE RATES BEING ALL THE SAME AT TO DATE, BUT THAT'S 'CAUSE THEY'RE ALL VERY LOW. 
          YEAH. 
          IF YOU RAISE COMPLAINING. 
          YEAH. 
          RIGHT. 
          IF YOU RAISE THE RATES TO THE FULL COST AND KEEP THEM ALL KIND OF LEVEL, WE THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, I THINK WE'RE LOOKING FOR DO YOU WANT TO KEEP IT ADMINISTRATIVELY SIMPLE AND RECOVER FULL COST, BUT BUT HAVE IT BE MAYBE NOT EQUITABLE? 
          [00:40:01]
UM, OR SHOULD WE, YOU KNOW, IS THERE AN INTEREST IN WORKING TOWARDS A MORE, UM, NUANCED, EQUITABLE RATE STRUCTURE WHICH WE WILL NOT HAVE AS A RESULT OF THIS COST OF SERVICE PROJECT? THAT WOULD BE A FOLLOW ON. 
          BUT THAT WOULD BE SOMETHING THAT FRANKLY WOULD BE YOUR BEST BET IN TERMS OF BEING DEFENDABLE, UM, AGAINST DIFFERENT RATE PAYERS IN THE MAIN STREET AREA. 
          YOU WOULD TAKE AWAY A LOT OF THE, THE ARGUMENTS THEY MIGHT HAVE. 
          SO I, I THINK WE WOULD WELCOME ANY GUIDANCE WHETHER HERE OR WHETHER IN, IN YOUR NORMAL PROCESS OF, OF HOW YOU DISCUSS THESE THINGS. 
          YOU, SO THE NEXT SLIDE DOES KIND OF TALK A LITTLE BIT. 
          MM-HMM,  I THINK SO ISN'T THAT WHAT IT WAS? SO, OR WHERE YOU SAID, OR DID YOU WANT US TO DISCUSS FIRST AND THEN GO TO THE SLIDE? WELL, NO, I, SO, SO WE TRY TO THROW OUT, UM, THINGS THAT WE HAVE, UM, SEEN AND EVEN PERFORMED IN OTHER COMMUNITIES. 
          SO, UM, A LOT OF TIMES WHEN YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT, UM, PRETTY SIGNIFICANT RATE INCREASES OR NEW RATE REGIMES, UM, IT'S A SMALL ENOUGH AREA, MAYBE SOME SORT OF SURVEY TYPE, UH, STAKEHOLDER TYPE THING. 
          UM, WE HAVE SOME OTHER CLIENTS THAT HAVE ACTUALLY FORMED, UM, LIKE THE DOWNTOWN BUSINESS DISTRICT COMMITTEE, SORT OF A, A STAKEHOLDER GROUP OF THE FOLKS THAT ARE IN, THEY HAVE SOME THINGS LIKE THAT, BUT I DON'T KNOW THAT EVERY BUSINESS PARTICIPATES. 
          YEAH. 
          IT'S, IT'S SORT OF A REPRESENTATIVE GROUP. 
          SO, SO SURVEYS AND OR STAKEHOLDER MEETINGS ARE THINGS THAT SOMETIMES WE'VE BEEN A PART OF. 
          UM, IT ALSO, WE, WE HAVE DONE, IN FACT, OUR FIRM DOES A LOT OF GENERATION AND WASTE COMPOSITION AUDITS WHERE WE ESSENTIALLY WALK THE AREA, WE ASSESS THE BUSINESSES, WE DO WALKTHROUGHS DURING BUSINESS HOURS OF THE BUSINESSES AND TRY TO GET A LITTLE MORE QUANTITATIVE DIFFERENTIAL IN THE ACTUAL WASTE GENERATION, RIGHT? LIKE IN A PERFECT WORLD, WE GIVE EVERYBODY A SCALE AND THEY'D WEIGH ALL THEIR TRASH AND WE KNOW EXACTLY HOW TO SET THEIR RATES. 
          WELL THAT'S NOT PRACTICAL, BUT WE DO SOME, UM, KIND OF GENERATION TYPE INVESTIGATION. 
          UM, AND THEN AGAIN, JUST MORE TOWN HALL MEETING REALLY SORT OF STAKEHOLDER OUTREACH. 
          AND SO THESE ARE THINGS, AND THEN BJ'S POINTED OUT THE, UH, CODE REVISIONS WOULD BE NECESSARY ULTIMATELY TO, TO CAPTURE A HUNDRED PERCENT THE ABILITY TO RECOVER REVENUE FROM THE FOLKS THAT DON'T CURRENTLY HAVE METERS IN EVERY, EVERY U UH, UNIT WITHIN A PARCEL. 
          SO, UM, UH, YOU KNOW, AGAIN, NOT SAYING YOU HAVE TO DO ANY OF THESE, BUT WE ALSO HAVE SEEN, UM, MAIN STREET RATES BE A LITTLE THORNY. 
          AND IN SOME REGARDS IT'S REALLY JUST, UM, TRY TO THROW, THROW YOU SOME IDEAS. 
          SO YOU'VE GOT SOME TOOLS TO GET OUT AHEAD OF IT TO TALK TO SOME OF THE FOLKS THAT ARE, UH, USING THESE SERVICES, THAT ARE PAYING THESE RATE DOWN RATES DOWNTOWN. 
          AND, UM, I, I THINK OUR PHILOSOPHY IS MOST ENTITIES AREN'T GOING TO COMPLAIN ABOUT, YOU KNOW, CONCEPTUALLY THE NOTION OF PAYING FOR THE SERVICES THAT THEY NEED. 
          UH, SO IN SOME REGARDS, WE ALWAYS JUST TRY TO KEEP IT BASED ON HOW, HOW LARGE IS YOUR BUSINESS AND WHAT'S YOUR WASTE, THE PROFILE, WASTE PROFILE OF YOUR BUSINESS. 
          THAT'S WHAT WE WANT TO USE TO SET RATES AND THAT TENDS TO NOT BE CONTROVERSIAL. 
          SO THE CONTROVERSY IS USUALLY THE DOLLAR VALUE, BUT THE UNDERLYING BASIS TYPICALLY IS NOT CONTROVERSIAL. 
          AND SO CAN WE, UM, MAY I ASK, IN YOUR EXPERIENCE, ARE WE THAT, I MEAN, DO YOU ALL COME ACROSS THIS OFTEN WHERE THERE'S THESE AREAS WHERE THEY HAVE SUCH A DIVERSE, YOU KNOW? YEAH, WE, WE ACTUALLY JUST DID A $50,000 STUDY FOR THE CITY OF KNOXVILLE, TENNESSEE, STRICTLY TO HELP THEM SET RATES IN ABOUT A FOUR BY EIGHT SQUARE BLOCK DOWNTOWN AREA, UH, OF KNOXVILLE, TENNESSEE. 
          WE HAVE ACTUALLY DONE DOWNTOWN RATE STUDIES FOR SEVERAL COMMUNITIES. 
          US IT'S, FOR WHATEVER REASON, IT'S PREDOMINANTLY IN THE MIDWEST. 
          I DON'T KNOW WHY THAT IS, BUT IT SEEMS LIKE THROUGHOUT, UM, UH, KANSAS, WE JUST DID ONE FOR MANHATTAN, WHICH IS A, IT'S A UNIVERSITY TOWN, SO THEY HAVE THEIR LITTLE DOWNTOWN, UH, I THINK IT'S AGGIE, UH, ONE OF THE KANSAS UNIVERSITIES. 
          SO IT, IT IS A COMMON, IT'S A COMMON CHALLENGE. 
          UM, AND COMMUNITIES HAVE SOLVED IT A VARIETY OF DIFFERENT WAYS. 
          UM, AND AGAIN, WE THINK THE, THE BEST PRACTICE IS TO FACTOR IN DIFFERENTIATION OF RATES BY THE TYPE OF BUSINESS AND BY THE SIZE OF THE BUSINESS. 
          AND IF, IF YOU CAN, IF YOU CAN FACTOR THOSE IN, YOU DON'T HAVE TO HAVE YOUR RATES PERFECTLY DOWN TO THE, DOWN TO THE LAST POUND. 
          THEY JUST NEED TO BE RATIONAL. 
          AND, AND I THINK THAT THAT'S A PRACTICE THAT IS, UH, APPLIED IN, IN MOST UTILITY SETTINGS AND IT'S WHAT WE'VE SEEN IN THE SOLID WASTE INDUSTRY. 
          UM, AND, AND I MEAN, IN SOME REGARDS, I REALLY THINK THAT IF YOU TAKE THE TIME TO DO IT AND YOU EXPLAIN IT, IT TENDS TO NOT, IT TENDS TO NOT BE AN ISSUE. 
          IT'S JUST WHEN IT, I, I THINK THE CHALLENGE HERE IN FRONT ROYAL IS THAT IT, IT'S A SMALL AREA, RIGHT? SO THERE AREN'T VERY MANY CUSTOMERS, SO IT HASN'T COME UP. 
          I THINK WE'VE GOTTEN INVOLVED FOR COMMUNITIES WITH VERY LARGE DOWNTOWN AREAS WHERE MAYBE IT'S, YOU KNOW, $500,000 OF ANNUAL REVENUE TO COVER THE DOWNTOWN SERVICE VERSUS $80,000, YOU KNOW, SO IT'S STARTING TO GET EVEN INTO THE MILLIONS OF DOLLARS, BUT, UM, IT'S PROBABLY, AGAIN, IT'S WORTH A THOUGHT. 
          UM, WE DIDN'T WANNA BE PRESUMPTUOUS TO SAY YOU HAVE TO DO THIS, BUT I APPRECIATE YOUR ATTENTION ON, YOU KNOW, SOME OF THESE NUANCES IN, IN OUR INDUSTRY THAT ARE CHALLENGING BECAUSE WE JUST DON'T HAVE, THERE'S NOT, NOBODY'S FIGURED OUT A TRASH METER THAT'S GONNA RUN UP, UH, A NICE LITTLE DIAL EVERY TIME YOU THROW AWAY TRASH. 
          [00:45:01]
SO, SO WE HAVE SOME UNIQUE ISSUES HERE IN SANITATION. 
          UH, AND THAT'S REALLY WHERE IT MANIFESTS ITSELF IN THE TOWN. 
          IT'S HERE DOWN IN THE MAIN STREET AREA. 
          CAN I ASK BJ, ROBBIE, ERIC A QUESTION? MM-HMM. 
          . 
          SO, SO IN, IN SOME OF THESE SITUATIONS THEY MIGHT BE PAYING ALL THE SAME, YOU KNOW, $26 OR WHATEVER, RIGHT? UM, BUT SO IF IT'S ONE OF THE BUSINESSES, ONE OF THE RESTAURANTS OR WHATEVER, IF THEIR BUSINESS OR RESTAURANT WAS SAY, FIVE BLOCKS OVER, ARE THEY PAYING THE COMMERCIAL? IS IT THE SAME? LIKE THEY, WELL, THEY MOST, WE ONLY HAVE 17 COMMERCIAL ACCOUNTS. 
          OKAY. 
          UH, OUTSIDE, YOU KNOW, UH, WHAT WE'RE DOING ON MAIN STREET, OBVIOUSLY, BUT 17 COMMERCIAL ACCOUNTS WHERE WE ACTUALLY PICK UP DUMPSTERS. 
          SO OUTSIDE OF MAIN STREET, MOST LIKELY OUTSIDE OF THOSE 17, THEY'VE GONE WITH A PRIVATE HAULER TO PICK UP PEOPLE ON MAIN STREET WHO DON'T HAVE THAT LUXURY GOING WITH A PRIVATE HAULER. 
          THAT'S WHY WE'RE OKAY. 
          WELL, AND, AND ACTUALLY THAT QUESTION IS PERFECT BECAUSE I THINK THE, THE FINAL CONSIDERATION AND THE REASON THAT THESE, UH, KIND OF MAIN STREET DOWNTOWN AREAS BECOME CHALLENGING IS THAT IT REALLY IS NOT FEASIBLE TO JUST TURN IT OVER UNREGULATED TO PRIVATE HAULERS BECAUSE THEN SUDDENLY YOU'VE GOT, YOU KNOW, KENDRICK LANE, YOU'VE GOT 60, UH, BUSINESSES AND THEY'VE CALLED FIVE DIFFERENT HAULERS. 
          NOW YOU HAVE EVEN MORE TRUCKS GOING ON YOUR MAIN STREET AREA AND IT'S JUST CHAOS. 
          SO, WELL, THEY DON'T PICK UP LIKE THEY WERE SUPPOSED TO. 
          SO, YEAH. 
          SO EITHER YOU GET POOR SERVICE, BUT UH, YOU KNOW, OR EVERYBODY, EVERYBODY PAYS MORE. 
          THERE ARE MORE TRUCKS ON THE ROAD AND IT'S INEFFICIENT BECAUSE NOW YOU HAVE MULTIPLE TRUCKS. 
          SO IT, IT'S, IT'S VERY WELL SUITED FOR BEING A MUNICIPALLY PROVIDED, EXCLUSIVELY PROVIDED SERVICE. 
          AND I MEAN, THE TOWN PROVIDING THE SERVICE THERE MAKES ALL THE SENSE IN THE WORLD. 
          I THINK WE WOULD LOVE TO HELP YOU OR JUST WORK WITH YOU AND, AND, YOU KNOW, PROVIDE THE SUPPORT YOU NEED TO GET APPROPRIATE REVENUE MECHANISMS THAT ARE GONNA COVER THE FULL COST FAIRLY RELATIVE TO ALL THE DIFFERENT GENERATORS THAT YOU HAVE, EVEN THOUGH IT'S A SMALL AREA. 
          UH, BUT WE THINK, YOU KNOW, WE THINK THAT LOCAL GOVERNMENTS ARE ON STRONG FOOTING IN DOING THAT. 
          UM, AND YOU KNOW, IT'S NOT URGENT. 
          I MEAN, YOU HAVEN'T HAD ANY PLOWING, EVERYBODY'S GONNA COMPLAIN UNDER THE STATUS QUO 'CAUSE EVERYBODY'S GETTING THE SERVICE FOR A PRETTY LOW RATE. 
          UH, SO IN SOME REGARDS IT'S NOT AN URGENT MEASURE, BUT THE SOONER YOU CAN ADDRESS IT, YOU CAN KIND OF FILL A LITTLE BIT OF, A LITTLE BIT OF A, YOU KNOW, THORN IN TERMS OF YOUR OVERALL REVENUE RECOVERY, UH, STRUCTURE FOR THIS, FOR THE SANITATION SERVICES. 
          THAT'S WHAT I WAS GONNA SAY. 
          WHEN YOU GO BACK TO THAT SLIDE WHERE YOU TALK ABOUT WHAT THE LARGE DIFFERENCE WAS, UM, YEAH. 
          SO IN MY MIND, I I, UM, IN MY MIND, I THINK IF AS A RESIDENCE, RIGHT, AS A A HOMEOWNER, IF WE'RE GONNA, IF WE NEED TO RAISE THE RATES, WE NEED TO RAISE THE RATES TO BE ABLE TO, TO PROVIDE THIS SERVICE TO EVERYBODY AS A HOMEOWNER, I WOULD BE FRUSTRATED IF I, IF MY RATE HAD TO GO UP HIGHER BECAUSE SOMEBODY ELSE WAS, BECAUSE SOMEBODY ELSE WAS HAVING A SERVICE THAT RIGHT. 
          YEAH. 
          UNDERSTAND WHAT I'M SAYING. 
          LIKE, I DON'T WANT OUR HOME, I DON'T WANT, YOU KNOW, JUST A HOMEOWNER TO HAVE TO, UM, MAKE UP A 27% DIFFERENCE. 
          IF WE FIND OUT THAT, YOU KNOW, 8% OF THAT MIGHT BE A SELECT GROUP OR WHATEVER. 
          WELL, SO TO THE, TO THAT, I TOTALLY AGREE. 
          AND TO THAT, TO THAT ISSUE, THE RATE INCREASES THAT WE'RE RECOMMENDING, UM, ARE SO, SO WE'RE, WE'VE ESSENTIALLY ASSUMED THAT THE TOWN WILL DO SOMETHING TO GET ITS REVENUE RECOVERY UP TO THE 86,000 IN THE MAIN STREET AREA, UHHUH, , SO THAT OUR RESIDENTIAL RATE INCREASE IS APPROPRIATE AND FAIR, STRICTLY ISOLATING ON YOUR RESIDENTIAL CUSTOMERS AS WE'RE NOT CROSS-SUBSIDIZING WITH THAT RATE INCREASE. 
          BUT I THINK THE RISK AS YOU, AS YOU POINT OUT IS IF THE TOWN RAISES RATES, FOR EXAMPLE, ALL AT ONCE FOR YOUR RESIDENTS, YOU KNOW, THAT'S 2030, YOU KNOW, 30% RATE INCREASE AND DOESN'T ADDRESS THIS SERVICE RIGHT? THEN IN SOME REGARDS, YOU'RE KIND OF, YOU KNOW, LETTING THE BUSINESSES GET AWAY WITH NOT PAYING FULL RATE, BUT YOU'RE MAKING YOUR RESIDENTS PAY THE FULL RATE. 
          SO IT DOES GET YOU A LITTLE OUT OF BALANCE. 
          SO I THINK THAT'S ADDS, AND THAT'S WHAT I WAS TRYING TO SAY FROM, YOU KNOW, OUR RESIDENTS MIGHT FEEL, YOU KNOW, RIGHT. 
          A RESIDENTS MAY FIND THAT TO BE UNFAIR IF THEY FEEL LIKE THEY'RE SUBSIDIZING SOMEBODY ELSE'S COMMERCIAL OR SOME COMMERCIAL. 
          YEAH. 
          AND I THINK AS A PRACTICAL MATTER, THEY PROBABLY WOULDN'T DIRECTLY BE SUB IF YOU DID NOTHING ON MAIN STREET AND JUST LEFT IT AS IS AND MASSIVELY UNDER ACCRUED, YOU'D PROBABLY HAVE TO BE SUPPLEMENTING YOUR SANITATION WITH LIKE GENERAL FUND REVENUES. 
          SO IT'D BE SORT OF AN INDIRECT SUBSIDY AS OPPOSED TO A DIRECT SUBSIDY, BUT IT WOULD ULTIMATELY REQUIRE SOME KIND OF SUBSIDIZATION FROM OTHER REVENUE SOURCES WITHIN THE TOWN. 
          AND I KNOW IN SOME PLACES TOO, LIKE THEY WILL HAVE, UM, LIKE IN THE AREAS WHERE THEIR TRASH IS, THEY'LL LITERALLY HAVE LIKE LOCKED MM-HMM. 
           LIKE A LOCKED GATE OR WHATEVER, SO THAT YOU CAN'T, SO THAT SOMEBODY ELSE CAN'T GO OUT THERE AND DUMP TRASH. 
          AND I'M NOT SURE IF THAT'S WHERE WE WANNA GO WITH THAT EITHER. 
          MM-HMM. 
          , BECAUSE THEN YOU RUN THE RISK OF, OF, AND WE'VE 
          [00:50:01]
ALL SEEN IT ON THE DAYS THAT THE, YOU KNOW, THAT, UM, WARREN COUNTY'S REFUGE SITE DIDN'T KNOW, LIKE CHRISTMAS DAY PEOPLE JUST COME AND DUMP IT THERE, EVEN THOUGH THEY CAN'T GET IN, THEY JUST DUMP IT THERE OR WHATEVER, CLEANING IT UP. 
          I'M SORRY. 
          THEN WE STILL END UP CLEANING IT UP. 
          AND THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING IN THE END, YOUR, YOUR WORKFORCE STILL ENDS UP USING THEIR HOURS TO, TO CLEAN UP. 
          SO, UM, BUT I, I, I, THAT'S INTERESTING THOUGH. 
          I DIDN'T REALIZE THERE WAS SUCH, SUCH A, SUCH A, SUCH A DIFFERENCE. 
          BUT I CAN SEE HOW IT CAN HAPPEN BECAUSE YOU REALLY DO ON MAIN STREET HAVE A VARIETY. 
          WE HAVE, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE, WE HAVE TENANTS WHO LIVE ABOVE THINGS. 
          WE HAVE RESTAURANTS, WE HAVE ANTIQUE SHOPS, WE HAVE WINE SHOP, WE HAVE, UH, ART STUDIO THAT PROBABLY DOESN'T GENERATE HARDLY ANY TRASH AT ALL. 
          YOU KNOW, THINGS LIKE THAT. 
          UM, SO WE HAVE HAD CLIENTS THAT ACTUALLY PUT OTHER DOWNTOWN BEAUTIFICATION SERVICES INTO A RATE FOR THAT AREA. 
          SO, UH, YOU KNOW, LITTER, BEAUTIFIC, YOU KNOW, CLEANUP, LITTER REMOVAL, STREET CLEANING, UM, WHERE IT'S NOT JUST THE SANITATION, SOMETIMES IT GETS BUILT BECAUSE IT, IT'S SUCH A SPECIAL AREA THAT YOU WANT TO HIGHLIGHT, YOU KNOW, THE WONDERS OF YOUR TOWN. 
          YOU REALLY WANT TO KEEP IT CLEAN. 
          SO WE ACTUALLY HAVE COMMUNITIES, I THINK, AND I THINK KNOXVILLE IS AN EXAMPLE THAT IT WASN'T JUST THE TRASH REMOVAL, IT WAS OTHER, YOU KNOW, SO THE ENFORCEMENT AND LITTER CLEANUP AND THINGS LIKE THAT, THAT ALL GET BUILT INTO THAT RATE. 
          AND IT JUST GIVES YOU A DIRECT REVENUE MECHANISM THAT YOU'RE CHARGING THE BUSINESSES PRIMARILY THAT BENEFIT FROM HAVING A NICE DOWNTOWN THAT PEOPLE WANNA COME VISIT. 
          SO, JUST AGAIN, FOOD FOR THOUGHT? YES, SIR. 
          YOU HAD A QUESTION, OR I HAD A QUESTION. 
          I DIDN'T SEE ANYTHING MENTIONED ABOUT RECYCLING. 
          MM-HMM. 
          . 
          AND I KNOW THAT WE DO FULL STREAM RECYCLING, RIGHT? MM-HMM. 
           SINGLE FOR. 
          OKAY. 
          IS THAT BUILT INTO ALL THIS? IT IS. 
          UM, AND I'M GLAD YOU ASKED THE QUESTION BECAUSE, UH, THERE'S SO MANY INTERESTING DETAILS IN OUR INDUSTRY. 
          UM, UP UNTIL, OH, PROBABLY FOUR OR FIVE YEARS AGO, THERE WAS A, A, A WIDELY HELD, COMPLETELY INCORRECT BELIEF THAT RECYCLING SOMEHOW DIDN'T COST ANYTHING AND WAS FREE. 
          UM, AND I THINK, UH, WE UNDERWENT, UH, DUE TO SOME INTERNATIONAL, UH, IMPORT EXPORT POLICIES FROM SOME ASIAN COUNTRIES THAT USED TO TAKE A LOT OF OUR RECYCLABLES, UH, DOMESTIC RECYCLABLES. 
          WE GET EXPORTED. 
          UM, WE, UH, BENEFITED AS A COUNTRY. 
          WE, WE GOT TO BE VERY LAZY RECYCLERS IN THE UNITED STATES UP UNTIL ABOUT 20 17, 20 18, BECAUSE WE COULD PUT A LOT OF JUNK IN OUR, OUR RECYCLING AND IF CHINA WOULD TAKE IT AND, AND CLEAN IT OUT. 
          AND, UM, AND THAT WAS GREAT. 
          BUT BOY, WERE WE LAZY. 
          UM, SO THAT HAS COME HOME TO ROOST. 
          AND SINCE ABOUT 2019, UM, OUR RECYCLING INDUSTRY IN THIS COUNTRY FOR THE FIRST TIME, ARGUABLY IN ITS HISTORY, HAS STARTED TO BECOME MORE CLEAR AND TRANSPARENT IN WHAT THE FULL COST OF RECYCLING IS. 
          UM, AND SO WE DO THINK IT'S A LOCAL, IT'S A JUDGMENT THAT LOCAL COMMUNITIES MAKE, BUT WE ALSO GENERALLY BELIEVE THAT YOU'RE ACTUALLY PROVIDING A BUNDLE OF MATERIALS MANAGEMENT SERVICES. 
          IN FACT, I'M USING, YOU KNOW, TRASH AND, YOU KNOW, REFUSE AND RECYCLING. 
          UM, WE REALLY SEE THE INDUSTRY, OUR INDUSTRY AS ONE OF MATERIALS MANAGEMENT. 
          AND I THINK AS YOU GO FORWARD ACROSS THE COUNTRY, IT, IT, IT GOES IN DIFFERENT, YOU KNOW, WE'RE NOT SAYING, I'M NOT HERE TO CONVINCE YOU THAT YOU SHOULD DO SOMETHING YOU'RE NOT DOING. 
          BUT AS I LOOK ACROSS THE NATION, I LOOK AT TRENDS. 
          OUR INDUSTRY IS GOING FROM HISTORICALLY THE LEGACY GARBAGE REMOVAL, RIGHT? GET STUFF OFF THE STREET SO IT DOESN'T GO INTO OUR GUTTERS AND POLLUTE, RIGHT? THAT'S KIND OF THE LEGACY OF, OF GARBAGE, GARBAGE COLLECTION. 
          BUT AS WE GO FORWARD AND AS WE LOOK AT RESOURCE RECOVERY, UM, REALLY THE NEW KIND OF MODEL IS ONE OF MATERIALS MANAGEMENT. 
          SO THE TOWN WE BELIEVE IS PROVIDING STANDARD SERVICES, WHICH IS A BUNDLE OF TRASH TO LANDFILL RECYCLING THAT GOES AND ACTUALLY GETS RECOVERED IN A REAL RECYCLING PLANT. 
          AND THEN RECOVERY OF YARD WASTE AND GREEN WASTE, WHICH CAN GET, YOU KNOW, CAN GET SHIPPED, IT CAN GET MULCHED, IT CAN EVENTUALLY GO BACK INTO NUTRIENTS IN THE SOIL. 
          SO WE THINK THE TOWN IS RIGHT WHERE THE INDUSTRY BASELINE IS. 
          UM, BUT THAT SAID, THE COST OF RECYCLING, AND FRANKLY, ONE OF THE REASONS PROBABLY YOUR FULL COST HAS INCREASED SINCE 2016, UH, IS THE RECYCLING COMPONENT COST HAS INCREASED LARGER THAN EVERYTHING ELSE BECAUSE THE FULL COST OF RECYCLING ARE NOW COMING OUT, AND WE'RE ALSO BEING HELD ACCOUNTABLE TO DELIVER CLEAN RECYCLABLES TO PROCESSORS. 
          SO THAT'S PROBABLY MORE THAN YOU EVER WANTED TO HEAR. 
          BUT IT'S A REALLY GOOD QUESTION BECAUSE THE RECYCLING INDUSTRY IS ALMOST ITS OWN INDUSTRY COMPARED TO THE WASTE TO LANDFILL INDUSTRY. 
          BUT YET TOGETHER THEY JOINTLY REALLY MAKE UP THE STANDARD SERVICE THAT WE REALLY SEE ACROSS THE US AND, AND EVEN ACROSS VIRGINIA. 
          I MEAN, YOU KNOW, SO IN THAT REGARD, AGAIN, OPERATIONALLY IN TERMS OF YOUR SERVICE DELIVERY, HOW YOU'RE DOING IT, AND THE SERVICES YOU'RE PROVIDING, LOOKING GOOD. 
          I MEAN, REALLY THE, THE TAKEAWAY IS, YOU KNOW, WITH THIS, THIS STUDY IS, HEY, LET'S TWEAK YOUR RATES AND MAKE SURE YOU HAVE THE REVENUE YOU NEED TO CONTINUE PROVIDING, YOU KNOW, THOSE SERVICES. 
          AND, YOU KNOW, WHETHER THAT'S A ONE YEAR OR A THREE YEAR. 
          AGAIN, THESE ARE JUST RECOMMENDATIONS IF YOU WANNA LOOK AT A TWO YEAR OR 
          [00:55:01]
A 10 YEAR. 
          AND WE'RE, WE'RE HERE TO SERVE AND WE'RE HAPPY TO WORK, UH, YOU KNOW, WITH, WITH STAFF TO COME BACK AND DO ANY REFINEMENTS. 
          BUT HOPEFULLY THIS GIVES YOU, YOU KNOW, A FAIRLY GOOD OVERVIEW AND HOPEFULLY SOME DECENT STARTING POINTS TO GO FORWARD. 
          AND I, I REALLY, THE QUESTIONS HAVE BEEN GREAT. 
          UH, AND I, YOU KNOW, I APPRECIATE, UH, UH, YOUR ATTENTION. 
          'CAUSE I THINK I'VE TAKEN DARN NEAR A FULL HOUR. 
          I WAS THINKING I'D BE DONE A LITTLE EARLIER THAN THAT, SO I APOLOGIZE. 
          WE, WE HAD YOU, WE HAD YOU PENCIL IN FOR AN HOUR, SO YOU ACTUALLY GOT FOUR MINUTES, 30 SECONDS, . 
          ANYWAY, JUST KIDDING. 
          WE, UH, BUT, BUT DO PEOPLE HAVE QUESTIONS? COUNSELMAN? I I JUST SAID, UH, THAT'S 68 ACCOUNTS. 
          I MEAN, HOW DO YOU GET A HANDLE ON THE, UH, THE NUMBER OF UNITS, UH, THAT, SO THAT, THAT 68 IS ALL ABOUT? SO, UM, IN LARGER COMMUNITIES, YOU MAY HAVE THE ABILITY TO LEVERAGE, UH, THINGS LIKE, YOU KNOW, UH, PROPERTY APPRAISERS, TAX ASSESSORS. 
          IN OTHER WORDS, UH, IS THERE AN ENTITY THAT YOU COULD TAP INTO THAT HAS JUST THEIR ROLE, UH, MAINTAINING AN INVENTORY OF THOSE BUSINESSES, BUT FRANKLY, IN SOME REGARDS, YOU'RE ALMOST SMALL ENOUGH. 
          YOU COULD ALMOST DO IT AD HOC FOR A RELATIVELY SMALL MAIN STREET AREA. 
          IN OTHER WORDS, JUST, WELL, WITH THIS MAIN STREET, I MEAN, YOU JUST GO, LOOK, I, WE KNOW THERE'S APARTMENTS OVER EVERY BUILDING. 
          MM-HMM. 
           JUST ABOUT MM-HMM, , WE JUST GO GET, WE GO TO THE POST OFFICE AND FIND OUT HOW MANY APARTMENTS, HOW MANY MAIL DROPS THEY HAVE AT EACH APARTMENT. 
          I THINK THAT'S PART OF THE ADMINISTRATIVE INFRASTRUCTURE THAT WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO FACE LATER ALONG. 
          ANOTHER ISSUE YOU HAVE WITH THAT IS, IS WHAT HAPPENS IF THE APARTMENT'S NOT, YOU KNOW, SOMEBODY'S NOT IN, THEY'RE NOT BEING USED. 
          THEY'RE NOT BEING USED. 
          MAYBE THEY'RE JUST USING AS STORAGE. 
          THERE ARE BUILDINGS ON, SO YOU CAN IDENTIFY 'EM, BUT THEN YOU STILL DON'T KNOW IF THE WASTE IS ACTUALLY COMING OUT. 
          THAT'S JUST ANOTHER ONE OF THE PROBLEMS THAT WE ENCOUNTER. 
          SO THE COUNT, SO THE COUNT JUST COMES 68 UNITS, JUST, JUST COMES FROM THE, UM, AMOUNT OF, YEAH, THAT NUMBER'S JUST BEING GENERATED FROM THE NUMBER OF KNOWN ENTITIES THERE. 
          THEY'RE ACTUAL ACCOUNTS. 
          THEY HAVE, THEY HAVE AN ELECTRIC METER, THEY HAVE A WATER METER. 
          OKAY. 
          SOME SORT OF METER. 
          UM, AND IT'S NOT BEING CHARGED. 
          AND, UH, EACH, EACH ONE IS A LITTLE BIT DIFFERENT. 
          LIKE I SAY, YOU MIGHT HAVE A WATER METER, UH, WHERE JUST THE LANDLORD HAS ALL, YOU KNOW, THE GARBAGE ON THAT YOU MIGHT HAVE FIVE ELECTRIC METERS, UH, AND EACH ONE OF 'EM IS PAYING. 
          THERE'S, THERE'S NOT A STANDARDIZATION RIGHT NOW. 
          RIGHT. 
          STREET. 
          AND THAT'S WHAT WE NEED TO GET TO. 
          AND ACTUALLY, EVEN TO THAT POINT, I SHOULD POINT OUT THAT IN ESTABLISHING THESE MAIN STREET DOWNTOWN RATE CONFIGURATIONS, USUALLY, UM, I THINK, I THINK IF NOT ALL, ALMOST ALL OF THE COMMUNITIES WHERE WE'VE SEEN THAT WE'LL HAVE A PROCESS THAT IF THERE'S, UH, A TENANT IN THAT DOWNTOWN AREA THAT JUST THINKS THAT THEIR RATE IS WAY OFF, THERE'S A, A SIMPLE PROCEDURE TO REQUEST A REVIEW. 
          AND AN AN EXCEPTION, RIGHT? LIKE, IF YOU'RE CHARGING SOMEBODY THAT YOU HAVE THEM CODED AS A RESTAURANT AND THEY COME TO YOU AND SAY, LOOK, WE'RE I'M STORING, YOU KNOW, I'M, I'M A A BICYCLE RENTAL COMPANY. 
          I'M STORING BICYCLES. 
          AND YOU GO OVER AND YOU LOOK, OH YEAH, YOU'RE STORING BICYCLES. 
          THERE'S SORT OF AN EXCEPTION FORM. 
          SO IN OTHER WORDS, I, I THINK WE DO REALIZE THAT MAINTAINING SOME ABILITY TO HAVE DISCRETION WHEN APPROPRIATE, YOU KNOW, WE DO SEE THAT IN OTHER COMMUNITIES THAT HAVE DEVELOPED THESE KIND OF RATIONAL RATE STRUCTURES. 
          I MEAN, YOU OBVIOUSLY, YOU WANNA APPLY IT. 
          IF YOU, IF A HUNDRED PERCENT OF THE PEOPLE DON'T SWAP, YOU'RE GREAT. 
          BUT IF YOU HAVE A, A PROTOCOL THAT IF SOMEBODY REALLY IS KIND OF EGREGIOUSLY HARMED BECAUSE FOR WHATEVER REASON WE, THE DATA DIDN'T SHOW IT OR THEY RECENTLY CHANGED THE BUSINESS, THERE'S AT LEAST AN ABILITY FOR THEM TO COME AND, AND GET AN ADJUSTMENT. 
          AND IT'S DONE ON KIND OF A, YOU KNOW, CONSIDERED BASIS. 
          SO, UH, YOU KNOW, AGAIN, THE GOOD NEWS, THAT'S A GOOD NEWS. 
          THESE ARE NOT ALL ISSUES THAT HAVE NEVER BEEN SEEN BEFORE, BUT IT IS GONNA TAKE A LITTLE WORK. 
          UH, I THINK BJ'S GOT A GOOD PATH FORWARD IN TERMS OF, YOU KNOW, THE STEPS TO, TO GO FORWARD. 
          IT'S JUST GONNA TAKE A LITTLE WORK TO GET IT WHERE IT NEED IT TO BE. 
          SO, BECAUSE ULTIMATELY I THINK IT SHOULD BE FAIR, YOU KNOW, I MEAN THAT I, MAYBE THAT'S WHAT WE FEEL IS FAIR. 
          I MEAN, OTHERS MAY NOT FEEL FAIR. 
          TRUE, TRUE. 
          NO, YOU GOTTA FIND THAT CALCULATION. 
          BUT I THINK, LIKE ME, LIKE WE, WE USE RECYCLING BOAT. 
          WE TAKE OUR TRASH BECAUSE WE DON'T PICK, THEY DON'T, BECAUSE WE 'CAUSE THE BEAR, WE SPENT, WE SPENT YEAR AFTER YEAR PICKING UP THE TRASH OUTTA THE YARD FOR THE BEAR. 
          WE FINALLY JUST SAID IT WAS EASIER TO, WE LEFT IT IN THE GARAGE ONE TIME, AND THE KIDS OPEN, LEFT THE GARAGE DOOR OPEN, AND THE BEAR ENDED UP IN OUR GARAGE IN THE MIDDLE OF THE NIGHT. 
          AND SO WE WERE JUST LIKE, BUT I'M JUST SAYING THOUGH, I, I DO THINK IT SHOULD BE FAIR. 
          LIKE, I, I DON'T THINK, IF I DON'T, I, IF SOMEBODY'S TAKING THEIR TRASH, YOU KNOW, A RESIDENT'S TAKING THEIR TRASH AND PUTTING IT IN, IN ONE OF THESE PLACES DOWNTOWN, THEY SHOULD, THEY SHOULD BE HELPING TO RECOVER THE EXPENSE OF THAT DEPARTMENT TOO. 
          BUT I AGREE WITH YOU. 
          THE OTHER SIDE OF IT IS, IS YOU'RE GONNA HAVE SOME THAT SAY THEY DON'T USE IT. 
          IN ACTUALITY THEY DO. 
          RIGHT. 
          BUT I'M SAYING TO YOU, WE DON'T USE IT. 
          , YOU KNOW, I PAY EVERY MONTH. 
          SO, UM, BUT ANYWAY, JUST SAYING, BUT WELL, I'M THINKING ABOUT, LIKE, I THINK ABOUT THAT LITTLE, THE YOUNG LADY THAT STARTED THE LITTLE, UM, VINTAGE FLEETWOOD 
          [01:00:01]
SHOP, RIGHT? RIGHT. 
          LIKE, THAT IS SUCH A SMALL LITTLE SPACE. 
          AND UM, I CAN, I WOULD THINK THAT, I BET $300 A MONTH FOR TRASH WOULD BE A BURDEN FOR THE NEW, NEW BUSINESS. 
          MM-HMM. 
          , YOU KNOW, SMALL BUSINESS LIKE THAT AND RIGHT. 
          UM, IT REALLY ISN'T PROBABLY GENERATING HARDLY ANY TRASH AT ALL. 
          ADMINISTRATIVELY. 
          THERE'S BE A LOT. 
          NOT EVERYBODY ON MAIN STREET'S ON THAT. 
          NO. 
          WELL, IT'S ONLY THE BUSINESSES WHO, WELL, THE $300 IS JUST A MATHEMATICAL EXERCISE TO SAY THAT IF YOU WANTED TO RECOVER THE FULL REVENUE THAT IT COST A SERVICE COMMERCIAL, YOU'D HAVE TO CHARGE 300. 
          WE'RE, WE'RE ACTUALLY NOT RECOMMENDING THAT YOU SET THAT YOUR PROPERTY A COMMERCIAL ACCOUNT, JUST TALKING POINT JUST TO TALK. 
          RIGHT. 
          THAT'S RIGHT. 
          . 
          BUT I THINK YOU'RE RIGHT THOUGH. 
          IF YOU, YOU, IF YOU WOULD, IF YOU WOULD COMPARE THAT BUSINESS TO SAY ONE OF THE RESTAURANTS DOWNTOWN THAT'S SEVEN DAYS A WEEK, YOU KNOW, YOU KNOW, 10:00 AM TO LIKE MAIN STREET, MIDDLE 10:00 AM OR WHATEVER LIKE THAT, WHERE THAT WOULD BE A DIFFERENT, THAT THOSE, THAT'S A VASTLY DIFFERENT. 
          UM, WHEREAS A RESIDENTS, I'M JUST SAYING, WHERE IS OUR RESIDENTS? THEY, THEY GET ONE TRASH CAN. 
          RIGHT. 
          AND IF YOU WANT A SECOND TRASH CAN, YOU HAVE TO PAY, BUT YOU HAVE TO PAY MORE FOR IT MONTHLY. 
          YOU PAY, YOU PAY DOUBLE THOUGH. 
          YEAH. 
          I'M LIKE, IF YOU'RE A FAMILY OF 10 AND YOU HAVE TWO TRASH CANS FULL, THAT'S WHAT'S, BUT I MEAN, THEY PAY FOR TWO. 
          BUT IF THERE'S SOMEBODY ELSE THAT HAS LIKE A SMALLER AND DON'T HAVE A LOT OF TRASH, YOU PAY FOR THAT. 
          SO WE, WE REALLY DO NEED TO LOOK AT HOW TO THERE ON FOR THAT. 
          I HAD TWO TRASH CANS FOR THREE YEARS WHEN I MOVED TO TOWN FROM THE COUNTY. 
          AND I ONLY USED TWO TRASH CANS THE WEEK OF THANKSGIVING, THE WEEK OF CHRISTMAS. 
          RIGHT. 
          THE WEEK OF MY KIDS' BIRTHDAYS. 
          SO I WAS PAYING FOR TWO, BUT THEY WEREN'T PICKING UP TWO TRASH CANS EVERY WEEK. 
          RIGHT? RIGHT. 
          YES. 
          I WAS PROBABLY OVER YEAH. 
          PAYING FOR SOMEBODY WHO WASN'T THERE. 
          ACTUALLY I'M PAYING. 
          YEAH. 
          WELL WE HAVE THE BEAR IN OUR NEIGHBORHOOD TOO. 
          YES, YOU DO. 
          I KNOW. 
          KNOCK ON THE DOOR. 
          DO. 
          SO, UH, MAYOR, TWO THINGS THAT WE NEED GUIDANCE STAFF NEEDS GUIDANCE TO MAKE. 
          NUMBER ONE IS, WHAT'S THE APPETITE FOR COUNCIL DOING A ONE OR THREE YEAR, UH, RATE INCREASE? 'CAUSE WE ARE BUILDING THE BUDGET. 
          THE THING TO REMEMBER IS THESE RATES WOULD BE EFFECTIVE JULY 1ST, SO THEY'D BE INCORPORATED INTO OUR BUDGET. 
          THE SECOND THING WE KIND OF NEED SOME GUIDANCE ON IS THIS MAIN STREET ISSUE. 
          WE'RE, WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO COME BACK AND GIVE YOU SOME OPTIONS TO DO THIS, BUT WE WANT TO KIND OF GET AN IDEA FROM COUNCIL IF THEY HAVE AN APPETITE TO KIND OF TRUE UP THAT COST OF SERVICE FOR MAIN STREET. 
          I'M DEFINITELY IN FAVOR OF PHASING IN THE THREE. 
          YEAH. 
          WE AWAY, WE CAN'T DO 30%. 
          I THINK IT, WE DON'T YEARS, WE DON'T ALL CONTINUE TO TAKE A LOSS. 
          WE DON'T HAVE TO INCREASE THE RATES, BUT WE NEED, AND HOPEFULLY THREE YEARS FROM NOW WHEN WE THINK IT'S THE TAIL END OF THE THREE YEARS THAT WE'RE NOT THE WAY INFLATION IS GOING, THAT WE'RE NOT SAYING THAT WASN'T ENOUGH, YOU KNOW? RIGHT. 
          UM, 'CAUSE I, I LIKED WHAT, UM, WHAT YOU SAID ABOUT BEING ABOUT, YOU KNOW, WORKING IT IN. 
          SO IT'S NOT EVERY SO MANY YEARS YOU GOTTA COME BACK AND DO A COST OF STUDY AGAIN. 
          THAT, THAT YOU'RE, YOU'RE LOOKING AT IT OVER TIME AND NOT JUST WAITING TO, SO DOES IT SOUND LIKE EVERYBODY, I MEAN, CONSENSUS WISE, EVERYBODY'S GOOD WITH THE THREE YEAR, GLEN, WHAT? I HAVE ONE QUESTION, UH, FOR JOE, 'CAUSE I'M NOT FAMILIAR WITH IT. 
          WHAT HAPPENS WITH OUR ELECTRIC RATES? AREN'T THEY AUTOMATICALLY ADJUSTED EVERY YEAR? I MEAN, NO, WE, UM, NO WE DON'T, BUT WE DO HAVE A, WHAT THEY CALL, UM, POWER COST ADJUSTMENT THAT ALLOWS US TO VARIABLE THAT RATE. 
          IF THE WHOLESALE POWER COST GOES UP AND WE VOTE ON THAT, COUNCIL TAKES ACTION ON THAT WHEN WE CHANGE THE RATE. 
          IS IS A THREE YEAR INCREMENT, UH, POWER COST ADJUSTMENT? NO, NOT THE AUTOMATED STRETCH. 
          YEAH. 
          NO. 
          BUT WHEN WE CHANGED THE UTILITY RATES LIKE WE FOUR OR FIVE YEARS OR SO LAST YEAR, CONSIDER TO BE ADJUST OR IS THAT, WOULD THAT JUST BE STRETCHED OUT TOO FAR TO, UM, SO JUST A, THERE WAS A LITTLE BIT OF CRUST, UH, CONVERSATION, BUT A QUESTION ABOUT, UM, I, I DON'T THINK THERE, I, THERE'S NOTHING THAT I WOULD CALL A STANDARD FOR HOW TO GO FROM BEING AT A DEFICIT TO BEING AT KIND OF HAVING FULL COST RATES. 
          UM, I DO THINK THAT THREE TO FOUR YEARS, I, I DON'T THINK I'VE EVER SEEN ANYTHING MORE THAN ABOUT FOUR YEARS. 
          UM, AND, AND IF IT'S A REALLY BAD DEFICIT, WE'VE ALSO SEEN NOT DOING LIKE A LEVEL INCREASE, LIKE KIND OF A BIG JUMP THE FIRST YEAR AND THEN A SMALLER JUMP, LIKE ALMOST LIKE A PARABOLA TYPE THING. 
          SO WE HAVE SEEN SOME, YOU KNOW, UH, YOU KNOW, DIFFERENTIAL INCREASES OVER A PERIOD OF TIME. 
          BUT AS YOU FI FIVE YEARS IS STARTING TO JUST GET PRETTY LONG. 
          COULD WE DO IT? ABSOLUTELY. 
          WOULD WE INCREASE IT AGAIN BY THEN? YEAH, YEAH. 
          ABSOLUTELY. 
          THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING. 
          I JUST DIDN'T KNOW IF THAT WOULD, I MEAN, HOW LONG THERE AN I I THINK IN SOME REGARDS, IF ONE OF THE REASONS WE STOPPED AT THREE YEARS IS IT'S A LITTLE HARD TO YOUR POINT ABOUT WHO KNOWS WHAT INFLATION'S GONNA DO FOR FIVE YEARS. 
          SO IT'S A LITTLE HARD IF BEYOND THREE YEARS, WE'RE STARTING TO FEEL LIKE IF YOU'RE STRETCHING IT OUT, THERE'S GONNA START 
          [01:05:01]
TO BE NEW FACTORS THAT NOBODY'S ANTICIPATED THAT, YOU KNOW, NOW YOU'RE ON THIS PACKAGE ADOPTION, WHO'S THE MINIMUM WAGE YEAH. 
          FOR FIVE YEARS. 
          AND THEN THERE'S CHANGES IN LAW. 
          THERE'S ALL KINDS OF OTHER STUFF. 
          SO I, I THINK THE THREE YEAR IS, IF THERE IS A, A STANDARD MORE THAN DOING IT ALL AT ONCE, PROBABLY TWO TO THREE YEARS IS PROBABLY RIGHT. 
          YEAH. 
          THREE YEARS PUSHES IT. 
          WE'LL DO IT IN THREE. 
          ONE, ONE LAST QUESTION. 
          THE STUDY WAS DONE BASED ON THE BELIEF WE WOULD CONTINUE DOING THINGS THE WAY WE ARE. 
          MM-HMM. 
           NOT WITH AN AUTOMATIC TRASH TRUCK, NOT REDUCING LABOR OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT. 
          CORRECT? THAT, THAT THAT IS CORRECT. 
          YEAH. 
          WE DIDN'T DO LIKE A RANGE OF, OF SORT OF OPTIONS AND FEASIBILITY ANALYSIS OF OPTIONS. 
          JOE, DID YOU I JUST WANTED TO REMIND EVERYBODY THAT IT, THE LAST INCREASE WAS 2016. 
          YEAH. 
          SEVEN YEARS AGO. 
          SO I AM NOT SURPRISED BY THESE NUMBERS. 
          AND, AND STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION IS TO DO A THREE YEAR JUST FOR THE SIMPLE FACT, EVEN THOUGH WE'RE ONLY TALKING A COUPLE DOLLARS, IT IS SIGNIFICANT IMPACT. 
          YEAH. 
          I THINK WE WERE TALKING ABOUT NEEDING TO DO THIS PROBABLY EVEN BEFORE NOW, DURING COVID, DURING COVID. 
          BUT EVERYBODY DURING THE COVID YEAR WAS LIKE, YOU KNOW, EVERYBODY WANTED TO REALLY TAKE IT EASY ON PEOPLE. 
          UM, BUT I WILL SAY, DIDN'T WE ALL NOTICE TOO, THERE WAS MORE TRASH, LIKE DURING THE, DURING COVID EVERYBODY TOLD GET A TRASH. 
          YEAH, WE, YES, THAT'S RIGHT. 
          WE USED COVID MONEY, GET THE TRASH BECAUSE IT WAS, AND TO JOE'S POINT, I, WE, I TOOK A NOTE FROM THE VERY BEGINNING OF THE PRESENTATION IN 2016 WHEN MSW WAS ENGAGED. 
          IT WAS AN OPERATIONAL ANALYSIS AND NOW IT'S MORE OF THE, YOU KNOW, FISCAL ANALYSIS AND THE COST IMPACT. 
          SO, AND YOU SAID IT SEEMS LIKE OUR OPERATIONAL ANALYSIS IS IN LINE BECAUSE OF THE SYSTEMS PUT IN PLACE FOR THE 2016. 
          SO YEAH, IN TWO 16 YOU HAD, YOU DIDN'T HAVE SINGLE STREAM RECYCLING. 
          RIGHT. 
          SO THAT WAS A MUCH DIFFERENT SYSTEM. 
          OH, I REMEMBER THE RECYCLING DEBACLE. 
          AND SO, UH, UM, AND NOW, YOU KNOW, WE CAN TALK ABOUT MM-HMM. 
          EFFICIENT, COST EFFECTIVE PROCESSING CAPACITY IN THE REGION, THAT THAT'S, YOU KNOW, THAT'S CERTAINLY SOMETHING MAYBE FOR LONGER TERM. 
          UM, AND I THINK THERE WERE SOME DIFFERENCES IN THE WAY THE COMMERCIAL SERVICE WAS PROVIDED A LITTLE MORE DISCONNECTED. 
          SO I THINK, I THINK MY POINT IS, I MEAN, FRANKLY, JUST LOOKING AT THE FULL COST PER HOUSEHOLD, I CAN TELL YOU RIGHT OFF THE BAT THAT YOU'RE WITHIN REASONABLENESS, RIGHT? YEAH. 
          I MEAN, IF YOU WERE, IF YOU WERE $32 PER HOUSEHOLD PER MONTH, I'D BE LIKE, MAN, YOU GUYS MIGHT WANNA LOOK AT YOUR OPERATIONAL EFFICIENCY. 
          'CAUSE I RIGHT. 
          JUST FROM THE PRICE ALONE, THE INDICATIONS ARE THAT OPERATIONALLY THE TOWN IS, YOU KNOW, COULD, COULD YOU MAYBE SQUEEZE SOMETHING OUT HERE? AND THERE MAY BE, BUT THERE'S NO REASON TO BE DISTRESSED ABOUT OPERATIONAL ISSUES. 
          YEAH. 
          MAY, YOU KNOW, SO, SO IS IS THE THOUGHT TO IF WE, IF THIS DOES GO INTO EFFECT, UH, FOR, YOU KNOW, IF WE OR IN CONSENSUS FOR THE THREE YEAR, UH, UH, INCREASE, IS THE THOUGHT THAT WE DO THAT FIRST AND THEN LOOK INTO THE MAIN STREET ISSUE? NO, I THINK, I THINK IT'S GOTTA BE DONE. 
          YEAH. 
          WE'RE GONNA DO SOMETHING WITH MAIN STREET AT THE SAME TIME CONSENSUS. 
          WE'LL HAVE TO COME BACK WITH, UH, SOMETHING ON MAIN STREET. 
          THAT WAS MY QUESTION. 
          IS THIS IS GONNA BE DONE. 
          I MEAN, I WOULD SUGGEST WE DO IT ALL. 
          JOE ASKED FOR TWO, HE ASKED TWO DIRECTIONS. 
          ONE WAS, DOES COUNSEL UH, PREFERRED TO DO ONE YEAR BIG JUMP OR OVER THREE YEARS? IT SOUNDS LIKE THE CONSENSUS IS THREE YEARS. 
          AND THEN THE SECOND DIRECTION YOU WERE LOOKING FOR IS, UH, ADDRESSING THE, UH, IN, IN, UH, INCONSISTENCY OR WHATEVER YOU WANNA CALL IT AROUND THAT AREA. 
          AND IS THERE NO TECHNOLOGY? I MEAN THERE, THERE DEFINITELY IS NO TECHNOLOGY THAT CAN BE PUT ON TRUCKS OR ANYTHING TO, TO MEASURE USAGE AS, AS IT'S COLLECTED INVENT, UH, SCALE FOR TRASH CANS. 
          MAYBE THERE'S A MILLION. 
          BUT ALSO PROBABLY JUST SO YOU KNOW, 'CAUSE ONLY 'CAUSE JOE TOLD ME ABOUT THIS BEFORE, BUT LIKE, THERE'S JUST DUMPSTERS BACK THERE. 
          SO YOU MIGHT BE DUMPING SOMETHING, YOU MIGHT BE DUMP YOUR SOMETHING, SOMEBODY ELSE MIGHT PUT IN 10 TRASH BAGS. 
          UNLESS SOMEBODY WAS SITTING THERE COUNTING, YOU HAD ONE BAG, YOU HAD FOUR, THERE'D BE NO WAY WE COULD DO THAT. 
          I MEAN, THAT WOULD BE A EXACTLY RIGHT. 
          I MEAN THAT, SO, OKAY, SO THAT, SO IT SOUNDS LIKE COUNCIL THINKS THAT WE NEED TO MAKE, YOU KNOW, MAKE FAIR AND EQUITABLE. 
          AND THEN WAS THERE ANOTHER QUESTION? NO, AND I THINK WE GOT, YEAH. 
          AND, AND MR. WALTZ, I WOULD JUST AGAIN POINT OUT, SO WITH THE THREE YEAR, THAT'S A RESIDENTIAL RATE WE'RE HEARING, BUT WE, WE DID HAVE JUST, WE'RE RECOMMENDING KEEPING COMMERCIAL ONE YEAR. 
          SO YOUR COMMERCIAL RATES ARE GONNA JUST JUMP UP ONCE RIGHT AWAY. 
          UM, AND THEY STAY THERE. 
          YEAH. 
          AND THEN, AND THEN THEY WOULD, YOU WOULD MIGHT CONSIDER THE ESCALATION LIKE AN AN ESCALATOR, LIKE A CPI ESCALATOR AND THE DOOR STARTED TO POINT THAT AND THE CURB TO DOOR SERVICE. 
          THAT WOULD BE A ONE JUMP. 
          YEAH. 
          WE'RE ALSO RECOMMENDING THAT SCHEDULE CODE THAT WOULD GO ONE JUMP AND THEN WE'LL TALK ABOUT THE SOUND CODE OR HOW WE WANT TO DEAL WITH THAT OR, OR WHATEVER. 
          YEAH. 
          AND I WOULD SUGGEST IF WE COULD, YOU KNOW, ENGAGE MAYBE LIKE FREDA OR MAYBE ONE OF THOSE GROUPS TO TALK ABOUT HOW IT MIGHT BE EQUITABLE TO ROLL OUT AMONG THE BUSINESSES, YOU KNOW, MAYBE TO ENGAGE THEM AS WE GET THE CODE OR SOMETHING LIKE THAT. 
          BUT, BUT, UH, IS IT JOHN? YES. 
          [01:10:01]
UH, TO YOUR POINT ABOUT THE TIER RATE STRUCTURE, UH, THAT MAKES A LOT OF SENSE TO ME. 
          I MEAN, THAT'S WHAT I WAS THINKING. 
          YEAH. 
          I MEAN, I THINK IF YOU LOOK AT IT, IT'S VERY OBVIOUS THAT, YOU KNOW, MELISSA MENTIONED IT WITH THE COMMERCIAL RATES, BUT IT'S DIFFERENT FOR THE BUSINESSES THAT ARE USING THE SERVICE FOR THE DUMPS. 
          BUT I MEAN, IT'S NOT FAIR THAT THEY'RE PAYING ALL THE SAME THING WHEN IT'S OBVIOUS THAT THERE'S TONS YEAH. 
          LITTLE TONS COMING. 
          I JUST DON'T KNOW. 
          SO I DO THINK THAT NEEDS FOR THAT REASON, SO THAT EACH, EACH BUSINESS ISN'T BEING EQUATED IN THE SAME WAY. 
          MM-HMM. 
          . 
          UM, ARE THERE MODELS IN PLACE, UH, TO DETERMINED THOSE RATES? I MEAN, WE JUST HAVE TO PUNCH IN THE NUMBERS, OR DO WE HAVE TO START RAW? NO, I THINK THEY CAN USE THE, THE DEFICIT THAT YOU HAVE. 
          WELL, SO, SO WE KNOW THE DEFICIT, THE, THE MAIN PIECE OF DATA THAT WE'LL NEED TO BE SPENDING SOME TIME ON WILL BE AN INVENTORY OF THE BUSINESSES, RIGHT. 
          AND CERTAIN ATTRIBUTES OF THE BUSINESSES. 
          LIKE HOW MANY SQUARE FOOTAGE AND TYPE OF BUSINESS OR HOW, WHAT KIND OF I, YEAH, WHAT EXACTLY. 
          SO THERE'S A LITTLE BIT OF INVENTORY, BUT ONCE WE HAVE THE INVENTORY AND HOW, HOW OFTEN THEY'RE OPEN. 
          I MEAN, THERE ARE BUSINESSES ON MAIN STREET THAT ARE ONLY OPEN THREE DAYS A WEEK VERSUS SEVEN DAYS AND SUMMER FROM 10 TO, YOU KNOW, NINE TO 10. 
          MM-HMM. 
          . 
          YEAH. 
          AND, AND I WAS GONNA SAY ABOUT SQUARE FOOTAGE, LIKE, I, I HEAR WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, BUT THEN I ALSO THINK TO MYSELF THAT'S NOT, I MEAN, I'M JUST THINKING LIKE THE ART STUDIO IS REALLY LARGE, RIGHT? THE TALK OF THE MOUNTAINS TINY, RIGHT. 
          I'M SURE THEY HAVE A LOT OF TRASH WHEN THEY'RE IN THEIR FOOD'S, NEW THEATER, THINGS LIKE THAT. 
          SO, UM, I'M SURE THERE'S LOTS OF THINGS TO GO INTO IT, BUT, BUT THE DIRECTION THAT FINANCE NEEDED, WE GOT EVERYTHING WE NEED. 
          WE DID. 
          WE WERE SUPER HELPFUL. 
          THANK YOU SO MUCH. 
          THOSE WERE GREAT QUESTIONS. 
          AND, AND THANK YOU. 
          AND THANK YOU. 
          GREAT, GREAT PRESENTATION. 
          IT WAS EASY FOR US TO UNDERSTAND. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU. 
          SO ITEM, SO WE'RE GOOD. 
          YOU HAVE WHAT? HAVE WHAT YOU NEED. 
          AND I'M GUESSING, WE'LL, THEY'LL GET BACK WITH US BECAUSE THAT WOULD ALL NEED TO BE DONE BEFORE JULY ONE IS WHEN CUSTOMERS WOULD SEE A DIFFERENCE AND YOU'RE GONNA NEED IT TO BE ABLE TO FIGURE OUT THE BUDGET TOO. 
          RIGHT? RIGHT. 
          OKAY. 
          SO ITEM THREE A IS THE SANITARY SEWER PROJECT. 
          UM, AND THAT IS MR. YEP. 
          ALRIGHT, SO, UH, THIS IS FOR THE SANITARY SEWER PROJECT, THE CONTRACT ADMINISTRATION AND RESIDENT REP REPRESENTATION. 
          UM, WHAT WE'RE REQUESTING IS, IS TO AWARD A CONTRACT TO, UH, CHA CONSULTING, UH, WHO IS AN ENVIRONMENTAL SERVICE CONTRACT, UH, ENVIRONMENTAL ENGINEERING SERVICE CONTRACT WITH US. 
          UH, A COUPLE MONTHS AGO WE DID AWARD A $2.7 MILLION CONTRACT, UH, FOR THE, UH, TO SNYDER FOR SAN FOR THE SANITARY SEWER PROJECT. 
          UH, NOW COMING BACK TO COUNSEL REQUESTING, UH, FOR THE CONTRACT ADMINISTRATION PURPOSES, UH, CONTRACT ADMINISTRATION, UH, BEING THAT, UH, THERE'LL BE ON SITE TO, UH, REVIEW THE WORK THAT'S BEEN DONE, UM, UH, TO MAKE SURE THE WORK'S DONE. 
          THERE'S PROPER SPECIFICATIONS TESTED PROPERLY, AND, UH, HANDLE ANY ISSUES THAT MAY COME UP AS WE MOVE FORWARD. 
          UH, THE PROJECT IS EXPECTED TO BE ABOUT 270 DAYS. 
          SO, UM, HAPPY TO ANSWER ANY QUESTIONS. 
          ANYBODY HAVE ANY QUESTIONS FOR MR. WILSON OR ANYONE ELSE? YEP. 
          OKAY. 
          SO WE'RE GOOD ON THAT. 
          ALRIGHT, MOVING ON. 
          THANK YOU. 
          MOVING ON TO OLD BUSINESS. 
          WE'RE ONLY THREE MINUTES BEHIND OUR SCHEDULE MAKING UP. 
          I'M TRYING REALLY HARD TO NOT BE OUTTA HERE. 
          MIDNIGHT TONIGHT. 
          UM, FOUR A, IT IS JUST THE LIAISON COMMITTEE MEETING ITEMS REVIEW. 
          UM, LAST WEEK WE TALKED ABOUT WHAT WE WOULD LIKE TO ADD AND MS. PRESLEY, UM, WAS COLLECTING THAT FOR US, UM, SO THAT WE CAN SEND IT OVER TO THE COUNTY AND IT NEEDS TO BE TO THEM BY THIS WEDNESDAY, RIGHT? AM I WRONG? WAIT, NO, I'M DOING THE AGENDA. 
          RIGHT. 
          THEY NEED TO SEND IT TO YOU BY ONE O'CLOCK ON WEDNESDAY. 
          RIGHT. 
          BUT THEN WE ALSO, THE IDEA IS THAT WE HAVE TO SHARE IT WITH THEM. 
          SO, YOU KNOW, SO WELL, I MEAN, I, I CAN DO THAT TOMORROW. 
          RIGHT, RIGHT, RIGHT. 
          WHATEVER. 
          NO, I JUST MEANT THE LAST TIME, THE LAST COUPLE TIMES WE'VE HAD WHERE WE SHARE WITH EACH OTHER WHAT WE WANNA DISCUSS. 
          AND THERE, IF THERE WAS SOMETHING THAT THE OTHER PARTY WAS LIKE, WE'RE NOT READY TO DISCUSS THAT QUITE YET. 
          WE'VE, WE'VE REMOVED IT FROM THE AGENDA. 
          SO THAT'S ALL I'M MEANT. 
          IS THERE ANYTHING ANYBODY WANTS TO ADD TO, WELL, I WANTED TO TALK A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT THE WORKFORCE HOUSING 'CAUSE I THINK I COULD DISCUSS THAT, THAT ISSUE A LOT AND DE BUT I THINK THEY CAN TOO. 
          BUT I, I'M NOT PREPARED NECESSARILY TO HAVE SOLUTIONS, UM, LIKE, LIKE THAT BRUCE BROUGHT OUT AT THE LAST LIAISON MEETING. 
          SO I'M, I'M, I'D LIKE TO HEAR MORE ABOUT WHAT WE EXPECT TO DO AROUND THAT ISSUE TOGETHER IN THE LIAISON COMMITTEE. 
          AND IS IT THE TIME TO DO THAT? ARE WE READY TO DO THAT? SO, 'CAUSE I, I HAVEN'T LOOKED INTO, WE JUST HAVE TO HAVE A SUMMARY TO WRITE UP IS WHAT TINA SAID LAST TIME 
          [01:15:01]
WE TALKED ABOUT IT. 
          SO WHAT WAS THE SUMMARY SAY THAT THE TOPIC ENTAILS? WOULD IT BE JU ARE YOU JUST ASKING? I HAVE TO REACH OUT TO YOU TOMORROW, SO, OKAY. 
          WERE YOU JUST GONNA, UM, WAS THE IDEA, ARE YOU TRYING TO, MELISSA, ARE YOU GETTING TO, LIKE, IS THE IDEA THAT WE WOULD JUST OPEN A CONVERSATION AND SEE IF BOTH BODIES ARE OR WANT TO TALK ABOUT IT, CONSIDER IT? IS THAT THE IDEA OR? WELL, HE HAD, I MEAN, HE HAD SOME GOOD, YOU KNOW, IDEAS OF, OF MAYBE A, A STRUCTURE TO ADDRESS THE ISSUE. 
          AND I GUESS MY, MY THOUGHT IS IS I'M NOT, I'M NOT PREPARED TO BE ABLE TO DISCUSS THAT INTELLIGENTLY , YOU KNOW, BUT, AND WHAT YOU'RE SAYING IS SINCE YOU'RE THE COUNCIL REP, IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING? WELL, AND WE CAN DISCUSS THE PROBLEM. 
          I'M SURE BOTH ENTITIES CAN DISCUSS THE PROBLEM AND YOU KNOW, WHAT WE'RE LOOKING FOR. 
          BUT I, YOU KNOW, TO HAVE US TO TALK, ARE WE TALKING ABOUT SOLUTIONS TOMORROW NIGHT? AND IF SO, THEN WHAT DIRECTION DO YOU WANT TO GO AND WHAT DO I NEED TO DO TO PREPARE SINCE YES, I'M LEAD LIAISON REP. 
          SO YOU MIGHT BE ABLE TO TAKE THE POSITION OF, YOU KNOW, WHAT WOULD IT TAKE FOR INCENTIVIZING, UH, INVESTORS TO DEVELOPERS TO PARTICIPATE IN, IN THESE PARTICULAR PROGRAMS THAT ARE OUT THERE? PROBABLY THE LOCALITIES WEREN'T IN LITIGATION AGAINST EACH OTHER. 
          IT'D BE A LOT MORE APPEALING TO DEVELOPERS. 
          BUT IN MY OPINION IS UNTIL CURRENT THINGS ON THE AGENDA AREN'T ON THE AGENDA EVERY WEEK, I DON'T SEE THIS DISCUSSION GOING VERY FAR WITH THE PEOPLE WHO COULD COME AND RESOLVE THE ISSUE. 
          I MEAN, YEAH, THAT'S TRUE. 
          I AGREE. 
          EVERYBODY WANTS WORKFORCE HOUSING, BUT UNTIL WE, I MEAN, IT'S JUST GONNA BE A DISCUSSION, A BACK AND FORTH CONVERSATION. 
          WE'VE JUST HAD A YOUTH CENTER FALL FLAT. 
          WE JUST HAD TOURISM FALL FLAT AND WE'RE STILL IN ACTIVE LITIGATION ON MULTIPLE FRONTS. 
          I JUST, OTHER THAN A CONVERSATION, BECAUSE IT'S NOT THE TOWN COUNCIL VERSUS THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS, WE GET ALONG AND WORK TOGETHER GREAT. 
          BUT OBVIOUSLY, UM, YOU KNOW, THERE'S SOME BEHIND THE SCENES ISSUES THAT I DON'T KNOW HOW FRUITFUL IT WOULD BE. 
          MY QUESTION IS HOW MUCH, SORRY TO BE CANDID, JUST HOW MUCH IN DEPTH IT WOULD BE. 
          I MEAN, WHEN I SAW THAT I WAS LIKE, IS IT WHAT, IS THERE LIKE A LOCATIONS IN MIND OR WHAT'S, I MEAN WELL, YOU COULD TALK, YOU COULD TALK ABOUT THAT'S LIKE TALKING ABOUT TRAFFIC FOR THAT MATTER. 
          IT'S LIKE, OKAY, WELL WHAT WHAT ABOUT TRAFFIC? ARE WE GONNA TALK ABOUT? DO WE HAVE A JOINT TOWN, COUNTY PROPERTY, OR, UH, YEAH. 
          I MEAN THERE'S, OR IT'S A VERY TOWN COUNTY GONNA FUND IT, YOU KNOW, JUST DON'T, WHAT'S WHAT'S THEIR INTENT TO DISCUSS? YEAH. 
          AND I'M NOT REALLY EVEN SURE WHO WOULD, YOU KNOW, I MEAN,  TALK ABOUT, BUT LIKE, I DON'T, I'M NOT SURE. 
          IS IT SOMETHING THAT WE AS A GOVERNING PARTNER ENCOURAGE OTHER PEOP ENCOURAGE DEVELOPERS TO COME IN? OR LIKE YOU SAID, TO INCENTIVIZE THEM TO COME AND WANT TO BUILD? IS THAT OUR ROLE? IS IT, UH, GO AHEAD. 
          I WAS GONNA SAY, OR AN OR, OR A PARTICULAR AREA. 
          AND I AGREE WITH ORGANIZATION, WHAT COUNCILWOMAN MOORE SAID THERE, EVERYTHING GOING ON, THE LIKELIHOOD OF US COMING TOGETHER, SINGING SOMEBODY ON, GETTING SOME RESOLUTION, BUT PERHAPS THERE COULD BE A SUBCOMMITTEE FROM THE COUNCIL AND, UM, THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS AND MAYBE START WITH A MEETING WITH OUR BUILDING ASSOCIATION. 
          THEY JUST SHUT THE TRANSPORTATION SUBCOMMITTEE DOWN. 
          I'M NOT, I'M PLAYING DEVIL'S ADVOCATE, I'M JUST SAYING I WOULD HATE TO BE A PART OF AN YET ANOTHER COUNCIL THAT HAS THE APPETITE AND DESIRE TO DO SOMETHING AND INVOLVES ANOTHER GOVERNING BODY AND SPENDS A YEAR SITTING IN MONDAY NIGHT MEETINGS UNTIL 12 1:00 AM EVERY MEETING FOR IT TO FALL FLAT. 
          IN MY OPINION, THIS IS A FRONT ROYAL ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AUTHORITY INITIATIVE. 
          IT'S FOR THEM TO SOLICIT DEVELOPERS. 
          MM. 
          IT'S FOR THEM TO MAKE OUR COMMUNITY APPEALING AND APPETIZING. 
          UM, AND, YOU KNOW, PART OF THE LIMITED GOVERNMENT IN ME, JUST, I'M ALL FOR WORKFORCE HOUSING. 
          I KNOW THERE'S A NEED FOR IT. 
          I'VE BEEN A PROPONENT FOR THAT FOR MANY, MANY YEARS. 
          BUT I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE TOWN COUNCIL NECESSARILY YEAH, I DON'T KNOW THERE'S ANY BE ALL ANSWERS UNLESS WE'RE WILLING TO PUT GOVERNMENT DOLLARS TAX DOLLARS TOWARDS FUNDING IT OTHER THAN ASKING THEM TO COME. 
          I DON'T KNOW WHAT THE COUNCIL CAN DO TO BRING WORKFORCE HOUSING RIGHT NOW AND NOT TO BRING UP, BUT IF WE HAD A PROPERTY, SORRY, I WAS GONNA SAY, WELL, I WAS GONNA SAY NOT TO PRE ADVERTISED SUBJECT, BUT THERE WAS TALK ABOUT THAT WORK TOWARDS HOUSING. 
          RIGHT? IT WAS A SCAM. 
          UNFORTUNATELY. 
          IT WAS A SCAM. 
          BUT, BUT, BUT, BUT MY QUESTION WOULD BE IS THAT THE, UM, IS THAT THE APPROPRIATE BODY? I THINK WE HAVE A RETREAT COMING UP WHERE IT WOULD BE A REALLY GOOD TIME FOR US TO DISCUSS THIS AS A COUNCIL AND SEE 
          [01:20:01]
IF IT'S ONE OF OUR MM-HMM. 
           INITIATIVES FOR 20 24, 20 25. 
          AND IF SO, IT'D MAKE A GREAT SPRING ADDITION TO THE LIAISON MEETING ONCE WE KNOW WHAT OUR GOALS AND PRIORITIES ARE. 
          'CAUSE THIS COUNCIL HAS NEVER DONE THAT, THAT MIGHT BE A, THAT MIGHT BE A PATH FORWARD. 
          UM, SO ALL THE INFORMATION THAT MR. REP, MR. RAPPAPORT'S BEEN RESEARCHING AND GATHERING UP SOME INFORMATION, MAYBE THAT'S INFORMATION THAT COULD BE SHARED AT OUR RETREAT AND OR GO AHEAD, BRUCE. 
          WHAT WERE YOU GONNA SAY? WELL, I WAS JUST GONNA SAY, I KNOW, I KNOW THAT THERE WAS $60 MILLION THAT YOU CAN FUND IT, UH, IN NEW CREDITS TO HELP RENTAL AFFORDABILITY. 
          MM-HMM. 
          . 
          MM-HMM. 
          . 
          SO, I MEAN, THERE'S MONEY OUT THERE. 
          IT'S JUST, YOU GOTTA GET TO DO THE TOWN. 
          CAN THE TOWN APPLY FOR THOSE FUNDS? LIKE HOW DOES THAT WORK? UH, THAT, THAT I'M NOT SURE ARE, THERE ARE, MAYBE IT'S, THERE'S A RETREAT IF WE DECIDE THERE ARE GRANTS TO, BUT I DON'T, BUT THE GRANT, WE WENT THROUGH THIS BEFORE LORI AND I, ONLY THE COUNTY COULD APPLY FOR THOSE GRANT. 
          NOT THE TOWN ONLY CITIES AND COUNTIES. 
          CORRECT. 
          SO WE NEED TO DO MORE RESEARCH INTO THAT. 
          THAT THE ONLY REASON I SAY MONEY, WE, WE DON'T, AND I'M NOT ABATEMENT, I'M, I'M NOT BEING NEGATIVE, BUT I'VE SAID ON THE TRANSPORTATION SUBCOMMITTEE THAT I WAS VERY PASSIONATE ABOUT BEFORE MY TIME BEING ELECTED THE FIRST TIME. 
          AND THAT'S SINCE COME TO A SCREECHING HALT BECAUSE SOME PEOPLE HAVE CRITICIZED AND SCRUTINIZED WHETHER THE TOWN AND COUNTY ARE ALLOWED TO HAVE A SUBCOMMITTEE. 
          SO WE'RE NOT MEETING CURRENTLY. 
          I DID REALLY. 
          SO AFTER OVER A YEAR, A VERY PRODUCTIVE, FRUITFUL CONVERSATIONS WITH DEVELOPERS WITH COMMERCIAL INTERESTS IN OUR COMMUNITY, THOSE MEETINGS HAVE STOPPED ENTIRELY BECAUSE THERE ARE PEOPLE, I, I BELIEVE ON THE COUNCIL AND THE BOARD OF SUPERVISORS WHO WERE WELCOMED TO BE ON THAT SUBCOMMITTEE, BUT DIDN'T WANT TO BE OR CHOOSE TO BE OR GET CHOSEN TO BE. 
          AND HAVE SINCE DECIDED THAT THEY DON'T KNOW IF WE'RE ALLOWED TO HAVE A SUBCOMMITTEE OF TWO SEPARATE GOVERNING BODIES. 
          AND NOT TO MENTION STAKEHOLDERS OVER HERE. 
          SO I WOULD HATE FOR US TO BRING THIS TO FRUITION. 
          LIKE, I THINK WE NEED TO HAVE A VERY CLEAR AND CONCISE VISION FOR WHAT WE WANNA SEE OUT OF THIS INSTEAD OF JUST DISCUSSING IT AT A LIAISON MEETING FOR IT TO FALL IN DEAF EARS. 
          RIGHT. 
          IN 12 MONTHS AGAIN. 
          AND I DON'T THINK THERE'S A DEPARTMENT WITHIN THE TOWN THAT WOULD BE LIKE IT. 
          I MEAN, THAT WE CAN INCLUDE, YOU KNOW WHAT I'M SAYING? IT'S NOT LIKE PLANNING AND ZONING OR, OR WHATEVER. 
          I'M JUST WONDERING, THAT'S WHY I WAS ASKING BEFORE, WHAT ENTITY WOULD THIS BE? I DON'T, I COULD, IT'S RHETORIC WRONG HERE. 
          I'M JUST SAYING LIKE, WOULD IT BE AN EDA, WOULD IT BE A, YOU KNOW, WARREN COALITION? AGAIN, I'M NOT, I'M JUST THROWING OUT DIFFERENT OR UNITED WAY OR PLAY, YOU KNOW, WHO EXACTLY LOOKS INTO THAT? 'CAUSE I KNOW WORKFORCE HOUSING CAME UP A COUPLE YEARS AGO. 
          A CITIZEN HAD TALKED TO ME ABOUT THAT AND THEY HAD TALKED ABOUT THE LAND THAT WAS ACROSS FROM THE APTEX. 
          MM-HMM. 
          , THE PARKING AND THE PARKING LOT. 
          LIKE THERE, THEY HAD TALKED ABOUT HOW THAT WOULD BE, YOU KNOW, A PERFECT AREA FOR, THERE WERE SITE PLANS FOR THAT. 
          EVERYTHING. 
          THERE WAS LOTS OF TALK ABOUT THAT. 
          BUT THE TOWN DOESN'T OWN THE LAND. 
          MM-HMM. 
          . 
          SO WE DIDN'T REALLY HAVE A VOICE IN IT OTHER THAN, YOU KNOW, BUT I'M JUST ASKING IN THE WORKFORCE HOUSING, DO YOU KNOW MR. WALTZ, IS THERE A PARTICULAR, IS THERE A PARTICULAR DEPARTMENT OR AN AREA THAT LOOKS INTO THAT? OR IS SO I WOULD, I WOULD THINK, IN MY OPINION, THAT FRIDA WOULD EXPLORE THOSE WORKHOUSE DEVELOPMENT, TRY TO PROVIDE INCENTIVES FOR DEVELOPERS COMING IN. 
          SO, AND I BELIEVE THAT IS PROBABLY ON THEIR LIST ALREADY. 
          OKAY. 
          WE DID HAVE MEETINGS TODAY, SO, OKAY. 
          JUST BECAUSE IF, AS AN EMPLOYER, IF I OWNED A CORPORATION AND I WAS GONNA RELOCATE TO FRONT ROYAL HOUSING IS ONE OF THE MAIN THINGS I'M GOING TO LOOK AT. 
          THEY LOOK AT THE POLITICAL SPECTRUM AS A WHOLE FOR A COMMUNITY. 
          BUT, SO WHILE FRIDA IS SOLICITING, YOU KNOW, COMMERCIAL DEVELOPERS OR ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT HOUSING GOES HAND IN HAND WITH ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT, IF YOU DON'T HAVE HOUSING, THEN YOU DON'T HAVE, YOU CAN'T DEVELOP. 
          WELL, IF YOU RECALL THE CASE STUDY THAT THAT, THAT THE GUY IN, UH,  AT THE BML, WELL WE WERE AT V-M-L-B-M-L, THE, THE TOWN FORMER TOWN COUNCIL MEMBER AT VIENNA. 
          HE WAS, HE, HE WAS, THEY BROUGHT CONDOS AND THEN THEY'VE HAD THE LARGEST PRIVATE EMPLOYERS IN THE STATE BASICALLY COME TO THEM. 
          AND AS A RESULT, THEY'RE A CITY, NOT A TOWN. 
          BUT AS A RESULT, IT'S PAID ENTIRELY FOR THEIR PUBLIC SCHOOL SYSTEM. 
          AND TO YOUR POINT, UH, ACTUALLY FRIDA COULD REACH OUT TO GET THE GRANTS. 
          OH, OKAY. 
          DEPENDING ON HOW IT'S STRUCTURED FROM THE STATE. 
          YEAH. 
          I I WOULD THINK THAT THEY WOULD BE ABLE TO TWO. 
          UH, SO, SO THAT, YOU KNOW, SO WITH TECHNOLOGY DEVELOPMENT AUTHORITIES CAN BE POWERFUL TOOLS SOMETIMES. 
          SO THINKING ABOUT THAT, YOU KNOW, BE BECAUSE OF THAT IN MY MIND. 
          'CAUSE MY, WHEN YOU GUYS KEPT TALKING, I THOUGHT, WELL, I GUESS WE COULD ALWAYS LEAVE IT ON THE AGENDA AND JUST ASK THE COUNTY, ARE YOU GUYS, YOU KNOW, THINKING ABOUT THAT IN THERE? BUT I DON'T, YOU KNOW, THEY 
          [01:25:01]
MAY BE LIKE, NO, WE'RE NOT THINKING ABOUT IT AT ALL. 
          SO MAYBE WE, MAYBE WE JUST FOCUS ON IT FOR OURSELVES A LITTLE BIT. 
          AND THEN, YOU KNOW, AND THEN IF WE'RE READY TO TALK MORE AND APRIL WE COULD SHARE WHAT WE'RE, YOU KNOW, WHAT'S, WHAT PROGRESS WE'VE MADE. 
          I I WILL SAY THIS THOUGH, YOU'VE DONE A LOT OF RESEARCH, EVEN IF YOU WANNA PROVIDE THAT RESEARCH. 
          YEAH. 
          UM, YOU KNOW, YOU COULD SHARE IT WITH US. 
          YOU COULD SHARE IT WITH FRIDA. 
          DO YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN? UM, THAT WOULD BE A I'LL, I'LL PUT SOMETHING TOGETHER. 
          OKAY. 
          WHAT I'VE DONE. 
          YEAH. 
          BECAUSE YOU WOULD EMAIL IT OUT TO US SPRING. 
          SURE. 
          BUT I THINK IT WOULD BE GOOD TO SHARE, I MEAN OBVIOUSLY TO US, BUT WE COULD SHARE IT WITH RITA AND, YOU KNOW, AND I DON'T KNOW REALLY WHAT'S GOING ON WITH IT, THEIR EDA, BUT YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN, JUST THE IDEA IS THERE. 
          YEAH. 
          I THINK THAT, AGAIN, I THINK, I THINK PROBABLY BOTH ENTITIES ARE INTERESTED IN IMPROVING HOUSING IN THE AREA. 
          AND I, WE COULD SIT AROUND ALL DAY AND TALK ABOUT THE PROBLEM, BUT, UM, WE, WE DO PROBABLY NEED TO STRATEGIZE ON OUR END FIRST. 
          AND I THINK THAT BRUCE HAS DONE A LOT OF WORK. 
          SO, UM, I'LL BE ANXIOUS TO SEE SOME MORE OF IT. 
          SO, AND I WILL SAY THERE WAS A, UM, I JUST NOTICED OVER THE WEEKEND THAT, UM, IN WINCHESTER THERE IS, UH, FOR THOSE OF YOU THAT HAVE BEEN HERE A REALLY LONG TIME, THE UM, WARD PLAZA. 
          WARD PLAZA. 
          OH, THERE WAS A BIG ARTICLE IN A WINCHESTER STAR ABOUT A DEVELOPER COMING IN AND, AND I FORGET HOW MANY ACRES, BUT IT WOULD BE ALL OF WARD PLAZA AND A LITTLE BIT BEHIND IT. 
          WHAT WAS IT? HOW MANY? 23 OR, YEAH, 23. 
          AND WHAT THEIR PLAN IS, IS, UM, I MEAN IT'S GONNA HAVE HOUSING, BUT IT'S KIND OF MIXED USE TOO. 
          THEY'RE HOPING FOR A GROCERY STORE AND SOME OTHER THINGS. 
          BUT IT WAS, I THINK IT WAS LIKE APARTMENTS AND DUPLEXES AND WITH THE IDEA COMMON AREAS. 
          YEAH. 
          MORE AFFORDABLE. 
          AND I WAS, OF COURSE, I WAS READING THAT AND THINKING, WOW, YOU KNOW, LIKE, BECAUSE, AND THEN OF COURSE, YOU KNOW, YOU GET THE BACK AND FORTH WITH THE PUBLIC TALK, YOU KNOW, ON SOCIAL MEDIA TALKING NEGATIVE ABOUT YOU USING THAT AREA FOR THAT. 
          AND THEN A LOT OF PEOPLE CAME BACK WITH, WELL, IT'S SITTING THERE DOING NOTHING. 
          IT IS NOT, YOU KNOW, WHAT ELSE ARE YOU GONNA DO WITH IT? AND UM, SO IT WAS IN, IT WAS INTERESTING. 
          AND, AND I THOUGHT WHEN I READ THAT, I WAS LIKE, THAT'S SOMEBODY, YOU KNOW. 
          BUT AGAIN, THEY HAD A DEVELOPER, THEY CAME IN THAT SAW AN OPPORTUNITY. 
          UM, YOU KNOW, SO THAT WAS THE INITIAL THOUGHT PROCESS BEHIND P AND D DEVELOPER STARTED PUTTING UP ABOUT $2 MILLION. 
          WHO IS THE CITY? THE CITY ALREADY. 
          YES. 
          AND IT WAS THEIR EDA THAT WAS PUTTING UP NO, WAIT, NO, IT WAS, WELL WHATEVER IT WAS, IT SAID THAT IF THEY DIDN'T, THEY GUARANTEED THE LOAN. 
          THEY GUARANTEED THE LOAN LIKE THAT THE CITY WOULD PAY THE DIFFERENCE OR SOMETHING ALONG THOSE LINES. 
          AND OF COURSE, YOU KNOW, THAT WAS NOT, BEFORE WE GET OFF OF THIS TOPIC, I'D LIKE TO GO BACK TO COUNCILMAN MORE AND HEAR A LITTLE BIT MORE ABOUT WHAT HAPPENED. 
          I MEAN, WE HAVE TRAFFIC AS AN ITEM ON THERE FOR MUTUAL DISCUSSION. 
          WHEN, WHEN DID THE TRAFFIC COMMITTEE GET TO BOSCH OR WHATEVER IT WAS DISCUSSED DURING CLOSED ON COUNCIL? I'M NOT SURE. 
          WELL, ACTUALLY, SO AT THE LAST LIAISON MEETING, OH, GO AHEAD. 
          YEAH, THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT THAT PARTICULAR COMMITTEE AND UM, THERE WAS JUST QUESTION ABOUT WHETHER THE COMMITTEE, WHETHER THE COMMITTEE WAS LIKE A TOWN COMMITTEE. 
          WAS IT A COUNTY COMMITTEE OR WAS IT A LIAISON COMMITTEE? AND SO THEY WERE LOOKING INTO, YOU KNOW, DO WE NEED BYLAWS? DO WE NEED MINUTES? DO WE NEED, UM, TO BE RECORDED? DO WE NEED TO BE OPEN TO THE PUBLIC? WHICH WE WERE FOR ALL OF THEM. 
          YEAH. 
          UM, WE ACTUALLY HAD STAKEHOLDERS AT EVERY SINGLE MEETING JOE ATTENDED. 
          I KNOW AT LEAST ONE OR TWO. 
          UM, I MEAN, WE HAD OUT OF TOWN DEVELOPERS COME TO THOSE TRANSPORTATION MEETINGS. 
          VDOT SAID THAT WE WERE ONE OF THE FIRST IN THEIR REGION TO DO THAT. 
          AND THEY DIDN'T UNDERSTAND WHY IT HADN'T BEEN DONE 20 YEARS PRIOR. 
          ALSO, THE GUY, UH, NORFOLK SOUTHERN NORTHFOLK SOUTHERN DID TOO. 
          YEAH. 
          RIGHT AFTER THAT TRAIN DERAILED INCIDENT THAT IF THE, HE GAVE US HIS CELL PHONE NUMBER. 
          YEAH. 
          IF THE TRAIN EVER STOPS AT CDO SHORES AGAIN. 
          SO THE PEOPLE IN THE TRANSPORTATION FOR THOSE STAKEHOLDERS TO SAY THAT HE, YOU GUYS ARE ACTUALLY DOING THIS THE RIGHT WAY. 
          WE'VE NEVER REALLY SEEN THIS BEFORE. 
          YOU GUYS TALKING TO HIM. 
          'CAUSE IT MAKES OUR JOB A LOT EASIER TO HEAR. 
          WHO DECIDED THAT IT WOULD STOP? WELL, I DON'T THINK IT WAS DECIDED. 
          I THINK THERE WAS JUST SOME QUESTION ABOUT HOW TO MOVE FORWARD WITH IT. 
          AND SO I'M THINKING ALSO, SINCE IT'S ON THE AGENDA FOR THAT, FOR THAT NIGHT, WE'LL BRING IT UP AGAIN. 
          LIKE ALL HOPEFULLY OTHER OPEN PUBLIC MEETINGS. 
          THERE WERE ONLY ALLOWED TO BE TWO REPRESENTATIVES FROM EACH FOUR. 
          THAT'S RIGHT. 
          NOW THERE WERE, THERE WERE ADDITIONAL PEOPLE THAT CONTINUED TO SHOW UP AND NOT ONLY SHOW UP, BUT ATTEMPTS TO PARTICIPATE, WHICH WAS NOT ALLOWED. 
          AND THAT'S WHERE WELL, THAT SHOULD HAVE BEEN MADE. 
          IT WAS MADE CLEAR, BUT IT CONTINUED TO HAPPEN. 
          AND I THINK THAT'S WHERE THE TRICKINESS CAME IN. 
          SO WE ARE GONNA HAVE IT, 
          [01:30:01]
WE'RE GONNA ENTERTAIN IT. 
          YEAH. 
          WE'RE GONNA ENTERTAIN IT AGAIN AT THE LIAISON MEETING AND JUST MAY SIMPLE THE TWO REPRESENTATIVES. 
          AND YOU WON'T SIT IN THE AUDIENCE JUST LIKE TONIGHT. 
          YOU SIT THERE AND KEEP YOUR MOUTH SHUT. 
          YEAH. 
          WELL THAT'S, YEAH. 
          YEAH. 
          ALL RIGHT. 
          ANYBODY WANNA ADD ANYTHING ELSE TO THE LIAISON MEETING? WE WE'RE KEEPING MCKAY ON THERE. 
          I THOUGHT WE WERE TAKING MCKAY OFF. 
          OR DID THE COUNTY ADD MCKAY COUNTY? SEE, THAT'S WHAT I WAS JUST TRYING TO PREVENT WITH WORKFORCE HOUSING IS HAVING AN AGENDA ITEM THAT'S BEEN ON THERE FOR ONE PLUS YEARS. 
          LIKE IT, JUST, LIKE, AT WHAT POINT IS IT PRODUCTIVE FOR THE PEOPLE WHO ARE GONNA GO REPRESENT THE TOWN FOR THE PEOPLE THAT ARE GONNA COME, REPRESENT THE COUNTY FOR THE STAFF TO CONTINUE TO DISCUSS SOMETHING AT EVERY SINGLE MEETING. 
          BUT I THOUGHT WE'D AGREE. 
          WE WERE, THERE'S NO UPDATE SEPARATE MCKAY'S BREAK. 
          JOE MADE IT VERY CLEAR AT THE LAST MEETING. 
          SO THAT'S MY QUESTION IS WHY IS THIS BEING BROUGHT UP AGAIN? AND I MEAN, WHAT'S THE, WHAT'S THE QUESTION THAT THEY'RE, IT JUST DOESN'T, THAT THEY'RE TRYING TO GET, TRYING TO LOOK FOR SOME COOPERATION ON, ON SELLING THOSE OTHER THREE PARCELS. 
          I I, I GUESS I HAVE NOT SEEN DR. 
          DALEY'S MEETING REQUEST TO THEY WELL, YEAH. 
          THEY WANT US TAKE, THEY WANT, THEY WANT SEE IF THERE'S A WAY FOR US TO KEEP THE PAY. 
          RIGHT. 
          AND THEY, THEY TAKE LAND THAT THEY NEED TO DEVELOP AND THAT WHAT THEIR STANCE IS. 
          WELL, WE DON'T, IT'S REMAINED FOR SINCE I'VE BEEN ON COUNCIL. 
          WELL, THE PROBLEM IS , THE COUNTY OWNS A PIECE. 
          THE TOWN OWNS A PIECE. 
          WE OWN PIECE TOGETHER. 
          AND SO THE QUESTION HAS BEEN AT EVERY, WELL, MOST OF THE LIAISON MEANS, YOU KNOW, AT FIRST WAS JUST, DO WE WANNA DIVIDE IT? UM, OR DID WE WANNA, YOU KNOW, DID, CAN I ASKED COULD THEY BUY US OUT? MM-HMM. 
           THEN THEY WERE LIKE, WELL, YOU CAN, YOU CAN, YOU CAN BUY US OUT. 
          AND THEN AT THE LAST MEETING, UH, MR. WELTZ AND I, WE, WE, WE TALKED ABOUT, UM, THE WATER SOURCE OF MCKAY SPRINGS AND THAT WE DIDN'T WANT TO DISTURB THAT IN ANY WAY. 
          AND SO THAT WAS KIND OF HOW WE LEFT IT LAST. 
          SO, WE'LL, WE'LL TALK ABOUT IT AGAIN. 
          IT'LL PROBABLY BE A QUICK ITEM. 
          YEAH. 
          BUT ANYWAY. 
          ALL RIGHT. 
          I PASSED OUT, WHICH WAS, WAIT, WE HAVE ONE MORE ITEM. 
          OH, I'M SO SORRY. 
          SORRY. 
           FOUR B OUT OF TOWN UTIL I'M SO SORRY. 
          JUST HOLD ON TO THAT. 
          UM, FOUR B OUT OF TOWN UTILITY CONNECTION APPLICATION FROM THE CATHOLIC DIOCESE OF ARLINGTON AND WARREN COUNTY BOARD OF SUPERVISORS CAN CONTINUE DISCUSSION. 
          AND LAST WEEK YOU GUYS KNOW THAT WE, UM, TALKED ABOUT THAT EXTENSIVELY AND WE ASKED SOME QUESTIONS AND IT LOOKS LIKE WE'VE GOTTEN SOME ANSWERS, UM, ABOUT, SO, UM, JUST, YOU KNOW, WHERE, WHERE ARE WE ON THIS? DOES ANYBODY HAVE ANY MORE TO ADD? BECAUSE, UM, WHAT, WHAT WAS THE WATER USAGE IS WAS THAT, WAS THAT ONE? WE HAD A QUESTION ABOUT THE WATER. 
          UM, WITH GREENWAY ENGINEERING FOR THAT PROJECT. 
          OKAY. 
          SORRY. 
          WELL, HOLD ON. 
          WE'LL WE'LL GET WITH YOU IN JUST A SECOND. 
          I'M SORRY. 
          AND YOUR NAME IS? MARISSA. 
          MARISSA, NICE TO MEET YOU MARISSA. 
          YOU TOO. 
          SO, UM, REALLY WE NEEDED TO, UH, JUST, I MEAN WE TALKED ABOUT LIKE HOW MUCH WATER, AND I KNOW LAST WEEK WHEN WE LEFT HERE, THE QUESTION WAS, IS THE APPLICANT AWARE THAT IF, UH, THEY WOULD WERE TO REMAIN OUTSIDE OF THE TOWN BOUNDARIES THAT THEY WOULD UM, BE, THEY WOULD HAVE TO PAY FULL TAP FEES AND DOUBLE WATER? DO WE KNOW THE ANSWER TO THAT YET? PROBABLY NOT. 
          I DO NOT VERIFY THAT WITH THE APPLICANT. 
          BUT THE APPLICANT IS REQUESTING OUT OF TOWN WATER. 
          SO THAT WOULD BE IMPLIED THAT THEY WOULD KNOW. 
          THEY WOULD PICK UP BREAKS. 
          OKAY. 
          AND YOU KNOW, IT'S INTERESTING AS I WAS GOING OVER THE TOWN CODE LAST NIGHT, 'CAUSE I WAS LOOKING ABOUT SOMETHING ELSE THAT WE'VE BEEN, I'VE BEEN TRYING TO FIGURE OUT, I WAS READING EVERY, NOT ALL OF IT 'CAUSE IT WOULD'VE TAKEN ME HOURS, BUT I CAME ACROSS THE WATER TALK IN THERE AND IT WAS SAYING LIKE THAT YOU, THERE WAS A PART IN THERE. 
          I'M ASSUMING WE, WE'VE, YOU KNOW, ADAPTED IT, BUT WHERE IT WAS TALKING ABOUT NOT PROVIDING WATER OUTSIDE THE TOWN LIMITS, I THOUGHT THAT WAS INTERESTING THAT IT WAS IN THE CODE CHAPTER 1 34 1 B TALKS ABOUT THE MORATORIUM YEP. 
          OF THE CERTAIN AREAS. 
          YEP. 
          SO, ALRIGHT. 
          UM, WHAT, SO WHAT WAS YOUR QUESTION, JOSH? ABOUT THE, ABOUT THE USAGE? YEAH, I MEAN USAGE, THE WATER USAGE, I MEAN, IT WAS 4,000 GALLONS A DAY. 
          I MEAN, IF IT WAS TRUE. 
          SO IF, YEP. 
          I WAS GONNA SAY, SO AT THIS TIME, IF IT'S OKAY WITH COUNSEL, I'LL RECOGNIZE MARISSA. 
          WE NORMALLY AT WORK SESSIONS DON'T DO THAT, BUT BUT YOU HAVE INFORMATION THAT WE NEED. 
          YES. 
          JOE HAD, THANK YOU HAVE TO CONTACT, ANSWER SOME QUESTIONS IF YOU, IF YOU'D LIKE TO DO THAT . 
          OKAY. 
          SO HER UP THERE. 
          DO YOU WANT, DO YOU MIND STANDING UP HERE? IS THAT OKAY OR IT IT, I MEAN, IT'S UP TO YOU. 
          I'LL HAVE HER, YEAH, IF YOU DON'T MIND. 
          THAT WAY EVERYBODY'S NOT NORMALLY PEOPLE WATCHING IT HOME. 
          YEAH. 
          WE DON'T TURN AROUND AND TRACK 
          [01:35:01]
THEY CAN TO THE AUDIENCE. 
          IF WE CAN, WE CAN KEEP FROM DOING THAT. 
          OUR STAFF GOT UP THERE, BUT WE COME UP HERE. 
          SO, HELLO MARISSA WITH GREENWAY. 
          HOW ARE Y'ALL DOING? NINE HUGGING. 
          SO WHAT QUESTIONS DO YOU HAVE? AND I'LL SEE IF I HAVE THE MAGICAL ANSWERS. 
          SO I THINK IT WAS ONE OF THE QUESTIONS WAS USAGE. 
          'CAUSE IT DIDN'T SEEM LIKE THAT WAS, IT DIDN'T SEEM LIKE FOR THE BLUEPRINT, UH, AND THE, NOT THE BLUEPRINT, BUT WHAT IT LOOKED LIKE IN THAT ADDITIONAL BUILDING, THAT 4,000 WAS GONNA BE THE ACCURATE NUMBER. 
          UM, WELL WE DID DO, UH, A STUDY OR, WELL, NOT AN OFFICIAL STUDY, OUR ENGINEER THAT DESIGNED EVERYTHING. 
          WE BASED THIS OFF OF THE SEATING CAPACITY OF THE CHURCH AS, AS STATE CODE RECOMMENDS. 
          MM-HMM. 
          . 
          SO THE 4,000 PER DAY IS KIND OF A, ACTUALLY AN OVERESTIMATE BECAUSE THEIR  DAYS ARE GONNA BE SUNDAY. 
          THIS CHURCH IS FOR ROLLOVER. 
          THEY'RE KEEPING THE CHURCH OPEN THAT IS IN TOWN, THAT'S RIGHTED ACROSS THE STREET. 
          MM-HMM. 
          . 
          SO WHAT THIS, THIS BUILDING'S GONNA BE FOR, IT'S GONNA BE A TWO PHASE CONSTRUCTION. 
          SO THE FIRST PHASE IS GONNA BE THE ONE, THE FIRST BUILDING. 
          AND IT IS GONNA BE BUILT AS A GYMNASIUM THAT WILL BE USED FOR, FOR OVERFLOW, FOR THE, FOR CHURCH SERVICE AND THEN A GYMNASIUM FOR CHURCH SERVICE. 
          YES. 
          YES. 
          BECAUSE SO THEN THE, THE REASON FOR THAT IS THEIR NEXT PHASE, THE PHASE TWO WILL BE WHEN THEY ACTUALLY BUILD THEIR SANCTUARY. 
          OKAY. 
          GOTCHA. 
          AND THEN THE GYMNASIUM WILL BE A GYMNASIUM. 
          SO IT'LL BE KIND OF A, A TWO PHASE BUILD. 
          UM, AND IT'S NOT GONNA BE THE FULL SERVICE GOING IN THERE OKAY. 
          IN THE FIRST PART. 
          RIGHT. 
          SO, AND THAT IT WON'T BE UNTIL DOWN THE LINE WHERE, AND THEY'RE, THEY'RE NEVER GONNA CLOSE THE CHURCH THAT EXISTS DOWNTOWN RIGHT NOW. 
          AND IT, IT'LL KIND OF BE, IT'LL ALWAYS BE KIND OF AN OVERFLOW AND THEN DOWN THE LINE IT'LL BE USED FOR, YOU KNOW, THE GYMNASIUM FOR EXTRA ACTIVITIES. 
          THEY'RE ACTUALLY PURCHASING THE PARCEL THAT'S ADJACENT TO IT WHERE THEY'RE GONNA DO LIKE FIELDS AND STUFF OUT THERE. 
          UM, SO IT'S GONNA BE MORE OF LIKE A COMMUNITY CENTER FOR THE CHURCH TO USE. 
          UM, AND POSSIBLY A SCHOOL IT SOUNDS LIKE? NO, NO, NO, NO. 
          FOR THE SCHOOL. 
          I ACTUALLY ASKED THAT TODAY. 
          UM, I TALKED TO THEM THIS MORNING, I WAS LIKE, DO YOU HAVE ANY INTENTIONS OF THIS BEING ANYTHING MORE THAN CHURCH WITH EXTRACURRICULAR ACTIVITIES LIKE FOR, FOR SPECIAL EVENTS OR YOU KNOW, JUST YOUTH GROUPS, THINGS LIKE THAT. 
          THEY DON'T HAVE ANY INTENTION ON THAT BECAUSE THEY'RE, I THOUGHT THEY HAD A SCHOOL NOW THERE DIDN'T THEY? I, THAT'S WHAT I VERIFIED BECAUSE WHEN I WENT TO THE SITE AND I SAW SO MANY PEOPLE WALKING AROUND BACK AND FORTH, I WAS LIKE, DO YOU ALL HAVE A, HAVE A SCHOOL GOING IN THERE NOW? AND SHE WAS LIKE, NO, THERE'S NO SCHOOL. 
          IT'S JUST, THAT'S THEIR MAIN CAMPUS. 
          IT'S VERY ACTIVE SITE. 
          THERE'S ALWAYS PEOPLE IN AND OUT OF THERE. 
          SO, AND THAT'S WHERE THEY HAVE ALL THEIR ADMINISTRATIVE OFFICES AS WELL. 
          SO THAT'S WHY IT SEEMS LIKE IT'S SUCH A BUSY FACILITY. 
          YEAH. 
          MINUTE. 
          IT'S A VERY FAITHFUL CON. 
          I MEAN, WELL I COULD SAY CONGREGATION, I'M NOT SURE WHAT YOU BUT, UM, PARISH. 
          PARISH, YES. 
          I'M SORRY. 
          YEAH. 
          UM, OTHER, SO 4,000, 4,000 IS, IS BASED OFF OF THE CD THAT WOULD BE PROVIDED IN THE CHURCH? YES. 
          AND AND YOU'RE SAYING ONLY ON SUNDAYS? YES. 
          I MEAN THE WEEKENDS WOULD BE THE MAIN TIME THAT WOULD BE USED DURING THE WEEK. 
          YOU MIGHT HAVE A COUPLE PEOPLE IN THERE, BUT IT'S NOT GONNA GET HIGH USAGE AND THE MASKS WOULD ONLY BE ON SUNDAY VERSUS, 'CAUSE MASKS CAN BE HELD ON SATURDAY TOO. 
          C, CD CLASSES AND LIKE ALL KINDS OF STUFF, SO. 
          RIGHT. 
          SO IT'S VERY RARE TO JUST HAVE A SUNDAY. 
          NO. 
          YEAH. 
          NOT, IT'S LIKE WHEN THEY HAVE MATH, THAT'S THEIR OVERFLOW. 
          IT'S NOT, IT'S NOT GONNA BE THEIR MAIN FACILITY. 
          MM-HMM. 
           IT'S, IT'S LITERALLY UNTIL THEY GET TO THEIR SECOND PHASE IN WHICH THEY'RE NOT QUITE CERTAIN, THE WAY THAT THEY DO THEIR FUNDING FOR CONSTRUCTION IS THE ACTUAL CHURCH HERE IN, IN FRONT ROYAL. 
          MM-HMM. 
          , THEY PUT UP A CERTAIN AMOUNT AND THEN THE DIOCESE, THEY PUT IN A CERTAIN AMOUNT AND THE DIOCESE CONTROLS THEIR BUDGET AND THEIR FUNDING. 
          SO THAT'S WHY THEY'RE LIKE, IT MAY BE FIVE YEARS, IT MAY BE 10 YEARS UNTIL THE SECOND PORTION GETS CONSTRUCTED. 
          AT THIS POINT IT'LL JUST BE THE ONE MAIN BUILDING AND THEN THEY'RE GONNA DECIDE IF THEY WANNA BUILD ABOVE OR BESIDE. 
          RIGHT NOW WE HAVE IT SHOWN BESIDE, BUT THEY'RE KIND OF GOING BACK AND FORTH ON THAT. 
          OTHER QUESTIONS FROM COUNSEL ABOUT THIS? OR AT LEAST QUESTIONS THAT MARISSA WOULD BE ABLE TO ANSWER. 
          RIGHT. 
          IN REGARD WITH REGARDS TO THE ENGINEERING REPORT, YOU KNOW, WE ASK ABOUT THE WATER. 
          'CAUSE THAT'S, 
          [01:40:01]
YOU KNOW, ESPECIALLY AFTER THIS PAST SUMMER RIGHT. 
          YOU KNOW, WE'RE, YOU KNOW, WATER IS, UM, YOU KNOW, OUR CONCERN, THEY, THEY ARE AWARE OF THE FEES. 
          MM-HMM. 
           THAT EVERYTHING IS, IT'S ABOUT DOUBLE, RIGHT? YEAH. 
          THE CONNECTIONS ARE THE WATER AND SEWER, ONCE THEY CONNECT, THAT WILL BE AS WELL. 
          UM, SO THEY'RE AWARE THAT EVERYTHING IS GOING TO BE MORE, UH, THEY, BUT THEY STILL THINK THIS IS MORE COST EFFECTIVE THAN WELLS. 
          WE WENT. 
          WE TALKED ABOUT THAT A COUPLE TIMES. 
          I DON'T KNOW IF THAT'S YOUR PART OF YOUR, I DON'T KNOW IF YOUR, THAT ENGINEERING IS THAT PART OF YOUR AREA? WELL WE, YEAH, AND WE, WE TALKED ABOUT THAT. 
          WE, WE WERE LIKE, YOU KNOW, YOU DO HAVE THE OPTION OF DOING A DRAIN FIELD AND A WELL, UM, YOU'RE RIGHT NEXT TO THE RIVER, EVERYTHING AROUND HERE PERKS. 
          GREAT. 
          SO THEY WOULDN'T HAVE AN ISSUE WITH THAT. 
          AND I THINK THAT THEY WANTED TO SEE IF THEY COULD GET THIS FIRST BECAUSE THE WATER AND SEWER LINES ALREADY RUN THROUGH THE PROPERTY. 
          UM, SO THAT WAS, THEY WERE KIND OF YEAH. 
          A LITTLE BACK AND FORTH. 
          I THINK THEY COULD GET PER THOSE KIND OF NUMBERS WITH THE WAY WE'VE HAD DROUGHTS THIS YEAR. 
          YEAH. 
          SEE PER AND THAT'S ALSO, THERE'S ALSO CAVES ALL THROUGH THERE. 
          THE CAVES ARE UNDER THE SCHOOL. 
          SORRY, WHAT? I WOULDN'T WANNA ANY WELL AROUND HERE THAT WOULD PRODUCE THAT MUCH. 
          YEAH, NO EITHER. 
          YEAH. 
          FOR, I DON'T KNOW. 
          AS I'VE CONFESSED, I KNOW NOTHING ABOUT WELLS. 
          WHAT, WHAT WAS IT? WHAT THEY USED TO BUY I ON THE UM, UM, YEAH. 
          UNDER THE 3000 GALLON MARK FOR A MONTH. 
          YEAH. 
          SO THAT, THAT'S WHY I ASKED, THAT'S WHY QUESTION WAS BROUGHT UP. 
          'CAUSE RIGHT. 
          IT WAS LIKE, OKAY, NOW WE GO IF THERE'S OTHER CHURCHES WITH 3000 GALLONS A MONTH, THEY WERE WANTING 4,000 GALLONS A DAY. 
          I'M LIKE, YEAH, WE HAD, WE DIDN'T KNOW IF THEY WERE RUNNING A WATER OPERATOR. 
          NO. 
          YEAH. 
          IT'S THE WAY THAT THE WATER PARK OR SOMETHING THEIRS NOT ALLOWED. 
          IT DOES SAY WE ARE A STATE THAT WOULD BE THE MAXIMUM CAPACITY. 
          UM, AND AND PART OF THAT IS TO MAKE SURE THAT WE HAVE, OR THAT THE, THE CHURCH HAS THE RIGHT SIZE, UM, TAPS INTO THE SYSTEM SO THAT THEY GET FURTHER WATER SUP OR FOR FIRE SUPPRESSION AND THEN WATER AND SEWER. 
          UM, AND IT'S, YOU KNOW, YEAH, I THINK THAT'S VERY HIGH. 
          THAT'S ME PERSONALLY. 
          BUT AS I SAID, IT'S BASED OFF THE CING FOR STATE CODE. 
          RIGHT. 
          AND THAT'S JUST FOR CHURCH BUILDING WITH A MASS ON SUNDAY OR WHATEVER, SO IT RIGHT. 
          AND THAT'S, THAT NUMBER WOULDN'T A FULL MASS SCHOOL THAT WOULDN'T INCLUDE A SCHOOL WHERE THAT WOULDN'T INCLUDE, UH, A, AN ACTIVITY AREA OR ANYTHING LIKE THAT. 
          LIKE YOU WERE JUST SAYING, LIKE IF THEY BUILT A ONE THAT WOULDN'T BE RIGHT. 
          WELL THIS IS FOR THEIR, THIS IS BASED OFF OF IF THEY BUILT THE ENTIRE BUILD OUT BUILD YES. 
          WHICH WOULD BE A LITTLE OVER 20,000 SQUARE FEET TOTAL. 
          GOTCHA. 
          SO THAT THIS IS BASED OFF THE 20,000 SQUARE FEET. 
          SO FOR THE CHURCH AND THE BUILDING, MM-HMM. 
           YES. 
          WHEN THEY WERE DONE. 
          MM-HMM. 
          . 
          RIGHT. 
          BUT LIKE YOU SAID, IT COULD TAKE A WHILE. 
          RIGHT. 
          RIGHT. 
          I'M GONNA ASK A REALLY ODD QUESTION 'CAUSE I DON'T KNOW THE ANSWER TO THIS, BUT LIKE, IF, IF WE, IF, IF TOWN SAID, IF TOWN WAS AGREEABLE TO THIS AND 4,000 IS WHAT WE ARE AGREEING TO, AND THEN IT TURNS OUT THAT IT'S MORE NOTHING WE CAN DO ABOUT IT THEN RIGHT? THE, THE JUST COST OF WATER. 
          I MEAN, JUST THEY PAY MORE FOR THE WATER, BUT IT'S NOT, AND IT WOULD BE ALL IN THERE CAPSIZING AND HOW THEY CONNECT TO OUR SYSTEM. 
          THAT WOULD BE THEIR RESTRICTION AS WELL. 
          IS THAT THEY COULD ONLY USE THAT ONE? WELL, NO, NO. 
          HOWEVER MUCH THE TAP WILL ALLOW. 
          RIGHT. 
          OH, OKAY. 
          OKAY. 
          ALRIGHT. 
          READY? THAT'S WHAT I WAS JUST ASKING, LIKE, ROBBIE, STILL THERE? YEAH. 
          ROBBIE, HOW MUCH DOES THE TAP USUALLY ALLOW? I MEAN, AN INCH AND A HALF YOU COULD THROW A T 10 METER, YOU CAN PULL ABOUT 50 GALLONS A MINUTE, UH, ROUGHLY. 
          I MEAN, DEPENDING ON THE PRESSURE. 
          BUT HOW MANY A DAY IS THAT ? THAT'D BE WHAT? 23,000. 
          OH WOW. 
          OKAY. 
          NO, THAT'D BE A WEEK. 
          YOU SAID 50 GALLONS A YOU SAID 50 GALLONS A MINUTE. 
          I KNOW YOU DIDN'T. 
          THAT WAS PROBABLY 50 SIRS. 
          3000 GALLONS A MINUTE OR 3000 GALLONS AN HOUR RIGHT THERE. 
          ROB PRESSURE. 
          I'M JUST, IT SEEMS LIKE WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, THEY TOOK THE STATE SCAT REGS AND PRETTY MUCH TOOK THE MAX AND, AND USE THE MAX NUMBERS WITH THE RIGHT. 
          YEAH. 
          DOES ANYBODY HAVE ANY OTHER QUESTIONS FOR MARISSA? OKAY. 
          THANK YOU. 
          HANG, SORRY, BRUCE. 
          WHEN, UH, IS, UH, THE CONSTRUCTION OF THE AUXILIARY BUILDING, WHEN, WHEN WOULD THEY BEGIN IT? I MEAN, WE'RE STILL WORKING THROUGH THE CONDITIONAL USE PERMIT PROCESS. 
          MM-HMM. 
          . 
          UM, SO THIS WEDNESDAY WE GO TO THE PLANNING, WARREN COUNTY PLANNING COMMISSION FOR 
          [01:45:01]
CONSENT TO ADVERTISE AND THEN, YOU KNOW, ANOTHER MONTH UNTIL IT'S PUBLIC HEARING AND THEN ANOTHER MONTH UNTIL BOARD OF SUPERVISORS. 
          SO I DON'T THINK THAT THEY'RE LOOKING TO START ANYTHING. 
          I MEAN, YOU KNOW, WE'RE NOT EVEN AT SITE PLAN YET. 
          YEAH. 
          SO WE GOT A WHILE. 
          WE JUST WANTED TO, TO GET THIS PROCESS STARTED KNOWING THAT IT COULD POTENTIALLY TAKE A WHILE TO, TO DETERMINE WHETHER OR NOT THAT THIS WOULD BE APPROVED OR NOT. 
          YEAH, I WAS, I WAS JUST LOOKING AT, UH, WHAT KIND OF TIMEFRAME THEY, THEY'RE LOOKING AT. 
          YEAH. 
          IS IS WHERE I WAS GOING WITH IT. 
          THAT'S ALL. 
          I MEAN, I WOULD THINK, YOU KNOW, AS SOON AS THEY GET AN APPROVED PLAN, THEY'RE GONNA BE READY TO, TO GO WITH IT. 
          FATHER, FATHER GEE IS VERY EXCITED ABOUT THIS PROJECT, SO. 
          ALL RIGHT. 
          WE DON'T HAVE ANY MORE QUESTIONS FOR OKAY, MARISSA. 
          I MEAN, YOU CAN HANG TIGHT. 
          WE MIGHT, BUT I'M JUST SAYING THERE NOW. 
          UM, BUT WHAT ELSE? DOES COUNSEL HAVE ANY OTHER DISCUSSION WITH THIS? 'CAUSE I'M, I'M, MR. WALTZ IS THIS, WHAT DIRECTION ARE YOU LOOKING FROM AT THIS POINT? I KNOW, I KNOW IT'S NOT A DECISION HERE 'CAUSE WE DON'T TAKE ACTION AT WORK SESSIONS, BUT, UM, UH, I, I I HAVE A QUESTION. 
          WHAT DOES, UM, STAFF'S RECOMMENDATION IS THE COUNCIL TAKE DESIRED ACTION. 
          I'M JUST CURIOUS IF STAFF HAS, UH, UH, ANOTHER YES, MR. WAL. 
          UH, MR. YES. 
          SO MADAM MAYOR, AS YOU POINTED OUT AT THE BEGINNING AND YOU CONCURRED, THERE'S A MORATORIUM, RIGHT? SO THIS WOULD REQUIRE AN AMENDMENT OF TOWN CUTTING TO EITHER PARTIALLY LIFT THE MORATORIUM OR LIFT IT ENTIRELY, WHICH WOULD INVOLVE A PUBLIC HEARING. 
          SO IF WE LIFT THE MORATORIUM, THEN WE LIFT IT FOR EVERYBODY. 
          WELL, IT, NO, YOU COULD ADD AN AREA THAT'S ACCEPTED FROM THE MORATORIUM. 
          OKAY. 
          GLEN, MR. BUT IT WOULD REQUIRE AN AMENDMENT OF TOWN CODE. 
          WHAT IF WE DID A BOUNDARY ADJUSTMENT THAT BECAME PART OF TOWN? THE MORATORIUM NEVER. 
          WELL, I THINK THAT WOULD BE DRIVEN BY THE APPLICANT'S WISHES. 
          THEY WOULD BE INTERESTED IF THAT WAS AN OPTION. 
          YEAH. 
          BUT NOW LET'S REMEMBER THAT IF SOMETHING LIKE THAT HAPPENS, THEN WE PROVIDE WATER AND SEWER AND WE, UM, WE PROVIDE WATER AND SEWER. 
          WE CONTROL THE SIDE PLAN. 
          YEAH, TRUE. 
          THERE'D BE NO TAX REVENUE, RIGHT? NO. 
          WELL, THERE WOULDN'T BE ANY TAX REVENUE AND THE WATER WOULD BE AT, YOU KNOW, OBVIOUSLY A REDUCED RATE. 
          UM, SO, YOU KNOW, I, I JUST WANNA MAKE SURE, 'CAUSE THIS IS SUCH AN AN, AN, UM, A DIFFERENT THING TO COME BEFORE COUNCIL, OR AT LEAST IN MY FOUR YEARS, VERY UNIQUE. 
          ANY, ANY BOUNDARY ADJUSTMENT HASN'T COME BEFORE US. 
          UM, AND I BELIEVE AFTER WE, UM, AFTER THE LAST TIME WE MET, WE ALSO FOUND OUT THERE OTHER PROPERTIES ON THAT STREET. 
          MM-HMM. 
           THAT ARE AL THEY'RE NOT, WE DIDN'T BOUNDARY ADJUST FOR THEM. 
          THEY'RE PAYING THE, UM, DOUBLE, UM, THANK YOU. 
          I WAS GONNA SAY, I, I KNEW, I REMEMBER I COULD PULL UP THE EMAIL, BUT SINCE YOU ACTUALLY HAVE IT THERE. 
          SO, UM, THIS IS ON, UH, BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENTS, THE THREE PRIMARY STATUTES IN STATE LAW THAT ADDRESS A BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENT. 
          OH, I THOUGHT YOU, I THOUGHT, AND I COULD LOOK IT UP, BUT THERE, THE DIFFERENT, WE ASKED A DIFFERENT TIME ABOUT. 
          SO IT SOUNDS LIKE THE ONLY PLACE THAT'S OUT THERE THAT IS NOT PAYING DOUBLE WATER IS THE SCHOOL, CORRECT. 
          ISLAND HOSPITAL. 
          THAT'S IT. 
          EVERY, EVERYTHING ELSE OUT ON THAT END. 
          NORTHWESTERN PUBLIC SAFETY, NORTHWESTERN THE NURSING HOME, UH, MASONIC LODGE, MASON, ALL OF THAT, RIGHT? YES. 
          SO, YES. 
          BUT AGAIN, IT'S, THAT'S A SMART THING TO DO. 
          WE'RE SITTING HERE TALKING ABOUT THE SAFETY IMPROVEMENTS UPON ER ROAD AND WE HAVE MORE CONTROL OVER ANY OF THE PROPERTY IN OUR PROPERTY LINE. 
          MR. WASH. 
          YOU'D HAVE TO EXPLAIN, ISN'T THE PROPERTY LINE LITERALLY THE SOUTHWEST SIDE OF CRO ROAD? ALL? SO WE CAN EITHER PLAN FOR THE FUTURE HERE AND DO SOMETHING AND, AND, AND START WHAT I'VE HEARD ABOUT MAY I FINISH? GO AHEAD. 
          GO AHEAD. 
          SO BEFORE WE POO POO THIS AND SAY, WELL, WE DON'T WANT A LITTLE BLOCK OF THIS. 
          HAD THE COUNCIL HAD 
          [01:50:01]
THE FORESIGHT TO INCORPORATE THESE OTHER PROPERTIES, THEN WE WOULDN'T BE HAVING THE RIGHT OF WAY ISSUE COMING UP AS WE WANT TO DO A SAFETY IMPROVEMENT FOR OUR CHILDREN. 
          YOU MEAN THE SIDEWALK? YES. 
          WELL, I MEAN, YEAH. 
          YEP. 
          YEP. 
          DOES THE TOWN DOWN TO PUT, I JUST WANTED TO NOTE FOR THE RECORD, FOR THE PEOPLE HERE, FOR THE PEOPLE WATCHING AT HOME, THAT THAT SIDEWALK PROJECT WAS IN EFFECT BEFORE THIS BOUNDARY ADJUSTMENT EVER CAME FORWARD. 
          UM, TOWN MANAGER WA UH, OUR GREAT FINANCE, ME AND BJ, WE, THIS WAS ALREADY UNDER WORKS WITH OR WITHOUT THIS PROPERTY. 
          SO IT'S NOT HALTING IF WE HAVE TO GET A RIGHT AWAY, UM, WE CAN'T REQUIRE THEM TO PROFFER A SIDEWALK. 
          UM, IT'S NOT ADDING ANY TAX REVENUE INTO THE TOWN'S TAX BASE TO PAY FOR THEIR PORTION OF THE SIDEWALK. 
          SO I DO JUST WANNA REITERATE THAT NOW, 4,000 GALLONS OF WATER A DAY, DOUBLE THE RATE, YOU KNOW, THAT MIGHT PAY FOR SOME OF THE SIDEWALK. 
          YEAH. 
          BUT, BUT MY RESPONSE TO THAT WOULD BE, YES, THE SIDEWALK PROJECT'S BEEN PLANNED. 
          WE'RE SETTING ASIDE MONEY NOW. 
          DO WE WANT ALL THE TAXPAYERS THE FRONT ROW TO PAY FOR IT ALL? OR DO WE WANT EACH PROPERTY ALONG THERE TO CONTRIBUTE TO IT? I THINK THEIR WATER RATE WOULD CONTRIBUTE TO IT. 
          BUT WOULDN'T THE, CORRECT ME IF I'M WRONG, THE WATER, THE WATER RATE THAT WOULD ACTUALLY GO INTO THE ENTERPRISE FUNDS. 
          WE COULDN'T USE, WE COULDN'T USE ANY OF THAT TOWARDS A SIDEWALK PROJECT. 
          I MEAN RIGHT. 
          I JUST, BUT HOW MUCH MONEY ARE WE ADDING TO ENTERPRISE FUNDS FOR, UM, THE INFRASTRUCTURE UPGRADES THAT WE'RE MAKING TO WATER AND SEWER IMPROVEMENTS IN THE LAST FOUR YEARS VERSUS SIDEWALKS? LIKE HOW MUCH OF THE BUDGET HAVE WE CONTRIBUTED TO THE ENTERPRISE FUND? WELL, THE ENTERPRISE FUNDS COMES OUT OF THE FEES, BUT THE YEAH, THE ENTIRELY PEOPLE PAY. 
          MM-HMM. 
          YES. 
          ENTIRELY. 
          YEAH. 
          GENERAL FUND IS THE, IS GENERAL FUND. 
          WHICH WERE INCREASING SEWER RATES TOO THOUGH. 
          RIGHT. 
          BUT ALL OF THAT, ALL OF THAT. 
          EVEN, UH, WHAT, UH, JOSH, THE GENTLEMAN THAT WAS HERE EARLIER, ALL FEES FOR REFUGE WOULD GO INTO THAT. 
          ALL OF THE ENTERPRISE FUNDS. 
          YEAH. 
          THEY'RE SELF-SUFFICIENT. 
          EACH ONE OF OUR ENTERPRISE FUNDS ARE SELF-SUFFICIENT. 
          RIGHT. 
          GENERAL FUND HAS THE ABILITY TO CONTRIBUTE TO ENTERPRISE FUNDS, BUT YOU CAN'T GO VICE VERSA. 
          RIGHT. 
          WHICH ONE OF THE OTHER THINGS IS WITH THE ENTERPRISE FUNDS. 
          WE HAVE A WATER AGREEMENT WITH OTHER PEOPLE WHO DIDN'T GET A BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENT, WHO HAVE SINCE RENEGOTIATED UNKNOWINGLY TO THE TOWN'S BEHALF FOR THEIR WATER, UH, CONSUMPTION, WHICH HAS IRRE IRREFUTABLY DAMAGED, UM, EXPECTED REVENUE FOR WATER FOR THE TOWN. 
          THAT'S NO ARGUMENT IN THE CORRIDOR. 
          WE'RE LOSING REVENUE THAT WAS EXPECTED TO BE GENERATED IN THE CORRIDOR FOR A WATER AGREEMENT THAT WE CAN'T DISCUSS. 
          AND SO WE'RE INCREASING OUR SEWER RATES, WHICH HAS BEEN NEEDING TO BE INCREASED. 
          I MEAN, I DO THINK THERE'S AN OFFSET STILL HERE, DESPITE WHICH PART OF THE BUDGET IT COMES OUT OF. 
          UM, I JUST DON'T SEE WHERE WE COULD GUARANTEE BY DOING A BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENT THAT THEY'RE GONNA CONTRIBUTE TO A SIDEWALK. 
          WELL, WE CONTROL THE SITE PLAN AT THAT POINT. 
          AND ONCE IT'S UNDER THE TOWN'S CONTROL, WE CONTROL THE REZONING OF THE PROPERTY FROM AGRICULTURAL TO WHATEVER CHURCH FALLS UNDER AND WE CAN APPROVE OR DISAPPROVE THE SITE PLAN. 
          DOES THE SITE PLAN, UM, 'CAUSE I, I'M NOT A PLANNING, I'VE NEVER BEEN A PLANNING COMMISSION MEMBER. 
          BUT DOES THE SITE PLAN, ARE YOU SUGGESTING, I'M JUST ASKING, ARE YOU SUGGESTING THAT WE COULD REQUIRE A SIDEWALK BE PART OF THEIR SITE PLAN? YOU'RE SUGGESTING EXACTLY THAT, THAT, SO YOU COULD REQUIRE THAT. 
          RIGHT. 
          OKAY, MR. SONNET, UM, ACTUALLY MY UNDERSTANDING WAS AFTER WE VOTED ON A REZONING APPLICATION, THE SITE PLANS ONLY WENT BEFORE THE PLANNING AND ZONING DIRECTOR COUNSEL HAS NO FURTHER SAY, SO CAN WE REQUIRE A SITE PLAN TO INCLUDE A PUBLIC ACCESS SIDEWALK? WELL, WE, I THINK THIS CAME UP LAST TIME AND LAUREN CHIMED IN AND SAID SIDEWALKS ARE AN ISSUE FOR THE SITE PLAN APPROVAL. 
          IF, IF SIDEWALKS ARE REQUIRED AND CURB AND GUTTER IS REQUIRED AS PART OF SITE PLAN APPROVAL. 
          I THINK LAUREN CONFIRMED THAT. 
          SO WE CAN REQUIRE IT OF THAT PROPERTY. 
          BUT NO OTHER PROPERTY. 
          NO CROSS. 
          RIGHT. 
          BUT THE REASON YOU ASK THE QUESTION, THE REZONING IS AFTER WE VOTE ON THAT, WE DON'T VOTE ON THE SITE PLAN. 
          CHURCHES ARE ALLOWED IN RESIDENTIAL, BUT IT'S AGRICULTURAL. 
          OH, TRUE. 
          BOUNDARY ADJUSTMENT WOULD COME IN AS AG. 
          SO HALF OF YOU REZONED DON'T BE A SITE PLAN. 
          THE SITE PLAN WOULD, WOULD INCLUDE THE SIDE PRE CARBON GOVERNOR. 
          I THINK CHURCHES ARE ALLOWED IN EVERY ZONE. 
          EVERY THEY ARE ZONING DISTRICT. 
          I THINK I READ 
          [01:55:01]
THAT SOMEWHERE THE ANY ZONE LIKE THEY COULD. 
          AND AFTER WE VOTED ON A REZONING THOUGH, COUNCIL IS REMOVED FROM THE SITE PLAN PROCESS. 
          AND THAT'S WHAT LORI ASKED AGAIN, TO REITERATE. 
          WE COULD REQUIRE IT OF THEM BECAUSE OF THEIR USE. 
          BUT WE CAN'T REQUIRE THAT OF ANY OTHER COMMERCIAL OR BUSINESS PROPERTY OWNER THAT WERE TO BUILD. 
          WE COULDN'T REQUIRE THEM UNLESS WE CAN REQUIRE CURB AND GUTTER. 
          YEAH. 
          BUT WE CAN'T REQUIRE SIDEWALK. 
          YOU CAN'T REQUIRE PEOPLE TO PUT A SIDEWALK IN. 
          'CAUSE WE HAD THIS CONVERSATION ABOUT CURB AND GUTTER FOR A DIFFERENT REASON. 
          UM, ANYWAY, UH, WHAT MR. WA, AT THIS POINT YOU NEED DIRECTION IS THAT, AT THIS, AT THIS POINT, DO YOU NEED DIRECTION AS TO WHICH WAY WE WANT TO, WHAT, WHAT COUNSEL IS? I MEAN, WE CAN'T TAKE ACTION, BUT ARE YOU LOOKING FOR DIRECTION, LIKE WHETHER OR NOT WE WANT, WHAT, WHETHER OR NOT THERE'S A CONSENSUS TO ENTERTAIN A BOUNDARY ADJUSTMENT OR A CONSENSUS TO, UH, TO NOT ADJUST BOUNDARY? WHAT IS IT THAT YOU WOULD LIKE FROM US? UH, THE WAY I READ THE CODE, UM, THE WAY THE CODE, UM, SPELLS OUT THAT COUNCIL FIRST CONSIDERS A BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENT. 
          'CAUSE IF YOU DO A BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENT, THEN YOU WOULD BE REQUIRED TO PROVIDE WATER AND SEWER. 
          IF COUNCIL DOESN'T WANT TO ENTERTAIN OR SUGGEST A BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENT, THEN THE COUNSEL WOULD HAVE THAT DECISION TO DECIDE IF THEY WANTED TO PROVIDE WATER, UH, OUT OF TOWN. 
          THAT DECISION DOESN'T NEED TO BE MADE TONIGHT. 
          BUT WE DO NEED THE APPLICANT. 
          I DON'T KNOW WHAT THEIR TIMELINE IS, BUT AT SOME POINT WE WILL NEED TO MAKE A DECISION. 
          AND I, IN MY OPINION, AS FAR AS THE BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENT, AND THEN IF WE DO NOT RECOMMEND A BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENT, THEN DO WE PROVIDE WATER OUT OF TOWN? WELL, YOU BROUGHT UP A GOOD POINT EARLIER, JOE. 
          YOU SAID THE APPLICANT RIGHT NOW IS ASKING, IS THE APPLICATION NOW IS ASKING FOR OUT OF TOWN WATER? CORRECT? CORRECT. 
          OKAY. 
          THEN AGAIN, THAT REQUIRES A CODED, WE DON'T HAVE, WE DON'T HAVE, IT REQUIRES A CODE AMENDMENT. 
          RIGHT. 
          YEAH, I UNDERSTAND. 
          YEAH. 
          THE MORE IMPORTANT HAS TO, HAS TO BE ADDED. 
          WHICH ALL WE HAVE TO DO IS ADD A, A LINE IN THERE FOR SAME AS WE DID FOR NORTHERN COURT. 
          I I GET THAT. 
          SO I'M JUST ASKING LIKE WHAT THE APPLICANT'S ASKING FOR RIGHT NOW IN WRITING BEING PRESENTED TO US TO ASK. 
          SO WE'RE BEING ASKED TO ADD WATER OUTSIDE OF TOWN. 
          I DON'T EITHER. 
          I THINK I, MY TAKE IS ON IT. 
          IF THAT'S WHAT THE APPLICANT'S ASKING FOR. 
          LET'S ANSWER THAT QUESTION. 
          YES. 
          I BELIEVE THE A CAN WE BRING HER BACK UP HERE? I'M NOT, SHE'S THE APPLICANT. 
          SHE'S THE ENGINEER. 
          BUT, BUT, BUT SHE MADE A COMMENT ON WATER. 
          THE APPLICANT REPRESENTATIVE. 
          YES. 
          YES. 
          YES, YOU ARE. 
          AND WHAT DID YOU SAY ABOUT, YOU WOULD BE AGREEABLE TO A BOUNDARY ADJUSTMENT. 
          DIDN'T YOU SAY THEY, THEY HAD ASKED IF AN ANNEX INTO THE TOWN WOULD BE A POSSIBILITY AND OR COULD THEY GET OUT OF TOWN WATER AND SEWER? I DON'T THINK THEY WOULD BE OPPOSED TO EITHER. 
          BASICALLY THEY JUST WANNA BE ABLE TO GET WATER. 
          THAT DOESN'T INVOLVE A WELL, RIGHT. 
          IT'S A, I MEAN THAT'S, WHEN YOU SAY WHEN, IF YOU'RE SAYING THEY WOULD ENTERTAIN EITHER ONE OF THOSE WITH THE END RESULT BEING THEY WOULD LIKE TO BE ABLE TO GET WATER PROVIDED BY THE TOWN IS THE END RESULT. 
          AM I INTERPRET MARISSA INTERPRETING IT THAT WAY? YES. 
          THAT'S, THAT IS THEIR INITIAL THOUGHT IS THAT YES, THEY WOULD, THEY WOULD PREFER TO BE ON PUBLIC WATER AND SEWER. 
          RIGHT. 
          IF THEY CANNOT, THEN THEY WILL NOT. 
          THEY WILL STILL BE SATISFIED. 
          I, THAT'S HOW I INTERPRETED IT AS WELL. 
          THEY WERE WILLING TO DO WHATEVER THEY HAD TO DO. 
          I THINK JOSH'S POINT WAS, WE HAD THIS CONVERSATION LAST MONDAY AND THE TOWN MANAGER, TOWN ATTORNEY CHIMED IN. 
          WE DISCUSSED THE APPLICATION THAT'S BEFORE US HERE TONIGHT IN OUR AGENDA PACKET. 
          AND THAT'S NOT WHAT THE APPLICATION BEFORE US HERE TONIGHT WAS. 
          SO, UM, I MEAN, YEAH, WE HAVE THE OPTION TO DO EITHER ONE, BUT WE HAVE TO GO BACK AND TELL THE APPLICANT THAT WE'RE WILLING TO DO THAT EVEN WITHOUT A REQUEST TO DO SO. 
          IT JUST SEEMED LIKE THE CART BEFORE THE HORSE. 
          BUT SAYS THE TOWN RECEIVED A REQUEST FOR WATER AND SEWER CONNECTION FROM WARREN COUNTY AND CATHOLIC DIOCESE OF ARLINGTON FOR ZERO CRE ROOT, WHICH LOCATED OUTSIDE THE COURT FOR LIMITS TOWN CODE ADDRESSES THE EXTENSION WATER AND SEWER SERVICE. 
          UM, AND THEN IT TALKS ABOUT THE TOWN CODE STATES THAT THE TOWN COUNCIL WILL DECIDE ON A CASE BY CASE BASIS WHETHER TO PROVIDE WATER AND SEWER TO THE PROPOSED PROPERTIES AS WELL AS WHETHER A BOUNDARY ADJUSTMENT IS APPROPRIATE. 
          WHAT MR. WALTZ IS SAYING IS IT WOULD REQUIRE A BOUNDARY ADJUSTMENT OR WE WOULD, WE COULD AGREE TO PROVIDE THEM WATER OR WE COULD AGREE TO NOTHING THERE. 
          THOSE ARE OUR THREE CHOICES. 
          AND YOU'RE SAYING WE DON'T HAVE TO MAKE THE DECISION TONIGHT. 
          HOWEVER, IF COUNSEL IS, IF COUNSEL'S LEANING TOWARDS A CERTAIN WAY, I'M SURE THEY'D BE JUST AS HAPPY, ESPECIALLY SINCE THEY'RE GOING TO WARREN COUNTY'S PLANNING 
          [02:00:01]
COMMISSION ON WEDNESDAY NIGHT. 
          'CAUSE IT SAYS IT'S A REQUEST FROM, I I DON'T, IT'S A REQUEST FROM BOTH WARREN COUNTY AND THE CATHOLIC DIOCESE. 
          RIGHT. 
          AND TECHNICALLY WE WOULD'VE, IF THEY WANTED TO DO A BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENT, WE WOULD'VE GOTTEN THAT INDICATION FROM THE COUNTY WITH THIS REQUEST RECOMMENDING A BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENT. 
          OKAY. 
          SEE, THAT'S, THAT'S WHAT I'M SAYING. 
          I'D RATHER HAVE SOMETHING IN WRITING IF THAT'S WHAT THEY REALLY WANTED ALL ALONG TO, TO HAVE THAT TRAIL OF WHAT THEY REALLY WANT. 
          BECAUSE AGAIN, I DON'T, I'M SITTING HERE GIVING CONSENSUS. 
          I DON'T YEAH. 
          I JUST, TO ME IT'S, IT'S, WE'RE TELLING AN APPLICANT WHAT TO DO. 
          YOU KNOW, WHEN, WHEN WE HAVE A CLEAN APP, WE HAVE A CLEAN APPLICATION RIGHT NOW WITH WHAT THEY'RE WANTING. 
          THEY HAVE A CLEAR INDICATION OF WHAT THEY'RE LOOKING FOR. 
          I JUST, I JUST DON'T WANNA MARK THAT UP. 
          THAT'S, THAT'S ALL. 
          COUNCILMAN A MORATORIUM. 
          MM-HMM. 
          . 
          WE HAVE AN APP THAT CAN, THAT WOULD LIKE OUR SERVICES BY INCORPORATING THEM INTO THE TOWN. 
          THEY GET WHAT THEY WANT. 
          THE TOWN CITIZENS WILL SAVE MONEY ON ROAD IMPROVEMENTS FOR WHATEVER THAT ROAD FRONTAGE IS. 
          I'M NOT SURE WHAT THE OPPOSITION IS TO THAT. 
          UH, I'M NOT COUNSEL, BUT I'M NOT CONVINCED THAT THE TOWN SYSTEMS ARE GONNA SAVE MONEY ON ROAD IMPROVEMENTS FROM THERE. 
          BUT IF BY JUST CREATING THE SIDEWALK. 
          BUT I COULD BE WRONG. 
          UM, BUT ANYWAY, I, IF THEY'RE PAYING, YEAH. 
          BUT IF THEY'RE, IF THEY'RE PAYING DOUBLE WATER, THAT'S ONE THING. 
          BUT IF THEY'RE GONNA PAY THE SAME WATER AND THERE'S NO TAX REVENUE, I DON'T. 
          BUT ANYWAY, MR. WAT, MR. SO YOU HAD YOUR HAND RAISED THAT I CALLED ON MR. WOOD FIRST ON THE, UH, AG ZONE. 
          UM, CHURCHES ARE BY SPECIAL USE, NOT BY RIGHT. 
          BUT, BUT IT WOULDN'T BE A REZONE, IT WOULD BE A SPECIAL USE. 
          SO IF EVER IT WEREN'T A CHURCH, IT WOULD DEFAULT BACK TO AG. 
          I'M SORRY. 
          IF EVER IT WEREN'T A CHURCH IN USE IN THAT SPACE, IT WOULD DEFAULT BACK TO AGRICULTURE. 
          WELL, IT WOULD STAY AGRICULTURE. 
          RIGHT. 
          BUT I'M SAYING LIKE, IF THE CHURCH SHUT DOWN AND ABANDONED IT, IT WOULD BE ANY, ANYTIME THERE'D BE A CHANGE OF USE HERE. 
          RIGHT. 
          YOU WANNA SEE, DO YOU NEED A CONSENSUS TONIGHT OR I MEAN 'CAUSE HERE'S THE THING IS IF WE DON'T, IF WE DON'T GET A CONSENSUS TONIGHT, AND I'M FINE, PEOPLE CAN WAIT. 
          BUT IT WON'T BE HAPPENING ON THE 22ND. 
          'CAUSE IT'S NOT GONNA GO TO ACTION THEN. 
          SO THEN WE WOULDN'T BRING IT BACK TO ANOTHER PUBLIC HEARING, ANN UNTIL LIKE FEBRUARY 5TH, WHATEVER THAT DATE IS, THAT MONDAY. 
          SO, UM, I, I GUESS I'M REALLY LOOKING FROM STAFF. 
          LIKE WHAT, WHAT TIMEFRAME ARE YOU LOOKING HERE FOR? OR ARE YOU, I MEAN, IS COUNCIL READY TO SAY WHAT? I MEAN, I KNOW A FEW PEOPLE ARE, BUT I DON'T KNOW HOW EVERYBODY ELSE IS READY TO SAY YES OR NO. 
          OR, OR, YEAH. 
          UM, MY THOUGHT MOVING FORWARD IS THAT IF COUNSEL WANTED TO ENTERTAIN A BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENT, THEY WOULD, WE WOULD HAVE TO PROVIDE THE COUNTY WITH OUR DESIRE TO DO A BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENT IN SOME FASHION. 
          RIGHT. 
          GEORGE, IN SOME FASHION PROBABLY, WHICH WOULD ALSO INVOLVE PUBLIC HEARING TO CHANGE THE, WE DON'T SAY, HEY, WE WANT THAT LAND IN THERE TRIGGERED BY YEAH. 
          WE ALREADY DECIDED RESOLUTION AND WE'D ALSO HAVE TO OUT A PUBLIC HEARING. 
          RIGHT. 
          UM, NOT AT WHAT TO CHANGE THE, NO, WE DON'T HAVE TO CHANGE THAT. 
          OKAY. 
          WE GOT TWO DIFFERENT THINGS HERE. 
          OKAY. 
          SO TO SERVE OUT OF TOWN COUNSEL WOULD HAVE TO AMEND 1 34 DASH 1D TO, UH, TREAT THIS AREA AS AN EXCEPTION TO THE MORATORIUM. 
          OKAY. 
          WHICH REQUIRES A PUBLIC HEARING, A BOUNDARY ADJUSTMENT, THE PROCESSES IN WHAT WAS CIRCULATED. 
          SO, UM, THERE WOULD HAVE TO BE SOME SORT OF REQUEST TO THE COUNTY, WHETHER OR NOT THEY'RE ON BOARD. 
          'CAUSE IT, IT WOULDN'T, YOU'D WANNA DO IT BY AGREEMENT, NOT, NOT HAVE A CONTENTIOUS SITUATION, WHICH IS WHAT THESE STATUTES ENVISION ALL BY AGREEMENT. 
          SO IS THAT TRIGGERED BY THE COUNSEL'S REQUEST OR THE APPLICANT? UM, I THINK, I THINK A RESOLUTION BY COUNSEL WOULD INDICATE COUNSEL'S POSITION AND, AND, AND ALLOW IT TO GO FORWARD THAT WAY. 
          A RESOLUTION TO THE EFFECT THAT THE TOWN IS, UH, PREPARED TO, OF COURSE SUPPLY THE UTILITIES, PROVIDED ITS BOUNDARY ADJUSTED INTO THE TOWN. 
          IS THERE A FEE ASSOCIATED ONCE WE, IF WE DID THE BOUNDARY ADJUSTMENT REQUEST? IS THERE, IS, IS THERE A FEE THAT ANYBODY PAYS IN THAT PROCESS? THERE'S NO FEE 
          [02:05:01]
THAT I'M AWARE OF. 
           WOULD ANY OF THE OTHER BUSINESSES, WOULD ANY OTHER OF THE, WOULD ANY OF THE OTHER, UM, WELL, THERE'D BE A PLACES ON THAT ROAD. 
          WOULD ANY OF THOSE OTHER PLACES THAT ARE NOW PAYING DOUBLE WATER, WOULD THEY, WOULD THIS GIVE THEM THE, UM, WOULD THIS GIVE THEM THE ARGUMENT TO THEN COME BACK AND ASK FOR THEIRS TO BE BOUNDARY ADJUSTED AS WELL? WELL, ANYONE COULD TO ADJUST THE BOUNDARY OF THE OTHER BUSINESS. 
          ANYONE PURSUE A BOUNDARY? OKAY. 
          I'M JUST SAYING THE OTHER ONES THAT ARE LIKE, WOULD BE RIGHT UP THE ROAD FROM THEM THAT ARE NOW PAYING DOUBLE WATER, THEN THEY COULD THEN COME AND WITH THE ARGUMENT OF WELL THEN WE, THEN WE WOULD LIKE TO, AND WE DEFINITELY WOULDN'T BE ABLE TO CONTROL A SITE PLAN THERE. 
          'CAUSE THE SITE ALREADY EXISTS. 
          THAT'S MY THING. 
          ARE WE RELYING UPON THOSE FUNDS? I MEAN, BEYOND THE SERVICE THAT'S BEING PROVIDED? WHAT DO YOU MEAN? WELL, I MEAN, LIKE, WE'RE, WE'RE CHARGING FOLKS WATER FEES, RIGHT? SO FOR THE FOLKS WHO ARE PAYING DOUBLE, WHERE DOES THAT DOUBLE MONEY GO RIGHT NOW? IT GOES INTO ENTERPRISE FUND, BUT IF THEY WERE TO BE BOUNDARY AND ADJUSTED THE END, WE WOULD GET, UH, REVENUE PERSONAL PROPERTY TAX. 
          REAL ESTATE TAX. 
          OH, OKAY. 
          THE OTHER PLACE THEM NOT, NOT THE CHURCH. 
          I KNOW, RIGHT? SO IT'S LIKE SCHOOLS TOO. 
          SCHOOLS TOO. 
          SCHOOLS, SCHOOLS ARE EXEMPT. 
          SO 'CAUSE THAT'S WHAT NORTHWESTERN IS. 
          NORTHWESTERN THAT'S A GOOD QUESTION. 
          THERE'S PART OF TWO IN THERE. 
          THERE'S TWO SCHOOLS IN THERE. 
          YEAH. 
          THERE'S TWO SCHOOLS IN THAT AREA. 
          IN THAT, IN THAT BUILDING SCHOOL SYSTEM USES IT AS WELL. 
          I I JUST THINK IT'S CLEAN'S NOT THE NURSING WHAT THEY GOT RIGHT NOW, BUT WHAT THEY'RE APPLYING IF, IF THE, IF THE APPLICATION SEEMS LIKE IT'S CLEAN RIGHT NOW AS IT IS. 
          I MEAN, I I DID A LOT OF THOUGHT FOR THIS. 
          I MEAN, I, I TOO, IT, I BROUGHT IT UP LAST WEEK. 
          YOU KNOW, WE'RE GOING, WE TALKED ABOUT IT, ABOUT THE IDEA OF THE SIDEWALK. 
          BUT IF IT'S GONNA INVOLVE A LOT MORE RED TAPE OR I THINK ANY AMOUNT OF RED TAPE FOR, FOR THE APPLICANT TO GO THROUGH FOR A BOUNDARY ADJUSTMENT, WHICH IT SOUNDS LIKE IT'S GOING TO BE, YEAH, I WOULD JUST SAY LET'S GO WITH THE APPLICATION AS IT IS AND, AND LET THEM GET, YOU KNOW, LET THEM GET THE WATER AS PART OF THE COUNTY. 
          YOU KNOW, AS, AS IS THIS, LET, LET'S SAY WE AS A COUNCIL, I THINK THAT'S MY TAKEAWAY. 
          WE SHOULD MAKE  WELL CAN YOU CLARIFY PART OF THE COUNTY? WELL, I MEAN, NO, JUST RIGHT NOW THEY'RE ASKING FOR WATER, BUT THERE'S NO, RIGHT NOW THERE'S NO WRITTEN INDICATION THAT THEY WANT A BOUNDARY ADJUSTMENT. 
          THE COUNTY NEVER SENT ANYTHING IN FOR THAT. 
          RIGHT. 
          SO RIGHT NOW IT'S ALL JUST, WE'RE JUST TALKING RIGHT NOW ABOUT A BOUNDARY ADJUSTMENT. 
          SO WE WOULD, I MEAN I JUST, IT'S GONNA CREATE MORE RED TAPE FOR THEM TO, TO GO DO ALL THAT. 
          I THOUGHT THEY DID REQUEST IT LAST IN THOSE STUFF THAT WE HAD LAST WEEK. 
          NO, NO, IT DIDN'T. 
          THERE'S NOTHING IN THERE TO REQUEST A BOUNDARY ADJUSTMENT. 
          IT WAS JUST A TALK. 
          WE JUST HAD, IT WAS A DISCUSSION, WHICH IS WHAT WE'RE HERE FOR, YOU KNOW. 
          BUT HAVING LOOKED OVER IT AGAIN, YOU KNOW, WHAT I'VE LEARNED TONIGHT AND JUST WHAT I'VE RESEARCH I'VE DONE, IT'S, TO ME IT JUST, IT WOULD JUST SEEM SIMPLER FOR THE APPLICANT TO LET THEM GET THEIR, LEAVE THEM IN THE COUNTY, LET THEM GET OUR WATER AND LEAVE IT AT THAT. 
          YOU KNOW, THAT'S WHAT I THINK THE SIMPLE, I THINK THAT'S GONNA BE THE QUICKEST THING FOR THEM TO DO. 
          BECAUSE AS WE KNOW, THIS COULD EASILY GO FROM A QUICK DECISION BY US ADDING TO THE MORATORIUM THAT ONE LINE FOR THEM. 
          OR THIS COULD GO INTO SEVERAL MONTHS OF BACK AND FORTH ABOUT NITPICKING HERE AND THERE AND THERE BETWEEN US AND THE COUNTY OR WHOEVER, YOU KNOW, WHATEVER. 
          MM-HMM. 
          PARTIES. 
          MM-HMM. 
          I'M JUST, I'M BEING DEVIL'S ADVOCATE, BUT I'M THINK I'M BEING REALISTIC HERE. 
          SO, YOU KNOW, THE FACT THAT THERE'S NO TAX BENEFIT, UH, IT MAKES IT HARD TO JUSTIFY YEAH. 
          ON A SMALL PARCEL LIKE THIS, SAY 8.4 ACRES, SO DOES SAID THAT THE HOUSEHOLD TRASH SO THAT THERE WOULD BE DUMPSTERS. 
          I DIDN'T WANT POINT THAT OUT. 
          SO I WAS LOOKING DOWN, I WAS LIKE, THAT WON'T CHANGE ANYTHING. 
          THAT'S OUR, ALRIGHT. 
          THAT'S OUR SERVICE TERRITORY. 
          ELECTRIC IS NOT CORPORATE. 
          SO BASICALLY ALL OF OUR SERVICES, POLICE WOULD NOT HAVE TO RESPOND THERE. 
          THE BOUNDARY DOESN'T DO WELL. 
          WELL, YEAH, BUT WE'RE, WE'RE HEARING ADVOCATION ON TO DO, WELL THEY GOT THE SHERIFF'S DEPARTMENT NEXT DOOR. 
          I'M NOT WORRIED ABOUT THAT. 
          REALLY? WELL I'M AT A CHURCH. 
          I WOULDN'T BE WORRIED ABOUT IT ANYWAY, BUT NO, THAT  FUNERALS AND WEDDINGS SHOOT UHHUH. 
          YEAH, IF THERE'S ANY WEDDINGS ON THERE. 
          UM, 'CAUSE IT DIDN'T SHOW, WELL, I DON'T KNOW. 
          I GUESS IT'S GONNA BE AN OVERFLOW. 
          WE HAVE THE DESIGN FOR THE SIDEWALK THROUGH THERE, CORRECT? MM-HMM. 
           PRELIMINARY DESIGN. 
          WE HAVE PRELIMINARY. 
          WE HAVE, WE HAVE A RENDITION. 
          I REMEMBER SEEING THAT. 
          YEAH. 
          YEAH. 
          WE CAN GO THROUGH AND GET CONSENSUS 
          [02:10:01]
FROM WHOEVER OR WHATEVER Y'ALL WANNA DO. 
          I DON'T CARE. 
          I'VE SAID ENOUGH, BUT, UH, I JUST HAD QUESTIONS. 
          I DIDN'T REALIZE IT WAS OPPOSITION. 
          I THOUGHT IT WAS DUE DILIGENCE. 
          BUT I DO HAVE QUESTIONS FOR STAFF. 
          BUT, UM, I CAN STILL MAKE A DECISION TONIGHT IF IT'S ME THAT'S HOLDING THE OTHER, YOU KNOW, 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6 UP OR WE CAN PUT IT ON FEBRUARY 5TH. 
          I DON'T REALLY CARE, BUT I'M READY TO MOVE ON TO THE NEXT ITEM EITHER WAY. 
          SO I'LL GIVE Y'ALL MY OPINION YET AGAIN. 
          OR WE CAN PUT IT ON THE NEXT ONE. 
          I JUST WANT COUNSEL'S OR YOU ALL WANT IT, MAKE A DECISION TONIGHT OR DO YOU WANT TO WAIT UNTIL FEBRUARY 5TH AND TALK ABOUT IT THEN JUST GIMME A YAY OR NAY. 
          'CAUSE IT, WE TALK ABOUT WHAT THE, DO WE WANT TO MAKE A DECISION ABOUT WHAT WE WANNA DO, WHETHER WE WANNA DO A BOUNDARY ADJUSTMENT OR, OR NOT. 
          AND OR DO WE WANT TO BRING IT BACK ON FEBRUARY 5TH OR ANYBODY HAVE ANY, OKAY. 
          PJ, I GOT A QUESTION. 
          IF WE DO, IF WE DO A BOUNDARY ADJUSTMENT, IT CUTS THEIR COST OF WATER AND A HALF, RIGHT? MM-HMM. 
          . 
          WELL, NORMALLY IN TOWN RATES YEAH. 
          IT BREAKS IT IN HALF COMPARED TO DOUBLE. 
          YES. 
          AND THE SYSTEM DEVELOPMENT FEES. 
          YEAH. 
          SYSTEM DEVELOPMENT FEES AS WELL. 
          BUT IF THEY DON'T, IF THEY DON'T USE OVER 3000 GALLONS A MONTH, THEY DON'T, DON'T PAY, THEY DON'T PAY ANYTHING. 
          RIGHT. 
          YOU SAID THAT LAST TIME, LAST FOR 3000 GALLONS, THEY DON'T PAY FOR YEAH. 
          AS THE CHURCH FIRST 3000 GALLONS IS CREATED IN ANYWAY. 
          CORRECT. 
          IN DOWNWARD OUT. 
          MR. ROSS, YOU HAD YOUR HAND RAISED. 
          DID YOU WANT YEAH, I, UM, MY RECOMMENDATION WOULD BE BRINGING THIS BACK ON FEBRUARY 5TH, AND WE CAN COME IN WITH WHAT THE CODE CHANGES WOULD BE TO, TO FOR THE MORATORIUM. 
          AND I'M, YOU KNOW, AS FAR AS MOVING BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENT, I, I DON'T, I DON'T KNOW IF THAT DECISION NEEDS TO BE MADE TONIGHT OR NOT. 
          UM, I THINK IF YOU GO THE BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENT, YOU'RE, YOU'RE GONNA BE ADDING TIME TO THE PROCESS. 
          SO, UM, THE, THE, THE QUICKER RESOLUTION I THINK FOR THE CHURCH WOULD BE IN OUT OF TOWN. 
          UM, WHEN STAFF LOOKS AT IT AND THEY LOOK AT THE EXISTING CUSTOMER BASE OUT THERE THAT ARE ALREADY PAYING OUT OF TOWN, UM, YOU KNOW, WE WE'RE, IT'S, IT'S A LOT TO PROCESS BECAUSE THEN YOU THINK LORI MENTIONED IF THEY WANT A BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENT FOR THE OTHER PLACES OUT THERE THAT ARE ON THE SAME ROW AND CLOSE PROXIMITY, UM, YOU KNOW, THAT DOES THE SAME FOR THEM, BUT THERE'S ACTUALLY NO TAX REVENUE FOR ONE OF THOSE LARGE FACILITIES EITHER BECAUSE THEY HAVE TWO SCHOOLS INSIDE OF IT. 
          SO WHAT THE, THE THING ABOUT THIS IN FORWARD THINKING IS YOU HAVE TO, EVERY DECISION HAS CONSEQUENCES AND EVERY ACTION HAS REPERCUSSIONS. 
          SO I DON'T THINK HAVING A SECOND CONVERSATION ABOUT THIS AS BEING UNREASONABLE OR OPPOSED TO IT, I THINK TRYING TO UNDERSTAND AND DO THIS THE BEST WAY POSSIBLE, NOT ONLY FOR THE RESOURCES FOR THE TOWN, BUT ALSO FOR THE APPLICANT AND THE MOST EFFECTIVE, EFFICIENT WAY. 
          UH, THERE'S A LOT TO PROCESS HERE. 
          THIS IS A VERY UNIQUE SITUATION THAT, YOU KNOW, EVEN WHEN I WATCHED COUNCIL FOR YEARS BEFORE I RAN, I NEVER SAW THEM FACE. 
          SO, AND AS WE'VE LEARNED WITH OTHER BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENTS THAT WE'VE MADE IN ANNEXATIONS IN THE TOWN COUNTY, YOU KNOW, SOMETIMES WE DON'T GET STUCK WITH THE RIGHT END OF THE STICK. 
          SO TYPICALLY I I, I, I WOULD CONSIDER TAKING IT TO ANOTHER SESSION, BUT, UH, BECAUSE OF THE PROPERTY AND THE WAY THAT IT'S SITUATED, IT'S KIND OF LIKE BOXED IN AND I, YOU KNOW, IT'S THE PARK AND THE RIVER BEHIND YOU AND IT'S, AND EVERYONE BESIDE YOU IS IN THE COUNTY. 
          SO, UM, I'M, I'M LIKE LEANING TOWARD, UH, YOU KNOW, UH, FOLLOWING THE OUT OF TOWN OR WATER, DOUBLE WATER RATES. 
          THAT'S WHERE I'M AT WITH THIS. 
          OKAY. 
          IT'S, AND LOOK, WE CAN, OKAY, WE CAN TAKE IT TO FEBRUARY 5TH OR IT SOUNDS LIKE BRUCE IS GOING THAT WAY. 
          THAT'S THE WAY I WAS LEANING. 
          I WANTED TO TALK TO STAFF DESIGN PLANTS. 
          IT'S EIGHT ACRES. 
          I, MELISSA GLEN I KNOWS, EXPRESSED WHERE TOWARDS. 
          SO REALLY JUST ONE OTHER PERSON WOULD BE A CONSENSUS TO DECIDE ONE WAY OR THE OTHER. 
          SO, AND IF IT SAVES US FROM PUTTING IT BACK ON THE FEBRUARY 5TH AGENDA, THEN, YOU KNOW, I COMING BACK ON FEBRUARY 5TH. 
          BECAUSE EVEN IF YOU CHOOSE NOT TO DO A BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENT, WE'RE GONNA HAVE TO COME BACK TO DECIDE WHETHER OR NOT TO, TO MODIFY THE TOWN CODE FOR THE MORATORIUM TO ALLOW YOU TO PROVIDE THAT OUT OF TOWN WATER, WHICH WE THEN GO TO A PUBLIC HEARING. 
          WELL, IT'S REALLY THREE DECISIONS. 
          IT'S DO YOU WANNA DO BOUNDARY LINE ADJUSTMENT? DO YOU WANNA PROVIDE WATER AT ALL 
          [02:15:01]
OR DO YOU WANNA SAY WE'RE NOT PROVIDING ANY WATER SERVICES AND YOU'LL NEED TO DO A WELL AND SEPTIC COUNCILMAN WOULD WITH THE UPCOMING LIAISON MEETING, WOULD IT BE APPROPRIATE TO APPROACH THEM ABOUT A VOLUNTARY BOUNDARY ADJUSTMENT AND SEE IF THE COUNTY'S EVEN INTERESTED? WELL, IT DOESN'T SOUND LIKE THE COUNTY, WELL, I DON'T KNOW. 
          I WASN'T, LET ME, I DON'T WANNA SPEAK FOR IT. 
          MELISSA AND WAYNE, I NEVER REALLY HEARD FROM YOU ONE WAY OR THE OTHER. 
          BECAUSE IF COUNSEL THEMSELVES IS NOT INTERESTED IN A BOUNDARY ADJUSTMENT, THEN THAT WOULD DO YOU OR YOU DO YOU HAVE, I'M NOT TRYING TO PUT YOU ON THE SPOT, ALTHOUGH WE'VE BEEN TALKING ABOUT IT NOW TWO WEEKS, AND THIS IS ONE OF THOSE ONES WHERE, YOU KNOW, I IT WE CAN, WE CAN BRING IT UP AT THE LIAISON. 
          IF IT SOUNDS LIKE COUNSEL WANTS TO ENTERTAIN A BOUNDARY ADJUSTMENT. 
          I DON'T EVEN JUST GO THE OUT OF TOWN, IS IT? YEAH. 
          MY DECISION, IF I HAD MADE A DECISION, I'VE GOT TO SAY ON, ON, UM, EXTENDING OR EXTENDING THE BOUNDARY SO THAT THEY COULD GET THE REDUCED RATE, IT WOULD BE TOTALLY EMOTIONAL BECAUSE I'M THINKING IT'S A CHURCH OR WE'RE LIKE A NON-PROFIT. 
          I'D BE TOTALLY GOING ON THAT. 
          FROM THE FISCAL SIDE, THE THOUGHTFUL SIDE, IT'S, WE ARE NOT GETTING TAX REVENUE. 
          WE REALLY E EVEN THOUGH I KNOW THAT THEY'RE, THEY HAVE A, A PLAN FOR WHAT IT IS, WE REALLY DON'T KNOW WHAT, WHAT WILL HAPPEN DOWN THE ROAD. 
          UM, AND I THINK THAT IT WOULD PROBABLY BE BETTER IF WE DON'T DECIDE AT THIS TIME ON A BOUNDARY ADJUSTMENT IF THEY WANT TO IN THE FUTURE, MAYBE REQUEST ONE, THEN MAYBE ENTERTAIN IT AT THAT TIME. 
          UM, I'M THINKING FROM HEARING EVERYBODY'S ARGUMENTS THAT I WOULD GO WITH DISCUSSIONS. 
          I DO WANNA EXTEND THEM WATER. 
          I DO WANT EXTEND THEM WATER. 
          I WAS GONNA SAY, I THINK THE ENTIRE CONSENSUS IS WE ALL WANNA GET THE WATER, WHICH ACTUALLY IS PROBABLY WHAT THEY REALLY NEEDED THE ANSWER. 
          THEY'RE LOOKING FOR THE ANSWER. 
          ARE THEY GONNA TO PROVIDE THEM WATER? I DON'T, I WANT TO BE ABLE TO PROVIDE THEM TOWN WATER. 
          I THINK THAT THAT IS THE ONLY CAPACITY THAT WILL SERVE THEIR NEEDS. 
          BUT, AND I JUST HOPE THAT IT'S MORE THAN 3000 GALLONS BECAUSE OTHERWISE IT'S GONNA BE FREE WATER. 
          UH, WHICH, YOU KNOW, WE'LL, WE'LL, YOU KNOW, JUST COST FROM OTHER SYSTEMS. RIGHT. 
          SO, ALL RIGHT. 
          ANY, ANY, SO SOUNDS LIKE WE CAN COME BACK ON FEBRUARY 5TH TO DISCUSS PART TWO OF THIS CONVERSATION, BUT AT LEAST WE ANSWERED ONE QUESTION. 
          I THINK IT SOUNDED LIKE THERE WAS A CONSENSUS TO GO THAT WAY. 
          UM, YEAH. 
          AND I DON'T KNOW IF THAT CHANGES ANYTHING THAT'S GONNA, THEM TALKING TO THE PLANNING COMMISSION ON WEDNESDAY OR NOT. 
          I KNOW THEY'RE GONNA HAVE WATER, WE JUST DON'T KNOW WHICH WAY. 
          RIGHT. 
          YOU KNOW, ONE THING I DO WANNA ADD IS THE COUNTY HAS ASKED THAT WE PUT A SIDEWALK ALONG CRIES OF ROAD AND HAS AGREED TO IT WELL, HALLELUJAH. 
          SO THAT'S EVEN BETTER BEEN NICE. 
          YEAH, THAT WOULD BE NORMALLY YOU SHOULD NOT INTERRUPT. 
          I'LL SAY, I WISH YOU HAD BECAUSE THAT WAS, THAT MIGHT SAVED. 
          THEY ARE KEEPING THE COMMUNITY GUARD. 
          THAT'S ALL I WAS TRYING TO GET OUT OF IT. 
          RIGHT? YEAH. 
          DIDN'T I RAISED MY HAND? LIKE IF THAT COMES UP IN THE PLANNING AND THEY BACK OUT THE SIDEWALK, TELL 'EM WE MIGHT BACK OUT THE WATER . 
          YEAH, THAT'S A, THAT'S A GIVEN. 
          UM, JUST KIDDING. 
          I GET, I WILL GET WITH THEM AND SEE THEY, WHICH WAY THEY WANT GO. 
          WELL WE HAD ASKED THE COUNTY TO SPLIT THE COST PART OF THAT SIDEWALK. 
          SO THAT'S PROBABLY THE COUNTY'S PORTION OF THAT. 
          THAT'S GONNA BE BENEFICIAL. 
          THEY'RE GONNA HAVE AN ACTIVITIES THERE FOR ESPECIALLY USE SIDEWALK IS GOING BE ALRIGHT. 
          THANK YOU. 
          THANK YOU. 
          NICE MEETING YOU. 
          YOU TOO. 
          FIVE A WAS ABOUT THE CODE OF CONDUCT AND SO YOU ALL KNOW THAT, UM, I, I TOOK FEEDBACK FROM YOU ALL THIS PAST WEEK AND JUST TRIED, I TRIED TO INCORPORATE ANYTHING THAT ANYBODY GAVE ME THAT WAS SPECIFIC SO THAT IT STILL MADE SENSE. 
          WHAT YOU ALL HAVE IN FRONT OF YOU IS THE CROSS OUT TO WHERE, LIKE, FOR EXAMPLE, IN NUMBER ONE, WE GOT RID OF SHALL AND ADDED MUST. 
          UM, AND INSTEAD OF THE TOWN OF LIKE COUNCIL MEMBERS MUST COMPLY WITH THE LAWS OF THE NATION, THE COMMONWEALTH OF VIRGINIA AND THE CODE OF THE TOWN OF FRONT ROYAL MR. SONNET. 
          IS THAT HOW YOU WOULD SAY IT? OKAY. 
          WHICH ONE? NUMBER ONE. 
          NUMBER ONE. 
          NUMBER ONE I WOULD GO WITH SHALL . 
          YOU WOULD MM-HMM. 
          OKAY. 
          IN THE LEGAL WORLD, UH, SHALL AND MAY ARE THE TWO. 
          ALRIGHT, WELL, THE TWO UH, WORDS, I KNOW ALL, HOPEFULLY THE COUNCIL MEMBER WAS, I'LL PUT SHALL BACK IN THERE, CROSS OUT MUSS. 
          BUT WHAT I WAS ASKING IS 
          [02:20:01]
A, APART ABOUT THE PART THAT SAYS, AND THE CODE OF THE TOWN OF FRONT ROYAL 'CAUSE ITS COUNCIL MEMBERS SHALL COMPLY WITH THE LAWS OF THE NATION, THE COMMONWEALTH OF VIRGINIA AND THE CODE OF THE TOWN OF FRONT ROYAL AND THE PERFORMANCE OF THEIR POST DUTIES. 
          IS THAT OKAY? IT IS. 
          OKAY. 
          NUMBER TWO, THERE WAS SOME QUESTION AS TO LIKE TO DEFINE IMPROPER. 
          AND I WILL TELL YOU I LITERALLY SPENT 30 MINUTES ON THAT ONE TRYING TO FIGURE OUT, LIKE I WAS LOOKING UP EVERYWHERE I COULD FIND FOR LIKE, LIKE A SYNONYM FOR IMPROPER OR HOW TO, TO DEFINE IMPROPER. 
          BECAUSE I WILL SAY THAT IT WAS A, IT WAS A A GOOD POINT WHEN SOMEBODY SAID, MY DEFINITION OF IMPROPER MIGHT BE DIFFERENT THAN SOMEBODY ELSE'S DEFINITION OF IMPROPER. 
          SO WHEN I WAS RESEARCHING IT, THEY SAID THEY LIKE IMPROPER VERSUS INAPPROPRIATE CAME UP MULTIPLE TIMES, LIKE WHICH ONE WORKS. 
          AND SO THEY SAID THE INAPPROPRIATE IS MORE LINKED TO THE CONCEPT OF GOOD OR BAD BEHAVIOR AND IMPROPER CONCERNS. 
          THE IDEA OF CORRECT AND INCORRECT. 
          SO DO YOU ALL HAVE YEAH. 
          BELIEVE IT OR NOT, TRUST ME, I DID. 
          WELL THAT'S, NO, THAT'S FINE. 
          I, I JUST NEED TO KNOW WHAT'S CORRECT OR INCORRECT. 
          WELL, I KNOW. 
          WELL THAT'S WHY I THINK THAT'S WHY I THINK I LIKE GOOD AND BAD BETTER BECAUSE INAPPROPRIATE INFLUENCE. 
          WHO DEFINES THAT? YEAH. 
          WHO DOES DEFINE THAT? I MEAN, I, YOU KNOW, IT, IT, WELL, AND MY OTHER THOUGHT WHEN I WAS LOOKING AT IT IS, IS TO JUST LITERALLY TAKE OUT IT IT ALL AND SAY, COUNCIL MEMBERS SHOULD ACT WITH INTEGRITY AND INDEPENDENCE FROM INFLUENCE AS THEY EXERCISE THE DUTIES, LIKE TO TAKE OUT IMPROPER INAPPROPRIATE, UM, BECAUSE INDEPENDENCE FROM INFLUENCE. 
          BUT, YOU KNOW, THEN I STARTED THINKING TO MYSELF, BUT IT IS IN, THERE IS A CERTAIN AMOUNT OF INFLUENCE WHEN YOU GATHER INFORMATION FROM CITIZENS. 
          EXACTLY. 
          SO THAT'S WHY I THINK IT NEEDED TO BE, UH, UM, UM, SO, AND I DON'T THINK ANYBODY, LOOK, THIS IS FOR US AND THIS IS FOR OUR CITIZENS TO, YOU KNOW, TO, TO HAVE TRUST IN US. 
          SO, YOU KNOW, IF WE GO WITH THE WORD, WE CAN ALWAYS CHANGE THE WORD LATER. 
          IT DOESN'T HAVE TO BE THANK YOUR INTENTION. 
          AND THIS IS VERY WELL, I THINK THAT YOU'RE BEING VERY OPTIMISTIC. 
          I THINK THIS IS GOING TO BE USED AS A TOOL AGAINST THE COUNCIL. 
          AND I THINK THAT THE PEOPLE IN THE PUBLIC THAT DID ELECT US TO SIT HERE IN THESE SEATS EQUALLY ELECTED AT EACH OF US IN OUR SPOTS FOR DIFFERENT REASONS, FEEL THAT THESE ARE DEFINED IN THE SAME WAY. 
          WHICH IS WHY, UM, I HAVE, I KNOW EVERYBODY ELSE WHO YOU'VE GOT CONSENSUS. 
          I WILL NOT BE PARTICIPATING IN THIS, UM, TO ANSWER GLEN'S EMAIL AND TO DISCUSS IT IN THE OPEN MEETING FOR THE PUBLIC. 
          UM, COUNCIL CAN CENSOR COUNCIL MEMBERS. 
          BUT ASIDE FROM THAT, THE ONLY WAY I CAN LOSE MY SEAT HERE IS A TWO THIRDS OF THE REGISTERED VOTERS IN THE TOWN OF FRONT ROYAL VOTE TO REMOVE ME FROM THE SEAT THAT THEY ELECTED TO PUT ME IN. 
          THEREFORE, UM, SOMETIMES THE DUTY OF THE CONSTITUENTS THAT ELECTED ME TO BE HERE, YOU KNOW, UM, IS NOT ALWAYS PRETTY AND RAINBOWS AND BUTTERFLIES AND GUM DROPS. 
          SO I THINK THE CODE OF CONDUCT THOUGH, UM, I THINK THE PURPOSE OF IT WAS JUST WAS TO, SO THAT THAT COUNCIL MEMBERS COULD, AND THE, AND THE PUBLIC COULD SEE US BEHAVING WITH CIVILITY AND THINGS LIKE THAT. 
          I DON'T, I DON'T THINK IT'S, UNFORTUNATELY, I DON'T THINK IT'S ANYTHING MEANT TO LIKE UNSEEN PEOPLE. 
          'CAUSE I DON'T, I DON'T THINK THAT'S, BUT, BUT THAT'S THE REPERCUSSION. 
          I MEAN THAT'S LIKE WHAT CAN BE DONE IF SOMEBODY BREAKS THIS WHILE YOU SLAP 'EM ON THE WRIST. 
          OUR CHIEF SITS BACK THERE. 
          NOT TO PUT 'EM ON THE SPOT, BUT IT'S UNFORTUNATE THAT, YOU KNOW, IT'S ENCLOSED SESSION THAT THE MOST OF THESE ARE BROKEN BY OTHER COUNCIL MEMBERS AND OUR STAFF IS TREATED POORLY BEHIND CLOSED DOORS. 
          IT'S NOT OUT HERE IN THIS OPEN MEETING TONIGHT. 
          IT'S NOT ON SOCIAL MEDIA, ON THEIR PUBLIC FACEBOOKS, IT'S WHAT THEY'RE SAYING TO THE BUSINESS OWNERS IN TOWN OR WHAT THEY'RE SAYING TO STAFF BEHIND THEIR OFFICE DOORS. 
          SO UNFORTUNATELY FOR ME, IN THE WAY THAT I WAS RAISED, I TREAT PEOPLE WITH RESPECT WHETHER WE AGREE OR DISAGREE. 
          UM, AND I TREAT EVERY SINGLE PERSON ON THE TOWN OF FRONT ROYAL STAFF THE SAME FROM MY TRASH MAN TO THE TOWN MANAGER AND THE TOWN ATTORNEY. 
          BUT THAT'S UNFORTUNATE THAT IT HASN'T BEEN THE SAME FOR ALL COUNCIL MEMBERS ACROSS THE BOARD HERE. 
          UH, BUT I THINK IT GOES WITHOUT SAYING WE'RE ALL RESPONSIBLE ADULTS, I WOULD HOPE. 
          UM, SO MR. WALTZ ON FRIDAY, THE, YOU AND OTHER, THE VML HELD THE CONFERENCE. 
          AND IT'S MY UNDERSTANDING THAT, AND AND IT'S INTERESTING THAT THIS WAS ACTUALLY, WE WERE ALREADY TALKING AND REALLY THIS CAME UP BECAUSE THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT THIS AT THE MAYOR'S INSTITUTE BECAUSE THEY WERE TALKING ABOUT, UM, IN PUBLIC MEETING WHERE FELLOW BOARD MEMBERS OR COUNCIL MEMBERS WERE DISRESPECTFUL TO EACH OTHER OR TO THE PUBLIC. 
          OR THE PUBLIC WAS DISRESPECTFUL TO THEM, OR, OR YOU KNOW, I MEAN, LITERALLY ONE MAYOR SHARED A STORY WHERE HE STOOD BETWEEN TWO PEOPLE. 
          HE HAD TO BREAK UP A FIGHT LIKE THAT HAPPENED HERE IN FORT ROYAL. 
          IT'S NOTHING BREAKS . 
          RIGHT? WELL, BUT, AND I THINK YOU WERE 
          [02:25:01]
THERE FOR IT, RIGHT? WELL, I'M JUST SAYING THOUGH, THAT'S WHEN THIS CAME UP. 
          I, I THOUGHT THAT IT WAS, UM, THAT, AND, AND ACTUALLY I PARTICIPATED IN COUNCIL MEETINGS IN THE LAST FOUR YEARS WHERE THERE WAS SOME STUFF THAT I, THAT MY MOTHER TAUGHT ME NOT TO DO. 
          YEAH. 
          UM, BUT I AGREE. 
          YOU HAVE CONSENSUS TO MOVE FORWARD WITH IT. 
          MY LAST POINT WILL BE THAT THERE ARE PEOPLE THAT HAVE SERVED ON, ON THIS COUNCIL WITH ME OR THAT DO SERVE ON THIS COUNCIL WITH ME, THAT THE SAME CONSTITUENT DIDN'T VOTE FOR US BECAUSE WE DON'T HAVE THE SAME IDEALS AND OPINIONS. 
          AND, UM, I'M IN THIS SEAT TODAY TO FIGHT FOR THOSE PEOPLE WHO ELECTED ME TO BE HERE TO DO THAT. 
          AND, UM, EXERCISE EVERY RIGHT THAT I HAVE OF THIS COUNCIL TO DO. 
          SO, SO TO SAY THAT THE PEOPLE WHO WERE ELECTED BY OTHER PEOPLE THAN ME MIGHT THINK THAT MY OPINION OR SOMETHING IS DISRESPECTFUL OF THEIR OPINION, WHICH I'VE BEEN ACCUSED OF BEFORE, IS, IS FEELINGS. 
          AND THIS COUNCIL SHOULD OPERATE UNDER FACTS, OVER FEELINGS EVERY SINGLE TIME. 
          SO I JUST THINK THIS IS A VERY EMOTIONAL PIECE. 
          AND I KNEW I WOULD BE THE MINORITY AND I'M SURE THE PRESS WILL WRITE ABOUT THIS. 
          AND I'M OKAY WITH THAT. 
          WELL, YOU'RE NOT THE ONLY, I MEAN, THERE HAVE BEEN OTHER, THERE ARE OTHER BOARD, THERE HAVE OTHER BOARDS WHERE PEOPLE SAID, I'M NOT GONNA SIGN THAT BECAUSE I'M NOT AGREED TO IT. 
          SO I TOOK AT THE WARREN COUNTY COURTHOUSE TO UPHOLD THE CONSTITUTION WHEN I TOOK THIS SEAT TWO TIMES. 
          AND THAT'S ON ME TO DO. 
          WELL A NUMBER TWO, DOES ANYBODY HAVE AN, DOES ANYBODY HAVE A PREFERENCE FOR IMPROPER OR INAPPROPRIATE? I THINK WE ALL KNOW WHAT THAT IS TRYING TO GET AT IS LIKE WHERE THERE MIGHT BE GROUPS OR INDIVIDUALS OR WHATEVER THAT WOULD BE TRYING TO ACT WITH INFLUENCE OVER A DECISION YOU MIGHT MAKE. 
          SO IS THERE A PREFERENCE TO IMPROPER OR INAPPROPRIATE OR TO JUST TAKE EITHER YOU COULD JUST SAY INDEPENDENCE FROM INFLUENCE. 
          BUT LIKE I SAID, YOU CAN'T DO THAT. 
          'CAUSE THERE IS AN, THE INFLUENCE THOUGH IS NOT IMPROPER WHEN CITIZENS ARE GIVING YOU THEIR INPUT. 
          EXACTLY. 
          WE ALSO GET INFLUENCE FROM ATTORNEYS. 
          TRUE. 
          CAN BE INDEPENDENT OF THEIR INFLUENCE. 
          'CAUSE WE WOULDN'T BE ACTING ON THE BEST INTEREST OF THE TOWN. 
          THAT'S NOT, THERE'S ANOTHER ONE THOUGH, THAT TALKS ABOUT THE TOWN ATTORNEY, BUT, ALL RIGHT. 
          ANYBODY HAVE A THOUGHT ON THAT YET? JUST, JUST GENERAL OBSERVATION. 
          THE USE OF THE WORD SHOULD TO ME IS ASPIRATIONAL. 
          MM-HMM. 
           AS OPPOSED TO SHALL, WHICH SEEMS APPROPRIATE IN NUMBER ONE AND TO ME IN NUMBER 14. 
          UM, AND, BUT I, I RESERVE JUDGMENT ON THE REST OF THEM. 
          SO AGAIN, I THINK THE 14 HAS SHALL YES. 
          OR YOU'RE SAYING 14 SHOULD SAY SHOULD. 
          NO, NO. 
           IT SHOULD SAY. 
          SO ALL THREE OF THOSE SHOULD SAY SHALL, IS THAT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING? OKAY. 
          USE OF THE WORD SHOULD TO ME IS ASPIR MEANS THAT WHATEVER FOLLOWS IS ASPIRATIONAL. 
          RIGHT. 
          OKAY. 
          SHALL USE OF A SHALL MEANS IT'S MANDATORY. 
          RIGHT. 
          OKAY. 
          WELL THAT'S WHERE THE  ONE AND 14 I THINK ARE APPROPRIATE FOR USE OF THE WORD SHALL. 
          AND I, I DON'T REALLY COMMENT AT THIS POINT ON THE REST OF THEM. 
          I'M JUST TRYING TO DO SOME GUIDANCE. 
          ANYBODY HAVE ANY, ANY PREFERENCE? IMPROPER, INAPPROPRIATE. 
          AND YOU COULD CERTAINLY COME UP WITH ANOTHER WORD IF YOU ARE LUCKY ENOUGH TO FIND IT ON ANY THE SOURCE. 
          BECAUSE , I, UH, I COULD NOT ANYBODY HAVE A THOUGHT? WELL, SEE YOU, YOU IMPROPER WAS NOT YOUR FAVORITE WORD. 
          WOULD YOU PREFER INAPPROPRIATE? WOULD I INAPPROPRIATE APPROPRIATE? YEAH, YOU WERE . 
          I DON'T, IT IS HARD TO SAY. 
          I DID THIS ON SUNDAY WHEN I WAS LIKE, YOU ONLY BAD PERSON TO GIVE THIS KIND OF THING TOO. 
          I COULD SPEND HOURS DOING THIS. 
          UM, NO, I DON'T HAVE A PREFERENCE FOR, UH, I THINK THAT I WAS THINKING IN MY HEAD, UM, WHAT IS JUDGMENTAL OR, YOU KNOW, WHAT COULD BE JUDGMENTAL? IT'S SUBJECTIVE. 
          YEAH, SUBJECTIVE. 
          IMPROPER IS SUBJECTIVE. 
          AND, AND YOU INAPPROPRIATE SUBJECTIVE TO THEY ARE. 
          UM, I GUESS, UH, WELL, AGAIN, THE WHOLE POINT, TO ME, THE WHOLE POINT IS, IS THAT OUR ENVIRONMENT IS SUCH THAT IT IS SAFE AND EFFECTIVE TO MAKE DECISIONS. 
          AND YOU KNOW, WHEN OUR, WHEN OUR BEHAVIOR OR WORDS OR WHATEVER, UM, IMPAIR THAT, RIGHT? THAT'S, THAT'S WHERE THERE'S A PROBLEM. 
          UM, AND, AND JUST WANNA SAY TOO, THAT THIS CODE OF CONDUCT WAS NOT JUST ABOUT HOW WE INTERACT WITH EACH OTHER, IT'S ALSO HOW WE INTERACT WITH THE PUBLIC. 
          AND I CAN SAY THAT BECAUSE THERE HAVE BEEN BOARDS IN THE PAST THAT GOT IN, IN A SHOUTING MATCH BACK AND FORTH WITH THE PERSON, PUBLIC PERSON AT THE PODIUM, WHICH WAS NOT APPROPRIATE EITHER. 
          UM, EVEN WHEN WE MAY BE FRUSTRATED AND I WAS THERE FOR THOSE MEETINGS, I JUST DON'T THINK EVEN IF THIS CODE CONDUCT WAS IN PLACE, IT WOULD'VE CHANGED THOSE PEOPLE'S BEHAVIOR ACTIONS. 
          BUT, YOU KNOW, I THINK IT, IT MAKES A DIFFERENCE THOUGH, WHEN 
          [02:30:01]
LORI STANDS UP AT EVERY MEETING AND SHE, BEFORE THE PUBLIC HEARING, YOU SAY, YOU CAN DO THIS AND YOU CAN'T DO THAT WHEN YOU'RE AT THE PODIUM. 
          I THINK THAT'S HELPFUL. 
          IT'S GETTING READY TO CHANGE WAY TOO. 
          THAT'S UPDATED. 
          THAT TOO. 
          IT GETS DONE FOR ALL THE BOARDS AFTER I WAS PHYSICALLY ATTACKED AT A SCHOOL BOARD MEETING. 
          YEAH. 
          I THINK, I THINK IT'S HELPFUL AND IT, I MEAN, IT COULD SET, IT SETS THE TONE, SETS A, IT SETS A BOUNDARY WHETHER WE, YOU KNOW, FOLLOW OR, SO, ALL RIGHT, I'LL COME BACK TO TWO, THREE. 
          COUNCIL MEMBERS SHOULD BEHAVE CONSISTENTLY AND WITH CIVILITY TOWARDS EVERYONE WITH WHOM THEY INTERACT. 
          OR WE COULD JUST SAY, COUNCIL MEMBERS SHOULD TREAT EVERYONE WITH WHOM THEY INTERACT FAIRLY AND WITH CIVILITY. 
          SO I WE COULD DO EITHER OR OF THOSE OR, OR TAKE OUT SOME. 
          WELL, IF YOU SAY THREE COUNCIL MEMBERS SHOULD BEHAVE CONSISTENTLY AND, AND WITH CIVILITY TOWARD EVERYONE WITH WHO? I MEAN BEHAVING CONSISTENTLY DEFINED THAT. 
          YEP. 
          WELL, THAT SHE SAID THAT, THAT'S WHY I READ, THAT'S WHY I REWORKED IT TOO, SHOULD TREAT EVERYONE WITH WHOM THEY INTERACT FAIRLY. 
          BECAUSE I THINK WHEN THEY MEAN CONSISTENTLY, THEY MEANT FAIRLY LIKE THAT YOU DON'T TREAT ONE PERSON, YOU DON'T TREAT ONE PERSON WITH MORE CONSIDERATION THAN ANOTHER. 
          OR SAME THING LIKE WITH CITIZENS, YOU KNOW, WE DON'T GIVE ONE PERSON DEFINITION FEAR AND YOURS ARE DIFFERENT THOUGH. 
          WELL, SIX MINUTES FOR ONE PERSON AND THREE MINUTES FOR ANOTHER, THAT'S OBVIOUS THAT THAT'S NOT FAIR. 
          RIGHT. 
          RIGHT. 
          OR WHEN WE'VE LET SOME PEOPLE TALK, YOU KNOW, LONGER OR BRING SOMETHING. 
          THAT'S WHAT I MEANT BY FAIRLY WELL. 
          AND IT ALSO, YOU KNOW, THERE'S BEEN CASES JUST FROM THE BRIEF TIME I'VE BEEN ON COUNSEL, WHERE OBVIOUSLY WE, WE HAVE PEOPLE WHO COME BEFORE US THAT SOME PEOPLE HAVE STRONG EMOTIONS AGAINST, YOU KNOW, BECAUSE OF WHATEVER REASON. 
          SO WE HAVE TO FIGURE OUT, YOU KNOW, AGAIN, ARE WE MAKING DECISIONS, THE FACTS BEFORE US, OR OUR FEELINGS ABOUT THIS PERSON AND, AND THEIR CHARACTER. 
          YOU KNOW, SO, BUT SOME PEOPLE'S FAULT ABOUT WHAT A FACT IS DOESN'T MEAN IT'S A FACT. 
          JUST 'CAUSE THEY THINK IT'S A FACT DOESN'T MEAN ITS A FACT. 
          TRUE, TRUE. 
          THAT I'M JUST SAYING, WE, WE'VE EXPERIENCED THAT TOO, WHERE PEOPLE SAID, WELL, THIS IS THIS AND WE FIND THAT IT'S NOT TRUE. 
          ABSOLUTELY. 
          EVERY DAY. 
          SO THREE, DO YOU HAVE A RED OR BLUE? BLUE? BUT KNOW, DOES ANYBODY ELSE I'M WITH BLUE ON THIS ONE. 
          OKAY, WE'LL GO WITH BLUE BECAUSE IT SAYS CIVILITY BECAUSE I LIKE YOU'RE SAYING RESPECT. 
          IT IS VERY YOUNG. 
          PEOPLE CALL RESPECTFULLY. 
          IT'S GONNA BE BENT TO, TO, TO, IT'S GOING TO END UP REALLY AT, AT YOUR GAVEL. 
          MAYOR A WHAT? IT'S GONNA END UP AT YOUR GAVEL. 
          YOU YOU CONTROL THE MEETINGS. 
          YOU RUN THE MEETINGS. 
          YOU CONTROL US. 
          GIVE US THE OPPORTUNITY TO SPEAK, NOT SPEAK, DRAIN US IN IF WE GET OUT. 
          AND THE SAME WITH THE PUBLIC. 
          BUT THIS WILL HELP, THIS HELPS REMIND PEOPLE OF WHAT THE EXPECTATION IS. 
          'CAUSE WE EASILY GET AWAY FROM IT. 
          UM, IT, I MEAN, LIKE I SAID, I, I'VE SEEN IT SOMETIMES MORE THAN OTHERS, BUT YOU'RE RIGHT. 
          CLOSE MEANS SOMETIMES IS, IS WORSE. 
          OR CERTAIN PUBLIC HEARINGS WHERE IT'S BEEN WORSE WHEN SOMEBODY STANDS UP AND SAYS, I'M NOT GONNA STOP TALKING AT THREE MINUTES. 
          YOU'RE JUST GOING HAVE TO DO SOMETHING, WHICH IS WHAT HAPPENED. 
          RIGHT. 
          THE MICROPHONE OFF. 
          SO THAT, SO THAT'S WHEN I WENT TO THE MICROPHONES BEING TURNED OFF OR SOMEBODY'S GETTING MOVED. 
          AND WE, AND WE DID HAVE TO, UM, WE DID HAVE TO CLEAR THE ROOM IN ONE OF MY COUNCIL MEETINGS WHEN IT GOT REALLY UGLY AND, AND CITIZENS WERE CUSSING PEOPLE ON THE DIE AND STUFF. 
          SO WE, WE'VE HAD SOME INTERESTING MEETINGS, BUT, BUT THIS WEREN'T FOR THE PUBLIC. 
          NO, NO, IT ISN'T. 
          HOWEVER CONDUCT IT IS. 
          BUT MANY LOCALITIES HAVE THE SAME THING FOR THEIR, IT'S EXPECTED OF THEIR BOARDS, THEIR COMMISSIONS, THEIR STAFF, LIKE THEY, AND THE, THE PUBLIC THING IS WHAT I READ BEFORE THE PUBLIC COMMENTS. 
          BUT NUMBER FOUR, UM, COUNCIL MEMBERS MUST ACT COLLECTIVELY AND PROPERLY NOTICE AND CONSTITUTED. 
          SOMEBODY ASKED ABOUT THE QUESTION ABOUT CONSTITUTED. 
          AND THAT MEANS TO BE A PART OF A WHOLE, WHICH JUST MEANS THAT COUNSEL IS EACH PERSON HERE IS A PART OF THE WHOLE BODY THAT WE ARE COLLECTIVE, YOU KNOW, THAT ONE PERSON CAN'T SPEAK FOR ALL THAT. 
          IT'S A COLLECTIVE, UH, COLLECTIVE BODY. 
          AND I TALK TO BEING AROUND THAT WHOLE THING ABOUT THAT WE HAVE TO, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE TO HAVE A QUORUM AND YEAH. 
          YOU KNOW, MEET ALL THE, AND NOTICE JUST MEANS ADVERTISE IS REALLY WHAT THAT UM, WHAT, WHAT WERE YOU GONNA SAY? YOU EACH GET ONE. 
          NO, GO AHEAD. 
          GO AHEAD. 
          UM, ALRIGHT, SO THAT ONE'S OKAY. 
          AND I, I'M NOT GONNA LEAVE CON THE BLUE CONSTITUTING IN THERE. 
          THAT WAS JUST MY DEFINITION TO REMIND MYSELF. 
          UH, COUN FIVE COUNCIL MEMBERS SHOULD MAKE A CONSCIENTIOUS EFFORT TO BE WELL PREPARED FOR EACH MEETING. 
          NOW, ORIGINALLY, THAT WAS ALL IT SAID, AND THEN PEOPLE ADDED STUFF TO IT, WHICH I, I THINK IT 
          [02:35:01]
DOES CLARIFY, INCLUDING, BUT NOT LIMITED TO READING MATERIALS PROVIDED IN ADVANCE, THE MEETING ARRIVING ON TIME AND IN A, THIS WAS INTERESTING AND A CONDITION TO THINK, REASON AND DISCUSSED YOU DEBATE IS THE WORD WAS, UH, DEBATE. 
          BUT I, I'M OKAY WITH JUST LEAVING IT. 
          WHAT CONDITION? I I I'M FINE WITH JUST SAYING, BEING WELL PREPARED FOR EACH MEETING. 
          YEAH. 
          I, I ENDORSE NUMBER FIVE FULLY, BUT THE REST OF IT, YEAH. 
          OH, WELL THAT WAS JUST, THAT LOOKS LIKE WHERE KIDS LACK SCHOOL. 
          HUH? C, B, D. 
          YEAH. 
          SO IT'S LEGAL, ISN'T IT? I DON'T KNOW. 
          PREPARED FOR THE MEETING. 
          AND THE UNDERSTANDING IS JUST, YOU KNOW, NOT JUST TO BE READING MATERIALS, BUT JUST BE IN A CONDITION. 
          NEXT TIME I HAVE STRAPPER I'LL KICKING. 
          OH, I WASN'T EVEN THINKING OF IT. 
          I WAS REALLY, THAT'S WHAT CONDITION. 
          PHYSICAL. 
          I WASN'T EVEN THINKING OF THAT. 
          I REALLY WAS THINKING DRUGS AND ALCOHOL AND, AND IT'S NOT. 
          AND THAT THERE IS MEMBERS THAT COME TO COUNCIL WHO ADMIT IT LATER. 
          LOOK, I, I'M EMOTIONALLY I'M UPSET ABOUT SOMETHING. 
          RIGHT? YOU KNOW, THAT KIND OF STUFF. 
          I'M GONNA RESIGN. 
          BUT WHO DECIDES WHO, WHOSE CONDITION IS WELL ENOUGH MENTALLY GET OUT OF TOWN. 
          WE WERE ELECTED BY ADULTS WHO ARE REGISTERED VOTERS. 
          WE ARE ADULTS WHO TOOK AN OATH. 
          WELL, WE SHOULD PUT OUR HAND UP AND SWORE ON AN OATH. 
          AN ACTING LIKE, AND NOW WE'RE GONNA HELPFUL TOO. 
          THIS SIX OF US ARE GONNA DECIDE WHOSE CONDITION IS WELL ENOUGH TO BE HERE. 
          NEXT COUNCIL MEMBERS SHOULD WORK TO CREATE, UM, I CHANGED A POSITIVE ENVIRONMENT. 
          OBJECTIVE ENVIRONMENT. 
          FIVE. 
          I'M SORRY, I, YOU ALL LOST ME ON FIVE. 
          WHAT ARE WE TAKING OUT OF FIVE? JUST GET RID OF THE BLUE. 
          JUST LEAVE. 
          BE WELL PREPARED FOR YOUR TEAM. 
          YOUR CONDITION. 
          DOESN'T MATTER WHEN, JUST MAKE SURE YOU'RE PREPARED, YOUR CONDITION. 
          THANK YOU. 
          I REALLY APPRECIATE THAT. 
          IF YOU'RE DISTRESSED, WE TRUST YOU TO MAKE DECISIONS LIKE A BIG POINT. 
          NUMBER SIX, COUNCIL MEMBERS SHOULD WORK TO CREATE AN ENVIRONMENT THAT PROVOKES SAFE AND EFFECTIVE GOVERNANCE AND DECISION MAKING WHERE CITIZENS, UH, FEEL SAFE IN THEIR ROLES AS OBSERVERS OR PARTICIPANTS. 
          WHICH THAT'S, YOU KNOW, AGAIN, I, I, THAT'S, I, YEAH. 
          HOPEFULLY THAT'S NOT A, A THAT, YOU KNOW, WE, I, THAT, THAT'S, THAT'S MORE CLARITY THAN A POSITIVE ENVIRONMENT. 
          'CAUSE POSITIVE TO ME MIGHT BE POSITIVE. 
          NOT SAYING . 
          EVERYBODY OKAY WITH THAT? INCLUDING THE BLUE, THE BLUE'S. 
          OKAY. 
          MAKES SENSE. 
          SEVEN. 
          UM, CHANGE THE WORDING A LITTLE BIT. 
          INSTEAD OF RESPECT TO CIVILITY, COUNCIL MEMBERS SHALL TREAT OTHER COUNCIL MEMBERS AND THE PUBLIC WITH CIVILITY AND HONOR THE OPINIONS OF OTHERS. 
          EVEN WHEN COUNCIL MEMBERS MAY BE IN DISAGREEMENT WITH THOSE OPINIONS. 
          HONORS WOULD BE THE WORD THAT I THINK THAT COULD BE SUBJECTIVE. 
          I DON'T KNOW HOW TO SAY THAT TO, TO CLARIFY MORE. 
          THAT WHEN YOU DON'T AGREE WITH SOMEONE ELSE, YOU CAN'T, YOU KNOW, YOU SHOULDN'T GET ANGRY, YELL, YOU KNOW, THE RAISE YOUR VOICE, THOSE TYPES OF THINGS. 
          OR TELL SOMEBODY THEIR, THEIR OPINION'S WRONG OR THEIR POSITION'S WRONG. 
          BUT, SO I DON'T KNOW. 
          WHAT'S THE BEST HONOR, RESPECT, OPINION. 
          I WOULD SAY RESPECT. 
          RESPECT. 
          THE OPINIONS WOULD BE BETTER THAN HONOR. 
          'CAUSE SOME PEOPLE I'LL HONOR OPINION, RESPECT, RESPECT OR VALUE. 
          BUT I DON'T, I'M NOT SAYING YOU HAVE TO HONOR, LIKE, IT DOESN'T MEAN AGREE WITH THEIR OPINION. 
          THAT'S NOT WHAT THIS I'M JUST SAYING. 
          THIS IS SAYING THAT IF YOU DISAGREE WITH THEM SOMETIMES THAT YOU'RE NOT SOMETIMES ARE WRONG. 
          AND I'M NOT GONNA, WELL SEE. 
          THAT'S NOT RESPECTING THEIR OPINION. 
          THEY MIGHT BE WRONG TO YOU, BUT NO, IT MIGHT BE FACTUAL. 
          WE'VE HAD THAT COME BEFORE US TOO. 
          THEIR OPINION OF SOMETHING LIKE THE SPEED CAMERAS THAT WAS ON THE RIVER, 95 3. 
          SHOUT OUT TO KALE. 
          I HEARD TODAY. 
          BUT THE OPINIONS OF THAT CAME FROM WHAT THEY SAID WERE FACT BASED, NOT GETTING TO FACE THEIR ACCUSER AND THINGS OF THAT NATURE AND DRUG IT OUT FOR, WHAT, NINE MONTHS. 
          I, I DON'T HAVE TO HONOR THOSE OPINIONS THAT DON'T UPHOLD LAW AND ORDER FOR THAT MATTER. 
          I DON'T. 
          RIGHT. 
          SO I WON'T. 
          RIGHT, BUT YOU WOULDN'T CUSS THEM OR SAY YOU'RE STUPID. 
          NO, I'VE NEVER DONE THAT. 
          WELL, YOU HAVEN'T BUT OTHERS HAVE. 
          SO I KNOW, I I'VE BEEN THERE WHEN I DIDN'T FEEL SAME WITH OTHER PEOPLE ON THE OTHER SIDE OF THE DIET NUMBER. 
          I DO UNDERSTAND COUNCIL MEMBERS SHALL MAINTAIN AN ATTITUDE OF ATTITUDE, OF COURTESY AND CONSIDERATION TOWARDS ALL COLLEAGUES AND STAFF DURING ALL DISCUSSIONS AND DELIBERATIONS. 
          I THINK THAT ONE WAS PRETTY SELF-EXPLANATORY. 
          UH, JUST JUMP IN ON SEVEN AND EIGHT FOR CONSISTENCY. 
          I SUGGEST SHOULD INSTEAD OF SAT SHALL ON THOSE TWO , DIDN'T YOU JUST AGAIN, AGAIN, ASPIRATE IT'S ASPIRATIONAL. 
          WHEREAS RES NINE FOR INSTANCE, UM, WAIT, SO SEVEN, YOU WANT IT TO BE SHALL SHOULD EIGHT. 
          SHOULD, SHOULD, I'M SORRY. 
          IT SHOULD BE, SHOULD, SHOULD. 
          AND EIGHT. 
          IT SHOULD BE, SHALL SHOULD. 
          RIGHT. 
          SAY THAT THREE TIMES AND NON I. 
          BECAUSE THAT DOES GO TO LAW. 
          THAT THAT'S A, THAT'S A STATEMENT. 
          YEAH. 
          UH, UH, 
          [02:40:01]
THAT'S A FACT. 
          SHOULD BE, THAT SHOULD BE COUNCIL MEMBERS SHALL NOT I TAKE THE DO OUT THEN, RIGHT WHAT YOU'RE SAYING, RIGHT. 
          COUNCIL MEMBERS SHALL NOT, BUT IT REALLY IS. 
          THEY DO NOT HAVE THE AUTHORITY TO DO THAT. 
          BUT YOU'RE FINE. 
          I HAVE NO IDEA ABOUT NATE, THE SHOWER, THE SHIP. 
          BUT I'LL HONOR YOUR OPINION. 
          GEORGE  AGAIN, SHOULD OR SHALL SUGGEST THAT I SHOULD HONOR YOUR OPINION. 
          SO NOW YOU WANT IT TO BE SHALL SHALL NOT. 
          I THINK I'M BEING CONSISTENT HERE. 
          . 
          OKAY. 
          SHALL SUGGEST THAT THERE'S AN UNDERLYING REQUIREMENT SOMEWHERE RIGHT IN, IN, IN THE LAW SOMEWHERE. 
          I SEE, I SEE. 
          SHOULD SUGGEST THAT IT'S ASPIRATIONAL, WHICH IS WHAT MOST OF THIS IS. 
          IT'S ASPIRATIONAL CONDUCT. 
          SO NUMBER NINE, TELL ME WHAT YOU WANT IT TO BE. 
          SHALL, SHOULD, SHALL. 
          MM-HMM, . 
          ALRIGHT. 
          SHALL 10. 
          WE'RE MAKING PUBLIC UTTERANCES. 
          COUNCIL MEMBERS MUST MAKE IT CLEAR WHETHER THEY'RE AUTHORS TO SPEAK ON BEHALF OF THE COUNCIL OR WHETHER THEY'RE PRESENTING THEIR OWN VIEWS. 
          THAT'S A GOOD ONE. 
          DOES THAT HAPPEN? UH, 11 COUNCIL MEMBERS MUST LIMIT THEIR ACTIVITIES TO MATTERS WITHIN THEIR SUBJECT MATTER JURISDICTION. 
          ALL RIGHT. 
          SOMEBODY ASKED CLARIFICATION ON THAT. 
          DID I DO A GOOD JOB CLARIFYING IT OR NOT? THAT WAS IN REFERENCE TO COUNCIL, COUNCIL MEMBERS ARE IT, IT'S SOMETHING THAT IS NOT A MATTER THAT WOULD BE DETERMINED BY THE COUNCIL STAFF IS STAFF, OR WE DON'T HAVE, WE CAN'T, WE SHOULDN'T BE ASKING FOR RESOURCES FROM OUR STAFF OR, OR GIVE DIRECTIONS OR ACTIONS OUTSIDE OF THAT JURISDICTION. 
          AND I, I CAN, I COULD GIVE YOU AN EXAMPLE, BUT I REALLY DON'T WANT TO 'CAUSE BE, I THINK IT WAS ME THAT WAS CONFUSED. 
          I WAS NOT SURE. 
          UH, 'CAUSE WHEN YOU SAID SUBJECT MATTER JURISDICTION, COUNCIL MEMBERS MUST, I'LL ADMIT I COPIED THIS ONE RIGHT OFF OF SOMEBODY ELSE'S TO MATTERS WITHIN THE, SO LIKE, I DON'T KNOW WHAT IS MY SUBJECT MATTER JURISDICTION? I MEAN, WHAT, WHAT, WHAT SUBJECT MATTER DO YOU THINGS THAT HAVE TO DO WITH THE TOWN, BUT YOU'RE NOT GONNA DETERMINE THIS COUNCIL IS NOT GONNA DETERMINE LIKE WHO'S GETTING WATER OR WHO'S GETTING SHUT OFF OR WELL, IT IS, HERE'S, HERE'S, HERE'S WHAT I THINK IF THAT'S, IF THAT'S A DEFENSE OBJECTIVE. 
          YEAH. 
          TELL ME WHEN IT SHOULD SAY, TOWN COUNCIL MUST LIMIT ITS ACTIVITIES TO MATTERS WITHIN ITS SUBJECT MATTER JURISDICTION. 
          OKAY. 
          THAT SOUNDS GOOD. 
          JOSH. 
          TOWN TOWN COUNCIL MEMBERS MUST LIMIT. 
          OKAY. 
          AND THAT WOULD BE A SHALL NO TOWN COUNCIL TOWN COUNCIL BE A SHALL MEMBERS? NO. 
          TAKE, BECAUSE THAT'S A MATTER OF LAW TOWN COUNCIL. 
          YOU CAN'T LIMIT LIMITS THEIR ACTIVITIES. 
          NO. 
          SHALL COUNSEL, HOW COUNSEL AS A ENTITY SHOULD LIMIT ITS ACTIVITIES. 
          SHALL, SHALL LIMIT, SHALL MOTION, SHALL YOU. 
          DON'T GO TELL THE COUNTY WHAT TO DO PER SE. 
          TOWN COUNCIL SHALL LIMIT ITS ACTIVITIES TO MATTERS WITHIN THEIR SUBJECT MATTER JURISDICTION ONLY LEAVE IT AT THAT WITHIN ITS SUBJECT MATTER. 
          OKAY. 
          AND DO WE WANNA JUST LEAVE IT THERE AND NOT PUT THE REST OF THE STUFF? YEAH. 
          CAN WE ASSUME WE WILL KNOW WHAT THAT MEANS? YEAH. 
          SO CROSS OFF THE, Y'ALL ALWAYS COME BACK AND WATCH IT. 
          WHEN YOU SAY PLATE STAFF, UM, I, I, I'M NOT SURE ABOUT THE WHOLE AGENDA THING. 
          YOU AND THE TOWN MANAGER SET THE AGENDA. 
          YEP. 
          SO I I DON'T KNOW THAT IT HAS TO BE RESTATED. 
          IT'S JUST NOT NO, I KNOW. 
          I'M, I, THERE HAVE BEEN TIMES IN THE PAST WHERE COUNCIL MEMBERS ASKED STAFF TO DO THINGS THAT REALLY WASN'T THEIR, IT WASN'T THEIR, IT WASN'T IN THEIR JURISDICTION TO ASK THEM TO DO. 
          I'LL JUST LEAVE IT AT THAT. 
          I, I MEAN WITHOUT, I MEAN, I, YOU KNOW WHAT I MEAN? LIKE, I DON'T, I DON'T WANNA GET INTO IT. 
          I, I I, THERE'S ENOUGH STAFF MEMBERS IN THIS ROOM THAT KNOW THAT, UH, THIS, THAT THAT'S A FACT. 
          YEP. 
          NOT A FEELING. 
          . 
          I'M SO, BUT THE OTHER REALLY GREAT THING ABOUT OUR HR AND STAFF IS THERE'S ONLY THREE PEOPLE THAT WORK FOR COUNCIL. 
          SO IF WE ASK THEM TO DO SOMETHING, THEY ABSOLUTELY HAVE NO OBLIGATION TO ANSWER. 
          THOSE PEOPLE ARE DO IT. 
          YEP. 
          BUT IT HAS MADE PEOPLE FEEL UNCOMFORTABLE IN PLACES. 
          BUT ANYWAY, I CAN JUST STOP AFTER JURISDICTION AND NOT ADD THE REST OF THE WORDS. 
          IF, IF, IF YOU'RE RIGHT BRUCE, THAT MIGHT BE TOO LONG. 
          IF IT'S TOO LONG. 
          WE'LL, RIGHT. 
          IT'S CONVOLUTED. 
          I THINK IT'S TOO LONG. 
          IT SHOULD BE. 
          BUT YOU HOPEFULLY, YOU KNOW, BECAUSE SOME PEOPLE KEPT SAYING, CLARIFY, CLARIFY, CLARIFY. 
          SO 12 COUNCIL MEMBERS SHOULD OR SHALL OR . 
          I'M ON 12. 
          IT'S A SHOULD. 
          ASPIRATIONAL. 
          SHOULD, YEAH, THEY SHOULD. 
          I GOT IT NOW. 
          UM, THAT'S A SHOULD NUMBER. 
          COUNCIL MEMBER SHOULDN'T EVER KEEP UP TO DATE THROUGH THE COUNSEL'S ATTORNEY AND OTHER SOURCES ABOUT NEW OR ONGOING LEGAL, ETHICAL, ETHICAL ISSUES THAT MAY FACE, THEY MAY FACE IN THEIR OFFICIAL POSITIONS. 
          OH YEAH. 
          I ASKED ABOUT THIS TOO. 
          I DIDN'T KNOW WHAT YOU WERE TALKING ABOUT. 
          WHAT, WHAT IT WAS 
          [02:45:01]
JUST TO BE AWARE OF WHAT, WHEN SOMEBODY, YOU KNOW, WHAT'S HAPPENING WHEN SOMEBODY SAYS, WELL, IF WE DO THAT, THAT COULD CAUSE THIS PROBLEM OR THIS LAWSUIT AND THOSE TYPES OF THINGS. 
          AND JUST BASICALLY LISTENING TO THE ATTORNEY. 
          'CAUSE THEY'RE, THAT'S HAPPENED BEFORE TOO, WHERE COUNCIL MEMBERS HAVE BEEN ADVISED OF WHAT SHOULDN'T HAPPEN. 
          AND, AND THEN IF THEY DO, IT PUTS THE TOWN IN A, IN, IN A POSITION. 
          BUT SO WERE YOU LOOKING THOUGH FOR THE PRI LIKE PRIVATE, LIKE WERE YOU LOOKING FOR PEOPLE TO DISCLOSE THEIR PRIVATE STUFF? NO. 
          OH, TOWNS JUST TOWN BUSINESS. 
          THAT'S OKAY. 
          SORRY. 
          OKAY. 
          BECAUSE NUMBER 11, . 
          OKAY. 
          OKAY. 
          JUST HER JURISDICTION. 
          OKAY. 
          OKAY. 
          OKAY. 
          13 COUNCIL MEMBERS SHALL RESPECT AND THE HEAR  SHOULD KNOW COUNCIL MEMBERS SHOULD RESPECT AND THE HEAR COUNCIL MANAGER TRUCTURE THE TOWN FRONT. 
          WELL, WITH RESPECT TO THE TOWN MANAGER RELATIONSHIP WITH THE TOWN COUNCIL, IN THIS STRUCTURE, THE TOWN COUNCIL DETERMINES POLICIES OF THE TOWN WITH THE ADVICE, INFORMATION, AND ANALYSIS PROVIDED BY THE PUBLIC BOARDS, COMMISSIONS, COMMITTEES AND STAFF TOWN STAFF. 
          THE TOWN MANAGER IMPLEMENTS THAT POLICY. 
          WAIT A MINUTE, WHAT I I'M SORRY TO DO THIS. 
          IT WAS COVERED IN WHY, WHY IS THAT A SHOULD ISN'T THAT, THAT'S A, THAT'S A LAW. 
          WELL, IT'S NOT, IT'S NOT, IT'S NOT A LAW. 
          THE COUNCIL, THE COUNCIL MANAGER STRUCTURE NOT NO, THERE'S NO LAW. 
          IT'S, NO, IT'S ASPIRATION. 
          OKAY. 
          IT'S ASPIRATIONAL. 
          OKAY. 
          OKAY. 
          IT'S HAPPENED BEFORE  NUMBER 14. 
          I'M JUST GONNA SAY THAT THIS IS JUST LIKE, THERE'S A WHOLE LOT OF THESE THAT I WROTE BASED ON MY LIFE EXPERIENCE. 
          14 COUNCIL MEMBERS SHALL NOT DISCLOSE CONFIDENTIAL AND PRISON. 
          THAT ONE'S, THAT ONE IS A, THAT'S A SHALL, RIGHT? YEAH. 
          YEP. 
          OKAY. 
          AND THAT, THAT ONE, NOBODY DISAGREES WITH THAT, RIGHT? NO. 
          OKAY. 
          ALL RIGHT. 
          SO AFFIRM THAT I'VE READ UNDER, ALRIGHT, SO WE HAD READ AND UNDERSTAND AND MELISSA MENTIONED ADDING, COMMIT TO UPHOLDING. 
          AND SO ANYWAY, UH, I HATE TO GO BACK TO NUMBER NUMBER TWO, BUT I WOULD SAY THOUGH, NOT TO PICK ON AMBER, BUT IF YOU'RE DECIDING THAT YOU DON'T WANT TO SIGN IT OR WHATEVER, THEN THEN WE WOULD LEAVE IT READ AND UNDERSTAND BECAUSE THEN SHE WOULD HAVE SAID SHE READ AND UNDERSTAND IT, BUT SHE'S NOT, WELL SHE JUST DOESN'T SIGN IT. 
          SHE DON'T HAVE TO. 
          THERE'VE BEEN OTHER BOARDS. 
          THIS IS REALLY MORE ON THE HONOR SYSTEM TO SAY WHETHER OR NOT YOU ARE WILLING TO DO THIS. 
          I'M NOT GONNA BE, I CAN'T BE REMOVED. 
          I MEAN, I'VE TOOK AN OATH AND THAT IS MY PLEDGE TO THE CONSTITUENTS, MY COMMUNITY. 
          I MEAN, IN THE TOWN. 
          I AGREE WITH SOME OF THE THINGS IN HERE AND I'VE WITNESSED IT. 
          I WAS ON THE OTHER FLOOR, DIES IN THE AUDIENCE WHEN WE HAD FORMER, I'M NOT EVEN GONNA SAY WHAT THEIR POSITIONS WERE. 
          THAT ACTED A FOOL AND I DIDN'T FEEL SAFE. 
          BUT I MEAN, I DON'T THINK THIS WOULD'VE PREVENTED THAT EVEN THOUGH IT WAS A VERY NICE SUGGESTION AND A GOOD GESTURE. 
          AND LORI, I COMMEND YOU FOR YOUR EFFORTS. 
          YOU HAVE BEEN THROUGH A LOT. 
          SHE HAS BEEN IN THE SAME BOAT THAT, THAT STORY SHE TOLD FROM SOME OTHER TRAUMATIZING MAYOR'S STORY. 
          UM, YEAH, MY FIRST MEETING, BUT NO, BEFORE THAT, LONG BEFORE THAT, IT WAS WAY WORSE. 
          AND SO ANYWAY, BRUCE, I, I WAS ELECTED TO UPHOLD AN OATH THAT I TOOK, BUT I, PERIOD, I DON'T ARGUE WITH THEM. 
          SO NUMBER TWO, IM IMPROPER OR INAPPROPRIATE. 
          DO YOU WANNA DO IMPROPER OR INAPPROPRIATE OR DO YOU WANT ME TO, I I FEEL LIKE YOU HAVE TO HAVE A WORD IN THERE. 
          IT NEEDS, IT NEEDS AN ADVERB. 
          SO WE GOTTA DESCRIBE THE INFLUENCE. 
          WHAT INFLUENCE DO YOU WANT TO BE IMPROPER OR INAPPROPRIATE? I ACTUALLY LIKE IMPROPER BETTER, BUT THAT'S JUST ME. 
          I THINK I'M FINE WITH THE PROPER AS WELL. 
          YEAH. 
          AND IT'S JUST SO MUCH LESS UP TO INTERPRETATION AND INTERPRETATION BEHAVIOR. 
          IT IS. 
          AND BY WHO? AND, AND I WILL SAY THIS TOO, THERE'VE BEEN TIMES, I MEAN, LOOK, WE'VE ALL THROWN OUT THINGS WHERE WE SAID THAT WAS, THAT WAS IN AND INAPPROPRIATE OR IMPROPER FOR A PARTICULAR PERSON TO ACT AWAY OR HAVE A VOTE ON SOMETHING THAT WAS A CONFLICT OF INTEREST. 
          SO YOU'VE ALL SEEN IT AND YOU KNOW, IT'S INTERESTING THAT THEY, IN THE TOWN'S HANDBOOK, THERE'S A CODE OF ETHICS, BUT THAT'S FOR WELL THAT'S CORRECT. 
          ADDRESSES COUNCIL. 
          YEAH. 
          IT, IT'S INTERESTING THAT, THAT THE CODE OF ETHICS DOESN'T INCLUDE THE TOWN. 
          I MEAN, YOU UNDERSTAND WHAT I'M SAYING? YEAH. 
          IT'S LIKE IT OUGHT TO BE INCORPORATED INTO ONE, NOT WELL, THAT'S WHAT SOME OF THE DOCUMENTS I READ WERE LITERALLY 12 PAGES LONG BECAUSE IT, IT INCORP AND IT BROKE THEM UP INTO COUNCIL, UH, STAFF PLANNING, UH, COMMISSION THIS, BOARD THAT BOARD. 
          LIKE IT BROKE IT UP INTO EACH THING. 
          AND THEY WERE, THEY WERE SIMILAR, BUT THEY HAD, UM, JOB SPECIFIC THINGS. 
          BUT, BUT, BUT COUNCIL MEMBERS ARE NOT TOWN EMPLOYEES. 
          BUT WE'RE, WE'RE AVAILABLE. 
          [02:50:01]
WE CAN RECEIVE TOWN BENEFITS AS A TOWN EMPLOYEE. 
          SO THERE'S A GRAY AREA THERE. 
          WELL, WE'RE ELECTED OFFICIALS, RIGHT? YEAH. 
          WE'RE NOT, WE'RE NOT TOWN COURT. 
          HE HAS ELECTED OFFICIALS IN THERE. 
          IT DOES. 
          AND COUNCIL ADOPTED IT. 
          YEAH, BUT I MEAN, I MEAN I'LL LEAVE THAT. 
          HE SAID COUNCIL ADOPTED IT. 
          THERE ARE ACTUALLY PLACES. 
          'CAUSE I, LIKE I SAID, I DID A LOT OF RESEARCH FOR THIS. 
          THERE ARE PLACES THAT DID, LIKE WHAT AMBER JUST SAID, THERE ARE PLACES WHERE THE ELECTED OFFICIALS CAN HAVE THE SAME BENEFITS AS THE TOWN EMPLOYEE. 
          YEAH, BUT I DON'T, I DON'T, YEAH. 
          DO I HAVE BENEFITS? NO, NO, NO. 
          NONE OF US DO. 
          IMM JUST SAYING THOUGH, THAT THERE ARE PLACES, I THINK THE COUNTY EVEN DOES THAT. 
          I THINK THEIR ELECTED OFFICIALS CAN GET THE INSURANCE AND, AND NOT BE ELIGIBLE FOR BENEFITS. 
          AND, AND I, NONE OF THIS WAS, I KNOW HOW IT WILL APPEAR. 
          NONE OF THIS WAS TO DISCREDIT YOUR WORK ON THIS OR TO SAY THAT THESE AREN'T REAL TRUE ISSUES. 
          BUT THERE HAVE BEEN TIMES WITH PREVIOUS TOWN MANAGER OUTSIDE OF THE CURRENT ONE, PREVIOUS COUNCIL, PREVIOUS MAYOR, WHERE I'VE REFUSED TO PARTICIPATE IN A MEETING BECAUSE IT GIVES US EXPOSURE TO SOMETHING. 
          SO THEREFORE I'M NOT GONNA ACT AS A WHOLE BODY IN THOSE. 
          I HAVE TO MAKE MY OWN CONSCIOUS DECISION ON WHAT THE BEST INTEREST FOR THE TOWN BY THE 2000 PEOPLE THAT ELECTED ME PUT ME HERE TO DO. 
          SO I'M NOT AGREEING TO ACT AS A WHOLE WITH YOU GUYS. 
          IF YOU GUYS GO INTO A MEETING THAT I KNOW GEORGE SAID, AH, I WOULD ADVISE YOU NOT TO DO THAT. 
          AND YOU GUYS DECIDE YOU'RE ALL GONNA DO IT, AND I DECIDE I'M NOT OR WHATEVER, I'M NOT GONNA LIKE AGREE TO KEEP IT KOSHER. 
          BUT MY PURPOSE THEN THIS, I KNOW WHAT YOU'RE, I KNOW YOUR PURPOSE AS AS WELL. 
          I KNOW THAT. 
          I MAKE SURE THE PUBLIC NOT AGREEING TO IT IS GONNA, MY, MY PURPOSE IN THIS TRULY WAS TO, TO HAVE CITIZENS WATCH OUR MEETINGS, ATTEND OUR MEETINGS, AND LOOK AT US WITH THE WAY IN WHICH WE TREAT EACH OTHER AND WE TREAT THE PUBLIC AND, AND RESPECT AND INTEGRITY. 
          AND THAT WAS REALLY MY ONLY PURPOSE IN THIS. 
          AND, AND IT SOUNDS LIKE THAT AFTER WHAT THE VIRGINIA MUNICIPAL LEAGUE CONFERENCE WAS TALKING ABOUT ON FRIDAY, WHICH I FIND SO INTERESTING THAT IT CAME UP AFTER WE WERE ALREADY ENTERTAINING THIS, THAT THEY WERE, THAT WAS ON THE AGENDA WAS A CODE OF CONDUCT. 
          AND I, IT WOULD NOT SURPRISE ME ANY AFTER THE FALL. 
          UM, IT WOULD NOT SURPRISE ME ANY AFTER OUR FALL MAYOR'S INSTITUTE IF THAT DIDN'T EVEN SPUR A LITTLE BIT OF THAT. 
          BECAUSE LIKE I SAID, IF YOU WOULD'VE ALL WOULD'VE HEARD SOME OF THE STORIES IN THOSE ROOMS OF OTHER PLACES AND WHAT THEY HAD GONE THROUGH, I JUST WAS SITTING THERE THINKING, WE'VE GOT A PRETTY GOOD WHERE WE ARE. 
          YOU KNOW, WE, THAT AGENDA IS SET BY WHAT COMES OUT OF EML BECAUSE LAST YEAR WHEN I WAS ON IT, WHAT CAME OUT OF THE POLICY AND LAW COMMITTEE WAS ABOUT THE CHANGES TO THE LEGISLATION WITH BEING ABLE TO PULL PEOPLE OVER FOR SECONDARY OFFENSES. 
          AND THAT'S WHAT WAS THERE THE NEXT TIME. 
          SO THE AGENDA IS SET BY WHAT WAS DISCUSSED AT BML. 
          THAT'S GOOD THOUGH BECAUSE THEY, BECAUSE THEY'RE LISTENING. 
          YEAH. 
          IT SHOULD BE BASED ON WHAT, WHAT IS IMPORTANT TO YOU AND WELL, I THINK WHAT'S GOING ON, I THINK THE COMMUNITY AND ESPECIALLY IT'LL, YOU KNOW, IT'LL COME UP IN THE NEXT NINE MONTHS. 
          YOU KNOW, YOU, YOU, YOU ALMOST ALWAYS DURING AN ELECT BIG ELECTION YEAR HEAR ABOUT THE COMMUNITY WANTS CIVILITY, THEY WANNA RETURN TO CIVILITY. 
          I DON'T, I HAVEN'T HEARD ANYBODY SAY THEY DON'T . 
          UM, AND I FEEL LIKE THIS, THIS IS, THIS IS A LOT, IF YOU WANT TO FRAME IT LIKE THIS, THIS IS A LOT ABOUT THE DIRECTION THAT YOU WOULD LIKE THE COUNCIL TO BE. 
          YOU KNOW, THIS IS YOUR EXPECTATION OF HOW YOU'D LIKE MEETINGS TO GO. 
          WE MAY FALL SHORT OF IT OCCASIONALLY OR WHATEVER, BUT THAT THIS IS YOUR EXPECTATION AND THIS IS WHAT WE WOULD LIKE TO ASPIRE TO DO. 
          SO I KNOW I'M USED TO THAT. 
          I'M JUST THINKING YOU SAY MINE, I JUST WANNA SAY THIS LIKE WHEN YOU SAY LIKE, MY EXPECTATION, I HOPE IT'S OUR, I HOPE IT'S ALL OF OUR EXPECTATION. 
          WELL IT'S MINE BECAUSE THAT'S HOW, I MEAN ANY PLACE I'VE EVER WORKED, BUT I'VE ALWAYS WORKED NON-PROFITS, SO, YOU KNOW, OR EDUCATIONAL. 
          SO THIS IS LIKE STANDARD STUFF, YOU KNOW, YOU ALWAYS ARE LIKE DOING A VISION OR PHILOSOPHY OR A WAY OF APPROACHING THINGS. 
          IT'S MY CAREER OR MY JOB. 
          I WOULD, YOU KNOW, SO POSITION, I DON'T, YOU KNOW, IT'S THE ONLY REASON I JUST LIKE, BUT ANYWAY, SO I APPRECIATE IT. 
          I'LL TAKE THESE CHANGES AND GEORGE, I'M GONNA RUN ABOUT YOU TO MAKE SURE I GOT MY SHOWER AND MY SHOULD . 
          OKAY. 
          I THINK I DID IT. 
          AND, AND UM, I, AND I'LL SEND IT BACK AROUND BEFORE THE 22ND. 
          UM, AND WE'RE NOT THEN I'LL GIVE IT TO YOU ON THE 22ND. 
          RIGHT. 
          WELL I ON THE AGENDA. 
          SO ISN'T SOMETHING WE TAKE ACTION, THIS IS JUST, I ONLY SAY THAT 'CAUSE I'VE NOTICED THAT IN OTHER PLACES WHERE THEY DID THAT BECAUSE YOU KNOW, IT WAS A BIG DEAL WHEN SOMEBODY'S, I'M NOT GONNA DO IT OR WHATEVER. 
          SO I'M, I'M FINE IF MAKE A BIG DEAL. 
          I RESPECT AND HONOR YOUR CODE OF CONDUCT, ALL OF YOUR OPINION. 
          DON'T COUNSEL'S GONNA TREAT IT AS A POLICY OF COUNSEL TO A VOTE. 
          OKAY, WELL WE'LL TALK ABOUT IT. 
          WE NOW AS INDIVIDUAL 
          [02:55:01]
SIGN ON. 
          YOU GUYS WANNA A CAN MAKE IT. 
          I THINK IT MIGHT BE BETTER, UM, TO HAVE IT AS A POLICY. 
          OKAY. 
          ALRIGHT. 
          MOVING ON TO THE LAST ITEM, WHICH IS CLOSED. 
          MADAM MAYOR, IF THERE'S SOMEBODY THAT, OH, GO AHEAD. 
          I'M READY TO GO. 
          YEAH. 
          MADAM MAYOR, I MOVE THE TOWN COUNCIL CONVENE A CLOSE MEETING PURSUANT TO SECTION 2.2 3 7 1 1 2 0.2372 OF THE CODE OF VIRGINIA FOR THE FOLLOWING PURPOSES. 
          ONE PURSUANT TO 2.2 DASH 3 7 1 A1 OF THE CODE OF VIRGINIA FOR THE DISCUSSION, CONSIDERATION, ASSIGNMENT, APPOINTMENT PROMOTION, PERFORMANCE DEMOTION, SALARY DISCIPLINING OR RESIGNATION OF SPECIFIC PUBLIC OFFICERS APPOINTED THESE OR EMPLOYEES OF ANY PUBLIC BODY, MORE SPECIFICALLY THE TOWN ATTORNEY. 
          AND TWO, PURSUANT TO SECTION 2.2 DASH 3 7 1 1 A SEVEN OF THE CODE OF VIRGINIA FOR CONSULTATION WITH LEGAL COUNSEL AND BRIEFINGS BY STAFF MEMBERS OR CONSULTANTS PERTAINING TO ACTUAL OR PROBABLE LITIGATION WHERE SUCH CONSULTATION OR BRIEFING AND OPEN MEETING WOULD ADVERSELY AFFECT THE NEGOTIATING OR LITIGATING POSTURE OF THE PUBLIC BODY. 
          MORE SPECIFICALLY FIRST BANK OF TRUST. 
          AND THREE, PURSUANT TO SECTION 2.2 DASH 3 7 1 1 A EIGHT OF THE CODE OF VIRGINIA FOR CONSULTATION WITH LEGAL COUNSEL EMPLOYED BY OR RETAINED BY A PUBLIC BODY REGARDING SPECIFIC LEGAL MATTERS REQUIRING THE PROVISION OF LEGAL ADVICE BY SUCH COUNSEL. 
          MORE SPECIFICALLY, A PROPERTY LOCATED AT 200 EAST EIGHTH STREET, FORMERLY OWNED BY THE TOWN, AND B, THE OBLIGATIONS OF THE, FOR WARREN COUNTY EDA. 
          HEAR A SECOND? SECOND. 
          OKAY. 
          ALL RIGHT. 
          SO WE ARE ENCLOSED. 
          MAYOR SEAT, VICE MAYOR. 
          YES. 
          COUNCILMAN INGRAM? YES. 
          CONDITION? YES. 
          COUNCILMAN REPPORT. 
          YOUR CONDITION, COUNCILMAN? YES. 
          COUNCILMAN WOOD? YES. 
          ALRIGHT, SO WE ARE ENCLOSED.
* This transcript was created by voice-to-text technology. The transcript has not been edited for errors or omissions, it is for reference only and is not the official minutes of the meeting.